HF Habs: 2019 Montreal Canadiens Training Camp

[admiralcadillac]

Not a single poster has ever argued players have 0 share of responsibility in their development. That's a fictional talking point made by guys who liked to defend the management.

This post is so f***ing ironic

I wasnt on board with Kotkaniemi making the team. Hed be further ahead today if he stayed in Liiga. Now he has no confidence. He doesnt play to his...

I don’t see how you can know that

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

You can't grab a player by the arm to make him sign here. It's well known Montréal is not a number one destination for many players.
Which quality player would've signed here these last 3 years? I mean.. I'm not really a Bergevin fan either but the reality is here.
Though, the future is brighter now with all them talented kids, it might be a different story next summer depending on the season they have.

Free agency isn't the only avenue. GMs can make trades. PK Subban was available for cap space this year. We could've added him and flipped Petry for a LD. All of a sudden we'd have a strong D and a chance to win something.

Instead we get Chariot (Alzner 2.0) and waste 3 mil in capspace on a mediocre filler. Makes no sense.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

He tried to sign Gardiner, offersheet Aho, probably many offers we don't know about. It's not like he didn't try and did absolutely nothing.

What would you have prefered?

Let's be honest. He did absolutely nothing.

Did he try? I guess. But his 'trades are hard' act wore thin about five years ago.

 

[Milhouse40]

Please stop putting our best centre prospects at wing. Poehling and Suzuki belong in the centre of the ice with guys like weal and Gallagher and domi who also can play wing/centre.

So true...for many years this organization used their prospect to fill the holes that this GM created.

Enough of this crap.

Put the kids where he is comfortable. If there's no place, then trade the kid or if he's better than the one in place, trade that vet.

The Shaw trade left a hole on the RW but it's not those prospect that have to pay for that.

 

[Archijerej]

PK Subban was available for cap space this year. We could've added him and flipped Petry for a LD.

Which team was on the market looking to swap a LD for a player of Petry's description? What LDs are talking about here, specifically?

 

[Habs Icing]

Please stop putting our best centre prospects at wing. Poehling and Suzuki belong in the centre of the ice with guys like weal and Gallagher and domi who also can play wing/centre.

Until further developments Domi belongs at center. Posters wanting to put him on the wing just makes me want to scream out my window. Please stop posting such nonsense. My neighbours are getting worried that someone is beating me in my own home.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Which team was on the market looking to swap a LD for a player of Petry's description? What LDs are talking about here, specifically?

Please stop with this stuff.

There's no way to "specifically" know which player is available for what. Shea Weber for example wasn't available until we offered Nashville PK Subban.

Other teams make trades. Other teams address the holes they have. There's nothing preventing us from doing this too - other than the fact that we have a really shitty GM.

 

[Tyson]

The intensity is about to ramp up...which prospect will handle it?

 

[Milhouse40]

Until further developments Domi belongs at center. Posters wanting to put him on the wing just makes me want to scream out my window. Please stop posting such nonsense. My neighbours are getting worried that someone is beating me in my own home.

You know that Domi is one of the smallest center in the entire NHL.

Two of the big difference between center and wing is that you have to be good in your own zone and take faceoffs.

Domi completely sucks at faceoffs and is ordinary in his own zone.

Not a knock on Domi at all, one of my favorite Habs but if you want to keep him at center. No problem but tell me who we are trading between KK, Suzuki and Poehling cause i'm sure not going to waste their value by playing them out of position or on the bottom line

 

[DangerDave]

The intensity is about to ramp up...which prospect will handle it?

Pretty confident in Fleury, Poehling and Suzuki in particular. Leskinen the dark horse this camp.

 

[Habs Icing]

Please stop with this stuff.

There's no way to "specifically" know which player is available for what. Shea Weber for example wasn't available until we offered Nashville PK Subban.

Other teams make trades. Other teams address the holes they have. There's nothing preventing us from doing this too - other than the fact that we have a really ****ty GM.

Or maybe you should stop it. That was a legit question. He asked you what team needs a RD that would be willing or is in a position to trade a LD. You create these pie in sky trades that are possible only in your make-believe world and then blame MB for not making the trades. And when you are asked for examples, you go off the handle.

 

[Habs Icing]

You know that Domi is one of the smallest center in the entire NHL.

Two of the big difference between center and wing is that you have to be good in your own zone and take faceoffs.

Domi completely sucks at faceoffs and is ordinary in his own zone.

Not a knock on Domi at all, one of my favorite Habs but if you want to keep him at center. No problem but tell me who we are trading between KK, Suzuki and Poehling cause i'm sure not going to waste their value by playing them out of position or on the bottom line

I agree he needs to work on his face-offs and the last two games of pre-season I think he has shown improvement. I haven't checked the numbers. But this nonsense that he is ordinary in defense has to stop. Have you taken a look at his +/- numbers from last year. And that was with Drouin on his left-wing for 2/3s of the year. He isn't Bergeron but he is more than adequate on the defensive side of the game.

