World Cup: 2018 FIFA World Cup
- Thread starter Paulie Gualtieri
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Suiteness
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Rob
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Rob
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Nalens Oga
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Jamie Vardy named as sub on bench in Croatia game, decides f*** it, I'm not wearing this primary school looking training jersey:
Well, two of my three favorite team reached the top 4, i.e. Belgium and Croatia, so I am quite happy. Also nothing against France winning it all, a much better result than a super boring team like Russia or Sweden somehow managing to win it.
However, France was considerably lucky in it's path. 1) They got to play an Uruguay that had no Cavani, 2) Croatia played a full games worth (90min) of super-taxing extra minutes in the three previous play-off games, plus two penalty kick sessions to boot. 3) the free kick that led to the first French goal in the final should never have happened, (instead a yellow card for Griezmann) and to top it off, it went in bouncing from a Croatian player 4) the penalty kick that led to the second is very debatable as the Croatian player had no chance to avoid the ball in that situation. It was no penalty kick in my opinion.
However, France was considerably lucky in it's path. 1) They got to play an Uruguay that had no Cavani, 2) Croatia played a full games worth (90min) of super-taxing extra minutes in the three previous play-off games, plus two penalty kick sessions to boot. 3) the free kick that led to the first French goal in the final should never have happened, (instead a yellow card for Griezmann) and to top it off, it went in bouncing from a Croatian player 4) the penalty kick that led to the second is very debatable as the Croatian player had no chance to avoid the ball in that situation. It was no penalty kick in my opinion.
Eisen
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maclean
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- Jan 4, 2014
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I couldn't help but joke about this during the England-Croatia semi - there was a shot of an "average" girl with England flags on her cheeks and I couldn't help but comment "this was the hottest English fan they could find", to which my friend noted "and it took them until the 80th minute".
Lol, someone manages to say France got lucky, and somehow, one of the arguments is that Croatia won on PK twice along the way. Let that sink in.
Luck played it's part yesterday.
And you have to be lucky to win it all anyway.
Croatia controlled the entire first half and came away from it a goal down. One to a non-existant free kick and an own goal, the other to a very debatable penalty.
(let's not get into the pen thing, I can understand the reasoning, but I don't agree with it - along with half the football world... it's a weak pen to give in a WC final, no way to react with Matuidi missing a fast ball a foot in front of him, and it's not like it was going in the net - Vida was right behind Perisic... point is, debatable, another ref on another day doesn't give it)
However, it also takes a great team to have a first half like France did yesterday and come away leading at 45 minutes.
Don't take it as a personal insult when someone says France were lucky.
They were. And they made the most of it, grabbed their chances and are deserved winners.
I don't, they were clearly lucky to come back to halftime with a lead. No argument there (OG and pen, only two chances).
That said, I must stress that while Croatia was the better team in the first half (again, zero argument here), they didn't have many chances to score.
This is something that has been forgotten. They abused Pavard (good game plan) and somewhat Hernandez too and got in good situations, but the center of the pitch was closed to them.
And crosses were denied by our CB.
I thought plenty of times there was fire in the french box, players looked close to panicking, but in the end, I don't remember Lloris making a decisive save.
People are acting here like Croatia miraculously didn't score. They scored one single goal through their domination spell. And didn't have any other chance to do so in the 90 minutes of the game.
People talk about lucky deflection and while Perisic's shot needed no luck, him being in that position after a set play was luck and his shot going through a forrest of player was both class and a tad lucky obviously.
The only two goals that weren't lucky were the last two and obviously, both goalie mistakes. I maintain Subasic was screened, but people will only remember his lack of reaction.
That said, I must stress that while Croatia was the better team in the first half (again, zero argument here), they didn't have many chances to score.
This is something that has been forgotten. They abused Pavard (good game plan) and somewhat Hernandez too and got in good situations, but the center of the pitch was closed to them.
And crosses were denied by our CB.
I thought plenty of times there was fire in the french box, players looked close to panicking, but in the end, I don't remember Lloris making a decisive save.
People are acting here like Croatia miraculously didn't score. They scored one single goal through their domination spell. And didn't have any other chance to do so in the 90 minutes of the game.
People talk about lucky deflection and while Perisic's shot needed no luck, him being in that position after a set play was luck and his shot going through a forrest of player was both class and a tad lucky obviously.
The only two goals that weren't lucky were the last two and obviously, both goalie mistakes. I maintain Subasic was screened, but people will only remember his lack of reaction.
To add to my previous post: 5) most penalty kick goals in the tournament: three, France/England. 6) most crossbar/goal frame hits in the tournament: four, Croatia.
Let those six points sink in.
None of your points hold any value (Did Croatia hit a post yesterday? Did any french PK was given which wasn't a pen?).
And everyone who knows footbal knows PK shootout are a coin flip. So Croatia won two straight coin flips.
Yet you think that's an argument to say France got lucky.
And everyone who knows footbal knows PK shootout are a coin flip. So Croatia won two straight coin flips.
Yet you think that's an argument to say France got lucky.
It's hard to discuss when your counterpart does not demonstrate having actually read what you wrote. Or the worse alternative: does not comprehend...
I was all the time talking about the *path* to the final, not *just* the final. It should not be hard to understand.
In summary, France was very, very lucky. There is no denying that. There is also no denying that they were an excellent team.
Usually in the autumn following the World Cup it is the start of the euro-qualifiers. Not this time though. There hasn't even been the draw for the qualifiers yet. Very strange.
And you're denying Croatia had much better luck winning two coin tosses along the way, citing that as an example of France being lucky.
Croatia had more luck than anyone by winning two penalty shootouts.
