Speculation: 2019-20 Anaheim Ducks Roster Discussion Part III

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Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
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Also, we have been playing bad/significantly injured teams. Let’s wait until we play someone who is legitimately dangerous before getting too excited, we lost to the only playoff team we have played, and they were missing essentially an entire top 6.

They're fun to watch, they’re playing a system that seems to work well, and they’re playing with confidence. Let’s not confuse that with being a good team until they play good teams and opposing coaches have had a chance to breakdown the system and identify where it’s weaknesses are.
 

Deuce22

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Also, we have been playing bad/significantly injured teams. Let’s wait until we play someone who is legitimately dangerous before getting too excited, we lost to the only playoff team we have played, and they were missing essentially an entire top 6.

They're fun to watch, they’re playing a system that seems to work well, and they’re playing with confidence. Let’s not confuse that with being a good team until they play good teams and opposing coaches have had a chance to breakdown the system and identify where it’s weaknesses are.
I don't think they're a good team, but I do think they are much improved. Forget the won-loss record, they are playing a more sustainable system, rolling 4 competitive lines, not giving up a lot of odd man rushes, generally even in shots for and against, and playing their best hockey late in games. The Pacific isn't a juggernaut, so I really don't feel like the Ducks are overmatched.
 

Anaheim4ever

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Also, we have been playing bad/significantly injured teams. Let’s wait until we play someone who is legitimately dangerous before getting too excited, we lost to the only playoff team we have played, and they were missing essentially an entire top 6.

They're fun to watch, they’re playing a system that seems to work well, and they’re playing with confidence. Let’s not confuse that with being a good team until they play good teams and opposing coaches have had a chance to breakdown the system and identify where it’s weaknesses are.
Sharks & Jackets were in the playoffs last year. Sharks had a mostly healthy team and were only missing Kane while the Ducks were missing Steel,
Getlzaf & Karlsson have not been playing 100%.
Also Sprong has been in AHL, PP would be better with him.
 

bumperkisser

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Looking at us on paper I cant help but feel we are 1 good forward and 1 good d away from being a legit cup contender. Either some young guys need to step up or we may need to go shopping in free agency next year. We have a bunch of good young players but need someone to make some big strides.

If by good player you mean an elite first line winger and elite defenseman then I'd maaaaybe agree with you.

As of now until our players develop more I'd say we're at least 3-4 really good players away from being actual cup contenders.
 
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Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
Jun 6, 2010
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Sharks & Jackets were in the playoffs last year. Sharks had a mostly healthy team and were only missing Kane while the Ducks were missing Steel,
Getlzaf & Karlsson have not been playing 100%.
Also Sprong has been in AHL, PP would be better with him.
Columbus was missing Panarin, Bobrobsky, Duchenne, and Dzingel - this roster is not that playoff roster at all. I don’t consider their current roster a playoff threat at all.

San Jose lost Nyquist, Pavelski, and Donskoi to free agency and were missing Kane. That’s 4 of the top 6 forwards from their playoffs. Again, not the same team.

I didn't say I think the Ducks were playing badly. I just don’t see how anyone can look at the actual teams that they’ve played and think that they’ve actually been tested yet.
 

Sean Garrity

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Say what you want about Ritchie but he’s still our second best LW and moving him means one of Jones or Comtois are going to be in the lineup when they are clearly not ready. His inconsistency is maddening but when he has the puck below the hash marks he shows very good vision and ability to control the play along the boards that only really Getzlaf can match. He’s also not bad in his own zone - all three of Murray, Eakins and Carlyle have used him to protect one goal leads late in games over the past year.

I agree 100%, he’s just a very frustrating player. I was very encouraged by his game last year, but it seems as if he hit a wall. I know, I know, overreaction based on the small sample size of this season.
 

IDuck

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i know have been harping on getzlaf a lot but my fear with him is him turning into perry 2.0....granted i think getz brings far more to this team/organization then perry ever did and its not like we are looking to make a cup run in the next year or so...but, the legs go first then the hands which is what you saw with perry, he couldnt put himself in scoring postions and when he had the puck he couldnt keep it...same is starting to happen with getzlaf where he isnt able to have the hands and mind in sync and work fast enough, he also isnt seeing the ice/play like he use to....my HOPE is that its just a slow start (which is normal for him) but fathertime only seems to wait for a select few (teemu) and usually those are the ones who work harder than anyone, which we all know that isnt a part of getzlaf's make up.

i look forward to seeing steel back in the lineup and hope to see more of lundestrom as well.
 
