Red Sox/MLB 2019 Playoffs V - Lowell Spinners would lose Red Sox connection under radical MLB plan

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JRull86

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Jan 28, 2009
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I made that point as well. The Dombrowski Henry hired is the exact guy he's firing. He came as advertised. And Henry approved the big signings along the way. He used Dombrowski for a title and is throwing him away like a piece of trash. Pick a direction already. Either you want the Cherington long game approach or the Dombrowski approach. I will allow for a middle ground but enough already. Clarify what you want in a GM and let them do their thing.



I'm confused by that tweet. What are they saying Dombrowski couldn't pull off?
Running a team with a lesser payroll, pulling off a Betts trade to maximize return I'd guess?
 

Fenway

HF Bookie and Bruins Historian
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Sep 26, 2007
68,589
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I don't think Orsillo misses Boston anymore

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KrejciMVP

Registered User
Jun 30, 2011
28,422
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Tampa, Florida
Redsox cant get away with not fielding a competitive team. The Yankees being in the division and the fans wont stand for it are factors. The year following chicken and beer tickets were available for very cheap
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
Been hearing about Eddie Romero Jr for years as a star of the organization

If he has what it takes they should hire him

The great Shawn McAdam does the radio Sox pregame and it is spectacular to listen to as I get supper ready - he’s phenomenal and is plugged in. Last night was tremendous as he outlined the field identifying 4 specific guys but mostly long shots.

He did say if Romero didn’t get he could see him leaving. Shawn like Speier and Gammons are all high on Romero.

Sure seems like Dombrowski would have been out after season but he walked into ‘their’ camp unsuspecting to them and wanted an answer. I don’t blame him. When he realized he was going to be out he left the park and the ownership didn’t issue a proper statement and address Monday like they should.

Sounds like the owners weren’t happy with the overpayments on trades like Kimball and Thornberg (I remember reading HF after both and many of you guys called it at that time as well)

The Sale deal they went along with although it went against what Henry said about pitchers over 30 to long term deals.

Regardless he’s out

The best news to come out of 2019 is

1. Xander Bogearts is signed long term

2. Rafael Devers is a star

3. We know exactly what Mookie Betts is and I think Betts does as well - a phenomenal leadoff hitter

That could be significant in keeping him

I believe he’s both accepted it and embraced it

He’s not Trout but Trout is not Betts

Like comparing a Lion to a panther

Both majestic in their own way

My Cabin in the Woods script

1. Romero if he’s as good as advertised

2. Pay Betts

He’s your leading man, and leadoff hitter and you own a TV station that is ratings driven for advertising dollars

He warrants close to Trout money

3. Call Boras bluff

Martinez said during Jimmy Fund telethon the Red Sox are his favorite team and Scott Boras thought the idea of opt outs was a good idea / he was sheepish when he said this

NO ONE stepped forward when JD Martinez was a 30 year old FA coming off 45 homers in Arizona when he could still play outfield

At 32 with a wonky back and diminishing skills in the field that all but relegates him to DH as well as a $23 M contract for several years his landing spot is limited to US in my view

The Yankees are already saying Miguel Andujar a spectacular young cheap hitter out all year with surgery will most likely DH next year as Geo Urshela plays 3B (assuming he’s not busted for PED)

The Yankees will soon have their Toronto Maple Leafs like Taveras/Marner/Matthews eating 1/2 their cap when the dust settles in a few years with Stanton $32 M thru 2028 and Gleyber Torres/Aaron Judge pay days

I’m optimistic

They need

1. Capable leadership
2. Stability
3. Blue print/plan
4. You pay Betts
 

BNHL

Registered User
Dec 22, 2006
20,017
1,458
Boston
Been hearing about Eddie Romero Jr for years as a star of the organization

If he has what it takes they should hire him

The great Shawn McAdam does the radio Sox pregame and it is spectacular to listen to as I get supper ready - he’s phenomenal and is plugged in. Last night was tremendous as he outlined the field identifying 4 specific guys but mostly long shots.

He did say if Romero didn’t get he could see him leaving. Shawn like Speier and Gammons are all high on Romero.

Sure seems like Dombrowski would have been out after season but he walked into ‘their’ camp unsuspecting to them and wanted an answer. I don’t blame him. When he realized he was going to be out he left the park and the ownership didn’t issue a proper statement and address Monday like they should.

Sounds like the owners weren’t happy with the overpayments on trades like Kimball and Thornberg (I remember reading HF after both and many of you guys called it at that time as well)

The Sale deal they went along with although it went against what Henry said about pitchers over 30 to long term deals.

