2018-19 Regular Season Thread

[sa cyred]

Literally LITERALLY just hates any young/skilled player.

People used to say that half-jokingly, but it's literally factually the truth.

I honestly think it's more on the side of, he truely thinks the "vet presence" is a super strong trait to have. No matter how bad a vet plays, them being there helps "calm" the team.

 

[wankstifier]

I feel like I’ve been overly critical of Provorov to check the unreasonably high expectations of the defenseman. Still, although it’s super early in the season and he’s started slow before, isn’t everyone glad that there wasn’t an 8x8 contract offered before the season?

 

[Tripod]

I feel like I’ve been overly critical of Provorov to check the unreasonably high expectations of the defenseman. Still, although it’s super early in the season and he’s started slow before, isn’t everyone glad that there wasn’t an 8x8 contract offered before the season?

Most reasonable people on here never wanted to offer him that kind of deal anyways. Most felt a 6-6.5 was reasonable.

 

[deadhead]

I honestly think it's more on the side of, he truely thinks the "vet presence" is a super strong trait to have. No matter how bad a vet plays, them being there helps "calm" the team.

Yeah, Hakstol and probably 29 other HCs, that attitude got Gallant fired in Florida.

 

[deadhead]

I think it depends on the eyes.

Before the last half of last season for example personally I always thought he looked good.

Physical, solid skater, decent outlet, good in NZ, good on the boards.

Yeah, but even since the last half of last season he looks good on analytics, not so much on the ice.
Either he's really smart in a quiet way (great anticipation), or is the luckiest mofo in the league.
Though one attribute he has shown is a heavy shot with a fairly quick release that he can get on net.

 

[deadhead]

I think its partially due to corsi being a rather poor stat/metric to use. Quality of shot is indefinitely more important than the number of shots. Gudas has a very "hulk smash" mentality with the puck, which is just fire away. As a coach I'd let a guy take a low percentage shot and not give up the middle of the ice. Heck I'd even give him a couple of attempts over giving him the middle of the ice for a prime scoring chance.

I don't get the obsession by some with these metrics, hockey isn't like baseball. There aren't a lot of independent events.

Metrics are chosen by their correlation with desired events, goals scored and goals against.
There is going to be a lot of variance game to game, but over a season they have value as predictors of desired outcomes.
However, there is a lot of noise, so people shouldn't put too much credence on any one metric.

 

[sa cyred]

Some advanced stats for the first 4 games:

2018-19 Philadelphia Flyers Roster and Statistics | Hockey-Reference.com


MacD is getting eaten alive out there. This is shown in around 5 other categories. Deadhead, there is literally nothing you can say or show to defend that.

 

[Curufinwe]

Top of the possession charts, and 3 assists for Gudas last night, but of course the downplaying of his offensive ability will continue unabated.

 

[wankstifier]

Some advanced stats for the first 4 games:

View attachment 145741

2018-19 Philadelphia Flyers Roster and Statistics | Hockey-Reference.com


MacD is getting eaten alive out there. This is shown in around 5 other categories. Deadhead, there is literally nothing you can say or show to defend that.

Whataboutism defense will point to Gostisbehere, Voracek, and Couturier with similar numbers.

 

[Curufinwe]

The difference is they don't have a long history of being poor possession players.

 

[sa cyred]

The difference is they don't have a long history of being poor possession players.

That at QOC isn't shown here. Ghost/Provorov are facing tougher opponents than MacD is.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I don't feel like I need to comment. It speaks for itself.

 

[Asnito]

I honestly think it's more on the side of, he truely thinks the "vet presence" is a super strong trait to have. No matter how bad a vet plays, them being there helps "calm" the team.

I personally think it's a case that the guy is so risk averse and he likes to know exactly what he's going to get when a player steps on the ice even if it's subpar as long as it's predictable. At this point it has to be a control issue, he doesn't like surprises. I can't think of any other reason why he maddeningly continues to overuse worse players when he has better sitting on the bench.

Last year after every goal, for or against, he would run out that Lehtera, Weise 4th line like 90% of the time. It made no sense except that he wanted to regain control over how things went and he went with players who performed exactly how he felt they would. That's the only thing I can think of that explains player usage.

Also this may have been covered elsewhere but for those of us who don't post during the game anyway we can go back to the Post Game Thread?

 

[deadhead]

Some advanced stats for the first 4 games:

View attachment 145741

2018-19 Philadelphia Flyers Roster and Statistics | Hockey-Reference.com

MacD is getting eaten alive out there. This is shown in around 5 other categories. Deadhead, there is literally nothing you can say or show to defend that.

