Speculation: 2019 Trade Deadline

[The Zetterberg Era]

Holland deserves all of the credit he gets, he's a first ballot hall of fame GM and I think if he went somewhere like Edmonton he would make them cup contenders.

I just think that once the cap was instituted he stopped being aggressive and for good reason. I'm not saying he wasn't aggressive in those moves to bash him, I just think they were calculated moves with zero risk. I feel that if you say a move is aggressive, like in a game when a goalie is aggressive and goes out for a poke check at the hash marks, there's a big risk involved. Signing Hossa to a 1 year deal or Rafalski once Schneider was gone isn't aggressive to me. They were both fantastic moves though.

I think Holland is far too comfortable with the Wings and too loyal to some players, I feel like Yzerman is a bit less loyal and will make moves that Holland won't because Yzerman hasn't been GM here for 30 years.

I agree there, I think the fresh set of eyes will be good. Even if they have a lot of the same philosophies, they won't approach things the same way. I do think Holland could have harmed this organization more than he has, he has had a pretty good run over the last 18 months since he has committed to the rebuild. Should have got there a few years earlier fine, but this was going to happen in my opinion. I value what he has brought and I still hope we can keep him in an advisory role because he is a very smart hockey person.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Are we inaugurating this thread tonight? It's looking like it's possible.

 

[Winger98]

Hah, of course not and that's not what I was implying. Back in 2009 I thought Hossa should walk because at that time Franzen was more valuable to the team and I thought it had to be Franzen or Hossa. A while after, I felt that Holland should've found a way to trade some group of Hudler, Filppula and/or Cleary to keep Hossa. I bought into the Patriots philosophy that you pay your stars and find your depth players for the cheap and continue to move on. Instead, we lost Hossa, then we lost Filppula, Hudler and had the Cleary debacle and didn't see anything out of it while Hossa won 3 cups with Chicago.

This is all in hindsight and with perfect information, but that's what these message boards are for.

That off-season horrible for us. We lost Hossa with the assumption we would still have Hudler on an RFA contract and re-sign Sammy. Instead, Hudler skipped to Russia for bigger money and Sammy went to Vancouver. We lost, what, 80 goals in those three guys? Between that off-season and the off-season heading into the last lockout where Holland locked into Tootoo, sammy, Bert, and Cocacola, that was just brutal on this org.

I think the Wings push for another cup in 9/10 if we still have Hudler and Sammy with that group.

 

[kliq]

I think what most people are dancing around is that Holland isn’t a bad GM and between 1998 and 2010 he was very good. The issue is that he’s a guy who can keep a team on the tracks and moving forward, but not the guy who is able to pick up the pieces when the team inevitably goes off the tracks. And that’s fine. If he could do both he’d likely be rated as a top 3 GM ever in the NHL. But, he’s not, and it’s time for a rebuild, and Holland is definitely a tool, just not the right one for this job.

I'm not saying that I think he is or isnt, but I have seen him on top of many lists when referring to the greatest GM's of all time. Scott Morrison's book for example (which is essentially the HNIC crew) has him #3 all time after Pollack and Lou, mind you the book is from around 10 years ago.

 

[lhsgolf19]

Red Wings weighing whether to sign or trade as deadline looms
Jeez, we need a new voice at the top, my god lol

 

[Shaman464]

Red Wings weighing whether to sign or trade as deadline looms
Jeez, we need a new voice at the top, my god lol

This is the type of stuff that shows how bad of a rebuild GM Holland is.

 

[DInTheB]

Red Wings weighing whether to sign or trade as deadline looms
Jeez, we need a new voice at the top, my god lol

If Nyquist will sign for the same deal he’s at now, that’s more valuable to us than a second round pick. If Gus wants another 1.5 AAV, the second round pick is more valuable.

It’s all part of the game a week out from the deadline.

 

[TatarTangle]

I think everyone is underestimating the veteran leadership Nyquist has. He may disappear on the scoresheet for a month but gosh darnit I'm not going to sit here and let everyone think Nyquist's veteran leadership isn't invaluable to the team.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Red Wings weighing whether to sign or trade as deadline looms
Jeez, we need a new voice at the top, my god lol

Clown college.

 

[Henkka]

This is the type of stuff that shows how bad of a rebuild GM Holland is.

Kind of opposite of it.

 

[Shaman464]

Kind of opposite of it.

Yeah re-signing 2nd tier talent has been a winning formula so far. Poor asset management has been the secret weapon to keep Detroit relevant for the last 3 seasons.

 

[PelagicJoe]

If we do make any trades, it will be for picks. I see at least one of Nyquist, Jensen, Glendening, or Howard gone. Maybe someone like Kronwall or Daley waives NTC to go to a contender. Who knows.
I wouldn't mind trading scrub prospects like Frk for mid to late picks either.