Regardless he’s out

The best news to come out of 2019 is

1. Xander Bogearts is signed long term

2. Rafael Devers is a star

3. We know exactly what Mookie Betts is and I think Betts does as well - a phenomenal leadoff hitter

That could be significant in keeping him

I believe he’s both accepted it and embraced it

He’s not Trout but Trout is not Betts

Like comparing a Lion to a panther

Both majestic in their own way

My Cabin in the Woods script

1. Romero if he’s as good as advertised

2. Pay Betts

He’s your leading man, and leadoff hitter and you own a TV station that is ratings driven for advertising dollars

He warrants close to Trout money

3. Call Boras bluff

Martinez said during Jimmy Fund telethon the Red Sox are his favorite team and Scott Boras thought the idea of opt outs was a good idea / he was sheepish when he said this

NO ONE stepped forward when JD Martinez was a 30 year old FA coming off 45 homers in Arizona when he could still play outfield

At 32 with a wonky back and diminishing skills in the field that all but relegates him to DH as well as a $23 M contract for several years his landing spot is limited to US in my view

The Yankees are already saying Miguel Andujar a spectacular young cheap hitter out all year with surgery will most likely DH next year as Geo Urshela plays 3B (assuming he’s not busted for PED)

The Yankees will soon have their Toronto Maple Leafs like Taveras/Marner/Matthews eating 1/2 their cap when the dust settles in a few years with Stanton $32 M thru 2028 and Gleyber Torres/Aaron Judge pay days

I’m optimistic

They need

1. Capable leadership
2. Stability
3. Blue print/plan
4. You pay Betts

Great post,I agree that the front nine is championship caliber. The starting pitching is a colossal mess outside of Erod. None of them are at all reliable,all of them have lost consistent velocity,and Sale's arm is gonna fall off any day now. Friggin disaster. How do they rearm?
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
Great post,I agree that the front nine is championship caliber. The starting pitching is a colossal mess outside of Erod. None of them are at all reliable,all of them have lost consistent velocity,and Sale's arm is gonna fall off any day now. Friggin disaster. How do they rearm?
You have to get Sale, Price and Eovoldi to perform even if 2 of 3

Cleveland lose Kluber, Carrasco, and trade Bauer yet have internal replacements

I’m running the baseball ops I’m watching how the A’s continue to piece pitching staffs together

Average pitching they win 95 games

My marketing campaign would be JD Martinez in middle and on each side two young stars - Betts & Benintendi/ Bogearts & Devers

You got that group you can kick ass with any pitching
 

KrejciMVP

Registered User
Jun 30, 2011
28,422
9,964
Tampa, Florida
to a degree I can understand the Sale signing. He's got ace potential and a high ceiling and if he can get healthy and turn it around I think the deal can still be good, really depends on the arm. I think going forward he might be a great closer which they don't have. Eovaldi is looking like a bad deal, he was so dominant and reliable in the playoffs, it put the Sox in a hit or miss situation and it looks like a big miss extending him.

I think the early bullpen problems demoralized the team early. Lots of blown saves. I think if they had more bullpen help they could have gotten off to a better start

Keep JD, he's the cog in the middle of the lineup that makes all the other hitters better so they can see more pitchers.

I saw nothing that warranted Dombrowski being fired except the Henry needing a scapegoat for the season
 
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BNHL

Registered User
Dec 22, 2006
20,017
1,458
Boston
You have to get Sale, Price and Eovoldi to perform even if 2 of 3

Cleveland lose Kluber, Carrasco, and trade Bauer yet have internal replacements

I’m running the baseball ops I’m watching how the A’s continue to piece pitching staffs together

Average pitching they win 95 games

My marketing campaign would be JD Martinez in middle and on each side two young stars - Betts & Benintendi/ Bogearts & Devers

You got that group you can kick ass with any pitching
The pitching has put too much pressure on the offense. I'm disgusted with the entire staff,outside of Workman and Erod. At one point we had all 3 top starters with mechanical problems,unless that's code for velocity loss. Levangie should be shown the door. I'm not a big Benintendi fan,thought he would be a .300 hitter with 25 HR power,but he's had a mediocre year. JBJ is the greatest all around CF,the Sox have ever had,but his bat is not MLB caliber 70% of the time. I think the Sox will shop him,we've seen him benched frequently lately.
 

TrashPanda

Registered User
Feb 24, 2019
165
144
Yankees are paying Stanton thru 2028 basically $32 M per

Judge if he averages 40 homers

$25-30 M

They have Hicks 7/$70

0.0 they are paying Betts $30 M. The Red Sox will win the 2019 WS before the Yankees sign Betts

Gleyber Torres
Gary Sanchez


Yankees will be in trouble to stay under cap with an OF of Gardner/Tachman- Hicks - Stanton- Judge

I agree that Betts to the Yankees is 0.0. But for almost none of these reasons.

