Player Discussion 2017-18 End of Season grades. Detention for almost all of you!
- Thread starter brian_griffin
- Start date
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Gerstmann 3:16
- Jun 9, 2012
- 13,229
- 3,309
Forwards:
Jack Eichel: B When the team couldn't score, he still was. When guys started scoring, he scored more. Still not the leader I'm hoping for. Still hasn't exploded offensively like I'm hoping for. Hasn't developed into anything more than an offensive talent.
"Zegmus" Girgensons: F A phrase I'm going to use a lot, "sick of making excuses for why he isn't better".
Larsson: F Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Nolan: F Garbage.
O'Reilly: C 'Should' be better. 'Should' be a guy you rely on night in and night out. Wasn't. Worst of all, I'm watching Compher and Zads and having buyers remorse. Not quite "Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better" but I wasn't a fan of the trade, then ROR sold me on the trade, now I'm wondering how long I'll stay sold.
Okposo: D Injuries happen, but when you're on the ice they don't give you bonus points for being 'tough'. Hoping he puts it back together.
Pominville: F Sad watching a favorite player as his career plows into the ground.
Pouliot: C Produced every now and then. So every now and then he was better than garbage. Since I thought he would be all garbage, bonus!
Reinhart: C Nice to see a return to the net front force that I think Sam needs to be. I wish he had a few more tools in the box. But mostly I wish he remembered he played hockey prior to January.
Rodrigues: A "Outperformed my expectations. Has a ways to go to be a complete player (and he may never be one), but it's clear he gave good effort consistently. Shocked to realize he scored at a 40-45 point pace projected to 82 games. Didn't seem to be afflicted by the Sabres malaise." agree completely
Wilson: A "See the same comments for Rodrigues (minus the scoring)." agree completely
Defense:
Antipin: C Can I just blame Housley?
Beaulieu: F Really I could give him a B. He was exactly what I expected.
Bogosian: F Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Gorges: C Round 2 of watching players I really liked as their careers end.
McCabe: F Hands down my biggest disappointment of the season.
Nelson: B Had no expectations so even making the list is a good start.
Ristolainen: C Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Scandella: B Fine. Stands out on the blue line for being fine. Not many players were fine. He at least achieved that low bar.
Goal:
Johnson: D Hopefully bye, but I think he's back for another round of "we really need to be better at position x".
Lehner: F Bye. Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Jack Eichel: B When the team couldn't score, he still was. When guys started scoring, he scored more. Still not the leader I'm hoping for. Still hasn't exploded offensively like I'm hoping for. Hasn't developed into anything more than an offensive talent.
"Zegmus" Girgensons: F A phrase I'm going to use a lot, "sick of making excuses for why he isn't better".
Larsson: F Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Nolan: F Garbage.
O'Reilly: C 'Should' be better. 'Should' be a guy you rely on night in and night out. Wasn't. Worst of all, I'm watching Compher and Zads and having buyers remorse. Not quite "Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better" but I wasn't a fan of the trade, then ROR sold me on the trade, now I'm wondering how long I'll stay sold.
Okposo: D Injuries happen, but when you're on the ice they don't give you bonus points for being 'tough'. Hoping he puts it back together.
Pominville: F Sad watching a favorite player as his career plows into the ground.
Pouliot: C Produced every now and then. So every now and then he was better than garbage. Since I thought he would be all garbage, bonus!
Reinhart: C Nice to see a return to the net front force that I think Sam needs to be. I wish he had a few more tools in the box. But mostly I wish he remembered he played hockey prior to January.
Rodrigues: A "Outperformed my expectations. Has a ways to go to be a complete player (and he may never be one), but it's clear he gave good effort consistently. Shocked to realize he scored at a 40-45 point pace projected to 82 games. Didn't seem to be afflicted by the Sabres malaise." agree completely
Wilson: A "See the same comments for Rodrigues (minus the scoring)." agree completely
Defense:
Antipin: C Can I just blame Housley?
Beaulieu: F Really I could give him a B. He was exactly what I expected.
Bogosian: F Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Gorges: C Round 2 of watching players I really liked as their careers end.
McCabe: F Hands down my biggest disappointment of the season.
Nelson: B Had no expectations so even making the list is a good start.
Ristolainen: C Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Scandella: B Fine. Stands out on the blue line for being fine. Not many players were fine. He at least achieved that low bar.
