2019-20 Roster Thread IV

[TheKingPin]

Good thing having Giroux in the system and Richards and Carter in the lineup didn't keep us from signing Danny Briere in 2007

We will win with depth my friend. I want our 3rd line to be better than most teams 2nd line.

Since we are on the topic of Nylander, imagine, if you will, a 20-21 lineup that has a Farabee - Frost - Nylander 3rd line

Chaching!!! Talking about waves! I’m with you man, I want two first lines a second line a third line.

 

[Rebels57]

Chaching!!! Talking about waves! I’m with you man, I want two first lines a second line a third line.

I want to f***ing overwhelm teams with our depth.

I want games won in the 1st period often, rather than lost in the 1st period often.

 

[TheKingPin]

I want to ****ing overwhelm teams with our depth.

I want games won in the 1st period often, rather than lost in the 1st period often.

You’d think AVs system with that lineup would be smothering. It would be so exciting to see.

 

[Stizzle]

Good thing having Giroux in the system and Richards and Carter in the lineup didn't keep us from signing Danny Briere in 2007

We will win with depth my friend. I want our 3rd line to be better than most teams 2nd line.

Since we are on the topic of Nylander, imagine, if you will, a 20-21 lineup that has a Farabee - Frost - Nylander 3rd line

That's nice. Except the situation the Flyers are in now is totally dissimilar to the one you referenced. That rebuild was thrown together out of thin air. Every piece was a necessity.

Today, we mostly have the pieces. Half the battle now will just be figuring out a way to retain enough cap flexibility to keep them all and grow them with proper roles.

Also, 90% of the posts on the last page have been about trading valuable assets we need, like Ghost or a 1st round pick, for a total luxury. Not a free agent signing.

By the way, where the f*** is @Striiker? He's usually the one who has to talk all the Holmgren's and Hakstol's off the ledge. I don't want this job.

 

[Rebels57]

That's nice. Except the situation the Flyers are in now is totally dissimilar to the one you referenced. That rebuild was thrown together out of thin air. Every piece was a necessity.

Today, we mostly have the pieces. Half the battle now will just be figuring out a way to retain enough cap flexibility to keep them all and grow them with proper roles.

Also, 90% of the posts on the last page have been about trading valuable assets we need, like Ghost or a 1st round pick, for a total luxury. Not a free agent signing.

By the way, where the **** is @Striiker? He's usually the one who has to talk all the Holmgren's and Hakstol's off the ledge. I don't want this job.

I get that you don't want to ever take a chance by making a single trade, but Fletcher doesn't feel that way, and we all know that. It doesn't have anything to do with members of this board being "Holmgren's." Moves are coming. Embrace the chaos.

 

[Laveuglette]

Hey, just a reminder. This guy exists.

Is that Jagr?

 

[BringBackHakstol]

I think people are really downplaying the impact that Frost and Farabee are looking very likely to have on this team within the next 2 years.

We really don’t need to be clogging up our squad with guys on huge 2nd\3rd contracts, at the expense of other solid pieces.

Our farm system was hot garbage in the first Holmgren rebuild era. Not the case anymore.

 

[deadhead]

If this year's playoffs taught us anything, it's that the speed/skill teams that lack grit are soon history.
So the first question when adding forwards, is whether they're going to swing the pendulum too far toward speed/skill.
I'd prefer Kapanen because he's a RW, he's cheaper and he's more likely to commit to a two way game.
We already have Voracek, JVR, and TK in the top 9, how many offense first forwards can we carry at one time?

 

[Rebels57]

I think people are really downplaying the impact that Frost and Farabee are looking very likely to have on this team within the next 2 years.

We really don’t need to be clogging up our squad with guys on huge 2nd\3rd contracts, at the expense of other solid pieces.

Our farm system was hot garbage in the first Holmgren rebuild era. Not the case anymore.

Not many are downplaying Frost and Farabee, but management isn't going to bank on their production in lieu of any external acquisitions. Ideally we add one top 6 forward plus 1 of them to the opening night lineup for next season.

