2017 U Sports Playoffs/University Cup (March 16th-19th in Fredericton, NB)

[Hollywood3]

IMO the CIS should look at hosts in places where CIS hockey is not big-time. Ryerson would be ideal. It is easy to get to Toronto. If they hosted this year, Queen's and York would have brought loads of fans. I am sure a lot of transplanted Squirrels, Monkeys, and Mutts would have shown up as well. Plus, hosting would bring the sport to the forefront in a new market which would have a shot at taking hold.

I remember Regina and Calgary put in bids a while back. Calgary has many good hosting options available.

Winnipeg is not a great host right now. All we have is a busy MTS Centre (with 15,000 and 8,000 seat configurations) and then nothing but 1,500 to 2,000 seat venues. There are perfect venues just outside the city (Selkirk and Portage la Prairie) but they have Junior A playoffs at that time of year.

 

[MiamiHockey]

Ryerson may get it, but what will the crowd support be like? Is it realistic to think that Ryerson would make it to the semi's? They would be wise to play on Friday, as that may be the only game they play.
A Friday loss and the crowd support dies.
The AUC saw 50/50 draws reaching over $15,000, $14,000 and $13,000 for UNB games alone, not including the other 5 tournament games. Pays bills. Host cities must feed and cover hotel costs, so it isn't cheap to host these events. Fredericton doesn't have competition, CIS hockey is the show.
Unlike the old format, you also have more teams, you are guarenteed only 1 game, no longer 2.
You have to take all of those factors into consideration.

It's tough to compete with the support found in Fredericton. Alberta and Saskatchewan come closest, but it's still not the same.

Clare Drake has hosted several U-Cups with a capacity of 2700. Mattamy's stated capacity is 2300, but it is much larger (and nicer) than Clare Drake, so I imagine they can sell more tickets than that with all of the available standing room.

Keep in mind that if Ryerson hosts, it means the OUA gets 4 spots. York, Western, Laurier, Waterloo, UOIT, Guelph, and Queen's are contending teams within a 3-hour drive. You'd get enough fan support from those schools' alumni to help out.

 

[AUS Fan]

"Keep in mind that if Ryerson hosts, it means the OUA gets 4 spots. York, Western, Laurier, Waterloo, UOIT, Guelph, and Queen's are contending teams within a 3-hour drive. You'd get enough fan support from those schools' alumni to help out"

I don't think the OUA gets 4 spots any more. They will alternate AUS-CW for a 3-3-2.

"Clare Drake has hosted several U-Cups with a capacity of 2700."

Yes, but the semis and finals were at Rexall.

"IMO the CIS should look at hosts in places where CIS hockey is not big-time. Ryerson would be ideal. It is easy to get to Toronto. If they hosted this year, Queen's and York would have brought loads of fans. I am sure a lot of transplanted Squirrels, Monkeys, and Mutts would have shown up as well. Plus, hosting would bring the sport to the forefront in a new market which would have a shot at taking hold."

I was in Kitchener 2 years and it was a ghost town at the rink. If not for SFX fans from Southern Ontario in 2000 the rink would have been almost empty. Yes, Toronto would be nice, but what about accommodation? There is not a Comfort Inn at $89 a night, two beds and Continental breakfast, within a 10 min drive to the rink.

If CIS hockey is not big time, there is a reason for that. The only exception I can make is Halifax, where for some reason, supports Any kind of major event, but is a dud with AUS hockey.

 

[UNB Bruins Fan]

I can't imagine the CIS ever picking a location that is an "unknown commodity" over a proven host unless there were no other options....it would just be too risky....and that's if those places even put in a bid in the first place.

I understand people will say you can't grow the league if you keep going back to the same few places, so it is a catch-22 situation.

Also, Sportsnet does have a say (I think one vote) when it comes to awarding the hosts...and they are going to pick places they know for sure will look good on TV.

Halifax was amazing last year...I wouldn't be opposed to them becoming a regular host like they do for basketball, but that is probably unrealistic. Not to mention a lot of the attendance last year was from 3 AUS teams playing on the weekend and then X making the final....and you obviously can't bank on that every year.

 

[AdamMcg83]

I don't quite understand why capacity matters so much here - a full building of 2,300 people at Mattamy would be a much better atmosphere (and much more manageable from a cost perspective) than 3,000 people in a 7500-seat venue.