Goal:
Johnson: D Hopefully bye, but I think he's back for another round of "we really need to be better at position x".
Lehner: F Bye. Sick of making excuses for why he isn't better.
Buffaloed
webmaster
The Sabres didn't develop collectively as a team. Their development as individuals was minimal. They all get an F and sadly they have to repeat a year. They should be relegated to the AHL.
He played 240 minutes with a .935 Save Percentage and a 2.00 Goals Against Average and you give him a 'C'?
And the thread starter gives Eichel a 'C'.
Negativity is to be expected after a season this bad but keep things in perspective.
And now we have this new trope that is gaining wider acceptance that ROR is 'too slow'.
C is average expectation. Did Ullmark outperform what I expected from him? No. Did Jack? Not particularly. That's how letter grades work.
I applaud so many of you for taking the time to write all this out. I mean that sincerely and at the same time jokingly because this team didn' put in half the effort this whole year that you guys did with these write ups.
I look forward to offseason discussions with everyone but I have no interest in grading our failure. As a team we deserve an F. We earned that F. Now how do we fix it (i.e let's go to the roster speculation thread lol)
I look forward to offseason discussions with everyone but I have no interest in grading our failure. As a team we deserve an F. We earned that F. Now how do we fix it (i.e let's go to the roster speculation thread lol)
ZZamboni
Puttin' on the Foil
If you expected Nolan to be amazing offensively. A star defensively. And fight every other game he played...
You were massively disappointed and give him a D or F.
If you expected very little. You were correct and that gives him an A or B.
Nolan gets a solid B. I expected so little from him. He delivered.
Larsson I expected more. Not a ton. But more. He gets a C. Hopefully better linemates will help him in his future.
Lehner I expected solid average to slightly above average. He looked real good for a handful of games. And sadly struggled for the majority of the games. It went beyond having the team look bad in front of him too on most nights. He gets a D.
Johnson gets a C. I expected a backup goalie to do a little better. But he never found his groove.
I’m basing this on pure expectations only. Did they meet my October thoughts on season long expectations?
ROR ... B+
Reinhart ... B
Eichel ... B+
Risto ... C+
Guhle ... A-
Falk ... B
Poms ... C
Bogo ... F
Pouliot ... B
Josefson ... C+
Nelson ... B
Kane ... B
Rodrigues ... A-
Baptiste ... B+
Girgensons ... F
Scandella ... A
McCabe ... F
Wilson ... A
Gorges ... B+
Beaulieu ... C-
Antipin ... B
Okposo ... B-
Housley ... D
JB ... C+
Sabretooth ... A+++ To get up for every game. Go to every game. Cheer and beat that drum every game. Shoot shirts into the crowd every game. Take pics with fans every game. Not hang yourself from the rafters after the first month of the season.
You were massively disappointed and give him a D or F.
If you expected very little. You were correct and that gives him an A or B.
Nolan gets a solid B. I expected so little from him. He delivered.
Larsson I expected more. Not a ton. But more. He gets a C. Hopefully better linemates will help him in his future.
Lehner I expected solid average to slightly above average. He looked real good for a handful of games. And sadly struggled for the majority of the games. It went beyond having the team look bad in front of him too on most nights. He gets a D.
Johnson gets a C. I expected a backup goalie to do a little better. But he never found his groove.
I’m basing this on pure expectations only. Did they meet my October thoughts on season long expectations?
ROR ... B+
Reinhart ... B
Eichel ... B+
Risto ... C+
Guhle ... A-
Falk ... B
Poms ... C
Bogo ... F
Pouliot ... B
Josefson ... C+
Nelson ... B
Kane ... B
Rodrigues ... A-
Baptiste ... B+
Girgensons ... F
Scandella ... A
McCabe ... F
Wilson ... A
Gorges ... B+
Beaulieu ... C-
Antipin ... B
Okposo ... B-
Housley ... D
JB ... C+
Sabretooth ... A+++ To get up for every game. Go to every game. Cheer and beat that drum every game. Shoot shirts into the crowd every game. Take pics with fans every game. Not hang yourself from the rafters after the first month of the season.
Rasmus CacOlainen
The end of the Tank
11 BsIf you expected Nolan to be amazing offensively. A star defensively. And fight every other game he played...
You were massively disappointed and give him a D or F.
