Prospect Info: 2018-19 Flyers Prospects - Top 30 SKATERS, #14

[Curufinwe]

This is the closest poll so far.

 

[Magua]

I could be wrong, but I'm fairly confident you haven't seen much of him.

deady doesn't watch most of these players. He forms loud opinions based on what he intuits from afar, often randomly changing them. It's part of his charm.

Age is a legitimate point, but so is developmental curve and being a late bloomer. It happens all the time. Those are great junior year numbers too; good enough to not "discount his performance" (what a statement). He finished as the leading defensive scorer on his team and 4th among all skaters. Among Big 10, NCHC, and Hockey East d-men, he was 14th in points; among only Big 10 d-men, he was 4th. He's not perfect: his skating technique needs some cleaning up, especially short area and pivot work; he needs to continue to hone in on being smart aggressive; and he has a bad habit of turning his back to the rush. It's worth noting his PP prowess limits his potential here, even if he hits. Though if he can score a lot in a big PP role in the AHL -- which he can because there's no other similar timeline defense prospect with his offense (Bernhardt, I guess, but he has his own flaws that drop him and make for difficult projection) -- he can build value. But he exceeded all modest expectations this year. Double re-entry or not.

 

[wasup]

Most and i mean most of Wyatt's points come on the powerplay , like i have said he is good offensively it is and always has been his defensine play and lack of compete physically . I do not write him off completely he is absolutely a late developer and can change but i am more concerned with the mental and physical toughness which he has had problems with over the years . Lots of skill no balls

 

[Beef Invictus]

When he is out of hockey holding the stop sign when construction is going on?

Probably not the ideal time to surprise people

 

[deadhead]

I'll take the SHL over Wisconsin, same reason I'd put Lycksell ahead of Cates.
When an 18 year old performs against men, that a big positive.

 

[FlyTimmo]

I'll take the SHL over Wisconsin, same reason I'd put Lycksell ahead of Cates.
When an 18 year old performs against men, that a big positive.

Most of the college guys are "men". This isn't juniors. Though, I think it is perfectly acceptable to put Lycksell above Cates or Kalynuk.

It is pretty awesome how good Lycksell and Kalynuk are for 6th and 7th round picks. Who knows if they will make it? They have a lot of competition in front of them, but they have certainly surpassed that late draft pick expectations

 

[FlyTimmo]

deady doesn't watch most of these players. He forms loud opinions based on what he intuits from afar, often randomly changing them. It's part of his charm.

Age is a legitimate point, but so is developmental curve and being a late bloomer. It happens all the time. Those are great junior year numbers too; good enough to not "discount his performance" (what a statement). He finished as the leading defensive scorer on his team and 4th among all skaters. Among Big 10, NCHC, and Hockey East d-men, he was 14th in points; among only Big 10 d-men, he was 4th. He's not perfect: his skating technique needs some cleaning up, especially short area and pivot work; he needs to continue to hone in on being smart aggressive; and he has a bad habit of turning his back to the rush. It's worth noting his PP prowess limits his potential here, even if he hits. Though if he can score a lot in a big PP role in the AHL -- which he can because there's no other similar timeline defense prospect with his offense (Bernhardt, I guess, but he has his own flaws that drop him and make for difficult projection) -- he can build value. But he exceeded all modest expectations this year. Double re-entry or not.

waduknow...

 

[FLYguy3911]

Most of the college guys are "men". This isn't juniors. Though, I think it is perfectly acceptable to put Lycksell above Cates or Kalynuk.

It is pretty awesome how good Lycksell and Kalynuk are for 7th round picks. Who knows if they will make it? They have a lot of competition in front of them, but they have certainly surpassed that 7th round expectations.

Lycksell was a 6th rounder fwiw.

 

[FlyTimmo]

Lycksell was a 6th rounder fwiw.

Thanks. Fixed

 

[deadhead]

Most of the college guys are "men". This isn't juniors. Though, I think it is perfectly acceptable to put Lycksell above Cates or Kalynuk.

It is pretty awesome how good Lycksell and Kalynuk are for 6th and 7th round picks. Who knows if they will make it? They have a lot of competition in front of them, but they have certainly surpassed that late draft pick expectations

The top college players leave around 20-21, the juniors and seniors for the most part are marginal NHL prospects, and are 21-23.
SHL and KHL are full of older players, some are ex-NHL players, others NHL caliber players who prefer to stay abroad (KHL especially, where the salaries are very good on teams owned by Oligarchs).
So college is physically tougher than juniors or the USHL, but not as challenging as SHL, KHL or even the Czech league.
So for a 18 or 19 year old to hold their own in the SHL is flat out impressive.
Ginning started 28 g, 7 PO games at 18. Of course, Hagg also started in the SHL at 18, shined in the U18, but not in the WJC-20.

 

[Stizzle]

Lycksell is easily the next highest forward left on my list. I've never seen him play other than clips. I don't know who here has other than @Appleyard. So my ranking is possibly modest. Luckily, we all get to see him next week on TSN/NHLN.