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Zegs2sendhelp

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Columbus was missing Panarin, Bobrobsky, Duchenne, and Dzingel - this roster is not that playoff roster at all. I don’t consider their current roster a playoff threat at all.

San Jose lost Nyquist, Pavelski, and Donskoi to free agency and were missing Kane. That’s 4 of the top 6 forwards from their playoffs. Again, not the same team.

I didn't say I think the Ducks were playing badly. I just don’t see how anyone can look at the actual teams that they’ve played and think that they’ve actually been tested yet.
Meh you just win the games that are put in front of you.... and winning the games you should win early in the season can pay off late in the season.

Every team weve played so far is a NHL team (Arizona being questionable), and any team in the nhl is able to beat any other team in a best of 1. These wins count as much as a win vs tampa/Toronto/Nashville etc


Build confidence off the wins, and hopefully bring it in to the harder games.... besides that everyone just wants to discredit the team at this point... happy we are winning and If we lose and play with the effort weve had in the first 5 games im completely okay with it. This season is basically a mystery box.... if we end up with a high pick awesome, if we end up in the playoffs awesome.
 

Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
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Meh you just win the games that are put in front of you.... and winning the games you should win early in the season can pay off late in the season.

Every team weve played so far is a NHL team (Arizona being questionable), and any team in the nhl is able to beat any other team in a best of 1. These wins count as much as a win vs tampa/Toronto/Nashville etc


Build confidence off the wins, and hopefully bring it in to the harder games.... besides that everyone just wants to discredit the team at this point... happy we are winning and If we lose and play with the effort weve had in the first 5 games im completely okay with it. This season is basically a mystery box.... if we end up with a high pick awesome, if we end up in the playoffs awesome.
Yes, but what I was adding to was the discussion about us being only 1 forward and 1 defenseman away from being a legit Cup contender. I want to see them play an actual healthy playoff contender at a minimum before I think that type of talk is warranted. Cup contenders don’t win one game on a given night, they win a minimum of 4 of 7 against all comers.
 

Zegs2sendhelp

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Yes, but what I was adding to was the discussion about us being only 1 forward and 1 defenseman away from being a legit Cup contender. I want to see them play an actual healthy playoff contender at a minimum before I think that type of talk is warranted. Cup contenders don’t win one game on a given night, they win a minimum of 4 of 7 against all comers.

That's all debatable I guess...

ill just see how we look at black Friday... if were still winning games then maybe we should make some sort of move.

But in all honestly I don't think were a cup contender even if we added Zucker/risto(or something on that line)… I think our center depth is too average... we could be a playoff team... maybe win a round and be a bit of an underdog story.

My statement wasn't really directed at you... I just don't think its worth labeling what this team is until we get roughly 20+ games in.... lot of changes.... the team isn't clickin yet but were still winning... not the best of teams but finding ways to win is an important quality.
 

Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
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That's all debatable I guess...

ill just see how we look at black Friday... if were still winning games then maybe we should make some sort of move.

But in all honestly I don't think were a cup contender even if we added Zucker/risto(or something on that line)… I think our center depth is too average... we could be a playoff team... maybe win a round and be a bit of an underdog story.

My statement wasn't really directed at you... I just don't think its worth labeling what this team is until we get roughly 20+ games in.... lot of changes.... the team isn't clickin yet but were still winning... not the best of teams but finding ways to win is an important quality.
Agreed 100%. I like that there’s a system that the team is buying into and using, and that it’s getting results. There’s substantially more entertaining to watch.

However... I want to see where the rookies are in 10-12 games when the adrenaline wears off. Ditto Larsson, Guhle, Holzer, MDZ, Grant. I want to see how much better players can be when there’s some actual line chemistry that’s had enough time to develop. I want to see if Lindholm, and Manson even moreso, can handle the defensive zone stresses they’re being given. I want to see if Fowler has his confidence built to where he can get back to being a 1-2 instead of a 2-3, or if he gets injured and crumbles again. I want to see if anyone can actually score. I want to see what happens to the players with a stretch of adversity. I want to see what happens when opposing coaches pick apart the weak spots in the scheme, and how Eakins adjusts to their adjustments.

This will be an entertaining season. I’m just not sold on it being substantially more successful yet. I won’t complain if it is though.
 

Trojans86

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Pump those breaks... we don’t even know if we are gonna have 3 20+ goal scorers and we are still building a culture and system. We are still subpar offensively and HORRIBLE on the PP. Those two players would need to be allstars.

So far we are just slightly above average, but competitive because of our goaltending.
I'd say most middle of the road teams can say they are one good d and one good f away.
 
