2019-20 Roster Speculation Part 13: 1 Less D

[SundherDome]

You dont give up that for hertl.

I would, easily. I would ask for a little something back but the premise is there.

 

[Jame]

You dont give up that for hertl.

It depends how you value those assets. I personally think very little of Montour, and have serious doubts about Mitts development.

I do that deal because Hertl completely changes our roster. And the assets we give up... didn’t

 

[Buffaloed]

Hertl or Zibanejad seem like the ideal, too good to be true, targets.
- Both have 2 seasons remaining after this year (natural bridges to Cozens or lessl likely Mitts resurrection)
- Both are on teams that are either in or headed to some form of rebuilding
- Both are experienced 1st line centers in their prime

SJs reported desperation in acquiring a 1st is certainly exciting, but a 1st alone doesn't sniff Hertl.

1st, Mitts, Montour for Hertl?

That's essentially 4 first rounders for Hertl... In my experience, this board doesn't have the stomach for that type of move

I'd do it. The 1st has to be lottery protected. Montour is expendable and too expensive. I'd really like to see Borgen here next season. I don't expect Mitts to amount to much. If the Sabres can snag Hertl at the deadline I think they can void the modified NTC due to kick in the following season. If he can't be extended it won't be a situation where the player dictates where he can be trade.

 

[tsujimoto74]

I'd do it. The 1st has to be lottery protected. Montour is expendable and too expensive. I'd really like to see Borgen here next season. I don't expect Mitts to amount to much. If the Sabres can snag Hertl at the deadline I think they can void the modified NTC due to kick in the following season. If he can't be extended it won't be a situation where the player dictates where he can be trade.

Same. Top 10 protected would do for me. Montour is a solid player, but he's expendable with Risto, Jokiharju, and Miller on the roster. I haven't given up hope for Mittelstadt, but I'd still be happy to swap that hope for a real player.

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

Montour is definitely not an untouchable for me. If we can use him to add scoring up front lets do it. He is a nice player to have but is a guy who should be your 3rd or better yet 4th best dman. And for a #4 dman paying him the ~5 per he likely wants is too much. I would rather extend Risto @6 long term then Montour @5. It seems crazy since Risto has way more games played but he is younger then Montour.

Mitts + Montour + top 3 protected 1st should return something real nice. That should bring back a ~65 point 1B center under 27. Mitts still holds high trade value though probably only til next season. If Alex Nylander could bring back Joki, Mitts should be worth something even more valuable on his own. Add in a top 4 RHD and a top 12 1st that will bring back something real valuable.

 

[brian_griffin]

Sabres should be looking at Granlund. He's listed at Center but plays RW, and he's struggled since being traded to Nashville but he's 27 and a UFA at the end of the year. If the team can dump Bogo in the trade that'd be ideal, if not, waive him to create cap space for Granlund.

I don't think the cost should be too high since he only has 16 points on the year, at most a 2nd, but ideally a third.

Pretty sure if Bogo is waived, the only cap which is cleared is the pro-rated remaining portion of this season times about $1.050 to 1.125M, which is the amount of one-way contract salary which can be excluded from the cap for players waived for purpose of assignment. (So maybe about $300k.) If you mean waive for purpose of release from pro contract (like Berglund), then the cap savings would be substantially larger, as you inferred.

It seems like your team's management isn't satisfied with not making the playoffs and is going to buy at the deadline. How available is your 1st? I'd be willing to do a deal for it around Zucker or Brodin

Their attempts at roster construction the past 3 seasons belie that notion.

Eh, when I thought we were building towards a cup window, I'd parse value on that kind of deal. Now I'm just curious if we can make February interesting again.

No Sabres games for 10 days and I'm surprisingly indifferent. I'll probably watch a couple other teams until the Sabres play again. And I'll probably be frustrated doing so.

 

[TehDoak]

It depends how you value those assets. I personally think very little of Montour, and have serious doubts about Mitts development.

I do that deal because Hertl completely changes our roster. And the assets we give up... didn’t

What I don't understand is, why are the Sharks, with Burns and Karlsson locked up on the right side for the next 6 years....looking to add another RHD? One who is a RFA to boot?

My big priority would be to stock up on ELC players that can contribute. And also, why are they interested in moving one of the only 2 top 6 forwards on the proper side of 28?

I'm not sure what the Sharks plans are for the trade deadline, but moving one of Hertl or Meier would be monumentally stupid at this point.

I'm not sure who would be interested in Mittelstadt at this point other than a reclamation project. He certainly isn't going to carry the value of a 1st round pick anymore. He's not quite Grigerenko bust levels yet, but he's approaching it, especially if he continues to struggle with his Amerks assignment.

 

[FormerSabresFan]

For the record, I would be on board for the Hertl trade...I'd dangle Jake McCabe instead of Montour if they prefer a LHD.