 

[Stizzle]

I get that you don't want to ever take a chance by making a single trade, but Fletcher doesn't feel that way, and we all know that. It doesn't have anything to do with members of this board being "Holmgren's." Moves are coming. Embrace the chaos.

Yeah, ok.

 

[Curufinwe]

Are Frost aged 20 and Farabee aged 19 better prospects than Patrick was at age 19?

He has 61 points in 145 games in his first two years.

 

[Larry44]

Can't imagine the Leafs will trade Nylander right after signing him to that deal. If anything, I'd imagine they'd trade Nylander only to keep a guy like Kapanen around, not trade them together.

The Leafs have big cap problems, They have to pay Marner in a range just below what they paid Matthews and Tavares. They are not going to be able to keep Gardiner, who is UFA and will walk.

Nylander is a very skilled, fast player who is softer than butter left in the sun. He had a terrible year after holding out for $7Mx7.

I am certain they are going to trade Kadri. He effectively cost them first round losses to Boston the last two years with stupid suspensions. He is a key player for them, the depth a C that differentiated the Leafs from the Bruins. He was as good as gone as soon as he hit DeBrusk.

They also have to pay Johnsson and Kapanen who are RFAs and will command big raises in the $4-5M range.

My gut tells me they will trade Kadri and Kapanen, and keep Johnsson and Nylander - as probably can't find a buyer for Nylander.

I've thought a lot about whether Nylander would be a good value buy for the Flyers. He's tempting, but he really did suck all year and in the playoffs. We can't afford a guy with that salary blocking Frost and Patrick and we don't need him at all if he's only a RW.

Kadri? He would be a great Flyer: annoying, chirpy, fast and skilled - and Babcock taught him how to play D.

What would the cost be? That's the key.

 

[Rebels57]

The Leafs have big cap problems, They have to pay Marner in a range just below what they paid Matthews and Tavares. They are not going to be able to keep Gardiner, who is UFA and will walk.

Nylander is a very skilled, fast player who is softer than butter left in the sun. He had a terrible year after holding out for $7Mx7.

I am certain they are going to trade Kadri. He effectively cost them first round losses to Boston the last two years with stupid suspensions. He is a key player for them, the depth a C that differentiated the Leafs from the Bruins. He was as good as gone as soon as he hit DeBrusk.

They also have to pay Johnsson and Kapanen who are RFAs and will command big raises in the $4-5M range.

My gut tells me they will trade Kadri and Kapanen, and keep Johnsson and Nylander - as probably can't find a buyer for Nylander.

I've thought a lot about whether Nylander would be a good value buy for the Flyers. He's tempting, but he really did suck all year and in the playoffs. We can't afford a guy with that salary blocking Frost and Patrick and we don't need him at all if he's only a RW.

Kadri? He would be a great Flyer: annoying, chirpy, fast and skilled - and Babcock taught him how to play D.

What would the cost be? That's the key.

Good post. Kadri at a discount relative to his actual on-ice value is definitely appealing.

 

[Magua]

I get that you don't want to ever take a chance by making a single trade, but Fletcher doesn't feel that way, and we all know that. It doesn't have anything to do with members of this board being "Holmgren's." Moves are coming. Embrace the chaos.

Better hope it's not a garbage move while embracing that chaos.

Are Frost aged 20 and Farabee aged 19 better prospects than Patrick was at age 19?

He has 61 points in 145 games in his first two years.

I don't know. Was Brayden Point a better prospect age 19-20 than Sam Reinhart?

It's not the impossibility you're making out that they are better, either faster or in general. And Patrick is still a heckuva talent. And that doesn't void acquiring the right fit player.

 

[Rebels57]

Better hope it's not a garbage move while embracing that chaos.



I don't know. Was Brayden Point a better prospect age 19-20 than Sam Reinhart?

It's not the impossibility you're making out that they are better, either faster or in general. And Patrick is still a heckuva talent. And that doesn't void acquiring the right fit player.

My fingers are permanently crossed.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Good post. Kadri at a discount relative to his actual on-ice value is definitely appealing.

I hate his ability to lose playoff games all on his own.

