Series Discussion: (3) Dallas Stars vs (6) Calgary Flames

[Iggys Dome]

I only caught the third period last night, but I'll say that I'm glad to hear that Talbot had himself a game. Interesting that Dallas went with Khudobin over Bishop so I'm assuming they'll go back to Bishop tomorrow. GFG lets get a stranglehold on this series.

 

[Mazatt]

Most of it was pretty standard. There were a few shifts towards the end with a two goal lead where he rolled a Monahan-Ryan-Mangiapane line along with a Rieder-Backlund-Lindholm line. Lucic-Bennett-Dube were left intact and Quine/Gaudreau/Rinaldo sat.

It's interesting that Ward had the balls to sit Gaudreau. I like that. With that infromation in focus I think we could see something like this with Lindholm taking Mangiapane's role on the 2nd line and Monahan and Mangiapane playing together on a new second line. The only question is where Gaudreau ends up. If Tkachuk is out again tomorrow could we see Rieder in his spot again, or would Gaudreau take that spot? Is Ward keeping these lines as a back pocket lead protection move? It'll be interesting to see if he commits to Gaudreau's line being split up.

 

[Mazatt]

With the recent look at the lines, Ward understands that Lucic - Bennett - Dube needs to stay intact. That gives the Flames plenty of room to play around with in terms of the other 9 forwards. I think we will see him run a more conservative lineup in the first, pending on Tkachuk's status before mucking it up if the team isn't succeeding. For example:

Gaudreau - Monahan - Mangiapane
Rieder - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Quine - Ryan - Rinaldo

1st doesn't go well, that becomes

Rieder - Backlund - Lindholm
Monahan - Ryan - Mangiapane
Lucic - Benentt - Dube
Gaudreau - Quine - Rinaldo

or even

Monahan - Backlund - Lindholm
Gaudreau - Ryan - Mangiapane
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Rieder - Quine - Rinaldo



IF Tkachuk is back, I think we see the common lineup in again, i.e. normal top line, Chucky Backs Mangi, and maybe Quine falls out due to Rinaldo being an aggressive force as far as I've heard, but on the other hand Quine has the versatility of another cenre in the lineup. If that doesn't work;

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Monahan - Ryan- Mangiapane
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Gaudreau - Quine - Rieder

Just my two cents on possible lineups though

 

[Yotes4Cup]

With the recent look at the lines, Ward understands that Lucic - Bennett - Dube needs to stay intact. That gives the Flames plenty of room to play around with in terms of the other 9 forwards. I think we will see him run a more conservative lineup in the first, pending on Tkachuk's status before mucking it up if the team isn't succeeding. For example:

Gaudreau - Monahan - Mangiapane
Rieder - Backlund - Lindholm
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Quine - Ryan - Rinaldo

1st doesn't go well, that becomes

Rieder - Backlund - Lindholm
Monahan - Ryan - Mangiapane
Lucic - Benentt - Dube
Gaudreau - Quine - Rinaldo

or even

Monahan - Backlund - Lindholm
Gaudreau - Ryan - Mangiapane
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Rieder - Quine - Rinaldo



IF Tkachuk is back, I think we see the common lineup in again, i.e. normal top line, Chucky Backs Mangi, and maybe Quine falls out due to Rinaldo being an aggressive force as far as I've heard, but on the other hand Quine has the versatility of another cenre in the lineup. If that doesn't work;

Tkachuk - Backlund - Lindholm
Monahan - Ryan- Mangiapane
Lucic - Bennett - Dube
Gaudreau - Quine - Rieder

Just my two cents on possible lineups though

gaudreau is not playing on the fourth line and derek ryan is not a second liner lol

 

[SKRusty]

gaudreau is not playing on the fourth line and derek ryan is not a second liner lol

Gaudreau was benched for part of game 3 by Ward. IF Johnny fails to show up in game 4 anything could happen. Don't understand the love affair with Ryan but whatever. It made me very happy when Sam took his spot.

 

[Mobiandi]

Mangiapane-Bennett-Dube
Lucic-Backlund-Lindholm
Gaudreau-Ryan-Tkachuk
X-Monahan-Rieder

 

[Mazatt]

Mangiapane-Bennett-Dube
Lucic-Backlund-Lindholm
Gaudreau-Ryan-Tkachuk
X-Monahan-Rieder

4th line Monahan. Interesting strategy...

I do like Ryan and Gaudreau together but not for Monahan who has been the most consistent member of that line. Lucic with Backlund and Lindholm also doesn't add up to me.

I'd prefer Lucic - Ryan - Gaudreau if that's the angle we want, then Tkachuk - Bennett - Dube, Rieder - Backlund - Lindholm, Mangiapane - Monahan - x

 

[Ace Rimmer]

Paging @super6646

Your GDT mojo is greatly desired.