Kitchener didn't work for a variety of reasons, including the obvious one: it's not anywhere near a University (and, in one of the two seasons, the host spot went to a team that didn't even play in the same region).

For these reasons, I think Ryerson could work - it's basically on campus, and you don't have to sell 10,000 tickets a game. However, the biggest problem with a Toronto bid might be Toronto - there's a lot to do in the big smoke on a Friday or Saturday night, and the Rams finished 7th in OUA attendance (338 ppl/game) with the advantage of the biggest market and the best venue - by far - in the league.

 

[MiamiHockey]

I don't think the OUA gets 4 spots any more. They will alternate AUS-CW for a 3-3-2.

Yes, but the semis and finals were at Rexall.

Here's how they allocate spots in the U Cup:
OUA - 3
AUS - 2
CW - 2
Host - 1

There's no longer a rotating spot.

Your memory is partly correct about Rexall. In 2005, they had the Semis and Finals at Rexall, because the NHL was on strike. In 2006, only the Finals were at Rexall. I was at the Lakehead vs. Saskatchewan game at Clare Drake. Jeff Richards buried the empty-netter to seal the victory.

TSN / Sportsnet have televised games from Clare Drake. It's not ideal, but they can do it. It's certainly better - and cheaper - than having 3000 people in an NHL barn.

 

[AdamMcg83]

Here's how they allocate spots in the U Cup:
OUA - 3
AUS - 2
CW - 2
Host - 1

There's no longer a rotating spot.

That's not true - there are three rotating spots, technically. According to the playing regulations, these were the allocated spots this year:

 OUA Representative
 RSEQ Representative (Participates in the OUA Sport Conference – East
Division)
 Canada West Representative
 Atlantic University Sport Representative
 Host (University of New Brunswick)
 Assigned berth rotating (CWUAA)
 Assigned berth rotating (OUA)
 Assigned berth rotating (AUS)

I believe that the last three are referred to as "rotating" for exactly this reason - so they can be rotated to another conference depending on who the host is.

 

[UNB Bruins Fan]

I am assuming when the OUA hosts next there will be 3 OUA/3 AUS/2 CW one year and 3 OUA/2 AUS/3 CW the other year.

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

I don't quite understand why capacity matters so much here - a full building of 2,300 people at Mattamy would be a much better atmosphere (and much more manageable from a cost perspective) than 3,000 people in a 7500-seat venue.

Kitchener didn't work for a variety of reasons, including the obvious one: it's not anywhere near a University (and, in one of the two seasons, the host spot went to a team that didn't even play in the same region).

For these reasons, I think Ryerson could work - it's basically on campus, and you don't have to sell 10,000 tickets a game. However, the biggest problem with a Toronto bid might be Toronto - there's a lot to do in the big smoke on a Friday or Saturday night, and the Rams finished 7th in OUA attendance (338 ppl/game) with the advantage of the biggest market and the best venue - by far - in the league.[/QUOT

A attendance base of 338 concerns me. You have to generate revenue to pay for the event. I have been in Ryerson's new arena and it is a nice facility. They could probably push for 3,000 plus, as it has standing room. It could work, but it would need to be full to generate revenue through ticket sales and 50/50 sales. Agree with AUS fan, in that hotels are going to be expensive and the host committee will have to eat it.
I think if they go there, it's for one year, if it isn't attended well, then at least your not stuck for another year.
As for Halifax, I can see Acadia bidding in the near future, as they are within 1 hour of Halifax and have lot's of Alumni in the city. They average over1,500 per game and have some of the best, loyal fans in the CIS.

 

[MiamiHockey]

That's not true - there are three rotating spots, technically. According to the playing regulations, these were the allocated spots this year:

 OUA Representative
 RSEQ Representative (Participates in the OUA Sport Conference – East
Division)
 Canada West Representative
 Atlantic University Sport Representative
 Host (University of New Brunswick)
 Assigned berth rotating (CWUAA)
 Assigned berth rotating (OUA)
 Assigned berth rotating (AUS)

I believe that the last three are referred to as "rotating" for exactly this reason - so they can be rotated to another conference depending on who the host is.

I'm not sure where you got that wording from, but it's not correct.