If you expected very little. You were correct and that gives him an A or B.
Nolan gets a solid B. I expected so little from him. He delivered.
Larsson I expected more. Not a ton. But more. He gets a C. Hopefully better linemates will help him in his future.
Lehner I expected solid average to slightly above average. He looked real good for a handful of games. And sadly struggled for the majority of the games. It went beyond having the team look bad in front of him too on most nights. He gets a D.
Johnson gets a C. I expected a backup goalie to do a little better. But he never found his groove.
I’m basing this on pure expectations only. Did they meet my October thoughts on season long expectations?
ROR ... B+
Reinhart ... B
Eichel ... B+
Risto ... C+
Guhle ... A-
Falk ... B
Poms ... C
Bogo ... F
Pouliot ... B
Josefson ... C+
Nelson ... B
Kane ... B
Rodrigues ... A-
Baptiste ... B+
Girgensons ... F
Scandella ... A
McCabe ... F
Wilson ... A
Gorges ... B+
Beaulieu ... C-
Antipin ... B
Okposo ... B-
Housley ... D
JB ... C+
Sabretooth ... A+++ To get up for every game. Go to every game. Cheer and beat that drum every game. Shoot shirts into the crowd every game. Take pics with fans every game. Not hang yourself from the rafters after the first month of the season.
4 As
and we are last by a margin. High standards as usual.
Rasmus CacOlainen
The end of the Tank
Ryan O'Reilly C+
He did well in terms of carrying some heavy lifting...but it didn't translate enough in team success. He is clearly lacking in leadership skills and he is paid to be a leader. He is good at the PP but not good enough this season at ES - 38 5v5 points is not enough to give him anything higher than a C+ based on expectations.
Kyle Okposo C-
Was clearly behind in terms of conditioning, struggled mightily early. 23 5v5 points is embarassing for his cap. He will carve out a bottom 6 PP specialist role, but he is paid to be more than that.
Jason Pominville C-
Even with low expectations, he was disappointing. Clearly a capdump to get Scandella but at this age we can't expect much more from him. Still scored more 5v5 points than Okposo but was bad defensively as well and most of the points are because he played with Jack for a good while.
Zemgus Girgensons D+
You can't spend most of your time playing with good centers like ROR/Jack and to only get 15 points on the saeson. He has been a big disappointment and has clearly taken a step back (somehow!!) from last season.
Johan Larsson D-
Has no clue how to produce offence. Roughly as bad as Girgensons offensively. Plus minus of -30, get him off my team immediately if some GM is dumb enough to take him. Or let him sit in the stands as backup 4C, I've had enough of the Johan.
Benoit Pouliot - D
Invisible most of the time with a rare flash of brilliance. Another punt that didn't pay off for Botts - just like Bealieu and to some extend Josefson.
Jordan Nolan - F+
Waste of a contract spot as far as I'm concerned. The + is for his good effort from time to time but there is no skill there.
Jack Eichel A-
Did as much as he could with the crap he was surrounded with and with another injury this season. Has shown growing leadership. Should be made our captain soon and deservedly so. Needs better wingers than Pominville and Girgensons though if possible.
Casey Mittelstadt - can't rate a guy based on 2 games I've watched him.
Sam Reinhart C+
Bloody awful to start. Complete failure at center and our GM has already given up on the idea of even trying him there. Great recovery in the second half of the season. As much as it has been a disappointment that he hasn't worked out as a center, there is very good signs that he is outperforming my expectations of him as a winger at least in the 2nd half of the season. Great net-front presence (one of the best in the league). My expectations of him were to be in the 50 to 55 pt range and he got to the lower end of that but... Still, he didn't show up when games actually mattered.
Jacob Josefson C-
A complete nobody offensively. At least he was relatively fine defensively - when fit. C may be generous but he was a defensive role player in the end...
Evan Rodrigues - B+
Did fine. But doesn't wow me much and doesn't strike me as a top6 player. He will be a fine bottom 6 player once we have decent roster depth though. Considering the money he's paid I think B is rather fair for him.
Scott Wilson B+
Didn't see much point in his acquisition as he won't turn around our franchise. But he has good attitude, relatively decent skill and has played his role well since acquiring him. For the cost and the AAV we pay him, he has been above average roster player for sure.
