Prospect Info: 2020 NHL Draft Thread: Part IV - well, the lotto sucked

[Rzombo4 prez]

Did any analysts call it right last year about Seider?

Yzerman's desire to trade down to take him was the worst kept secret in hockey. The media was all over it the week of the draft. I am not sure how many had him actually taking him at 6th though.

 

[Christien]

Did any analysts call it right last year about Seider?

this was J.D. Burke at around 3 P.M before the draft that day

 

[jkutswings]

This is a wonderful example of why sometimes median is a better measure than mean.

Here's the statement I was responding to:

Strawman???
He was compared to Kucherov, a Hart Trophy winner.
Hart Trophy guys have a claim at being drafted #1 overall.

So Perfetti is compared to a Hart Trophy winner. And allegedly Hart winners are #1 picks.

Except for half of the last ten winners. Including the specific name Perfetti is being compared to, who is the latest pick of the entire bunch.

So yeah, #1 overall is the most common draft slot for a Hart winner. But the side dish is that it's not exactly airtight to use #1 and Hart in the same argument, and the main entree is that it's awful logic to use #1 and Hart and Kucherov all together.

 

[Larkin2AA]

This is my guy at 4. Check out this Twitter thread:

This is who I want the most. I won’t be mad with Perfetti, but Raymond is just exciting to watch.

 

[lilidk]

This is who I want the most. I won’t be mad with Perfetti, but Raymond is just exciting to watch.

I won't be mad with Perfetti, just upset. We have Rossi and Raymond even Drysdale. We should not skip them for Perfetti

 

[FabricDetails]

From an eye test and also scouting reports and how amazing he's been for the longest time, I got Holtz as the second best player in this draft just a skosh ahead of Stutzle. I know we're going to grab an all-star at 4 regardless who we grab, I truly honestly believe Holtz is going to be the second most dominate player in this draft. Take it from me, I'm wrong half of the time and the other half I'm either right or I'm wrong.

"99.9% of the time it works 25% of time..."

 

[HisNoodliness]

Strawman???
He was compared to Kucherov, a Hart Trophy winner.
Hart Trophy guys have a claim at being drafted #1 overall.



This is a straight up comparison to Kucherov.

And if you think Perfetti equal to that, you should be talking about Perfetti as a potential #1 overall pick.

Unless you think Lafreniere is Lemiuex/Gretzky level good.

I had Perfetti as my #2 guy of the likely available players at #4. But the skating, low-energy forecheck says two things to me. 1) He's probably not a center. And I'm not really down for another winger right now. 2) As a winger, he's a less skilled, less dynamic Patrick Kane, who doesn't work hard to win battles in the corners. Is that what I want at #4?

Any comparison is stylistic. That's always the case for any prospect. We compare Drysdale to Heiskanen, Raymond to Marner, Byfield to Malkin. Sometimes it's hard to find a good comparable and we need a modifier like Rossi plays like small Crosby, Larkin is Helm with hands, Lafreniere is cerebral Nash. Obviously it would be unfair to expect any of these guys end up as good as those stars (except maybe Laf)... They honestly might but the point of a comparison is to describe a player easily using the existing knowledge that everyone here shares.

Perfetti looks a lot like Kucherov. He's great at the pass from the half wall to the slot or other wing. He has quick hands and maneuvers around guys with deft touch. His shot is very accurate and has a similar release. He's often the third man into the offensive zone and can have disinterested body language. He's not overly big or physical.

 

[ShanahanMan]

Hakan speaking about both Holtz and Raymond in this interview. Any Swedes out there able to translate? This may give a big indication on who we’re leaning on since I know management relies heavily on how Hakan views potential players.

Inför NHL-draften: Detroits veteranscout gästar studion - Hockeysverige

 

[Martinez]

Tyler Tullio seems like such a Yzerman pick

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Tyler Tullio seems like such a Yzerman pick

I know he is an @Frk It pick.

 

[Martinez]

I know he is an @Frk It pick.

Nice, wheeler praised him on his latest athletic piece (or I should say people wheeler talked to)

Strong candidate for my who I would have picked list

 

[FMichael]

Any comparison is stylistic. That's always the case for any prospect. We compare Drysdale to Heiskanen, Raymond to Marner, Byfield to Malkin. Sometimes it's hard to find a good comparable and we need a modifier like Rossi plays like small Crosby, Larkin is Helm with hands, Lafreniere is cerebral Nash. Obviously it would be unfair to expect any of these guys end up as good as those stars (except maybe Laf)... They honestly might but the point of a comparison is to describe a player easily using the existing knowledge that everyone here shares.

