2018 Olympics: What will be the fallout of Russian ban or boycott?

[Jablkon]

I don't know what this means.

It means that you got OGs 2014 and World cup.... They voted for you. Sure they did it just to smash you with doping scandal. IOC and WADA or FIFA have even more at stake than you have but sure they prepared this scandal just to bash Russia. Especially WADA loves when their laboratories dont work.... But we dont have to continue here. As you said I am not here to push anybobody somewhere. People, especially in your original west dont care about bipolar nationalistic world, so check if you dont overestimate meaning of your country in peoples mind. Thats all I am saying.

 

[Fantomas]

It means that you got OGs 2014 and World cup.... They voted for you. Sure they did it just to smash you with doping scandal. IOC and WADA or FIFA have even more at stake than you have but sure they prepared this scandal just to bash Russia. Especially WADA loves when their laboratories dont work.... But we dont have to continue here. As you said I am not here to push anybobody somewhere. People, especially in your original west dont care about bipolar nationalistic world, so check if you dont overestimate meaning of your country in peoples mind. Thats all I am saying.

If Russia gets anything of this stature in the next 10 years I will personally apologize to you. However the Ukraine crisis and the Syria conflict have changed everything and this has created a cascade of righteousness and vengeance.

 

[Fantomas]

The next political bs is they will try to block as many Russian athletes as possible from competing as neutrals. The goal being to make Russia compete with as splintered team as possible so it hurts their medal count. So this means more stress for athletes, more CAS hearings, more bs.

It will be ugly. I am thinking 5 medals at most.

 

[Zalos]

I just found out about the ban and decided to come here to see how Russian fans are reacting. However, this is ridiculous.

To begin with, almost all Olympics athletes are doped. Not just in Russia, but in the US, China, Canada, France, etc. At this point in time, what matters is to avoid getting caught. Sadly, Russia has been caught on a large scale. Now, it must pay the price. There is no conspiracy, your committee just failed at covering itself up. Who's to tell which country will be next?

Meanwhile, I think all Russian athletes should be able to participate in the events if they want to. Sure, the Olympics have a patriotic element to them, but it is also a personal quest for all athletes. They should not have wasted their time and energy on training for nothing. Allow them to participate even if it is just for themselves. And, anyway, Russians will still be able to applaud for them. This is not that big of a deal in the end.

As for the person who said the Olympics are not the same without Russia in them... hum. Get off your high horse, sir? Russia, just like any other single country, does not dictate the quality of a worldwide sporting event. The Olympics will be great even without Russia, thank you very much. In fact, the Olympics would be a lot more fun without the big five in them, as competition in general would be more even.

Anyhow, I hope your athletes get to participate!

 

[Fantomas]

To begin with, almost all Olympics athletes are doped. Not just in Russia, but in the US, China, Canada, France, etc. At this point in time, what matters is to avoid getting caught. Sadly, Russia has been caught on a large scale. Now, it must pay the price. There is no conspiracy, your committee just failed at covering itself up. Who's to tell which country will be next?

It is very easy to tell who won't be next.

 

[Jussi]

It is very easy to tell who won't be next.

Countries where the government isn't involved in covering up doping usage of it's athletes definitely won't be next. Which should be about 97% of the countries on this planet.

 

[Atas2000]

Countries where the government isn't involved in covering up doping usage of it's athletes definitely won't be next. Which should be about 97% of the countries on this planet.

So you are telling me that US and Canada are among those 3%?

 

[Atas2000]

I think Russia needs to put some thought into their response and be clever about it. The IOC's decision was made to set up Russia in such a way that they have a lose-lose scenario and terrible optics: a) admit their athletes into the games, look weak and defeated, and worst of all guilty, and expose them to all kinds of harassment, b) pull out of the games and look like they are punishing their own athletes.

I believe that Russia can respond appropriately to IOC's decision and still allow their athletes to compete. But the severity of their response has to address their own role as participant and partner in the Olympic process. I'm biased about this because I have never really cared about the Olympics and I know that Russians do. But I think it would be best for them to consider cutting off the Olympics in the long run, phase them out maybe even completely. Because as things stand the Olympics are controlled by organizations that do not have their interests in mind and unless Russia can impose its influence in any way, this will be a losing game.

