GDT: 2018 Free Agency: Jay Beagle 4 x 3M, Antoine Roussel 4 x 3.25M, both w/ limited NTCs

[F A N]

Who on the team will be finishing the fights that he instigates? This isn't to say he never 'drops the gloves' but he's pretty much a spot picker.

Spot picker? He isn’t 6’4” 230lbs. He has fought Gudbranson, Cody McLeod, Buff, Zach Kassian, Iginla. He shouldn’t be expected to fight all the time and he shouldn’t be expected to fight some team’s HW enforcer. As mentioned, he’s usually a top 10 to top 20 guy in number of fights. He usually drops the gloves enough. Fighting is way down in the NHL. I really don’t think “who on the team will be finishing the fights that he instigated” would be a problem.

 

[clay]

Just got around to watching the Benning presser on these signings. Holy hell the media in this city are soft. Not a single question about how these signings completely block our rookies from cracking the lineup for the next 3 years.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Just got around to watching the Benning presser on these signings. Holy hell the media in this city are soft. Not a single question about how these signings completely block our rookies from cracking the lineup for the next 3 years.

Who are they taking spots from?..Gaunce,Motte..?

 

[Melvin]

Abusive men should not be role models and be given a pass because they can provide entertainment value. Period.

And people who are good at sports or other forms of entertainment should not be role models. They are young millionaires who play a dangerous game for our amusement, nothibg more.

 

[Josepho]

Who are they taking spots from?..Gaunce,Motte..?

Gaudette, Goldobin, maybe someone like Lind/Dahlen has a really good preseason.

I'd be far more okay with these signings if we could actually hold players accountable, but we've basically never shown the ability to do that aside from when we got rid of Clendening and Vey.

 

[Cupless44]

Just got around to watching the Benning presser on these signings. Holy hell the media in this city are soft. Not a single question about how these signings completely block our rookies from cracking the lineup for the next 3 years.

I thought that exact same thing when I listened to that press conference

 

[Cupless44]

Who are they taking spots from?..Gaunce,Motte..?

Prepare for Gaudette to be in Utica so we can watch Beagle plod around. Goldobin, Leipsic, possibily Virtanen could have trouble getting ice time.

 

[clay]

Who are they taking spots from?..Gaunce,Motte..?

Assuming Virtanen is signed, we have Baertschi, Horvat, Boeser, Eriksson, Gagner, Granlund, Sutter, Beagle, Roussel, Schaller, Virtanen signed to 1 way deals. That's 11 guys. Leaves 1 spot open for Pettersson, Gaudette, Gaunce, Leipsic, Goldobin, Motte, Dahlen, Lind to battle over. Of the names above, only Granlund is coming off the books next year and we have to wait 2 years before only Gagner and Schaller come of the books. It's a complete tire fire.

 

[Cupless44]

Gaudette, Goldobin, maybe someone like Lind/Dahlen has a really good preseason.

I'd be far more okay with these signings if we could actually hold players accountable, but we've basically never shown the ability to do that aside from when we got rid of Clendening and Vey.

These veterans never sit no matter how poor their play or effort is. We have seen that with Gagner and Eriksson and Del Zotto.

 

[CanaFan]

And people who are good at sports or other forms of entertainment should not be role models. They are young millionaires who play a dangerous game for our amusement, nothibg more.

Except that’s not how human beings work. Someone is exceptional at their field, esp something as visual and win/loss driven as sports, is always going to be exalted. Saying “they shouldn’t be” is like saying no one should watch the World Cup b/c FIFA is corrupt and its just kicking a ball into a net. Like sure, technically you’re 100% correct but at the same time it will never happen either.

Edit: For clarity, the above is in no way a defense of Voynov. I’m only referring to athletes in general.

 

[Duodenum]

The Beagle signing probably means that the Canucks have no use for Gaunce, he won't be a part of the Canucks going forward I assume. Either traded or left in the AHL.

 

[geebaan]

Who are they taking spots from?..Gaunce,Motte..?

Wasn't Motte a great return for Vanek in your eyes? Now you don't care if he's waived? Not to mention all the other points other posters have made...

 

[Melvin]

Except that’s not how human beings work. Someone is exceptional at their field, esp something as visual and win/loss driven as sports, is always going to be exalted. Saying “they shouldn’t be” is like saying no one should watch the World Cup b/c FIFA is corrupt and its just kicking a ball into a net. Like sure, technically you’re 100% correct but at the same time it will never happen either.