His scoring in extremely limited minutes last year in the SHL is pretty astounding. I suspect his shooting percentage must be crazy high. But in any event, I'm optimistic.

A big part of the reason I went Kalynuk is simply positional value. I'm usually willing to reach a little on Dmen with smarts & skill. There's such an obvious premium on them these days. And really, I don't think I'm reaching on Kalynuk all that much. The draft this year was crazy. Guys with similar skill sets flew off the board and were pretty much gone by round 2.

 

[FlyTimmo]

The top college players leave around 20-21, the juniors and seniors for the most part are marginal NHL prospects, and are 21-23.
SHL and KHL are full of older players, some are ex-NHL players, others NHL caliber players who prefer to stay abroad (KHL especially, where the salaries are very good on teams owned by Oligarchs).
So college is physically tougher than juniors or the USHL, but not as challenging as SHL, KHL or even the Czech league.
So for a 18 or 19 year old to hold their own in the SHL is flat out impressive.
Ginning started 28 g, 7 PO games at 18. Of course, Hagg also started in the SHL at 18, shined in the U18, but not in the WJC-20.

There is a gap between college and AHL/SHL/KHL, but plenty if not most of college players are physically developed. Whether you prefer a player who is among the best of college players or holding their own in the SHL is up to you.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Awarding or subtracting points just because of the circumstance is the dumbest thing with prospects. There’s plenty of CHL & USHL/NCAA players that could play in pro leagues overseas from a talent standpoint. It’s really not that hard for a draft worthy prospect over there to progress to the top pro leagues by their D-1 or D+1 seasons as the junior leagues aren’t nearly as strong.

 

[Curufinwe]

I may not be able to start the next poll until Monday due to issues with Verizon . So don't panic if this one ends on Saturday afternoon and #15 hasn't been created yet.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

I may not be able to start the next poll until Monday due to issues with Verizon . So don't panic if this one ends on Saturday afternoon and #15 hasn't been created yet.

Unacceptable. Can someone please ban @Curufinwe immediately?

 

[deadhead]

Awarding or subtracting points just because of the circumstance is the dumbest thing with prospects. There’s plenty of CHL & USHL/NCAA players that could play in pro leagues overseas from a talent standpoint. It’s really not that hard for a draft worthy prospect over there to progress to the top pro leagues by their D-1 or D+1 seasons as the junior leagues aren’t nearly as strong.

At what age?

Kalynuk was 20, at 18 in the USHL, 59g 3-21 24, P 10g 0-2 2
Allison at 18, USHL 56g 25-22 47, PO 11g 9-7 16, at 19 as a college freshman, 36g 12-17-29
Laczynski at 18, USHL 52g, 24-39 63, , college at 19, 34g 10-22 32 [how did he fall to the 6th rd?)

Allison and Laczynski at 18 performed at a high level in the USHL.
A USHL player who is 19 is similar to a 20 year old CHL player, they should dominate.
Their freshman college seasons reflected their USHL performances.
Both really should have come out this year, they have nothing to prove at the college level.

Appleyard can give you more information, but from what he's posted, few players start on a regular basis at 18, or are top players by 19-20 in the SHL. Most SHL players who are among the point leaders at 19-20 become top NHL players. Same in the KHL, young players are glued to the back of the bench for a couple seasons.

While point translation factors are at best a crude measure, they suggest Allsvenskan is closer to AHL than NCAA in quality. So a young player performing well at that level at 17 (pre-draft season) is someone to watch.

 

[Tripod]

I may not be able to start the next poll until Monday due to issues with Verizon . So don't panic if this one ends on Saturday afternoon and #15 hasn't been created yet.

Why not just let this one continue until Monday?

 

[Curufinwe]

When I create these polls I set them to close after four days, and I can't change that after the fact.

This poll will close on Jul 28, 2018 at 3:24 PM.

 

[deadhead]

It is tough at this point.

Friedman > Kalynuk, Friedman is more physical and was a good college player at a younger age (18-19 his freshman season).
Ginning v Kalynuk, Ginning in SHL at 18. But this is where it gets more hazy, younger physical D-man v older mobile D-man.

Lycksell > Cates, Lycksell in SHL at 18, Cates 18-19 in USHL.

Strome, Bunnaman, Twarynski, Sushko ???
Strome has most upside, least chance of reaching it, Bunnaman didn't show much at center but may be better fit at LW, Twawynski was a meh checking wing until he put up 45 goals, overage, but that's still impressive for a guy with size, good speed and willing to play defense.
Sushko had good WJC-20, but PD+1 wasn't that impressive.

What's interesting is like last year, we're going to be 20+ deep in legitimate skater prospects.
Most of these guys would easily have made it into the top ten pre-Hextall.

 

[Tripod]

When I create these polls I set them to close after four days, and I can't change that after the fact.

Ahhh...I did not know that you could set a time on them. Learned something new.