That doesn't make them any less deserving BTW.
koyvoo
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- Nov 8, 2014
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Teams who advance far in tournaments very often have lucky breaks on their side. It’s the norm and one part of the very fine line between winning tournaments and not. It’s not a rarity in the least.
Who remembers Belguim being robbed two clean goals vs Brazil in 2002? Brazil was extremely lucky there, and went into win the tournament. Who remembers Italy being awarded the most dubious of penalties vs Australia in 2006? Who remembers Spain scoring on offside goal vs Portugal to advance in 2010?
It doesn’t matter how good you are, if you’re truly unlucky, it’s not going to happen. In all of the above cases, had the eventual champions not received extremely lucky breaks, they may have never achieved their titles.
Who remembers Belguim being robbed two clean goals vs Brazil in 2002? Brazil was extremely lucky there, and went into win the tournament. Who remembers Italy being awarded the most dubious of penalties vs Australia in 2006? Who remembers Spain scoring on offside goal vs Portugal to advance in 2010?
It doesn’t matter how good you are, if you’re truly unlucky, it’s not going to happen. In all of the above cases, had the eventual champions not received extremely lucky breaks, they may have never achieved their titles.
I think that in the knock-out matches if there is a draw after 120 minutes the team with a better record in the group should proceed.
It is harsh if you win three group games but jn the round of 16 lose a shoot-out and then you are out.
It is harsh if you win three group games but jn the round of 16 lose a shoot-out and then you are out.
TheMoreYouKnow
Registered User
Thing that makes France's win disappointing on a footballing level is that the lessons learned aren't so great. France 2018 is a team of great athletes who can perform in the sport of football, it does not have many footballers. They won with set pieces, strength, discipline, speed and gamesmanship.
Even with Mbappe it seems most of the hype comes from the sheer athleticism. The country that produced Platini doesn't have any artists playing football left. Of all French teams I've seen in my lifetime, this is probably the one with the least flair. It's an interesting role reversal, in the 80s through the mid 90s Germany were known for their lack of flair and reliance on strength and discipline while France's 80s side was seen as rich in flair and artistry. Now, Germany hit a low point this tournament while trying to play an audacious form of possession football (that relied on one/two guy covers while 8-9 guys are attacking) and France won it with those qualities they spurned back in the day.
Now this tournament has seen some excellent footballers, KdB, Hazard, Modric, Rakitic and of course Messi..they all lost to France. Even though this France team does not have a footballer of that quality. Of course, most countries do not have access to these types of athletes, but I hope that even ones which may - like Germany - do not go down that route.
Even with Mbappe it seems most of the hype comes from the sheer athleticism. The country that produced Platini doesn't have any artists playing football left. Of all French teams I've seen in my lifetime, this is probably the one with the least flair. It's an interesting role reversal, in the 80s through the mid 90s Germany were known for their lack of flair and reliance on strength and discipline while France's 80s side was seen as rich in flair and artistry. Now, Germany hit a low point this tournament while trying to play an audacious form of possession football (that relied on one/two guy covers while 8-9 guys are attacking) and France won it with those qualities they spurned back in the day.
Now this tournament has seen some excellent footballers, KdB, Hazard, Modric, Rakitic and of course Messi..they all lost to France. Even though this France team does not have a footballer of that quality. Of course, most countries do not have access to these types of athletes, but I hope that even ones which may - like Germany - do not go down that route.
koyvoo
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- Nov 8, 2014
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It’s been a long time now that even the prettiest teams have had the element of being able to play ugly or scrappy “tournament” football to be able to win.
It’s famous how in 1994 Carlos Alberto Parreira told his Brazilian squad - if you want to win again, F joga bonito. Let someone else entertain the masses.
I really don’t understand how people can’t see that Spain in 2010 was some of the most negative football played by a champion. Look at their goal totals. Sure, they had the ball at they’re feet, but once the 1-0 came, they did nothing with it. Even Germany in 2014 had to find a way to win when putting up a total stinker vs Algeria in which indeed it was a more pragmatic (in that game, particularly the extra time) Germany that smartly prevailed.
Beautiful possession based football didn’t die yesterday. It didn’t die in 2016. Not even in 2004 with Greece. Winners knew the difference between tournament success and being good for many years by that point.
It’s famous how in 1994 Carlos Alberto Parreira told his Brazilian squad - if you want to win again, F joga bonito. Let someone else entertain the masses.
I really don’t understand how people can’t see that Spain in 2010 was some of the most negative football played by a champion. Look at their goal totals. Sure, they had the ball at they’re feet, but once the 1-0 came, they did nothing with it. Even Germany in 2014 had to find a way to win when putting up a total stinker vs Algeria in which indeed it was a more pragmatic (in that game, particularly the extra time) Germany that smartly prevailed.
Beautiful possession based football didn’t die yesterday. It didn’t die in 2016. Not even in 2004 with Greece. Winners knew the difference between tournament success and being good for many years by that point.
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You're on a roll.
Not many good footballers. No artist on the pitch.
Griezmann, Fekir, Lemar, Dembele, Mbappe, Pogba, Sidibe, etc... those guys are athelte with no flair and no artistry....
We got that you're bitter. But please stop posting BS all the time.
Rob
Registered User
BTW, can you please link me to a YT clip with someone, ANYONE, doing a double backheel in a WC semi final to set up a one on one with the keeper.
Or maybe your tainted glasses can't properly evaluate talent. You have to put people in corners. Ahtletes can't be artists and vice-versa.
Or maybe your tainted glasses can't properly evaluate talent. You have to put people in corners. Ahtletes can't be artists and vice-versa.
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