Perfetti looks a lot like Kucherov. He's great at the pass from the half wall to the slot or other wing. He has quick hands and maneuvers around guys with deft touch. His shot is very accurate and has a similar release. He's often the third man into the offensive zone and can have disinterested body language. He's not overly big or physical.

I just recently learned how Raymond is comparable to Marner...I'd be fine with that.

 

[Ulysses31]

After and before (not during) wings pick just gonna be chanting mantra "pick someone stupid" again and again in my head

 

[MBH]

Here's the statement I was responding to:

Strawman???
He was compared to Kucherov, a Hart Trophy winner.
Hart Trophy guys have a claim at being drafted #1 overall.

So Perfetti is compared to a Hart Trophy winner. And allegedly Hart winners are #1 picks.

Except for half of the last ten winners. Including the specific name Perfetti is being compared to, who is the latest pick of the entire bunch.

So yeah, #1 overall is the most common draft slot for a Hart winner. But the side dish is that it's not exactly airtight to use #1 and Hart in the same argument, and the main entree is that it's awful logic to use #1 and Hart and Kucherov all together.

No. But if you were confident Perfetti could turn out like Kucherov, you'd absolutely consider him at #1.
I don't think Lafreniere will be as good as Kucherov. And he's almost universally considered the #1 pick in the draft.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Hakan speaking about both Holtz and Raymond in this interview. Any Swedes out there able to translate? This may give a big indication on who we’re leaning on since I know management relies heavily on how Hakan views potential players.

Inför NHL-draften: Detroits veteranscout gästar studion - Hockeysverige

(just need an actual translator for the audio/interview)...

Google translator:

The NHL draft is fast approaching. It celebrates hockeysverige.se with its own studio program for next week's big event. Here, Uffe Bodin and guest Håkan Andersson talk about this year's draft and the strange circumstances that surround it.

This week, hockeysverige.se and editor-in-chief Uffe Bodin had a studio visit by Detroit Red Wing's longtime European scout Håkan Andersson for a talk on this year's NHL draft.

On October 6-7, the NHL will carry out the draft digitally due to the current corona pandemic. In the program, Uffe and Håkan discuss the challenges with scout players during the pandemic, what the draft will look like for him and how big a difference it is to work as a scout when you represent a team that has done poorly and therefore has more and higher choices.
In addition:

* Håkan Andersson about his 30 years as a scout for the Red Wings.

* Håkan gives his view on Lucas Raymond and other Swedish top players before the draft.

* Interview with Djurgården's Alexander Holtz about his feelings about the delayed draft finally being implemented.

* This is how the North American junior leagues differ from J20 National.

* Elite Prospects J.D. Burke is a guest on the program to give his views on the likely draft leader Alexis Lafrenière and the German Tim Stützle who can follow him.

* Håkan Andersson talks about the German hockey phenomenon that is becoming increasingly remarkable.

 

[ShanahanMan]

Google translator:

The NHL draft is fast approaching. It celebrates hockeysverige.se with its own studio program for next week's big event. Here, Uffe Bodin and guest Håkan Andersson talk about this year's draft and the strange circumstances that surround it.

This week, hockeysverige.se and editor-in-chief Uffe Bodin had a studio visit by Detroit Red Wing's longtime European scout Håkan Andersson for a talk on this year's NHL draft.

On October 6-7, the NHL will carry out the draft digitally due to the current corona pandemic. In the program, Uffe and Håkan discuss the challenges with scout players during the pandemic, what the draft will look like for him and how big a difference it is to work as a scout when you represent a team that has done poorly and therefore has more and higher choices.
In addition:

* Håkan Andersson about his 30 years as a scout for the Red Wings.

* Håkan gives his view on Lucas Raymond and other Swedish top players before the draft.

* Interview with Djurgården's Alexander Holtz about his feelings about the delayed draft finally being implemented.

* This is how the North American junior leagues differ from J20 National.

* Elite Prospects J.D. Burke is a guest on the program to give his views on the likely draft leader Alexis Lafrenière and the German Tim Stützle who can follow him.

* Håkan Andersson talks about the German hockey phenomenon that is becoming increasingly remarkable.

Yeah sorry should have been more clear. I meant the video.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Yeah sorry should have been more clear. I meant the video.

no worries, I missed the audio 1st time around & edited my prior post, thanks for sharing....It's Christmas in Oct., I'm so excited for our new toys!!

+ the bonus prospects, picks & roster players from the cap dumps & casualties.

