Speculation: 2019-20 Trade thread (NOT Tank Talk)

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Nor did I say it was... that was just the piece that has been some what discussed, by commendore

I was just suggesting if it was potentially part of a deal for Henrique.

When you lead with a name and just add ++ it implies the name is the main piece.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Trade Bait: Carolina Hurricanes' search intensifies for 'D' - TSN.ca

16. Derek Grant
48. Michael Del Zotto
49. Josh Manson

What, no David Ayres?

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

When you lead with a name and just add ++ it implies the name is the main piece.

Its the only part that was rumored... so why wouldn't I lead with it

would be awkard if I wrote ++ Milano

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Its the only part that was rumored... so why wouldn't I lead with it

would be awkard if I wrote ++ Milano

Or maybe when fringe players are being rumored available you don't propose a deal for an established player with value. The idea of Milan being available shouldn't get Bob think he might be able to move Rico. It should possibly get him thinking about whether he has a similar disappointing asset that might make a good swap.

 

[Goose of Reason]

No interest in trading Sprong for Milano. I really dont get why the coaching staff doesn't like him. Sure his defensive game isnt polished but when he was up this season he was skating his ass off, he passed the eye test and his CF% and CFrel in all situations were the best or top 3 on the team. We are starved for offense he should be given a legitimate shot.

 

[bsu]

No interest in trading Sprong for Milano. I really dont get why the coaching staff doesn't like him. Sure his defensive game isnt polished but when he was up this season he was skating his ass off, he passed the eye test and his CF% and CFrel in all situations were the best or top 3 on the team. We are starved for offense he should be given a legitimate shot.

Watch the Gulls

 

[JabbaJabba]

What, no David Ayres?

No way Carolina trades him.

Milano to the Ducks sounds a bit weird but I guess if he's in Torts' doghouse, they might use him to get a more experienced player for their playoff push. I would rather not swap Sprong with Milano as I don't want to give up on Sprong just yet, so I wonder if there would be other pieces that could interest Columbus.

 

[dracom]

Sprong isn't improving anything in the ahl he's still a selfish player that coasts on defense, the other night they were on the power play and he tried to go coast to coast 3 straight times and loss the puck each time ending the power play.

He was then benched

Sounds like Terry who frequently goes into the offensive on his own and loses the puck. We need players like Sprong who care about creating offense even if it means it doesn’t work every time. We have enough players who play it safe.

 

[DavidBL]

Milano for Sherwood to unite the Sherwood brothers?

 

[bsu]

Sounds like Terry who frequently goes into the offensive on his own and loses the puck. We need players like Sprong who care about creating offense even if it means it doesn’t work every time. We have enough players who play it safe.

Not on the powerplay and Terry backchecks, he is actually one of the best on the team at getting back with his stick.

I guess there's a reason why the Ducks are doing everything to develop Terry and Steel and Sprong is trapped on the 3rd line in the minors.

 

[dracom]

Not on the powerplay and Terry backchecks, he is actually one of the best on the team at getting back with his stick.

I guess there's a reason why the Ducks are doing everything to develop Terry and Steel and Sprong is trapped on the 3rd line in the minors.

Im sure there is a reason, but i doubt it’s because Sprong abilities. If it’s his attitude, then we’ll always be an average team if management is so opposed to have anyone who tries to create offense instead of just playing the safe way the coach wants.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Or maybe when fringe players are being rumored available you don't propose a deal for an established player with value. The idea of Milan being available shouldn't get Bob think he might be able to move Rico. It should possibly get him thinking about whether he has a similar disappointing asset that might make a good swap.

If we could get a value of 2 2nds + milano i take it and run.

I was lookin at it from columbus perspective what they might want, and the fact that we are open to trading henrique.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

No way Carolina trades him.

The thing is, the Leafs own him. And they are desperate!

 

[JabbaJabba]

The thing is, the Leafs own him. And they are desperate!

Oh yeah that's true. Dubas is probably working on a 6 years 8,4 millions per year deal as we speak.

 

[robbieboy3686]

Why? Production wise they are pretty similar. We don’t exactly need another underperforming left winger. Plus he’s older than Sprong.

It would seem like poor asset management to move one reclamation project for another one with less upside because you can’t get sprong to be a better player after one year. Milano doesnt fill a need here.

I’m just not seeing the reasoning why we would move the younger player with more potential who can fill a need for an older similar player who doesnt fill a need.

