GDT: 2019 IIHF World Championship III (OP Warning)

[My3Sons]

Jack Hughes will be the best prospect we’ve ever had. Better scrutinize him to death and fearmonger about how scouts are wrong sometimes.

How do you gut and sell fear like a fish?

 

[My3Sons]

That's an excellent point. I never really thought of that.

If it helps, I can say that I like to scream it to the mountaintops when I feel a player is sorely underrated. Some of these kids ranked in the 40-75 range get very little attention leading up to the draft, and when I see a kid like Jamieson Rees or John Beecher or Lassi Thomson who I feel deserves far more attention than they are receiving, I try to give it to them.

When I think prospects are highly overrated however, I would prefer not to call attention to it. It is troublesome to me to pick apart a teenager chasing a dream, even if I believe his game is flawed enough that it could prevent him from achieving this dream. There was a kid picked in the first round by Minnesota last year whom I felt shouldn't have even been considered as a top 100 pick overall. I'd prefer not to make fun of the kid, and instead tend to go after the executive who was behind the pick. And believe me, I have no problem ripping apart the utter incompetency of Wild GM Paul Fenton.

In the end, I'd guess that right now the entire Rees family follows me on Twitter now. Of course, they will unfollow me right after the draft. But it must be nice for them to read one very minor draft writer constantly writing that their kid is much better than most people realize and should be a first-round pick.

Enough with the uncovering unpolished gems. Don’t you think you are making Castron’s job that much harder? If you’d just say awful things about Seider and some of the other under appreciated guys and push those narratives hard to the public and then called Castron to give him the real inside scoop I’m sure he’d thank you.

 

[JimEIV]

would you also allow that taking a step up in age/competition level requires an adjustment period? because kakko has had that adjustment period playing in a men's league all year and these are hughes' first games, with undesirable circumstances at that. have to assume that a player with elite skills and and elite hockey brain would be able to make those adjustments but it's not necessarily going to be in 5 games with limited minutes, no pp time and inconsistent linemates

That is for sure reasonable. But I don't think I want to have the same level of patience for player with supposed elite skills and an elite hockey brain as I might have with other players. I think at this point it is fair to say that he didn't adjust. And I don't know how you can't be left thinking how far is he and how long is this going to take?

 

[Call Me Al]

i mean i don't care if he is "just ok" next season so that could be a big difference between us. I'm more interested in when he and nico are both in their primes, so my expectation that they will be leading the team to the playoffs year in year out by say 2022 is the more interesting outcome to me. which is part of why this debate is frustrating but at the same time i understand the point of questioning who is better now

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

That is for sure reasonable. But I don't think I want to have the same level of patience for player with supposed elite skills and an elite hockey brain as I might have with other players. I think at this point it is fair to say that he didn't adjust. And I don't know how you can't be left thinking how far is he and how long is this going to take?

Here's where I mainly disagree with what youre saying. He has adjusted in games, against Germany he wasnt getting thrown around, he made some good plays, He looked quicker than any other player. Although he got knocked around against Slovakia, I thought that was his best game actually. He created a bunch of chances and looked as advertised, whether the scoresheet matched the play is another thing. I think your analysis of this tournament and his play is black and white and over dramatic.

 

[Call Me Al]

also it's not just needing the skill and the brain to adjust - i will readily admit that he needs to gain 15-20 lbs in order to get the most out of the rest of his skills, but i'm not worried about that happening even a little bit in the long term

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

also it's not just needing the skill and the brain to adjust - i will readily admit that he needs to gain 15-20 lbs in order to get the most out of the rest of his skills, but i'm not worried about that happening even a little bit in the long term

Elias Pettersson was 162 pounds at the combine in 2017... Im not worried about Hughes long term or even past his rookie year.

 

[BenedictGomez]

You know the answer, he wrote himself a couple pages back he hadn’t decided yet - which btw isn’t an outrageous POV to have at face value a month before the draft.

Now if your point is he has decided and is being misleading based on the last few pages of posts well, that may be true (I can’t reconcile the head and shoulders mantra with truly being undecided) but that’s arguing the poster, not the post or his points and we’re getting into the realm of keep personal issues with other posters off the board.

I also think you aren't coming up with some additional possibilities.

 

[devilsblood]

No, It doesn't. But I do think that is the teams decision and I wouldn't have a problem with it...I think I am leaning Jack but I really want it to be because I think so...Not because anyone says so.


3 weeks ago I was watching Hughes tear up the U18 and I just assumed he was the clear cut #1... Everyone was saying so..."Lose for Hughes", Right? I gave it no real consideration...I was more worried about the Devils season this year...