 

[super6646]

Paging @super6646

Your GDT mojo is greatly desired.

Will have that shortly

 

[Anglesmith]

I don't think we're in the worst position ever. Winning game 6 would put a huge amount of pressure on the Stars. It sucks losing game 6 if you're up 3-2.

The key is winning, though.

 

[Mobiandi]

Remember when the Flames went down 3-0 in the first period of game 6 to the Canucks and still stomped back to a 7-4 win. I want that fight

 

[Ace Rimmer]

Is Matthew Phillips in the bubble?

If so, put him in Game 6.

 

[Mazatt]

The entire series the Flames have done a few things terribly. Defensively, they haven't held the blue line effectively and have allowed themselves to be backed off by the Stars speed, causing a bad gap which allows them to make passes easier. Once in our zone, the Flames have had board-side winger effectively cover the point man, but the opposite winger collapses to the slot to avoid Dallas cutting to the middle off of a miscue along the boards. You can see this on the Game 5 GWG as Janmark gets free from the corner and Gaudreau collapses into the slot to take the angle away, which allows Janmark to kick back to Klingberg for the goal. This has been happening all series and is how they are able to score on us so much from the point. The Flames need to keep the winger higher up in the slot and always in between the man in the corner and their d-man, this means relying on our D and centre to be able to stop the Stars forwards from driving to the net, but it stops the goals that have actually been scored on Talbot. I've also seen this strategy hurt our breakout. We've attempted to shoot the puck down the opposite boards, but beause the winger is in the high slot, the Stars D is able to pinch down and continue their zone time.

System wise, one thing I've liked is Backlund actually skating it backwards in the zone to start the breakout. He'll grab the puck along the boards off a steal and skate behind the net to use it as a pick. It makes the Stars D respect his speed as they have to back up with speed due to the Flames wingers being able to leave early, but Backlund's speeds allows him to break into the zone. That kind of composure isn't a system thing it's just something I've liked from Backlund, and I'd like to see other players slowing down the game to assess the breakout. I also wouldn't mind the Flames D being more willing to flip the puck out of the zone to clear pressure instead of passing to Lucic who gets stripped of the puck a lot. If they flip it out, it would make sense for our forwards to be in the high slot as they are able to get to centre to collect the puck/challenge the D quickly. Idk, just some things I've noticed watching the games.

 

[Kranix]

Remember when the Flames went down 3-0 in the first period of game 6 to the Canucks and still stomped back to a 7-4 win. I want that fight

Only Hudler could lead them to do that

 

[Nanuuk]

The Stars play the trap and we have been trapped. Our transition game sucks and defensively (and I've been saying this all year) we give up our blue line way too easily. Once the Stars enter our zone they use their speed and big bodies to cycle and our D is too slow for that.

While I'll cheer to the bitter end I think we are watching the last of our core play together. There will be a different face or two next season. I also believe that Coach Ward and his staff will be gone next year. I thought at one time they were the right guys, but the more I watch this series it reminds me of the Flames being rag-dolled by Colorado. Not good enough.

 

[Kranix]

Zone entry is terrible and dump and chase is terrible.

 

[Mobiandi]

Short of it being a severe injury, I think Tkachuk will force his way back into the lineup for game 6

 

[Anglesmith]

Short of it being a severe injury, I think Tkachuk will force his way back into the lineup for game 6

If it's concussion, it's probably out of his hands.

 

[Nanuuk]

Short of it being a severe injury, I think Tkachuk will force his way back into the lineup for game 6

To add to Angelsmith's comment, the Flames will not want to jeopardize this player's future health. Look at poor Michael Ferland. His career could be over. So its better safe than sorry. The rest of the boys need to do a gut check and step it up.

 

[Kranix]

They have to beat the Dallas blueline trap with speed. Not Johnny stick handling to the blueline backhand sauce to nobody every fricking time.

 

[HugginThePost]

The Stars play the trap and we have been trapped. Our transition game sucks and defensively (and I've been saying this all year) we give up our blue line way too easily. Once the Stars enter our zone they use their speed and big bodies to cycle and our D is too slow for that.

While I'll cheer to the bitter end I think we are watching the last of our core play together. There will be a different face or two next season. I also believe that Coach Ward and his staff will be gone next year. I thought at one time they were the right guys, but the more I watch this series it reminds me of the Flames being rag-dolled by Colorado. Not good enough.

Agree 100%.....

The core has shown us who they are, and they aren't good enough. Period.

Should be an interesting off-season.

The part that annoys me is there are so many holes.