Because sprong , you can just see him, has an entitled attitude, he doesn’t fit in.

 

[duckpuck]

Sounds like Terry who frequently goes into the offensive on his own and loses the puck. We need players like Sprong who care about creating offense even if it means it doesn’t work every time. We have enough players who play it safe.

Most of the ducks forwards care about creating offense. Unfortunately, none of them are finishers. Sprong is the best finisher of all the young forwards - he needs to play on this team. Trading him for another young forward that seemingly can't finish (Milano) is not a help. Admittedly, I don't know much about Milano, but he doesn't seem like the answer to the ducks scoring woes.

If we could get a value of 2 2nds + milano i take it and run.

I was lookin at it from columbus perspective what they might want, and the fact that we are open to trading henrique.

That is awful for the ducks. Amazing how you consistently undervalue ducks players and overvalue second or lower round draft picks.

Henrique is the ducks top goal scorer (low bar but still true). Why would they trade him now for a mediocre player (arguably a draft bust) and 2 picks that are not likely to produce an NHL player for 3-4 years - if at all. Henrique will be a productive player for the next 3+ years and they don't have an obvious replacement at C who is ready now (could change next year). Your trade only makes sense if the ducks are in full tank mode and even then I think Henrique can return a better player or prospect than Milano - if not now then in the offseason.

 

[dracom]

Because sprong , you can just see him, has an entitled attitude, he doesn’t fit in.

So someone has confidence in themselves that makes them entitled?

 

[robbieboy3686]

So someone has confidence in themselves that makes them entitled?

Arrogance isn’t confidence.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Most of the ducks forwards care about creating offense. Unfortunately, none of them are finishers. Sprong is the best finisher of all the young forwards - he needs to play on this team. Trading him for another young forward that seemingly can't finish (Milano) is not a help. Admittedly, I don't know much about Milano, but he doesn't seem like the answer to the ducks scoring woes.



That is awful for the ducks. Amazing how you consistently undervalue ducks players and overvalue second or lower round draft picks.

Henrique is the ducks top goal scorer (low bar but still true). Why would they trade him now for a mediocre player (arguably a draft bust) and 2 picks that are not likely to produce an NHL player for 3-4 years - if at all. Henrique will be a productive player for the next 3+ years and they don't have an obvious replacement at C who is ready now (could change next year). Your trade only makes sense if the ducks are in full tank mode and even then I think Henrique can return a better player or prospect than Milano - if not now then in the offseason.

Amazing how some of you overate trade scenarios, I try to see the trades from both sides and what it will actually cost to get a trade done, not what I hope we will get.

If a trade is made for Henrique I assume itll be in the ball park of 2 2nds + prospect of some sort, Milano would be okay imo.

Look at the backes trade, I think I saw people suggesting 1st + andersson + beecher/studnika…. people laughed at the idea of 2nd + pulj/bensen for Kase… but we basically got that in the trade.


Maybe his value is more, but I don't think a team will give much more than that... and if he is moved that's what I expect the return to be.

 

[MMC]

It's at least 1st round pick or don't bother for me with Henrique. Would take 21 1st either unprotected or with an additional prospect. His value to us in terms of not having to rush anyone into the 2C spot is greater than what we'd be likely to get in a trade IMO. Once Steel, Zegras, Lundestrom, Groulx, 2020/21 pick, whoever becomes a 60 point + player, it makes sense to move Henrique.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

It's at least 1st round pick or don't bother for me with Henrique. Would take 21 1st either unprotected or with an additional prospect. His value to us in terms of not having to rush anyone into the 2C spot is greater than what we'd be likely to get in a trade IMO. Once Steel, Zegras, Lundestrom, Groulx, 2020/21 pick, whoever becomes a 60 point + player, it makes sense to move Henrique.

I could see a team get desperate and go to a 1st + range... but I think we will need a really desperate team.

Other than that if a trade gets done I feel like its 2 2nds + prospect... if we don't accept that type of trade then I assume hell be in Anaheim until draft/next deadline.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Amazing how some of you overate trade scenarios, I try to see the trades from both sides and what it will actually cost to get a trade done, not what I hope we will get.