Edit: For clarity, the above is in no way a defense of Voynov. I’m only referring to athletes in general.

They are really not the same thing at all. It's actually the opposite of what I am saying.

You should watch the world cup if you want to but don't act like anyone involved is in any way someone your kids should aspire towards.

 

[Bad Goalie]

They are similar. Sutter is just the better version. They're both guys who are adequate in largely defensive roles, and who you'd want to keep as far from offensive situations and offensive players as possible. Beagle is just doubling up. And on a bad contract too boot.

IMO Green's "Malhotra-like" deployment of Sutter is optimal way to use him. He's never been an offensive player. Like you said, he's unique in that he produces the same amount regardless of teammates. He's exactly the opposite of the guy you'd want to move up the lineup. Signing another is massive overkill, crowds out the kids, and really guarantees they're anchored to guys who lack offensive talent to make them better.

What we should be looking for are more Vaneks. Cheap, one-year guys we can pair with and help the younger guys (like the Boeser-Vanek combo) and then flip at the deadline.

Beagle and Sutter are defensive Centers and useless to goal scoring wingers.

Horvat is an offensive center, but not a gifted play making center which makes him a really good #2 center, but he is forced to be #1 since there isn't anybody else. There's a plethora of wingers combined in those returning and new ones on the vine who just might be high scoring, but have no center to feed them.

Gagner, at best, is currently a #3 center.

The way I see it is Benning, through his contract construction, has positioned Horvat at #1, Sutter (according to Benning' press conference) at #2, Gagner at #3, and Beagle at #4. It's possible Green will swap Sutter and Gagner at the 2/3 spots. This is an extraordinary weak middle 4 after Bo when it comes to scoring goals.

It is finally making sense to me. Having gone nuts on this now starting the 4th season in which the Utica Comets have not had a play making center. Benning has always acquired that 2nd line center that the coach has had to force into the 1st line center's role despite his lack of 1st line play making skills. The top forwards have always been accused of under performing by Vancouver posters without serious consideration having been given to who their centers were. The Comets have always had 2 4th line centers that play #3 and #4. Then the guy who clearly is a 3rd line center gets to play #2. It could be argued the Canucks have done a lot of the same. The Sedins in their twilight hours would have been an incredible 3rd line in the fashion of the modern NHL where 3rd lines are scoring lines.

2015-16 Gaunce/Friesen, Cassels/Hamilton (Gaunce called up and the #3 hole became Zalewski/Jones/Marino)

2016-17 Chaput/Valk/Pelletier/Cassels/Hamilton (Chaput called up for all but 1st 10 games.)

2017-18 Chaput, Darcy, Cassels, Hamilton (Chaput called up and/0r injured Utica centers resulted in a circus of centers on PTOs)

2018-19 Right now it appears to be Kero/?/Darcy/Hamilton (just signed for 2 more seasons to the maddening amazement of Comets fans). Kero is still a #2 forced into #1 role unless something comes Utica's way down the road. Lots of possibilities for that guy in Vancouver.

None of these #1s were actually #1s. 2 of the 3 went up and Kero is likely to do the same leaving the Comets with crap in the middle. The Valk season the Canucks had nobody after Chaput went up and by some miracle The Comets didn't face any major loss at center due to injuries in house.

This season is setting up to be one in the same.

I don't think Benning knows what a #1 center actually is and what the role of any center between talented wings actually is! It's becoming all too clear. He has made no moves to get one for Vancouver and he has made no moves to get one for Utica. His center answer on Sunday was Beagle to go along with Sutter, 2 #4s. He constantly forces the square pegs into the round holes. Even if the Canucks philosophy is that Gaudette should start his career in the AHL, this season's UFA search should have targeted a center to play offensive minutes on a #2 line so Pettersson and whomever is on the other wing would have a play maker between them. We all know it isn't Sutter who Benning just said CAN NOW MOVE UP TO #2.

The AHL hunt should be for 2 centers. I have watched every NHL team since the playoffs began acquiring centers from Europe mostly intended for their farm. e.g. Par Lindholm acquired by the Leafs for the Marlies to replace their most recent team leading point getter, #1 center Ben Smith. In the recent NHL free agency players were also acquired to play center on the farm. Montreal for example picked up Michael Chaput to play for the Laval Rocket. I have a huge list of like signings beginning back in May.

Centers Jimbo, CENTERS!

 

[CanaFan]

They are really not the same thing at all. It's actually the opposite of what I am saying.