So I propose playing real hard ball and threatening to pull out of the process entirely. Draw up a list of demands, among which should be that the IOC reinstate the banned athletes from Sochi unless they can prove - convincingly - that those athletes doped. This means, yes, obtaining actual positive samples. Letting this kind of stuff go creates an awful precedent for Russia, and allows these Western-controlled governing bodies to do whatever they want. If they can ban Russian athletes without concrete proof of guilt, what could possibly stop them in the future? The abuse will only continue if Russia remains subservient to this system.

By making a concrete list of demands Russia will also shift the onus from themselves onto the IOC, which I think will play well with its public. At present time Russia is running around and doing its best to adhere to arbitrary, Western-imposed standards, spending tons of money revamping its doping program. It should stop doing this and turn the tables completely. This is costing them too much money and labor and just isn't worth it.

Draw up demands, get out of the Olympics, send any local IOC bureaucrats packing and make it clear that you will not participate until those demands are met. In the meantime allow the Korea-eligible athletes to participate neutrally in this particular instance only (give the IOC a taste of what they'll be missing), but without any state funding or assistance of any kind. Give your athletes the choice to make up their own minds, but before they get there make your announcement. Announce your tit-for-tat in advance. In the meantime you will prepare your athletes (including the potential summer Olympians) about their likely non-participation in future games, but also have enough time to figure how to redirect their competitive aspirations.

Look at this as another round of sanctions. You will lose monetarily in the short run. But in the long run you will only lose to a greater extent and continue losing if you accept the existing status quo. The Russia ban only happened because the West is calling Russia's bluff, believing that Putin won't have the guts to respond. They believe he is too addicted to Western capital (I hope not).

But without Russia the Olympics will never be a complete event, and will always deal with questions of "what if." Make them feel the brunt of their decision. This is Russia's only true option.

The decision to ban Russia is an extension of a pattern of Western aggression against Russia. It is also so incredibly transparent. Even the fact that Rodchenkov is hiding in the US and working with the secret service is absurdly on-the-nose. Respond with strength or die.

Thanks for the thoughts. We will see how it unfolds. Hopefully you are closer to a good prediction than to a scenario we only wish to actually happen. Obviously 2018 is going to be a turning point in very many ways. For better or worse. The board is set, the pieces are moving.

 

[Fantomas]

Thanks for the thoughts. We will see how it unfolds. Hopefully you are closer to a good prediction than to a scenario we only wish to actually happen. Obviously 2018 is going to be a turning point in very many ways. For better or worse. The board is set, the pieces are moving.

It's not going to happen the way I said it. I think like a commie and too realpolitik.

 

[Fantomas]

So who in Russia will have the balls to say that Putin is acting awfully weak on the Russian Olympic ban? The election is coming up after all.

 

[Toro2017]

So who in Russia will have the balls to say that Putin is acting awfully weak on the Russian Olympic ban? The election is coming up after all.

Is it possible (if Putin really belives that there is this big conspiracy against Russia) that he is looking at the bigger picture here? I mean why would he want to upset chinese people by boycotting IOC and the olympic games, because one team can't use Russia jersey in some hockey contest, on the other side of the world? As I understand Russia and China are practically allies and some dispute on sport world is pretty small thing to risk relationship between Moscow and Beijing.

 

[Albatros]

So who in Russia will have the balls to say that Putin is acting awfully weak on the Russian Olympic ban? The election is coming up after all.

Is he acting weak, or did he actually do a secret deal with the IOC? A fairly nominal punishment after which there's full normalization and business continues as usual (also regarding doping no doubt).

 

[Atas2000]

Is he acting weak, or did he actually do a secret deal with the IOC? A fairly nominal punishment after which there's full normalization and business continues as usual (also regarding doping no doubt).

Yep, mafia Russians always do sneaky deals, right?

Just take a walk, take a deep breath and come back without those stereotypes.

 

[Atas2000]

Is it possible (if Putin really belives that there is this big conspiracy against Russia) that he is looking at the bigger picture here? I mean why would he want to upset chinese people by boycotting IOC and the olympic games, because one team can't use Russia jersey in some hockey contest, on the other side of the world? As I understand Russia and China are practically allies and some dispute on sport world is pretty small thing to risk relationship between Moscow and Beijing.

That's a tremendously simplified look at politics.

 

[Albatros]

Yep, mafia Russians always do sneaky deals, right?

Just take a walk, take a deep breath and come back without those stereotypes.