Matt Moulson F-
Can't believe it took them 14 games to realize there's nothing there.
Alex Nylander - can't rate a guy based on 1 game I've watched him.
Nick Baptiste C-
He is turning into relatively acceptable checking line player, but the offensive game that we needed from him never came.
Justin Bailey C
Didn't look too bad in the games he was given. IMO he deserved a longer stint. Hopefully turns into at least a good bottom 6 player that can chip in some goals and show some physicality.
Seth Griffith D+
Looked OK but on yet another team could not translate his AHL production to the NHL. I guess he's career AHLer from now on despite my expectations that he could turn into a good player for the Sabres.
Rasmus Ristolainen C
Not good enough by the standards expected of him. Often made dumb plays in our end even though he still produced some points offensively.
Zach Bogosian F-
Pile of broken trash.
Marco Scandella B+
I liked most of what he did. Was more solid than Risto and also chipped in some offensively as much as his skillset allows him. Carried a lot of tough minutes and still only finished -15 on our trash team. He will be a solid player for us for some years and we need more players like him.
Josh Gorges C
A whole lot of meh but at least he wasn't a complete defensive liability this season. Zero significant vet leadership from him. Will gladly never see him in our jersey again.
Nathan Bealieu F
We paid a 3rd for this pile of smelly trash. Would love to see him bough out if no one wants to take him for free (which they shouldn't but you never know).
Jake McCabe D
Very disappointing. Dumb plays, unreliable defensively and insufficient offense.
Victor Antipin C-
Considering the big expectations of one of the upper calibre of players in the KHL, he has been disappointing. On the other side he was not given much support from the management team. Still not solid enough defensively and not much shown offensively (where I think we particularly expected more of someone like him).
Justin Falk C
Meh, he looked fine sometimes but nothing groundbreaking or worthy of giving him a new contract. There is no offense there even if defensively he wasn't particularly bad.
Brendan Guhle C+
Expected a tad more from him but considering these are his first significant steps in the NHL, he didn't look completely out of place. There is certainly potential there.
Casey Nelson A
Vastly outperformed expectations of him and looked mostly solid at both ends. Need more success stories like him. Would love it if he can keep up such level of play when games actually matter at the start of next season.
Robin Lehner D+
Only reason he doesn't get an F is he looked like an above average starter for about a month and a bit. Other than that he has been his usual trashy self. If we pay him his QO there should be riots in Buffalo.
Chad Johnson D-
We gave this guy 2.5mil, the joke is on us.
Linus Ullmark - not enough sample size for me.
Housley - F
...for FRAUD
Jason Botterill - C
Protecting Ullmark was key, slow cooking both Ullmark and Guhle and potentially others (Nylander) were good moves. Drafting Casey and allegedly Davidsson by all accounts have been very good draft choices regardless of the amount of input he has had in these choices. Getting Scandella at the cost of 2 scrubs was amazing. Getting Wilson for nothing was a good move...but there were bad moves as well Nolan, Bealieu, Pouliot, the treatment of Antipin. Failing to address positions of need properly (RD, G and winger depth) are big stains on his record so far as well. My biggest disappointment is the way he approached the Kane trade with a ludicrous ask that clearly put off some potential buyers, we should have gotten more for a player of the calibre of Kane or tried to re-sign him. We got neither.
He did well in terms of carrying some heavy lifting...but it didn't translate enough in team success. He is clearly lacking in leadership skills and he is paid to be a leader. He is good at the PP but not good enough this season at ES - 38 5v5 points is not enough to give him anything higher than a C+ based on expectations.
Kyle Okposo C-
Was clearly behind in terms of conditioning, struggled mightily early. 23 5v5 points is embarassing for his cap. He will carve out a bottom 6 PP specialist role, but he is paid to be more than that.
Jason Pominville C-
Even with low expectations, he was disappointing. Clearly a capdump to get Scandella but at this age we can't expect much more from him. Still scored more 5v5 points than Okposo but was bad defensively as well and most of the points are because he played with Jack for a good while.
Zemgus Girgensons D+
You can't spend most of your time playing with good centers like ROR/Jack and to only get 15 points on the saeson. He has been a big disappointment and has clearly taken a step back (somehow!!) from last season.