 

[wasup]

At what age?

Kalynuk was 20, at 18 in the USHL, 59g 3-21 24, P 10g 0-2 2
Allison at 18, USHL 56g 25-22 47, PO 11g 9-7 16, at 19 as a college freshman, 36g 12-17-29
Laczynski at 18, USHL 52g, 24-39 63, , college at 19, 34g 10-22 32 [how did he fall to the 6th rd?)

Allison and Laczynski at 18 performed at a high level in the USHL.
A USHL player who is 19 is similar to a 20 year old CHL player, they should dominate.
Their freshman college seasons reflected their USHL performances.
Both really should have come out this year, they have nothing to prove at the college level.

Appleyard can give you more information, but from what he's posted, few players start on a regular basis at 18, or are top players by 19-20 in the SHL. Most SHL players who are among the point leaders at 19-20 become top NHL players. Same in the KHL, young players are glued to the back of the bench for a couple seasons.

While point translation factors are at best a crude measure, they suggest Allsvenskan is closer to AHL than NCAA in quality. So a young player performing well at that level at 17 (pre-draft season) is someone to watch.

Okay i do not know much about the Euro leagues or Russian leagues nor do i pretent to but the North American leagues i am very well versed on both sides or the border at all levels and wow you have things scewed.
First and foremost Kalynuk is a late developer physically and mentally , so he will need time to see what he can be . Personally i don't think he will develop the jam to play in Philly but that is just my opinion take it for what it's worth just an opinion
Secondly Laczynski was a 6 round pick cause he was a second year eligible to the draft just like Rem Pitlick was but Laczynski father has not played in the NHL like Pitlick's did he went third round but had better stats as well . . According to his stats Laczynski probably should have been drafted late 4th early 5th. but they look at more than just stats .
Remenber the NHL draft is Sept 15 till Sept 14 of the next year .College works according to school and USA schools go school year to school year as cut off dates . Most people think and you must be one of them that think it is Sept 15 till Dec 31st of the next year and you think the late birthday kids are a year older but it is still only one year span just different starting and ending dates. The USA system does a better job of developing the later birthday kids because of this
Thirdly there are 4 twenty year olds allowed in the USHL vs 2 in the CHL and there are lots of 16 year olds on most all CHL and very few in the USHL . So how come should a 19 year old dominate it the USHL the same as a 20 year old in the CHL . The USHL is an little older league and more defensive so throw the stats arguement out the window .
Appleyard is well versed in Europe so i take what he has to say about stuff over there as pretty legit .
Therefor Allison 1st year Laczynski 2nd year and Kalynuk 3rd year eligible and i consider all of them late developers so USA system of development has worked well for all of them where in the CHL more probably they would have got passed by. Different strokes for different folks continuing to develop is the key don't get so caught up on the age think til 23-24 years of age .

 

[CowboyDan]

I went with Lycksell because of reasons.

 

[BigToe]

Here comes the Ginning votes.

 

[deadhead]

Remenber the NHL draft is Sept 15 till Sept 14 of the next year .College works according to school and USA schools go school year to school year as cut off dates . Most people think and you must be one of them that think it is Sept 15 till Dec 31st of the next year and you think the late birthday kids are a year older but it is still only one year span just different starting and ending dates. The USA system does a better job of developing the later birthday kids because of this

Thirdly there are 4 twenty year olds allowed in the USHL vs 2 in the CHL and there are lots of 16 year olds on most all CHL and very few in the USHL . So how come should a 19 year old dominate it the USHL the same as a 20 year old in the CHL . The USHL is an little older league and more defensive so throw the stats arguement out the window .

The overall talent in the CHL is still better than the USHL, though the gap is closing.
Since a lot of USHL kids go to college, what are you doing there if you're 20? Even if you're 19, you should be in college the next year if you're good enough to garner a scholarship, and most play at 18 and start college at 19.
Whereas in the CHL, most kids stay for two post-draft seasons, so only the elite players leave before they turn 20.
Kaylnuk may be a late bloomer, but you could make the same argument for Twarnyski or any other CHL player who has a big post-draft +2 season at age 19-20.

 

[wasup]

The overall talent in the CHL is still better than the USHL, though the gap is closing.
Since a lot of USHL kids go to college, what are you doing there if you're 20? Even if you're 19, you should be in college the next year if you're good enough to garner a scholarship, and most play at 18 and start college at 19.
Whereas in the CHL, most kids stay for two post-draft seasons, so only the elite players leave before they turn 20.
Kaylnuk may be a late bloomer, but you could make the same argument for Twarnyski or any other CHL player who has a big post-draft +2 season at age 19-20.

Twarnyski got to play with Dillion Dube and on PP with Kole Lind in a weak BC division last year. So goals scored are a bit scewed and i kind of have those two in about the same range anyways but they are way different players like by a mile . One's Hatcher one's anti Hatcher if ya know what i mean and i think ya do . lol