Then I saw some things that bother me a little bit during the U18 especially in the loss to Russia -- Holding on to the puck a little too long, trying to do things himself(Doing things yourself is the antithesis of "Vision" which has been so highly touted), making bad decisions with the puck, getting hit a little more than he had in the past games and not handling it particularly well. But I thought no big deal.

Then some of those things seemed a little more glaring against higher level of competition in this tournament. The turnovers became a little more prevalent... I don't think he adjusted well to less time and space...The attributes that everyone is saying make him the clear cut #1 should have shown a little better in my opinion, that is what I was expecting...While these are Pro's this isn't the cream of the crop...This isn't Crosby and Malkin coming at you in a March game with the playoffs on the line. Two weeks ago I started to think he was further behind than what everyone was saying.

So that is really where I am.

I actually liked that Hughes got a little greedy vs Russia. It showed (or reaffirmed given the 1st game of tourney play he def was more in attack mode) to me that if he wants to play a more goal scorers game he can. Did that lead to a few bad turnovers? Sure. Is that something you want him to do all the time? No, but clearly that is not his game 95% of the time anyways. Also don't forget he rang a couple off the pipes late vs Russia, my memory is foggy, but I'll assume he had some nice setups late in that game as well.

So Russia was a tough loss, Russia's goalie was excellent, USA was ringing shots off the iron, but that type of game is not uncommon in hockey. IMO that was no way a bad look for Hughes.

 

[NJDevs26]

Elias Pettersson was 162 pounds at the combine in 2017... Im not worried about Hughes long term or even past his rookie year.

And Pettersson didn't play in the NHL till his +1 year. Realistically that isn't going to happen with Hughes but it feeds into the not ready for the NHL now critique.

 

[devilsblood]

Elias Pettersson was 162 pounds at the combine in 2017... Im not worried about Hughes long term or even past his rookie year.

Agree, we are seeing so many small players excel that I'm not worried in the least about it. Hughes will get stronger and it will not be an issue.

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

And Pettersson didn't play in the NHL till his +1 year. Realistically that isn't going to happen with Hughes but it feeds into the not ready for the NHL now critique.

I understand he didnt play in the NHL but he played professional hockey against Men in the SHL and lit it up. so its a little best of both worlds for our current debate lol

 

[devilsblood]

That is for sure reasonable. But I don't think I want to have the same level of patience for player with supposed elite skills and an elite hockey brain as I might have with other players. I think at this point it is fair to say that he didn't adjust. And I don't know how you can't be left thinking how far is he and how long is this going to take?

Was he really given a chance to adjust? He was basically benched in his 3rd game.

 

[BenedictGomez]

I understand he didnt play in the NHL but he played professional hockey against Men in the SHL and lit it up.

And SHL >>>>>>> Liiga

 

[None Shall Pass]

Am I allowed to start a thread called "Prospect Discussion" to talk about the World Championship?

 

[zharkenby]

Anyone know if Hughes is playing tomorrow?

 

[devilsblood]

Am I allowed to start a thread called "Prospect Discussion" to talk about the World Championship?

I hear what your saying, except, as has been noted, no one would care about the WC's if it were not for Hughes and Kakko.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

And Pettersson didn't play in the NHL till his +1 year. Realistically that isn't going to happen with Hughes but it feeds into the not ready for the NHL now critique.

He also had 24 goals and 56 points in 44 games in the SHL. He was probably would’ve been good in the NHL too, there’s no way of knowing.

 

[JimEIV]

Was he really given a chance to adjust? He was basically benched in his 3rd game.

Man I really wish I had a dollar for every time a fan blamed the coach for a young struggling player.

 

[NJDevs26]

I hear what your saying, except, as has been noted, no one would care about the WC's if it were not for Hughes and Kakko.

Sad but true...and they ARE still playing. When they both get offed, ideally the discussion moves to the draft thread and/or other thread(s). But of course one or both probably make the Final now lol

 

[devilsblood]

Man I really wish I had a dollar for every time a fan blamed the coach for a young struggling player.

I thought he looked good in game 1. I'm pretty sure you agreed with me. I didn't see game 2, but by game 3 he wasn't even playing. Is 2 games, one in which he looked good, enough to adjust, or enough time to proclaim a player is struggling?

 

[OmNomNom]

Man I really wish I had a dollar for every time a fan blamed the coach for a young struggling player.

i blame JVR for not burying grade A chances

 

[JimEIV]

I can’t reconcile the head and shoulders mantra with truly being undecided

Curious why? Kakko is head and shoulders above Hughes right now...That doesn't mean it is going to remain that way.

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

 

[MadDevil]

Impressive Jim. Most impressive.