This is why we tend to disagree. You're admitting you are always trying to get a deal done. That's how you get bent over. Nobody (especially on HF) is going to agree to pay top dollar when you ask for it. So you immediately handicap yourself by insisting on finding some kind of deal the other side will agree to. Occasionally you're in a position where you have to move a player (for various reasons). That's when you make the best deal you can, knowing you have to get it done. But when you aren't in that position, (and most of our currently discussed deals fall into this category) then it's dumb to decide you're going to find a common ground just to move guys. You should ask top dollar and be willing to say no unless you get what is a very good deal for you.

 

[duckpuck]

Amazing how some of you overate trade scenarios, I try to see the trades from both sides and what it will actually cost to get a trade done, not what I hope we will get.

If a trade is made for Henrique I assume itll be in the ball park of 2 2nds + prospect of some sort, Milano would be okay imo.

Look at the backes trade, I think I saw people suggesting 1st + andersson + beecher/studnika…. people laughed at the idea of 2nd + pulj/bensen for Kase… but we basically got that in the trade.


Maybe his value is more, but I don't think a team will give much more than that... and if he is moved that's what I expect the return to be.

Reasonable minds can differ about value. Henrique is tough because of the term and AAV on his contract. Maybe his value is what you think it is - but I think not when you consider that rentals are traded for 2nds + currently. I could be wrong.

But you don't just stop when opining about player value. You then take the next step of saying that the ducks should accept your value and make the trade - in your words "to get a trade done . . . it would be okay." In this case Henrique for 2 seconds and a busted prospect. You don't really see it from "both sides" - there is absolutely no reason for the ducks to trade Henrique now for your proposed return. Why would the ducks make that trade today? Why should the ducks make that trade today? You ignore those questions. Barring a tank, there is literally no reason for the ducks to trade him for your proposed return - even if you are correct in value.

Your version of the Kase discussions is revisionist in my opinion. Obviously, views varied, but not many people thought Kase would return a first + or even a first. Not at this point given the year Kase had.

Edit: I posted this after Dr. Johnny's post. He said it better than I did.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

This is why we tend to disagree. You're admitting you are always trying to get a deal done. That's how you get bent over. Nobody (especially on HF) is going to agree to pay top dollar when you ask for it. So you immediately handicap yourself by insisting on finding some kind of deal the other side will agree to. Occasionally you're in a position where you have to move a player (for various reasons). That's when you make the best deal you can, knowing you have to get it done. But when you aren't in that position, (and most of our currently discussed deals fall into this category) then it's dumb to decide you're going to find a common ground just to move guys. You should ask top dollar and be willing to say no unless you get what is a very good deal for you.

Most trades tend to fall under common ground in the mind of the GMs, I don't think any GM says

Hey let me trade X + Y to get Z, and completely fleece myself.

No one is going to pay top dollar for Henrique, we all know that... his contract is fine right now... but it has potential to be no soo good looking in the not too distant future.

We didn't have to move Kase, and I think majority of us thought that trade would look a lot different... and my guess is BM is pretty happy with the trade.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Reasonable minds can differ about value. Henrique is tough because of the term and AAV on his contract. Maybe his value is what you think it is - but I think not when you consider that rentals are traded for 2nds + currently. I could be wrong.

But you don't just stop when opining about player value. You then take the next step of saying that the ducks should accept your value and make the trade - in your words "to get a trade done . . . it would be okay." In this case Henrique for 2 seconds and a busted prospect. You don't really see it from "both sides" - there is absolutely no reason for the ducks to trade Henrique now for your proposed return. Why would the ducks make that trade today? Why should the ducks make that trade today? You ignore those questions. Barring a tank, there is literally no reason for the ducks to trade him for your proposed return - even if you are correct in value.

Your version of the Kase discussions is revisionist in my opinion. Obviously, views varied, but not many people thought Kase would return a first + or even a first. Not at this point given the year Kase had.

Edit: I posted this after Dr. Johnny's post. He said it better than I did.

I think a teams fan base looking to trade for Henrique would want to offer up
2nd + prosect
I think our fan base prob wants
1st + Prospect
middle ground is somewhere around
2 2nds + prospect

Do I think a trade gets done, /shrug idk... I guess it depends on BM thinks about Zegras… or how much he likes our chances of getting a guy like byfield who could likely play in the NHL next year.

We don't have to trade Henrique, but in his case I don't think that helps his value much because I don't think he is that desirable for a lot of teams... as his cap and term would be tough pill for most teams to swallow, and the teams that could/might want him... likely wouldn't risk their 1st for him as they are likely middle of the pack teams battling for playoffs.