Johan Larsson D-
Has no clue how to produce offence. Roughly as bad as Girgensons offensively. Plus minus of -30, get him off my team immediately if some GM is dumb enough to take him. Or let him sit in the stands as backup 4C, I've had enough of the Johan.
Benoit Pouliot - D
Invisible most of the time with a rare flash of brilliance. Another punt that didn't pay off for Botts - just like Bealieu and to some extend Josefson.
Jordan Nolan - F+
Waste of a contract spot as far as I'm concerned. The + is for his good effort from time to time but there is no skill there.
Jack Eichel A-
Did as much as he could with the crap he was surrounded with and with another injury this season. Has shown growing leadership. Should be made our captain soon and deservedly so. Needs better wingers than Pominville and Girgensons though if possible.
Casey Mittelstadt - can't rate a guy based on 2 games I've watched him.
Sam Reinhart C+
Bloody awful to start. Complete failure at center and our GM has already given up on the idea of even trying him there. Great recovery in the second half of the season. As much as it has been a disappointment that he hasn't worked out as a center, there is very good signs that he is outperforming my expectations of him as a winger at least in the 2nd half of the season. Great net-front presence (one of the best in the league). My expectations of him were to be in the 50 to 55 pt range and he got to the lower end of that but... Still, he didn't show up when games actually mattered.
Jacob Josefson C-
A complete nobody offensively. At least he was relatively fine defensively - when fit. C may be generous but he was a defensive role player in the end...
Evan Rodrigues - B+
Did fine. But doesn't wow me much and doesn't strike me as a top6 player. He will be a fine bottom 6 player once we have decent roster depth though. Considering the money he's paid I think B is rather fair for him.
Scott Wilson B+
Didn't see much point in his acquisition as he won't turn around our franchise. But he has good attitude, relatively decent skill and has played his role well since acquiring him. For the cost and the AAV we pay him, he has been above average roster player for sure.
Matt Moulson F-
Can't believe it took them 14 games to realize there's nothing there.
Alex Nylander - can't rate a guy based on 1 game I've watched him.
Nick Baptiste C-
He is turning into relatively acceptable checking line player, but the offensive game that we needed from him never came.
Justin Bailey C
Didn't look too bad in the games he was given. IMO he deserved a longer stint. Hopefully turns into at least a good bottom 6 player that can chip in some goals and show some physicality.
Seth Griffith D+
Looked OK but on yet another team could not translate his AHL production to the NHL. I guess he's career AHLer from now on despite my expectations that he could turn into a good player for the Sabres.
Rasmus Ristolainen C
Not good enough by the standards expected of him. Often made dumb plays in our end even though he still produced some points offensively.
Zach Bogosian F-
Pile of broken trash.
Marco Scandella B+
I liked most of what he did. Was more solid than Risto and also chipped in some offensively as much as his skillset allows him. Carried a lot of tough minutes and still only finished -15 on our trash team. He will be a solid player for us for some years and we need more players like him.
Josh Gorges C
A whole lot of meh but at least he wasn't a complete defensive liability this season. Zero significant vet leadership from him. Will gladly never see him in our jersey again.
Nathan Bealieu F
We paid a 3rd for this pile of smelly trash. Would love to see him bough out if no one wants to take him for free (which they shouldn't but you never know).
Jake McCabe D
Very disappointing. Dumb plays, unreliable defensively and insufficient offense.
Victor Antipin C-
Considering the big expectations of one of the upper calibre of players in the KHL, he has been disappointing. On the other side he was not given much support from the management team. Still not solid enough defensively and not much shown offensively (where I think we particularly expected more of someone like him).
Justin Falk C
Meh, he looked fine sometimes but nothing groundbreaking or worthy of giving him a new contract. There is no offense there even if defensively he wasn't particularly bad.
Brendan Guhle C+
Expected a tad more from him but considering these are his first significant steps in the NHL, he didn't look completely out of place. There is certainly potential there.
Casey Nelson A
Vastly outperformed expectations of him and looked mostly solid at both ends. Need more success stories like him. Would love it if he can keep up such level of play when games actually matter at the start of next season.
Robin Lehner D+
Only reason he doesn't get an F is he looked like an above average starter for about a month and a bit. Other than that he has been his usual trashy self. If we pay him his QO there should be riots in Buffalo.
Chad Johnson D-
We gave this guy 2.5mil, the joke is on us.