Top 5 lotto protected first.

 

[jc17]

What I don't understand is, why are the Sharks, with Burns and Karlsson locked up on the right side for the next 6 years....looking to add another RHD? One who is a RFA to boot?

My big priority would be to stock up on ELC players that can contribute. And also, why are they interested in moving one of the only 2 top 6 forwards on the proper side of 28?

I'm not sure what the Sharks plans are for the trade deadline, but moving one of Hertl or Meier would be monumentally stupid at this point.

I'm not sure who would be interested in Mittelstadt at this point other than a reclamation project. He certainly isn't going to carry the value of a 1st round pick anymore. He's not quite Grigerenko bust levels yet, but he's approaching it, especially if he continues to struggle with his Amerks assignment.

Hertl has this year, them 2 more. This year is shot for them and they dont have any cap room to make major improvements within the next 2 years.

So they can hold on to Hertl, and trade him at the deadline in 2 years when they're only getting a rental payment for him, or trade him while he has a favorable contract. They wont re-sign him, when his contract is up because there wont be space.

How they value mittelstadt is unknown. I'm sure some have soured on him, but I'm also sure some GM's would be very interested in having an inexpensive player with a lot of potential. The Shark's have only drafted 2 first rounders that still belong to their organization since drafting Hertl in 2013, and they are without a first again this upcoming draft. Getting a 1st+a former 1st, even if somewhat devalued, still beats losing hertl in 2 years and being without and 1st rounders in 3/5 years, when you're roster is loaded with big contracts which, like you said, means they need some ELC's.

 

[VaporTrail]

How long before Bogo and E-rod get an "A" on their jersey ?

 

[HaNotsri]

I'd like to trade for Mikael Granlund, should come super cheap.

Why?
I believe Krueger is a good, perhaps legit transformative, leader. He should be able to help players grow and develop good habits, that only takes you so far though since the players need to have some kind of talent to nurture. I'd like to go for some talented but damaged goods that is underperforming before the end of the season. Could be a better option than trying to cover our holes with free agents in summer.

 

[TehDoak]

Hertl has this year, them 2 more. This year is shot for them and they dont have any cap room to make major improvements within the next 2 years.

So they can hold on to Hertl, and trade him at the deadline in 2 years when they're only getting a rental payment for him, or trade him while he has a favorable contract. They wont re-sign him, when his contract is up because there wont be space.

How they value mittelstadt is unknown. I'm sure some have soured on him, but I'm also sure some GM's would be very interested in having an inexpensive player with a lot of potential. The Shark's have only drafted 2 first rounders that still belong to their organization since drafting Hertl in 2013, and they are without a first again this upcoming draft. Getting a 1st+a former 1st, even if somewhat devalued, still beats losing hertl in 2 years and being without and 1st rounders in 3/5 years, when you're roster is loaded with big contracts which, like you said, means they need some ELC's.

Sure they MIGHT be interested in Mittelstadt, but he isn't going to carry a huge premium around the league

As far as the cap goes....they've got like 19M in space to flesh out their roster. So, it'll be tight, but far from impossible.

San Jose Sharks - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

As bad as things have been this year, their window to win is within the next 2-3 years. They won't be able to replace Hertl's production at that cap number.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Hertl has this year, them 2 more. This year is shot for them and they dont have any cap room to make major improvements within the next 2 years.

So they can hold on to Hertl, and trade him at the deadline in 2 years when they're only getting a rental payment for him, or trade him while he has a favorable contract. They wont re-sign him, when his contract is up because there wont be space.

How they value mittelstadt is unknown. I'm sure some have soured on him, but I'm also sure some GM's would be very interested in having an inexpensive player with a lot of potential. The Shark's have only drafted 2 first rounders that still belong to their organization since drafting Hertl in 2013, and they are without a first again this upcoming draft. Getting a 1st+a former 1st, even if somewhat devalued, still beats losing hertl in 2 years and being without and 1st rounders in 3/5 years, when you're roster is loaded with big contracts which, like you said, means they need some ELC's.

I don't see how it makes sense for them to be trading away guys like Hertl.

They are locked in to so many players - they are surely committed to putting this season down as an anomaly & 'retooling' as opposed to a full 'tear down' job.

I imagine they will try to move Thornton/Marleau for a shot at a cup but nothing like Hertl or Meier.

 

[sabrebuild]

Hertl has this year, them 2 more. This year is shot for them and they dont have any cap room to make major improvements within the next 2 years.

So they can hold on to Hertl, and trade him at the deadline in 2 years when they're only getting a rental payment for him, or trade him while he has a favorable contract. They wont re-sign him, when his contract is up because there wont be space.