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Trojans86

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If by good player you mean an elite first line winger and elite defenseman then I'd maaaaybe agree with you.

As of now until our players develop more I'd say we're at least 3-4 really good players away from being actual cup contenders.
In my head that is a top line winger and a number 2 d....
 

Hockey Duckie

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Agreed 100%. I like that there’s a system that the team is buying into and using, and that it’s getting results. There’s substantially more entertaining to watch.

However... I want to see where the rookies are in 10-12 games when the adrenaline wears off. Ditto Larsson, Guhle, Holzer, MDZ, Grant. I want to see how much better players can be when there’s some actual line chemistry that’s had enough time to develop. I want to see if Lindholm, and Manson even moreso, can handle the defensive zone stresses they’re being given. I want to see if Fowler has his confidence built to where he can get back to being a 1-2 instead of a 2-3, or if he gets injured and crumbles again. I want to see if anyone can actually score. I want to see what happens to the players with a stretch of adversity. I want to see what happens when opposing coaches pick apart the weak spots in the scheme, and how Eakins adjusts to their adjustments.

This will be an entertaining season. I’m just not sold on it being substantially more successful yet. I won’t complain if it is though.

This whole discussion seems premature at the moment like the whole Sprong being waived situation... before he was cleared. =)
 
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Columbus was missing Panarin, Bobrobsky, Duchenne, and Dzingel - this roster is not that playoff roster at all. I don’t consider their current roster a playoff threat at all.

San Jose lost Nyquist, Pavelski, and Donskoi to free agency and were missing Kane. That’s 4 of the top 6 forwards from their playoffs. Again, not the same team.

I didn't say I think the Ducks were playing badly. I just don’t see how anyone can look at the actual teams that they’ve played and think that they’ve actually been tested yet.

Lol that is not four of San Jose's top six forwards from last year. You're at least more accurate with Columbus but overall, come on.

The larger point that they aren't that close to being a contender is definitely true and they haven't faced a gauntlet or anything but you really do yourself no favors by being dishonest and dying on this weird hill.
 

Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
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Lol that is not four of San Jose's top six forwards from last year. You're at least more accurate with Columbus but overall, come on.

The larger point that they aren't that close to being a contender is definitely true and they haven't faced a gauntlet or anything but you really do yourself no favors by being dishonest and dying on this weird hill.
Pavelski and Kane were absolutely in their top 6 scoring forwards, and Nyquist had 60 points last year which places him very squarely into that group as well. Donskoi was top 9, my bad. It’s still their #1, 4, 6 and 9 in ice time, so it’s a minimal exaggeration. Every single one of them outperformed every Duck with the exception of Donskoi, who would have been 5th.

“More accurate” with Columbus. Panarin (87 points) and Duchene (7o) are significantly better than any forward on the Ducks, Dzingel outpaced everyone with 56, and Bobrovsky has actually won the Vezina. That’s a legitimate top line and Vezina goaltender gone and I’m “more accurate”.

Sorry, those are significant losses for playoff teams. You’re trying way too hard to simply be contrarian. You didn’t actually look at the teams, did you? Your only argument is that I mischaracterized a single top 9 player as a top 6. Might want to see who’s on the hill.

Edit - regular season numbers. The point still stands.
 
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I think we will eventually start scoring goals. The defense being where it is, is a pleasant surprise. I think Steel can help balance out the roster but if Anaheim plays 50/50 games alot it will be good enough bc of our goalies. Asking them to make 5-8 big saves vs 1-13 each games matters
 
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Pavelski and Kane were absolutely in their top 6 scoring forwards, and Nyquist had 60 points last year which places him very squarely into that group as well. Donskoi was top 9, my bad. It’s still their #1, 4, 6 and 9 in ice time, so it’s a minimal exaggeration. Every single one of them outperformed every Duck with the exception of Donskoi, who would have been 5th.

“More accurate” with Columbus. Panarin (87 points) and Duchene (7o) are significantly better than any forward on the Ducks, Dzingel outpaced everyone with 56, and Bobrovsky has actually won the Vezina. That’s a legitimate top line and Vezina goaltender gone and I’m “more accurate”.

Sorry, those are significant losses for playoff teams. You’re trying way too hard to simply be contrarian. You didn’t actually look at the teams, did you? Your only argument is that I mischaracterized a single top 9 player as a top 6. Might want to see who’s on the hill.

Edit - regular season numbers. The point still stands.