Here is the link to the USports Policy:

http://en.usports.ca/information/me...dures/15-16/4__Policy_20_Programs_-FINAL-.pdf

And here is the wording from that document:

20.20.4.7 Men’s Ice Hockey Championship
8 Team Format, Single Elimination
4 Regional Associations
1 Host
1 Assigned berth OUA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth CWUAA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth AUS Regional Association

You'll note there is no use of the word "Rotating" ... that wording was used for the previous 6-team format. But, with the new 8-team format, it's the Host spot + 7 assigned spots.

So, the OUA will get 4 spots if they host.

 

[UNB Bruins Fan]

Would it be possible to have the AUS conference 'host' the event in Halifax, instead of a particular school. You have to think with 3 berths, NS teams would have a very good chance of getting at least two of them, which would drive attendance. And as AUS Fan said, Halifax tends to come out for the big events. Halifax might be one of the few places you could have a successful tournament without necessarily having a designated host team since all of the AUS schools are within reasonable driving distance.

This is essentially what they do with basketball I believe.

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

It's tough to compete with the support found in Fredericton. Alberta and Saskatchewan come closest, but it's still not the same.

Clare Drake has hosted several U-Cups with a capacity of 2700. Mattamy's stated capacity is 2300, but it is much larger (and nicer) than Clare Drake, so I imagine they can sell more tickets than that with all of the available standing room.

Keep in mind that if Ryerson hosts, it means the OUA gets 4 spots. York, Western, Laurier, Waterloo, UOIT, Guelph, and Queen's are contending teams within a 3-hour drive. You'd get enough fan support from those schools' alumni to help out.

Halifax, drew, I believe between 9-10,000 for last year's gold medal game.

 

[AUS Fan]

Kind of hard for the OUA to get 4 teams in some cases. Should Windsor (13-13-2)get the spot over Calgary (18-9-1) or Acadia (20-8-2)?

 

[MiamiHockey]

Kind of hard for the OUA to get 4 teams in some cases. Should Windsor (13-13-2)get the spot over Calgary (18-9-1) or Acadia (20-8-2)?

That's actually not what would happen.
The Host would get the 4th spot. So, it would have been Ryerson, not Windsor. And, yes, it's perfectly fine for that to happen.

 

[Bob Stauffer]

U of A/Stan Marple/Hosting

Stan has done a stellar job.
The U of A had an exceptional recruiting class, Stan is the primary recruiter for Alberta.
Stan has also brought in several core sponsors for the program.
My sense for several years is that the U of A Athletics program is very partial to their Court Sports teams, I don't see them having the "will" to step up and go get the University Cup.
Clare Drake Arena has some limitations but I actually think a very successful USports Championship could be run there, one that would be a massive home ice advantage to Alberta-this was a concern when we moved the semi-final and final in 2005 and the final in 2006 to Rexall Place.
The commercial success of the Edmonton Oil Kings is legitimate concern.
They were not around in 2005/2006.
The Oil Kings, who were in a full blown rebuild this season, averaged over 9400/game and had 18,000 for the season finale on Sunday in the brand new Rogers Place (in fairness the building at this time is a draw as well).

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

That's actually not what would happen.
The Host would get the 4th spot. So, it would have been Ryerson, not Windsor. And, yes, it's perfectly fine for that to happen.[/QUOTE
Then the quality of hockey may suffer, it is a National Championship.

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

Stan has done a stellar job.
The U of A had an exceptional recruiting class, Stan is the primary recruiter for Alberta.
Stan has also brought in several core sponsors for the program.
My sense for several years is that the U of A Athletics program is very partial to their Court Sports teams, I don't see them having the "will" to step up and go get the University Cup.
Clare Drake Arena has some limitations but I actually think a very successful USports Championship could be run there, one that would be a massive home ice advantage to Alberta-this was a concern when we moved the semi-final and final in 2005 and the final in 2006 to Rexall Place.
The commercial success of the Edmonton Oil Kings is legitimate concern.
They were not around in 2005/2006.
The Oil Kings, who were in a full blown rebuild this season, averaged over 9400/game and had 18,000 for the season finale on Sunday in the brand new Rogers Place (in fairness the building at this time is a draw as well).

The question is , could they use the Drake for the entire tournament?
Or take the semi's and Final to Rexall, like in 2005-6. Is there any plans to decommission Rexall??