 

[GBFP]

Holland will sign all three and give them full NTC/NMC's so the Red Wings are forced to protect them in the Seattle expansion draft...

 

[kliq]

If we do make any trades, it will be for picks. I see at least one of Nyquist, Jensen, Glendening, or Howard gone. Maybe someone like Kronwall or Daley waives NTC to go to a contender. Who knows.
I wouldn't mind trading scrub prospects like Frk for mid to late picks either.

We just waived Frk, meaning any team could have picked him up for free. If teams aren't willing to take him for free, they aren't going to give up a mid round pick for him. Its not like he has some giant contract or anything. MAYBE a team trades like a 7th for him if we retain 50% if they are really tight with the cap, but I cant even see that happening.

 

[PelagicJoe]

I forgot he just got waived. Oh well. Use him as a throw in for something if we have to.
Larkin, Mantha, AA, Bert, Cholo, and Hronek are the only ones I say are off the table unless the return is massive of course.

 

[Claypool]

If Nyquist will sign for the same deal he’s at now, that’s more valuable to us than a second round pick. If Gus wants another 1.5 AAV, the second round pick is more valuable.

It’s all part of the game a week out from the deadline.

Nyquist isn't worth investing in anymore, no matter how cheap the contact is. His entire career in Detroit has been a let down after his awesome rookie season.

 

[avssuc]

Red Wings weighing whether to sign or trade as deadline looms
Jeez, we need a new voice at the top, my god lol

After the last several seasons, I'm willing to reserve judgement until the deadline has passed. You can't up the value on these guys by saying that you're desperate to unload them, so I'm pretty sure KH is just playing the game right now. His bad decisions ended with the playoffs streak and Ilitch SR being around. Until he goes back to that poisonous well, I'm not worried about the PR battles.

 

[lhsgolf19]

Nyquist... #8
Howard... #10 (Top Goalie)
Jensen... #25 (Trending Up, Interesting...)
Glendening... #26

 

[Run the Jewels]

Holland will sign all three and give them full NTC/NMC's so the Red Wings are forced to protect them in the Seattle expansion draft...

Yeah, this has all the makings of Holland having "kicked the tyres" on trading those three guys and no one was willing to meet his price. Now he's probably trying to negotiate with the players. The longer the players wait and the closer we get to July 1st Holland will cave and offer them lots of term, AAV and no movement clauses. It's a well established Holland tradition.

It would never cross Holland's mind to make a hockey trade or package futures to address needs. It's unbelievable how completely blind he is on the various ways you can improve your roster. It's hard to believe this is a guy who has been an NHL GM for over 20 years.

 

[TheRatPoisoner]

Nyquist... #8
Howard... #10 (Top Goalie)
Jensen... #25 (Trending Up, Interesting...)
Glendening... #26

And Stone and Simmonds might end up not being traded, so that helps boost Nyquist's value further.

 

[SuperScript29]

I'm actually not opposed to keeping Nyquist, he's 29 years old and pretty much in his prime producing top-6 numbers. We could definitely use his experience for the next two to three years while we roll the youth in.

 

[kliq]

I'm actually not opposed to keeping Nyquist, he's 29 years old and pretty much in his prime producing top-6 numbers. We could definitely use his experience for the next two to three years while we roll the youth in.

Very good point, but if we are going to move forward with him, it makes more sense to trade him then re-sign him.

 

[SuperScript29]

Very good point, but if we are going to move forward with him, it makes more sense to trade him then re-sign him.

That would be ideal, but it's completely possible that if you trade him, he may be gone for good.

 

[kliq]

Yeah, this has all the makings of Holland having "kicked the tyres" on trading those three guys and no one was willing to meet his price. Now he's probably trying to negotiate with the players. The longer the players wait and the closer we get to July 1st Holland will cave and offer them lots of term, AAV and no movement clauses. It's a well established Holland tradition.

It would never cross Holland's mind to make a hockey trade or package futures to address needs. It's unbelievable how completely blind he is on the various ways you can improve your roster. It's hard to believe this is a guy who has been an NHL GM for over 20 years.

Since the streak ended, which UFA has he done this with at the deadline? Smith....traded. Vanek.....traded. Ott......traded. Tatar (not even a UFA)......traded. Mrazek.....traded.

I don’t get the irrational hate.

Holland did a great job from 1998-2011
Holland did a bad job from 2012-2016
Holland has done a good job from 2017-present.

Can we just move on and not fixate on a bad stretch? Nobody is arguing it wasn’t bad, no need to repeat the same rhetoric in every single thread.

 

[kliq]

That would be ideal, but it's completely possible that if you trade him, he may be gone for good.

Agreed, there is a risk, however I would have to assume given how well the wings treat their players, Nyquist would hear them out.