How they value mittelstadt is unknown. I'm sure some have soured on him, but I'm also sure some GM's would be very interested in having an inexpensive player with a lot of potential. The Shark's have only drafted 2 first rounders that still belong to their organization since drafting Hertl in 2013, and they are without a first again this upcoming draft. Getting a 1st+a former 1st, even if somewhat devalued, still beats losing hertl in 2 years and being without and 1st rounders in 3/5 years, when you're roster is loaded with big contracts which, like you said, means they need some ELC's.

I'm all for getting Hertl too, but I don't understand why there won't be any space for them in two years?

They fit in this year, with two years of inflation I would think they could fit his raise.

And let's be real, they will find a way to clear away one of these bad deals over the next two years vs losing Hertl.

Vlasic will be sent somewhere or it will be Kane, and Thornton's money will be gone.

Not to say they won't move Hertl, but I doubt it will be because they can't afford to keep him.

 

[sabrebuild]

Sure they MIGHT be interested in Mittelstadt, but he isn't going to carry a huge premium around the league

As far as the cap goes....they've got like 19M in space to flesh out their roster. So, it'll be tight, but far from impossible.

San Jose Sharks - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

As bad as things have been this year, their window to win is within the next 2-3 years. They won't be able to replace Hertl's production at that cap number.

I don't see how it makes sense for them to be trading away guys like Hertl.

They are locked in to so many players - they are surely committed to putting this season down as an anomaly & 'retooling' as opposed to a full 'tear down' job.

I imagine they will try to move Thornton/Marleau for a shot at a cup but nothing like Hertl or Meier.

Bah you both were too quick

 

[KeyserSoze81]

How long before Bogo and E-rod get an "A" on their jersey ?

It may increase their trade value, and it takes the A off of McCabe. Let's do it! We may be able to get a conditional 7th, boys! FERDA!

 

[Hasekperreault23]

Hertl or Zibanejad seem like the ideal, too good to be true, targets.
- Both have 2 seasons remaining after this year (natural bridges to Cozens or lessl likely Mitts resurrection)
- Both are on teams that are either in or headed to some form of rebuilding
- Both are experienced 1st line centers in their prime

SJs reported desperation in acquiring a 1st is certainly exciting, but a 1st alone doesn't sniff Hertl.

1st, Mitts, Montour for Hertl?

That's essentially 4 first rounders for Hertl... In my experience, this board doesn't have the stomach for that type of move

I would do that trade all day everyday

 

[Hasekperreault23]

It depends how you value those assets. I personally think very little of Montour, and have serious doubts about Mitts development.

I do that deal because Hertl completely changes our roster. And the assets we give up... didn’t

I agree not a big Montour guy vastly overrated

 

[UnleashRasmus]

I would love to get a player like Hertl, someone who can play a competent high end transition center ice position. But, also play a great away from the puck left wing. If it costs Montour, that's fine too. We have enough competent RHD at the moment to make it work. I guess the only other question I have is on the totality of the pick involvement etc.

 

[Buffaloed]

Hertl has this year, them 2 more. This year is shot for them and they dont have any cap room to make major improvements within the next 2 years.

So they can hold on to Hertl, and trade him at the deadline in 2 years when they're only getting a rental payment for him, or trade him while he has a favorable contract. They wont re-sign him, when his contract is up because there wont be space.

They won't even get a decent rental payment because his modified NTC with his 3 team list of acceptable teams will be in effect.

 

[Buffaloed]

For the record, I would be on board for the Hertl trade...I'd dangle Jake McCabe instead of Montour if they prefer a LHD.

Top 5 lotto protected first.

Congratulations, you may have won a prize for using the words dangle and Jake McCabe in the same sentence.

 

[Zman5778]

Congratulations, you may have won a prize for using the words dangle and Jake McCabe in the same sentence.

Huh? They're used in sentences together A LOT. Ya know ''.....and McCabe gets dangled again by a forward"

 

[CrazyPsycho]

Makes some sense Zajac noping out of a Sabres trade

 

[Chainshot]

Makes some sense Zajac noping out of a Sabres trade

Or it was the Islanders like Friedman speculates?

 

[mechaworm]

Yeah, I don't see Hertl being available generally unless it's a shakeup trade for another high impact player in their prime. The Sharks are too heavily invested in this window.

---

If Hertl WERE available, you'd probably take him for something LIKE that price. Montour is moveable for him. Casey is moveable for him. SOME first rounder is moveable for him, but not a lottery pick. All three in one deal is .... plausible. Wear protection. And pray and work this offseason so that next year's first isn't top 10 as well. You probably need to clear ~0.5M in cap, but not a huge problem if you sell on any other player.

But being real about it, the guy who tagged Casey 8OA and just traded a first and Guhle for Montour probably values those guys higher than we do, and too highly to do this deal. GMs don't give up on their babies easily.