 

[Tripod]

I avoid Nylander, just for the fact that at 6.9 million, it distorts our future RFA numbers. He is a 69 point guy, who got those points playing with Matthews. That scares me.

I would much rather Kapanen not only because he would be cheaper to acquire and sign, but he would help our team speed and be used in the PK.

But ultimately, we really need someone who can play at C if Frost is not ready to start the season, and Kap is not that. But could you do a Kap and Marleau deal where essentially you take the cap hit of Marleau, to get Kap at a better price. Then you play Marleau as the #3 C if Frost is not ready to start. Definition of a stopgap.

Just throwing ideas out there.

 

[Rebels57]

I avoid Nylander, just for the fact that at 6.9 million, it distorts our future RFA numbers. He is a 69 point guy, who got those points playing with Matthews. That scares me.

I would much rather Kapanen not only because he would be cheaper to acquire and sign, but he would help our team speed and be used in the PK.

But ultimately, we really need someone who can play at C if Frost is not ready to start the season, and Kap is not that. But could you do a Kap and Marleau deal where essentially you take the cap hit of Marleau, to get Kap at a better price. Then you play Marleau as the #3 C if Frost is not ready to start. Definition of a stopgap.

Just throwing ideas out there.

This is intriguing, but Marleau would have to waive his NMC.

 

[Tripod]

This is intriguing, but Marleau would have to waive his NMC.

And he ugh that if he sees that we are adding AV as coach, then him and Kap, and if we added a D beforehand, it becomes a bigger possibility.

But honestly, I think we can add a F thru FA and a D thru trade.

 

[deadhead]

Do not want Marleau, stick a fork in him.

Nylander is not only expensive, but you have to ask how would he score here.

If he's a 40 ES scorer and on the 2nd PP unit, you're paying $6.9M for a so-so 2C with a questionable commitment to defense, similar to Duchene, lower cap cost but a big asset hit.

If we can only afford to add one major long-term salary, who should it be, an offensive center, two way forward or a defenseman.
Now if you could move out Voracek, then adding Nylander makes more sense, trading one expensive scorer with a younger, faster, cheaper version.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Gardiner seems like a whipping boy in Toronto. I still think he is a good middle pairing guy. Its just the Leafs team D is brutal and its Gardiner who gets the blame.
They really need to trade Nylander for defense. Not sure if Dubas will ever get that tho

 

[bobbythebrain]

Gardiner seems like a whipping boy in Toronto. I still think he is a good middle pairing guy. Its just the Leafs team D is brutal and its Gardiner who gets the blame.
They really need to trade Nylander for defense. Not sure if Dubas will ever get that tho

I agree with this...but he most definitely deserves the blame as the bizzaro Justin "Mr. Game 7" Williams

 

[Tripod]

Gardiner seems like a whipping boy in Toronto. I still think he is a good middle pairing guy. Its just the Leafs team D is brutal and its Gardiner who gets the blame.
They really need to trade Nylander for defense. Not sure if Dubas will ever get that tho

-10 in 3 game 7's.

He produces at ES, can move and skate the puck out. But he makes bad decisions in the DZ.

They...and US....need a Dman that is actually good defensively in the D zone. People can talk about net this and that, but giving up grade A chances against is a bad thing. Having that solid Dman playing NEXT to a Gardiner would be ideal as they can cover each other's weaknesses.

 

[wasup]

Gardiner seems like a whipping boy in Toronto. I still think he is a good middle pairing guy. Its just the Leafs team D is brutal and its Gardiner who gets the blame.
They really need to trade Nylander for defense. Not sure if Dubas will ever get that tho

I put Nylander in the same boat Ehlers , they fly around all season touching no one but putting up some points then playoffs start and they disappear . If we are going after someone try going after somebody with playoffs in mind not just scoring stats in regular season .

 

[Larry44]

Gardiner seems like a whipping boy in Toronto. I still think he is a good middle pairing guy. Its just the Leafs team D is brutal and its Gardiner who gets the blame.
They really need to trade Nylander for defense. Not sure if Dubas will ever get that tho

I don't mind Gardiner, but he is noted for catastrophic screw ups. He skates miles and miles and has improved on D.