Betts won't make it to UFA, IMO. Either he signs for the 90% of Trout contract (even if he's isn't 90% of Trout) with Boston, or they trade him to another team who gives him that deal.

If he makes it to UFA, that number goes up. Not substantially, this isn't the 80s with George Steinbrenner, but it's not 0.0.

If Stanton doesn't opt out, and there's no reason to believe he will, the Marlins kick in $30m and the AAV on his contract is $23m per. It was a big reason why they made that trade rather than diving into UFA this year with Harper/Machado.

Hicks's contract is either tradeable if he recovers from his elbow injury, and eatable if they don't.

Tauchman isn't a barrier to a Betts signing.

Judge I believe will be 31 when he hits UFA. Since the evidence of a guy his size holding up in the outfield might be isolated to Giancarlo Stanton, it's not a lock he gets a mega deal at UFA.

I'll grant you Sanchez/Torres, and though they print more money than they could spend, they haven't been very inclined to do so the latter half of this decade. This is why I'd put it somewhere between 10-15% rather than the stone cold lock of a Boston mega star making it to FA in his prime it used to be.
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
I agree that Betts to the Yankees is 0.0. But for almost none of these reasons.

Betts won't make it to UFA, IMO. Either he signs for the 90% of Trout contract (even if he's isn't 90% of Trout) with Boston, or they trade him to another team who gives him that deal.

If he makes it to UFA, that number goes up. Not substantially, this isn't the 80s with George Steinbrenner, but it's not 0.0.

If Stanton doesn't opt out, and there's no reason to believe he will, the Marlins kick in $30m and the AAV on his contract is $23m per. It was a big reason why they made that trade rather than diving into UFA this year with Harper/Machado.

Hicks's contract is either tradeable if he recovers from his elbow injury, and eatable if they don't.

Tauchman isn't a barrier to a Betts signing.

Judge I believe will be 31 when he hits UFA. Since the evidence of a guy his size holding up in the outfield might be isolated to Giancarlo Stanton, it's not a lock he gets a mega deal at UFA.

I'll grant you Sanchez/Torres, and though they print more money than they could spend, they haven't been very inclined to do so the latter half of this decade. This is why I'd put it somewhere between 10-15% rather than the stone cold lock of a Boston mega star making it to FA in his prime it used to be.
I agree Betts will not make it to FA here

I expect he will sign very close to Trout contract

And should
 

TrashPanda

Registered User
Feb 24, 2019
165
144
You have to get Sale, Price and Eovoldi to perform even if 2 of 3

Cleveland lose Kluber, Carrasco, and trade Bauer yet have internal replacements

I’m running the baseball ops I’m watching how the A’s continue to piece pitching staffs together

Average pitching they win 95 games

My marketing campaign would be JD Martinez in middle and on each side two young stars - Betts & Benintendi/ Bogearts & Devers

You got that group you can kick ass with any pitching

You should market JD like you did earlier " 32 year old DH with a wonky back and diminishing skills in the field.

When you mean kick ass with any pitching, any means any decent right, i.e. not what they tossed out there this year?

Kidding aside. There's no reason a team with Betts/Boegarts/Devers and any sort of clue in the player development space shouldn't contend to be a super team year in/year out.

As a baseball fan, I'm fascinated by an Astros/Yankees ALCS, because while both teams bludgeon the ball, they go about run prevention in very different ways. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Yankees didn't get more than 2 wins from their starters in a full postseason run this year whereas the Astros are going to roll out Verlander/Cole/Greinke 6(+?) times in a 7 game series. Going into this offseason either the Yankees or Dodgers is going to come out of this 3 year mini era of the super team with 0 championships.

Now watch Oakland and Minnesota upset both of them and play the Nationals in the series.
 

KrejciMVP

Registered User
Jun 30, 2011
28,422
9,964
Tampa, Florida
You should market JD like you did earlier " 32 year old DH with a wonky back and diminishing skills in the field.

When you mean kick ass with any pitching, any means any decent right, i.e. not what they tossed out there this year?

Kidding aside. There's no reason a team with Betts/Boegarts/Devers and any sort of clue in the player development space shouldn't contend to be a super team year in/year out.