 

[Milhouse40]

I agree he needs to work on his face-offs and the last two games of pre-season I think he has shown improvement. I haven't checked the numbers. But this nonsense that he is ordinary in defense has to stop. Have you taken a look at his +/- numbers from last year. And that was with Drouin on his left-wing for 2/3s of the year. He isn't Bergeron but he is more than adequate on the defensive side of the game.

Then why he didn't PK minutes?

Domi and Drouin was on a sheltered line while Danault line was facing the thougher one. The micro managing as to stop.

Domi was adequate but he wasn't good either. He kept playing down low while a center must stay up high most the time.

But as i said...i don't habe a problem with it. But all i see is people wanting to keep both Domi and Danault as top 6 center....while we have kids waiting in the back and those kids aee either better and more suited for center ice.

Danault and Domi as top 6 center ain't good enough and we won't win with that. Last year it wasn't enough.

But if we want to keep those two...then fine but i'm start talking about trading KK for Laine or Suzuki for a D.

And for the one we got stats for...Domi was the worst at faceoffs with 40%....new kids are already above 50%

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Or maybe you should stop it. That was a legit question.

No it's not.

He asked me specifically who was available and what it would take to get him. There's no way to possibly know this without going out and actually having conversations with other GMs.

Is Darnell Nurse available? For sure he is - at the right price. What that price would be would depend on what we're offering back. Just for Petry? No. Petry ++ maybe...

Stop trying to convince people that "there's nobody available". There are ALWAYS players available for trade.

And it's BS that I haven't put forth trade proposals for LD. I certainly have. But I'm not going to watch the thread get derailed into something where it becomes a "what about this" "oh they'd never do that" type situation.

Bottom line is it's his JOB to make the team better. Sitting there and letting these open holes fester the way he has is a freaking joke.

 

[habsfan891]

I agree he needs to work on his face-offs and the last two games of pre-season I think he has shown improvement. I haven't checked the numbers. But this nonsense that he is ordinary in defense has to stop. Have you taken a look at his +/- numbers from last year. And that was with Drouin on his left-wing for 2/3s of the year. He isn't Bergeron but he is more than adequate on the defensive side of the game.

Fair enough which rookie are we trading then because there isnt enough room at center and like millhouse said its not their fault the GM cant plug holes so they shouldnt be forced into playing a position they dont want to or arent comfortable in especially when they project as better top 6 centers than what we currently have you cannot hold them back indefinitely

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

Which team was on the market looking to swap a LD for a player of Petry's description? What LDs are talking about here, specifically?

Winnipeg come to mind for a player like Heinola

 

[Milhouse40]

No it's not.

He asked me specifically who was available and what it would take to get him. There's no way to possibly know this without going out and actually having conversations with other GMs.

Is Darnell Nurse available? For sure he is - at the right price. What that price would be would depend on what we're offering back. Just for Petry? No. Petry ++ maybe...

Stop trying to convince people that "there's nobody available". There are ALWAYS players available for trade.

And it's BS that I haven't put forth trade proposals for LD. I certainly have. But I'm not going to watch the thread get derailed into something where it becomes a "what about this" "oh they'd never do that" type situation.

Bottom line is it's his JOB to make the team better. Sitting there and letting these open holes fester the way he has is a freaking joke.

Nobody thought that Weber was available....

 

[CheldishGamibno]

Free agency isn't the only avenue. GMs can make trades. PK Subban was available for cap space this year. We could've added him and flipped Petry for a LD. All of a sudden we'd have a strong D and a chance to win something.

Instead we get Chariot (Alzner 2.0) and waste 3 mil in capspace on a mediocre filler. Makes no sense.

Shitty GM. I can't agree.
Here's the players all part of our team right now that filled up some holes
Jordan Weal for Michael Chaput
Suzuki, Tatar, 2nd for Pac
Domi for Galchenyuk
Danault for scraps
Petry for a 2nd
Byron from waivers
Kulak for scraps
Armia for scraps
Weber for Subban (arguable. Subban being traded twice in 3 years gives many question marks)
Add to that all his recent draft picks.

Which LD for Petry? An available top 4 LD is a rare product and I'm pretty sure you know that. Even more rare is in a 1on1 trade for a RD.
Petry could be flipped for something way better at the trade deadline than during the offseason if the playoffs are out of reach this year, and if he keeps improving (fortunately) like we've seen last year.

I agree about the singings though, he's made many mistakes, Alzner, Drouin, probably Chiarot/Byron, Price to an extent but all in all, I just don't believe he's a shitty GM as a whole.

 

[Habs Icing]

No it's not.

He asked me specifically who was available and what it would take to get him. There's no way to possibly know this without going out and actually having conversations with other GMs.

Is Darnell Nurse available? For sure he is - at the right price. What that price would be would depend on what we're offering back. Just for Petry? No. Petry ++ maybe...

Stop trying to convince people that "there's nobody available". There are ALWAYS players available for trade.