Linus Ullmark - not enough sample size for me.
Housley - F
...for FRAUD
Jason Botterill - C
Protecting Ullmark was key, slow cooking both Ullmark and Guhle and potentially others (Nylander) were good moves. Drafting Casey and allegedly Davidsson by all accounts have been very good draft choices regardless of the amount of input he has had in these choices. Getting Scandella at the cost of 2 scrubs was amazing. Getting Wilson for nothing was a good move...but there were bad moves as well Nolan, Bealieu, Pouliot, the treatment of Antipin. Failing to address positions of need properly (RD, G and winger depth) are big stains on his record so far as well. My biggest disappointment is the way he approached the Kane trade with a ludicrous ask that clearly put off some potential buyers, we should have gotten more for a player of the calibre of Kane or tried to re-sign him. We got neither.
Icicle
Think big
- Oct 16, 2005
- 6,055
- 1,007
Forwards:
Jack Eichel: B Still produced despite having dits for brains Kane and the corpse of Pominville at his side for the first half of the season, and then picked it up despite carrying more corpses of former NHLers. His defense improved this year, but he could still be better. His PP production tanked as they forgot how to move the puck fast, and that stems from Eichel holding on to it so much.
"Zegmus" Girgensons: D I think he should've been 4C, he was a better winger for our talent than half of the other trash, but his game has regressed so much over the years. He sticks to the system and forgets he's trying to score. I hope he is allowed to focus on his real role next year.
Larsson: F Slow, lazy, useless. He really was being propped up by Folingo and Gionta, as pathetic as that may sound. I don't want to see him play anymore.
Nolan: B I don't understand what other people expected from him. Unlike players like Girgensons, somehow Nolan always had the puck- and that's because he skated hard and would be in the right places. Just because he made stone hands look like a shootout specialist doesn't mean he didn't do what was expected out of him. I upgrade him to a B because the locker room started to change around his coming, sending off pure waste like Griffith, and that was important to this team.
O'Reilly: D Started the season as an F, earned some of that back, but he completely failed to produce when needed. He had the best linemates out of any center this year and did nothing much with them. He stepped up when Eichel was out, just to go into hiding when Eichel came back. That's a mental problem and he needs to fix it. I'm not going to say he has to change his diet, but he needs to find his mojo from somewhere new.
Okposo: CI don't think enough people realize how serious injuries like that can be. I'm very disappointed in Okposo, but it's not on him. However, in injury+2, either he needs to find his way or do everyone, including himself, a favor and permanent LTIR. I will take solace that his game isn't top-6 or bust even if he treads water with us longer.
Pominville: BAgain, I don't understand people's expectations. The guy's defense was there all but maybe two games this season. His shot was there when he was passed to. Other than Eichel, there's not really anyone who was able to give him passes worth a damn all year. It was said straight since his acquisition- play him in a 3rd line role and don't expect more and you'll be happy. Well, unfortunately our prospects sucked and he was asked to do more than he ever should have had. Isn't his fault. I think he did more than I had expected he could offer this year.
Pouliot: FStill inconsistent and a total liability on his off days. I had a low bar for a 1 million dollar player, but being as lazy as he was, good bye and good riddance.
Reinhart: C No way he can be given higher after that total joke of a first half of the season. #2OA should forever haunt him. It's sad we've had to stoop his expectations so low. I'll be very happy if he can continue to produce once the games matter again, but he's yet to show it.
Rodrigues: A I had high hopes and he fit them. I hope him being a center is a thing of the past, and that's the part I had the hardest time of. Yes, he has defensive flubs that look really bad every so often, but he more often makes plays that aren't completely predictable and quite simply makes the game enjoying to watch. 600k/yr was a total steal, it's sad the first season of it was wasted, especially by that dirty pre-season hit that screwed him over. We need more players like him (thankfully we have one named Smith)
Wilson: AHe should never be more than a 4th line winger, but he showed up all the chumps on the team this year and I'm happy for it. But if he's more than a 4th line winger next year, Botterill made a mistake. He helps the beta players like ROR and Reinhart actually shoot the puck, which they don't do enough of, but he's a total mismatch with players like Eichel, since he can't process more than 'shoot the puck within a second of retrieving it'.
Defense:
Antipin: C I hope he re-signs. He had opportunities early on and blew them, then barely got played, but without anything negative being said.