So is Ghost. So there!

MacDonald is obviously not a 100%, last year he was a #5, ranked somewhere in the 125-150 range league wide.
He's working his way back into shape, if Folin had shown more, AMac might sit out a week.

Get over it, Hextall doesn't want Myers/Friedman in the NHL right now, I think because they get more hands on coaching and a bigger role in the AHL, so he feels it's better for player development. They did hire a new defensive coach in LHV last year.

Former NHL Defenseman Kerry Huffman Named Assistant Coach - Lehigh Valley Phantoms

 

[Psuhockey]

I don't feel like I need to comment. It speaks for itself.

Both those teams finished the season in the bottom 10 of the league. 2011-2012 NHL Hockey Standings

 

[Lindberg]

Metrics are chosen by their correlation with desired events, goals scored and goals against.
There is going to be a lot of variance game to game, but over a season they have value as predictors of desired outcomes.
However, there is a lot of noise, so people shouldn't put too much credence on any one metric.

I think a lot of people here use metrics as validation for their own personal opinions and attempt to shove it down people's throats. There's certainly some value added by looking at different metrics and trying to determine how much it is noise and how much of it actually factors into the quality of player.

 

[Lindberg]

Top of the possession charts, and 3 assists for Gudas last night, but of course the downplaying of his offensive ability will continue unabated.

Aren't you the same guy that was going on and on about Andrew MacDonald being better than people saying he is?

 

[kelmitchell]

Both those teams finished the season in the bottom 10 of the league. 2011-2012 NHL Hockey Standings

Well if we fo as bad as i think we will, then we will have yet another good draft pick.....and still a brain dead coach

 

[Curufinwe]

MacDonald's goals for/against numbers aren't as bad as you would think based on his reputation, but has always had poor possession numbers as a Flyer, apart from maybe one season where he was average. Gudas is the exact opposite. And they get the same usage in terms of zone starts.

Andrew MacDonald Stats | Hockey-Reference.com

Radko Gudas Stats | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[Cootsfanclub]

That at QOC isn't shown here. Ghost/Provorov are facing tougher opponents than MacD is.

Against three playoff teams with stacked top units to boot.

 

[Lindberg]

MacDonald has always had poor possession numbers as a Flyer, apart from maybe one season where he was average. Gudas is the exact opposite.

Gudas point totals aren't exactly high and I don't think anyone is underrating his ability. He consistently just shoots the puck on net for better or worse and is prone to very bad turnovers.

 

[Curufinwe]

I know which one I want in the top 4 and which one I want on the third pairing, and it's the opposite of how Hak is using them.

 

[Lindberg]

I know which one I want in the top 4 and which one I want on the third pairing, and it's the opposite of how Hak is using them.

They both can be shot out of a cannon for all I care. I'm ready to move on from both of them but I will agree with you there and have no problems doing so.

 

[Curufinwe]

They both can be shot out of a cannon for all I care. I'm ready to move on from both of them but I will agree with you there and have no problems doing so.

Yeah, and that's dumb because on of them is an effective defensemen, and one isn't. Point totals don't tell the full story when you're looking at dmen who don't get PP time.

NHL.com - Stats

Provorov: 3,122:25/60 = 52.03 hours. 61 P/52.03 = 1.17 Points/60 at ES.

Ghost: 3,683:49/60 = 61.4 hours. 72 P/61.4 = 1.17 Points/60 at ES

Gudas: 3,552:26/60 = 59.2 hours. 55 P/59.2 = 0.93 Points/60 at ES

Sanheim: 781:32/60 = 13.03 hours. 11 P/13.03 = 0.84 Points/60 at ES.

MacDonald: 4,338:34/60 = 72.31 hours. 55 P/72.31 = 0.76 Points/60 at ES

Hagg: 1,229:50/60 = 20.5 hours. 12 P/20.5 = 0.59 Points/60 at ES.

 

[sa cyred]

So is Ghost. So there!

MacDonald is obviously not a 100%, last year he was a #5, ranked somewhere in the 125-150 range league wide.
He's working his way back into shape, if Folin had shown more, AMac might sit out a week.

Get over it, Hextall doesn't want Myers/Friedman in the NHL right now, I think because they get more hands on coaching and a bigger role in the AHL, so he feels it's better for player development. They did hire a new defensive coach in LHV last year.

Former NHL Defenseman Kerry Huffman Named Assistant Coach - Lehigh Valley Phantoms

As I said earlier, QOC isnt even close here between the two. Ghost, while not looking great stats wise as well, is facing harder competition than MacD is.