You should watch the world cup if you want to but don't act like anyone involved is in any way someone your kids should aspire towards.

I don’t, but I can’t control how my kid views these players. If he decides Harry Kane is the awesomest human on earth, I can’t really stop that. It’s natural for kids and teens to look up to adults that exemplify success or coolness in some manner. As a parent I can’t control who he idolizes short of not owning a TV and never allowing him to watch sports, ever.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding you. Are you saying we shouldn’t have sports idols full stop (where I’m saying it isn’t fully in anyone’s control) or are you saying we shouldn’t expect these people to act any better just because they happen to be idols i.e. stop expecting these people to be perfect? Because if it’s the latter I have no real argument although someone who engages in a criminal act is clearly a different matter.

 

[Melvin]

I don’t, but I can’t control how my kid views these players. If he decides Harry Kane is the awesomest human on earth, I can’t really stop that.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding you. Are you saying we shouldn’t have sports idols (where I’m saying it isn’t fully in anyone’s control) or are you saying we should expect these people to act any better just because they happen to be idols?

The former.

Don't idolize celebrities.

 

[Hit the post]

Spot picker? He isn’t 6’4” 230lbs. He has fought Gudbranson, Cody McLeod, Buff, Zach Kassian, Iginla. He shouldn’t be expected to fight all the time and he shouldn’t be expected to fight some team’s HW enforcer.

Many of those guys don't go around taking runs at goalies or other things Roussel was known for. You run around like Brad Marchand's relative, you have to expect the opposition to respond in kind. Maybe he's changed his game. We shall see.

But as I said in another thread, perhaps my judgement is clouded by these "instigator type of players". I had hoped we closed the chapter on the team having those kinds of players when Burrows was dealt.

 

[racerjoe]

The former.

Don't idolize celebrities.

As a mid thirties male can I idolize Emilia Clarke?

 

[Dab]

meh, starting **** on the ice so another teammate has to fight his battles. Like Vigneault liked that type of player. And that was BEFORE he became a cheapshot artist on the ice (he was the original Brad Marchand).

Cooke was pretty much Roussel in a harder hitting era and Canucks fans by in large loved Cooke. I remember on Canucks dot com and the thousands of “Cookie” and Cooke24” type handles there were.

Regardless if people like Roussel today, I’m sure he will turn some Canucks fans heads when he gets under the skin of the West’s best players.

I’m personally not a huge fan of the signing but I can see why management did it.

 

[Hit the post]

Cooke was pretty much Roussel in a harder hitting era and Canucks fans by in large loved Cooke. I remember on Canucks dot com and the thousands of “Cookie” and Cooke24” type handles there were.

Cooke actually put up over 40 points once in his career (and didn't really start the uber cheap stuff until after his Canuck playing days). And I realize I'm in the minority when I say I wasn't a fan of Cooke (neither was Vigneault - though he was a Tanner Glass fan so nobody's perfect....).

And I do remember the time Cooke was agitating Phaneuf enough so that later dropped his gloves. Ohlund had to step in and fight him (a guy with one bad eye).

 

[Dab]

Cooke actually put up over 40 points once in his career (and didn't really start the uber cheap stuff until after his Canuck playing days). And I realize I'm in the minority when I say I wasn't a fan of Cooke (though neither was Vigneault - though he was a Tanner Glass fan so nobody's perfect....)

If you don’t think Cooke was “cheap” as a Canuck but somehow discovered cheap shots once moving on you’ve just proven my point.

Roussel will be popular here.

 

[Hit the post]

If you don’t think Cooke was “cheap” as a Canuck but somehow discovered cheap shots once moving on you’ve just proven my point.

Maybe I'm a biased fan who conveniently ignores transgressions by Canucks - but I don't recall Cooke making a reputation on those headshots (or knee on knee hits) until after he left the team.

And I ALREADY said I'm in the minority here with respect to viewing Roussell as a player. It's just my OWN opinion.

 

[CanaFan]

The former.

Don't idolize celebrities.

I don't. Many do. It's not a conscious or controllable decision people make. You might as well tell people not to fall in love because it might lead to heartbreak or jealousy. Not in our control.

 

[Melvin]

I don't. Many do. It's not a conscious or controllable decision people make. You might as well tell people not to fall in love because it might lead to heartbreak or jealousy. Not in our control.

Your analogies are really off the mark today.

 

[CanaFan]

Your analogies are really off the mark today.

Sorry?

Perhaps you’re smart enough to figure out what I am intending to convey. It’s not that complicated man.