 

[MiamiHockey]

That's actually not what would happen.
The Host would get the 4th spot. So, it would have been Ryerson, not Windsor. And, yes, it's perfectly fine for that to happen.[/QUOTE
Then the quality of hockey may suffer, it is a National Championship.

So, changing one team would affect the quality of entire tournament, would it?

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

Stan has done a stellar job.
The U of A had an exceptional recruiting class, Stan is the primary recruiter for Alberta.
Stan has also brought in several core sponsors for the program.
My sense for several years is that the U of A Athletics program is very partial to their Court Sports teams, I don't see them having the "will" to step up and go get the University Cup.
Clare Drake Arena has some limitations but I actually think a very successful USports Championship could be run there, one that would be a massive home ice advantage to Alberta-this was a concern when we moved the semi-final and final in 2005 and the final in 2006 to Rexall Place.
The commercial success of the Edmonton Oil Kings is legitimate concern.
They were not around in 2005/2006.
The Oil Kings, who were in a full blown rebuild this season, averaged over 9400/game and had 18,000 for the season finale on Sunday in the brand new Rogers Place (in fairness the building at this time is a draw as well).

Alberta's recruiting class was by far the best in the CIS, this year. With a year under their belt, they will learn to raise their compete levell. They will be a beast to stop! Saskatchewan returns their entire lineup and the upswing of Mount Royal, means that the level of competition is on the rise in CanadaWest. This is good for the entire conference.

 

[RED ARMY EAST]

So, changing one team would affect the quality of entire tournament, would it?

How many OUA teams played in the semi's and finals this year?
How many last year in Halifax?
Now watch the wolves pounce!

 

[Rob]

Calgary has many good hosting options available.

Outside of the Saddledome what other rinks could they use?

 

[AUS Fan]

That's actually not what would happen.
The Host would get the 4th spot. So, it would have been Ryerson, not Windsor. And, yes, it's perfectly fine for that to happen.

What if the host wins the Queens Cup, or is runner up? Then a lesser team would get the host slot? When Lakehead hosted they did not get 4 teams. They got the usual 3 with AUS and then CW getting the extra slot. I realize that it was a 6 team tourney, but I can't see the OUA getting 4 teams.

I have no inside knowledge, and at times have been told I know nothing, but I'm willing to bet that, should the OUA host, they will get 3 slots.

 

[MiamiHockey]

What if the host wins the Queens Cup, or is runner up? Then a lesser team would get the host slot? When Lakehead hosted they did not get 4 teams. They got the usual 3 with AUS and then CW getting the extra slot. I realize that it was a 6 team tourney, but I can't see the OUA getting 4 teams.

I have no inside knowledge, and at times have been told I know nothing, but I'm willing to bet that, should the OUA host, they will get 3 slots.

You can bet all you want, but it's very clearly stated in the USports Policy ... which is on their website, and I provided a link to above.

I'm not sure why you don't want to believe what is written in their regulations.

 

[AdamMcg83]

You can bet all you want, but it's very clearly stated in the USports Policy ... which is on their website, and I provided a link to above.

I'm not sure why you don't want to believe what is written in their regulations.

These regulations are pliable from year to year. Nobody is arguing what the regulations say now, but we're arguing that the regulations will change in a scenario where the OUA is the host.

Also, in answer to an earlier question:

"I'm not sure where you got that wording from, but it's not correct.
Here is the link to the USports Policy:

http://en.usports.ca/information/mem...ms_-FINAL-.pdf

And here is the wording from that document:

20.20.4.7 Men’s Ice Hockey Championship
8 Team Format, Single Elimination
4 Regional Associations
1 Host
1 Assigned berth OUA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth CWUAA Regional Association
1 Assigned berth AUS Regional Association"

The link you posted was for the 2015-16 season, and it's dated August of 2015. The 2016-17 playing regulations once again use the word "rotating" to refer to the final three spots. No idea if that wording change was to allow more future flexibility, but it's certainly possible. See section 3.1 of this doc:

http://en.usports.ca/information/me...7/NEW/170118_PlayingRegs_Hockey_-M-_FINAL.PDF

 

[Drummer]

Guys - I don't think it really matters. I have no problem with an OUA having 4 teams (3 winners and a host). You still have two strong teams from CW an AUS.

Also, no 6-7-8 seed has ever advanced, so may as well keep costs down and take a local team who is going to lose.