Beaulieu: F Boom or bust signing. Bust.
Bogosian: F Injured again? f*** you
Gorges: B I think he did more than anyone would've expect when he stepped in. Bar was reaaaaaly low though
McCabe: F Guy is a total diva. Has his head up his ass all season then follows in the great steps of Bogosian with injury concerns.
Nelson: A By all reports I thought he was lost, but with the bar being so low, he didn't have much to make us happy. Assuming he comes back, if he's slotted in as anything more than a 7D it is a mistake by Botterill though.
Ristolainen: F He needs to spend the off-season passing the puck. I know he is asked way much more than he ever should have been, but the guy is too slow to make a pass and then can't even make it tape to tape when he does. This ends up destroying not only the breakout for this team, but the will of any player on the ice stuck with him. And he's out there for literally half the game? Are you confused why we suck? Ristolainen is a big part of it. If he wasn't given a pass for being such a slow, lazy, and terrible passer maybe he could turn it around. The question is: who or what is going to change that?
Scandella: B Best defenseman we've had by a mile. Doesn't get the A because he takes 1 out of every 5 games off and this team can't handle it when he does. I may be expecting too much out of him, but I didn't give many an above average grade, so take it for what it is.
Goal:
Johnson: D Bye
Lehner: F f*** you, bye
Jack Eichel: B Still produced despite having dits for brains Kane and the corpse of Pominville at his side for the first half of the season, and then picked it up despite carrying more corpses of former NHLers. His defense improved this year, but he could still be better. His PP production tanked as they forgot how to move the puck fast, and that stems from Eichel holding on to it so much.
"Zegmus" Girgensons: D I think he should've been 4C, he was a better winger for our talent than half of the other trash, but his game has regressed so much over the years. He sticks to the system and forgets he's trying to score. I hope he is allowed to focus on his real role next year.
Larsson: F Slow, lazy, useless. He really was being propped up by Folingo and Gionta, as pathetic as that may sound. I don't want to see him play anymore.
Nolan: B I don't understand what other people expected from him. Unlike players like Girgensons, somehow Nolan always had the puck- and that's because he skated hard and would be in the right places. Just because he made stone hands look like a shootout specialist doesn't mean he didn't do what was expected out of him. I upgrade him to a B because the locker room started to change around his coming, sending off pure waste like Griffith, and that was important to this team.
O'Reilly: D Started the season as an F, earned some of that back, but he completely failed to produce when needed. He had the best linemates out of any center this year and did nothing much with them. He stepped up when Eichel was out, just to go into hiding when Eichel came back. That's a mental problem and he needs to fix it. I'm not going to say he has to change his diet, but he needs to find his mojo from somewhere new.
Okposo: CI don't think enough people realize how serious injuries like that can be. I'm very disappointed in Okposo, but it's not on him. However, in injury+2, either he needs to find his way or do everyone, including himself, a favor and permanent LTIR. I will take solace that his game isn't top-6 or bust even if he treads water with us longer.
Pominville: BAgain, I don't understand people's expectations. The guy's defense was there all but maybe two games this season. His shot was there when he was passed to. Other than Eichel, there's not really anyone who was able to give him passes worth a damn all year. It was said straight since his acquisition- play him in a 3rd line role and don't expect more and you'll be happy. Well, unfortunately our prospects sucked and he was asked to do more than he ever should have had. Isn't his fault. I think he did more than I had expected he could offer this year.
Pouliot: FStill inconsistent and a total liability on his off days. I had a low bar for a 1 million dollar player, but being as lazy as he was, good bye and good riddance.
Reinhart: C No way he can be given higher after that total joke of a first half of the season. #2OA should forever haunt him. It's sad we've had to stoop his expectations so low. I'll be very happy if he can continue to produce once the games matter again, but he's yet to show it.
Rodrigues: A I had high hopes and he fit them. I hope him being a center is a thing of the past, and that's the part I had the hardest time of. Yes, he has defensive flubs that look really bad every so often, but he more often makes plays that aren't completely predictable and quite simply makes the game enjoying to watch. 600k/yr was a total steal, it's sad the first season of it was wasted, especially by that dirty pre-season hit that screwed him over. We need more players like him (thankfully we have one named Smith)
Wilson: AHe should never be more than a 4th line winger, but he showed up all the chumps on the team this year and I'm happy for it. But if he's more than a 4th line winger next year, Botterill made a mistake. He helps the beta players like ROR and Reinhart actually shoot the puck, which they don't do enough of, but he's a total mismatch with players like Eichel, since he can't process more than 'shoot the puck within a second of retrieving it'.