As a baseball fan, I'm fascinated by an Astros/Yankees ALCS, because while both teams bludgeon the ball, they go about run prevention in very different ways. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Yankees didn't get more than 2 wins from their starters in a full postseason run this year whereas the Astros are going to roll out Verlander/Cole/Greinke 6(+?) times in a 7 game series. Going into this offseason either the Yankees or Dodgers is going to come out of this 3 year mini era of the super team with 0 championships.

Now watch Oakland and Minnesota upset both of them and play the Nationals in the series.

It's been a long time since Minnesota and Oakland made any playoff noise and they've had many chances. Probably Dave Stewart and Jack Morris days are the last time they won a meaningful series
 

TrashPanda

Registered User
Feb 24, 2019
165
144
I agree Betts will not make it to FA here

I expect he will sign very close to Trout contract

And should

I think it's nuts that he hasn't been signed already. Unless he's asking for Trout+ or he just flat out doesn't like Boston.

He's already won a series in Boston, over the course of a 10 year deal I'd expect him to win at least one more. He could probably surpass Trout by opening a chain of Mookie's Bowlarama's (or a combo bowling/sports betting place called Betts and Balls?) when all is said and done if he stays.

Now, am I enjoying how nervous this is making my Sox fan friends? Absolutely!
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
I think it's nuts that he hasn't been signed already. Unless he's asking for Trout+ or he just flat out doesn't like Boston.

He's already won a series in Boston, over the course of a 10 year deal I'd expect him to win at least one more. He could probably surpass Trout by opening a chain of Mookie's Bowlarama's (or a combo bowling/sports betting place called Betts and Balls?) when all is said and done if he stays.

Now, am I enjoying how nervous this is making my Sox fan friends? Absolutely!
Didn’t realize about Judge

Older then thought

Yankees have leverage

I thought Bogearts was a bigger flight risk and he signed and said he loved it here
 

DKH

The Bergeron of HF
Feb 27, 2002
73,961
51,460
You should market JD like you did earlier " 32 year old DH with a wonky back and diminishing skills in the field.

When you mean kick ass with any pitching, any means any decent right, i.e. not what they tossed out there this year?

Kidding aside. There's no reason a team with Betts/Boegarts/Devers and any sort of clue in the player development space shouldn't contend to be a super team year in/year out.

As a baseball fan, I'm fascinated by an Astros/Yankees ALCS, because while both teams bludgeon the ball, they go about run prevention in very different ways. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the Yankees didn't get more than 2 wins from their starters in a full postseason run this year whereas the Astros are going to roll out Verlander/Cole/Greinke 6(+?) times in a 7 game series. Going into this offseason either the Yankees or Dodgers is going to come out of this 3 year mini era of the super team with 0 championships.

Now watch Oakland and Minnesota upset both of them and play the Nationals in the series.
Cleveland is dangerous with Shane Bieber looking like a Cy Young winner
 

TrashPanda

Registered User
Feb 24, 2019
165
144
At least one of those teams is going to come out of the DECADE with 0 championships.

The Dodgers thing is funnier to me (mostly because I'm a Yankees fan). They've essentially been the NL's only super team during that time span. 7 postseason appearances. 6 times in the NLCS since 2008 (I'd be stunned if they didn't make it 7 this year).

And the Giants make the postseason 4 times and win 3 championships.
 

EverettMike

FIRE DON SWEENEY INTO THE SUN
Mar 7, 2009
44,242
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Everett, MA
twitter.com
I think it's nuts that he hasn't been signed already. Unless he's asking for Trout+ or he just flat out doesn't like Boston.

He's already won a series in Boston, over the course of a 10 year deal I'd expect him to win at least one more. He could probably surpass Trout by opening a chain of Mookie's Bowlarama's (or a combo bowling/sports betting place called Betts and Balls?) when all is said and done if he stays.

Now, am I enjoying how nervous this is making my Sox fan friends? Absolutely!

You're way out of line.
 

TrashPanda

Registered User
Feb 24, 2019
165
144
Didn’t realize about Judge

Older then thought

Yankees have leverage

I thought Bogearts was a bigger flight risk and he signed and said he loved it here

100% agree with you on Bogaerts vs. Betts flight risk. I'd have thought Betts would have been done before Harper/Machado and shortly after Stanton. Boston prints money, he seems like a good dude and an amazing player. (Not saying Xander isn't). At least with Betts if there are 10 "big market" teams that can afford his contract, that's 30 spots because he can seamlessly play all 3 OF spots. With Xander and the Shortstop boom, 8 or 9 of those teams might be like, Bogaerts is amazing, but we also like our guy.

I wonder with their weak division, stockpile of young prospects, and near misses on both Machado and Harper that the White Sox are the danger team were he ever to make free agency.
 
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