Yeah I wasn't disputing those two lol. The other two definitely weren't(icetime numbers aren't right either, although they're close). The "more correct part" also had to do with you just blatantly ignoring that half the guys you listed were deadline acquisitions. They're still losses and Columbus' were devastating without them, but both were good teams before the trade deadline as well, and both still are pretty good teams, especially San Jose who people felt was still a contender. If you only had the sense to just admit that one was a quality win instead of weirdly trying to argue they're not a playoff team, you probably wouldnt have had that much pushback.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is being contrarian. Its even more astonishing considering I'm not the only one, and really, you're coming off as the contrarian. I even conceded your larger point was true in my eyes, that's hardly contrarian. But when you try and make those kinds of arguments, come on, you deserve some pushback.

Like if I merely pointed out that Arizona is a good team that improved on paper and seemed poised to take that next step, or that Detroit has already beaten multiple good teams and has played pretty well, while both are true, I could see how that could be seen as contrarian. But saying that no, San Jose wasn't missing 4 of their best 6 forwards from last year in that game, that's not remotely contrarian. Which, even if it was true, it's still a hilariously dishonest point lol.
 

Anaheim4ever

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They are at a point where things can go either way: right now it could be that they are going thru early season struggles to score & eventually start scoring or they continue to struggle. The one player i'm worried about is Terry, if he doesn't start to prodce it could hurt his confidence that he can't score at the NHL level.

The situation the Ducks were in back in 2017-18 is what the Sharks are going thru as they are likely in their last year of their playoff runs if they do somehow make the playoffs like that Ducks 2017-18 team did as they eventually climbed all the way back to barely make it in but got knocked out early.
 
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Ducks DVM

sowcufucakky
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Yeah I wasn't disputing those two lol. The other two definitely weren't(icetime numbers aren't right either, although they're close). The "more correct part" also had to do with you just blatantly ignoring that half the guys you listed were deadline acquisitions. They're still losses and Columbus' were devastating without them, but both were good teams before the trade deadline as well, and both still are pretty good teams, especially San Jose who people felt was still a contender. If you only had the sense to just admit that one was a quality win instead of weirdly trying to argue they're not a playoff team, you probably wouldnt have had that much pushback.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is being contrarian. Its even more astonishing considering I'm not the only one, and really, you're coming off as the contrarian. I even conceded your larger point was true in my eyes, that's hardly contrarian. But when you try and make those kinds of arguments, come on, you deserve some pushback.

Like if I merely pointed out that Arizona is a good team that improved on paper and seemed poised to take that next step, or that Detroit has already beaten multiple good teams and has played pretty well, while both are true, I could see how that could be seen as contrarian. But saying that no, San Jose wasn't missing 4 of their best 6 forwards from last year in that game, that's not remotely contrarian. Which, even if it was true, it's still a hilariously dishonest point lol.
You’re being a contrarian because you’re accusing me of being “dishonest” on a matter of opinion. You’re the only one making this a moral failing rather than simply discussing it, and as usual you make an issue of me having a moral failing rather than just disagreeing. There actually wasn’t all that much pushback, and there are those that agree with me too. People disagreeing on a message board. It must be the first time that’s ever happened. If you want to push back, pushback with arguments. Also, look up the definition of “dishonest”, and stop making moral implications about me. If you want to say my facts are wrong, provide your own.

Losing Bobrovsky alone makes Columbus a questionable playoff pick. Losing Panarin iced it. WITH those 4 players they were the last seed in the playoffs, making it in by 2 points after winning 6 of their last 7 games. Their new starting goaltender has a career 0.906 SV%. They’re being picked as a lottery team by oddsmakers and pundits this year. So no, I do not have to refer to it as a win over what I consider a “playoff team”, the burden on you is to show how they ARE with something other than an appeal to the majority.

San Jose has been about as far from good without those 4 players as possible.
NHL.com - Stats

Sort for TOI/GP
Pavelski 19:03
Hertl 19:01
Couture 18:36
Kane 18:25
Meier 16:58
Nyquist 15:34
Thornton 15: 33
Labanc 14 :01
Donskoi 13:25
I said 1,4,6, and 9. Those numbers appear to be not “close” but “actual’. If you want to play the ESTOI game, they are 1,2,7,8 although in the playoffs then it was actually 1,3,6, and 9, which again is my point of just misstating on Donskoi.

“I’m a good guy, because even though thou art needlessly dishonest, and aren’t helping thineself by being needlessly dishonest, I will point that out to the masses with stinging rhetoric that they might thus be enlightened as to thine moral failings, while magnanimously allowing that the overall premise that thou dost posit might perchance contain a mere kernel of truth, that I shall water with my blessings, while providing no reason for that position to be so other than mine admission, nor other than mine own glorious opinion. So let it be written, so let it be done”.
 
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