We aren't fast enough, we aren't big enough, we aren't talented enough, we don't really know what we have in the goaltending duo, coaches aren't good enough, Gio has plummeted to earth with no real true #1 stepping up to take his place, scoring continues to be an issue from our top-end players - I'm looking at you first-line guys, Jesus it's depressing.

We are what we have been for decades. Mediocre. Mediocre in every way possible.

There was a point when we thought we had a superstar in Johnny, but it's now apparent this is far from the case. HE's a super-skilled winger that, given room, can be amazing. Take that space away, and he's a giveaway machine. Worried about every little hit, slash, whack he gets.

I hope to god the Johnny Hockey experiment ends this offseason.

The problem is he's not getting us much in return. He needs to go to a big-bodied team that can shelter him in the manner he requires. He certainly isn't getting us a true #1 center we have needed for, well, ever. We will have to part with one of our young D's and some picks for that. Which exposes our lack of good players going forward.

I think we're in for many more years of being average.

Which, personally, I'm sick and tired of.

 

[Anglesmith]

Agree 100%.....

The core has shown us who they are, and they aren't good enough. Period.

Should be an interesting off-season.

The part that annoys me is there are so many holes.

We aren't fast enough, we aren't big enough, we aren't talented enough, we don't really know what we have in the goaltending duo, coaches aren't good enough, Gio has plummeted to earth with no real true #1 stepping up to take his place, scoring continues to be an issue from our top-end players - I'm looking at you first-line guys, Jesus it's depressing.

We are what we have been for decades. Mediocre. Mediocre in every way possible.

There was a point when we thought we had a superstar in Johnny, but it's now apparent this is far from the case. HE's a super-skilled winger that, given room, can be amazing. Take that space away, and he's a giveaway machine. Worried about every little hit, slash, whack he gets.

I hope to god the Johnny Hockey experiment ends this offseason.

The problem is he's not getting us much in return. He needs to go to a big-bodied team that can shelter him in the manner he requires. He certainly isn't getting us a true #1 center we have needed for, well, ever. We will have to part with one of our young D's and some picks for that. Which exposes our lack of good players going forward.

I think we're in for many more years of being average.

Which, personally, I'm sick and tired of.

The problem I have with this analysis is that we treat the elimination of time and space as a given. It's really not. Our play as a team is resulting in very little time and space, but if you watch any other teams in the playoffs (other than the heavy underdogs) you'll see consistent rushes with time and space. You'll see teams with their top players skating with room through the neutral zone and looking like top players because of it. You'll also see absolute superstar players who we'd love to have look bad if they never have time and space.

We need to defend with a plan, break the puck out with a plan and move through the neutral zone with a plan. If we continue to make our forwards look bad by throwing them grenades with no support, we'll watch them go to other teams that do have a good system and see them blow up.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

The problem I have with this analysis is that we treat the elimination of time and space as a given. It's really not. Our play as a team is resulting in very little time and space, but if you watch any other teams in the playoffs (other than the heavy underdogs) you'll see consistent rushes with time and space. You'll see teams with their top players skating with room through the neutral zone and looking like top players because of it. You'll also see absolute superstar players who we'd love to have look bad if they never have time and space.

We need to defend with a plan, break the puck out with a plan and move through the neutral zone with a plan. If we continue to make our forwards look bad by throwing them grenades with no support, we'll watch them go to other teams that do have a good system and see them blow up.

This x 1000.

 

[Kranix]

The problem I have with this analysis is that we treat the elimination of time and space as a given. It's really not. Our play as a team is resulting in very little time and space, but if you watch any other teams in the playoffs (other than the heavy underdogs) you'll see consistent rushes with time and space. You'll see teams with their top players skating with room through the neutral zone and looking like top players because of it. You'll also see absolute superstar players who we'd love to have look bad if they never have time and space.

We need to defend with a plan, break the puck out with a plan and move through the neutral zone with a plan. If we continue to make our forwards look bad by throwing them grenades with no support, we'll watch them go to other teams that do have a good system and see them blow up.

That's on Ward

 

[Dack]

The problem I have with this analysis is that we treat the elimination of time and space as a given. It's really not. Our play as a team is resulting in very little time and space, but if you watch any other teams in the playoffs (other than the heavy underdogs) you'll see consistent rushes with time and space. You'll see teams with their top players skating with room through the neutral zone and looking like top players because of it. You'll also see absolute superstar players who we'd love to have look bad if they never have time and space.

We need to defend with a plan, break the puck out with a plan and move through the neutral zone with a plan. If we continue to make our forwards look bad by throwing them grenades with no support, we'll watch them go to other teams that do have a good system and see them blow up.

Oh it's a given that any player we trade is going to do better in a system where they don't get passes while flatfooted with a pinching d man or force checker barreling down on them.

The team is completely inept at transitioning.