You just gave a specific example which is all he asked for. Now if you can explain what those ++ are you might find that your trade is unrealistic. I like Nurse but he might not be worth Petry ++. It all depends on what you are willing to give with your ++.

 

[Tyson]

No it's not.

He asked me specifically who was available and what it would take to get him. There's no way to possibly know this without going out and actually having conversations with other GMs.

Is Darnell Nurse available? For sure he is - at the right price. What that price would be would depend on what we're offering back. Just for Petry? No. Petry ++ maybe...

Stop trying to convince people that "there's nobody available". There are ALWAYS players available for trade.

And it's BS that I haven't put forth trade proposals for LD. I certainly have. But I'm not going to watch the thread get derailed into something where it becomes a "what about this" "oh they'd never do that" type situation.

Bottom line is it's his JOB to make the team better. Sitting there and letting these open holes fester the way he has is a freaking joke.

Come on man you didn’t get the memo? “Trades are hard”

 

[Habs Icing]

Fair enough which rookie are we trading then because there isnt enough room at center and like millhouse said its not their fault the GM cant plug holes so they shouldnt be forced into playing a position they dont want to or arent comfortable in especially when they project as better top 6 centers than what we currently have you cannot hold them back indefinitely

Maybe Suzuki can take over from Domi - that's debatable. But Poehling will never replace Domi. He'll replace Danault - maybe. And for KK he hasn't shown me the offense you guys are raving about. I see him as #2 C. So we have

Domi
KK
Danault

as our centers and in that order. So whatever prospect center comes along he will have to play better than those centers in their designated roles. None of Suzuki, Poehling or Evans have done that yet.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Nobody thought that Weber was available....

Exactly my point.

****ty GM. I can't agree.
Here's the players all part of our team right now that filled up some holes
Jordan Weal for Michael Chaput
Suzuki, Tatar, 2nd for Pac
Domi for Galchenyuk
Danault for scraps
Petry for a 2nd
Byron from waivers
Kulak for scraps
Armia for scraps
Weber for Subban (arguable. Subban being traded twice in 3 years gives many question marks)
Add to that all his recent draft picks.

A bunch of lateral moves and unintentional tanks. Meanwhile we've had 9 mil in cap space two years running and a horrific defense in front of our 10 mil goalie.

Sorry, he doesn't get points for getting Kotkaniemi 3rd overall after an unintentional tank. The man has no plan.

Which LD for Petry? An available top 4 LD is a rare product and I'm pretty sure you know that. Even more rare is in a 1on1 trade for a RD.
Petry could be flipped for something way better at the trade deadline than during the offseason if the playoffs are out of reach this year, and if he keeps improving (fortunately) like we've seen last year.

Tons of teams would be interested in Petry. And if you packaged him with Drouin then there'd be an even bigger market. It's the GMs job to go out and do this stuff.

Adding Subban would've given us a killer right side. It would've costed us nothing more than cap space and our GM even could've crowed about having gotten him back essentially for "free."

Hell, we could've just tried Petry on the left side if wanted to.

I agree about the singings though, he's made many mistakes, Alzner, Drouin, probably Chiarot/Byron, Price to an extent but all in all, I just don't believe he's a ****ty GM as a whole.

He's among the worst GMs this team has ever had.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

You just gave a specific example which is all he asked for. Now if you can explain what those ++ are you might find that your trade is unrealistic. I like Nurse but he might not be worth Petry ++. It all depends on what you are willing to give with your ++.

That's what the trade proposal thread is for. Bottom line is that you want to derail the main point - our GM is quite happy to sit there with huge holes on his roster and make excuses for his own inaction. That's not what you want in a GM.

There are tons of blueliners who've been rumoured to be available right now. We just don't want to pay the price. Our GM is cheap. That's why he played games with Radulov's contract and we watched him and Markov walk.

His "trades are hard" and "nobody is available" lines are crap. Other GMs are able to do this. There's no reason we can't.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Free agency isn't the only avenue. GMs can make trades. PK Subban was available for cap space this year. We could've added him and flipped Petry for a LD. All of a sudden we'd have a strong D and a chance to win something.

Instead we get Chariot (Alzner 2.0) and waste 3 mil in capspace on a mediocre filler. Makes no sense.

While one can question the signing of Chariot, the last thing this team needed was reacquiring an expensive, aging and diminishing asset.

 

[japhi]

Can’t believe there are still people that believe the “natural position” myth.

Seriously, you would have thought this line of thought died with the Galchenyuk trade. Tens of thousands of posts on why he was a “natural” centre lol. Suzuki is the polar opposite to Galch but they are both nautural centres? Ok

Not everony can play C but anyone that can play C can excel at wing. It’s an EASIER position. Chemistry with your linemates, systems, utilization are all far more important then forward position.

While I agree Suzuki looks good at C, I would bet everything I own he would look great at RW assuming he has good linemates and utilization. The league is full of incredible wingers and I can live with him being a productive winger, considering how deep we are at C. Guys, take that in, we are deep at C, thats all that matters.