 

[Dotter]

No. But if you were confident Perfetti could turn out like Kucherov, you'd absolutely consider him at #1.
I don't think Lafreniere will be as good as Kucherov. And he's almost universally considered the #1 pick in the draft.

Nobody said Perfetti "could turn out like Kucherov"

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Strawman???
He was compared to Kucherov, a Hart Trophy winner.
Hart Trophy guys have a claim at being drafted #1 overall.



This is a straight up comparison to Kucherov.

And if you think Perfetti equal to that, you should be talking about Perfetti as a potential #1 overall pick.

Unless you think Lafreniere is Lemiuex/Gretzky level good.

I had Perfetti as my #2 guy of the likely available players at #4. But the skating, low-energy forecheck says two things to me. 1) He's probably not a center. And I'm not really down for another winger right now. 2) As a winger, he's a less skilled, less dynamic Patrick Kane, who doesn't work hard to win battles in the corners. Is that what I want at #4?

Yes. It is absolutely a strawman.

1) Lots of guys taken 1OA have won the Hart. But there are plenty of nominees who have been 5th round or later. There have been plenty of guys taken 1OA who haven't remotely sniffed a Hart. Correlation isn't causation. It's not "taken 1st overall, short list for Hart". 1OA picks are more likely to win the Hart, especially now, because scouting has so vastly improved over the past... but even so, Nico Hischer and Jack Hughes aren't looking to bang down the door right now. Ryan Nugent Hopkins, Nail Yakupov, Aaron Ekblad, etc.

2) Comparisons are literally stylistic. When comparisons are tossed out, they're not ever saying "This player is going to be X." They are saying that this player's style is that of X. There aren't 75 Viktor Arvidsson clones running around the league potting 20+ goals. He was a super common "comparable" for strong, aggressive forwards. Also, the comparison is being given by his coach. Not by scouts, not by any relevant agencies... but by a coach who has a vested interest in pumping his guy's tires. Remember when Calle Jarnkrok was Zetterberg 2.0? When Tatar and Nyquist were the Eurotwins 2.0? Larkin was "Helm with hands"? People use current NHL players to give some context as to the games because not everyone has the time to watch every game.

3) Top 2020 NHL Draft prospects compared to current players

Here is a different comparison by Central Scouting. So, with just one sample, just like you have... let's see.

Lafreniere: Jonathan Huberdeau
Byfield: Evgeni Malkin
Stutzle: Matthew Barzal
Perfetti: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
Drysdale: Cale Makar
Rossi: Claude Giroux
Askarov: Pekka Rinne

One of those forward comps is not like the others. One of them just doesn't belong.

Lastly, why when it is Cole Perfetti you're saying "I see a less skilled, less dynamic Patrick Kane who doesn't fight hard in the corners" and that worries you, but Perfetti's coach who sees him play on the regular saying that his game is reminiscent of Kucherov's somehow also worries you?

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I think they are only talking about Perfetti being like Kucherov in the same sense that you compare him to Kane

Shhh... That's sense. We can't be having that in this topic.

 

[Bondurant]

My work schedule was adjusted beginning today. I now get off at 4 PM PST. Just in time but will have a few dirty tricks up my sleeve to ensure nothing holds me over.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

No. But if you were confident Perfetti could turn out like Kucherov, you'd absolutely consider him at #1.
I don't think Lafreniere will be as good as Kucherov. And he's almost universally considered the #1 pick in the draft.

You wouldn't consider him at #1 if you were more confident that Laf will become a better David Pastrnak, Byfield could become Evgeni Malkin, or Stutzle could become Claude Giroux.

 

[Killerjas]

Any leaks coming out? Last year someone claimed they knew Yzerman was getting Seider a week before the draft.

 

[odin1981]

Strawman???
He was compared to Kucherov, a Hart Trophy winner.
Hart Trophy guys have a claim at being drafted #1 overall.



This is a straight up comparison to Kucherov.

And if you think Perfetti equal to that, you should be talking about Perfetti as a potential #1 overall pick.

Unless you think Lafreniere is Lemiuex/Gretzky level good.

I had Perfetti as my #2 guy of the likely available players at #4. But the skating, low-energy forecheck says two things to me. 1) He's probably not a center. And I'm not really down for another winger right now. 2) As a winger, he's a less skilled, less dynamic Patrick Kane, who doesn't work hard to win battles in the corners. Is that what I want at #4?

Is he Canadian? Is sportsnet hyping him up giving a comparison? Yes to both questions.