Because Good Russian Kid Putin would never do such a sneaky thing, just a stereotype.

 

[Atas2000]

So who in Russia will have the balls to say that Putin is acting awfully weak on the Russian Olympic ban? The election is coming up after all.

He is a politician after all. Let's wait and see. There is a lot of stuff going on beyond Olympics and he is winning more board battles than he is losing for now. He has a rep to support though. He has to strike back at some point.

And if it would promise some real political profit to blame Putin now I am pretty sure the whole bunch would be already doing ot. They are not. It speaks volumes.

The whole election thing is in full stride. The punches against Russia and Putin coming left and right now. Although they are ALL old ones, washed up, whataboutist claims and silly exagerrations. Gives, it is the first wave and the pre-election big ones are being saved for right before the elections or they don't have any new ideas.

Either way the year before elections is a special case obviosly. Sports slips down on the agenda pretty damn deep.

With all the balls-o-steel in the world calling out Putin right now won't change a thing. Also it won't give us a leftist shift or something. Realpolitik I guess.

 

[Atas2000]

Because Good Russian Kid Putin would never do such a sneaky thing, just a stereotype.

Your problem is you say it like it is a bad thing.

Him being a ex-KGB officer is a positive on his resume while you are floating through the pink clouds far from reality western dellusions.

 

[Fantomas]

Is he acting weak, or did he actually do a secret deal with the IOC? A fairly nominal punishment after which there's full normalization and business continues as usual (also regarding doping no doubt).

Which would mean business as usual for Russian oligarchs but lost medals and lifetime bans for innocent athletes?

Super.

 

[Jussi]

He is a politician after all. Let's wait and see. There is a lot of stuff going on beyond Olympics and he is winning more board battles than he is losing for now. He has a rep to support though. He has to strike back at some point.

And if it would promise some real political profit to blame Putin now I am pretty sure the whole bunch would be already doing ot. They are not. It speaks volumes.

The whole election thing is in full stride. The punches against Russia and Putin coming left and right now. Although they are ALL old ones, washed up, whataboutist claims and silly exagerrations. Gives, it is the first wave and the pre-election big ones are being saved for right before the elections or they don't have any new ideas.

Either way the year before elections is a special case obviosly. Sports slips down on the agenda pretty damn deep.

With all the balls-o-steel in the world calling out Putin right now won't change a thing. Also it won't give us a leftist shift or something. Realpolitik I guess.

Oh the irony...

 

[Atas2000]

Oh the irony...

The irony you don't undestand. You are on quick sand and we watch you sinking in, but you cheer all the way.

 

[KrejciMVP]

So who in Russia will have the balls to say that Putin is acting awfully weak on the Russian Olympic ban? The election is coming up after all.

I think the response from Russia has been appropriate. Fight the decision in arbitration and see where things are. Rational people without and axe to grind know that this is a political decision based on current world events. In the end, Russia will move on and the IOC and Olympics will most likely suffer a huge financial loss in these games.

 

[Fantomas]

I doubt this very much.

 

[Jussi]

Russian Olympic Committee supports athletes going to Olympics so there propbably won't be any boycott since the national hockey team's players and coaches declared their willingness to play as well.

 

[RossiyaSport]

6 womens hockey players. No evidence. No evidence offered in the ruling. The words of a paid off criminal. Athletes who have never failed a test.

So Rodchenkov's words go from "the whole womens team was on dope cocktails" to banning 6 girls with zero evidence.

So the logic ppl want to push is a team that finished 6th at the Olympics was on 'dope' but then all big tournaments after which were in places like Sweden, Canada etc they finished better. And nobody failed a test. So they want to say that the tournament where they had the worst result they were on dope. This is really the hypothesis people want to go with?

 

[Jussi]

6 womens hockey players. No evidence. No evidence offered in the ruling. The words of a paid off criminal. Athletes who have never failed a test.

So Rodchenkov's words go from "the whole womens team was on dope cocktails" to banning 6 girls with zero evidence.

So the logic ppl want to push is a team that finished 6th at the Olympics was on 'dope' but then all big tournaments after which were in places like Sweden, Canada etc they finished better. And nobody failed a test. So they want to say that the tournament where they had the worst result they were on dope. This is really the hypothesis people want to go with?

You don't need to fail a test to get banned. Avoiding testing or tampering with testing are offenses that result in bans as well.