Defense:
Antipin: C I hope he re-signs. He had opportunities early on and blew them, then barely got played, but without anything negative being said.
Beaulieu: F Boom or bust signing. Bust.
Bogosian: F Injured again? f*** you
Gorges: B I think he did more than anyone would've expect when he stepped in. Bar was reaaaaaly low though
McCabe: F Guy is a total diva. Has his head up his ass all season then follows in the great steps of Bogosian with injury concerns.
Nelson: A By all reports I thought he was lost, but with the bar being so low, he didn't have much to make us happy. Assuming he comes back, if he's slotted in as anything more than a 7D it is a mistake by Botterill though.
Ristolainen: F He needs to spend the off-season passing the puck. I know he is asked way much more than he ever should have been, but the guy is too slow to make a pass and then can't even make it tape to tape when he does. This ends up destroying not only the breakout for this team, but the will of any player on the ice stuck with him. And he's out there for literally half the game? Are you confused why we suck? Ristolainen is a big part of it. If he wasn't given a pass for being such a slow, lazy, and terrible passer maybe he could turn it around. The question is: who or what is going to change that?
Scandella: B Best defenseman we've had by a mile. Doesn't get the A because he takes 1 out of every 5 games off and this team can't handle it when he does. I may be expecting too much out of him, but I didn't give many an above average grade, so take it for what it is.
Goal:
Johnson: D Bye
Lehner: F f*** you, bye
ZZamboni
Puttin' on the Foil
Again, From what my expectations were going in....
Don’t agree? Oh well. It’s my opinion. As you would say.
stokes84
Registered User
ZZamboni
Puttin' on the Foil
ZZamboni
Puttin' on the Foil
Rasmus CacOlainen
The end of the Tank
brian_griffin
"Eric Cartman?"
Crazy Tasty
Registered User
F for the whole lot of them. I might have watched 3 or 4 complete games this year.
Zero excitement, zero desire to tune in. It's supposed to be competitive and entertaining and it was neither.
Vegas is my favorite city, I'm rooting for them in the playoffs. We'll see about next year.
Zero excitement, zero desire to tune in. It's supposed to be competitive and entertaining and it was neither.
Vegas is my favorite city, I'm rooting for them in the playoffs. We'll see about next year.
joshjull
Registered User
Jack should certainly be held to a higher standard for a lot of reasons, not the least of which being the commitment the team made to him contractually. But I'm a tad surprised by these questions. Not that you ask them but that you seem to be using them to frame this season as a nothing burger in terms of his growth as a player.
-He had growth in his defensive game. I wouldn't call it exceptional but it was certainly an improvement.
-He elevated his linemates, such as they were. For stretches his line, and whoever was on it, was the only offense. Many of those wingers struggled to do much offensively away from his line. Kane and Pommer being the most prominent examples.
-This year was a progressive build on last season. At ES he's gone from .43 to .54 to .63 in ESppg. His overall points per game went from .69 to .93 to .96 this year largely due to his growth at ES. Obviously our PP struggling like it did impacted his ability to grow his overall ppg more than he did.
Going forward he needs to keep growing his defensive game. Hopefully when we have more talent on the roster his production takes a step to an elite level. Not there yet but its been steadily growing.
Last edited:
Approach: Grades given based on what is Expected.
Forwards:
Jack Eichel: C+
Expectation: Franchise Star in Year 3
Simple. Expectations were not close to being met. A 30 goal "pace" is not enough. Defensive game is still lacking. Skill is there. Leadership is not. 10 mil players don't get the linemates excuse. 10 Mil players turn Pascal Dupuis in to 20 goal scorers. Improved his scoring from .93 (last year) to .95... in a "more offensive system". Improved scoring from .92 in first half (35 pts in 38 games), to 1.0 in 2nd half this year (29 pts in 29 games in 2018).
Zemgus Girgensons: F
Expectation: Versatile top 9 forward who contributes throughout the lineup with a solid defensive game and depth scoring.
How do you manage 8 assists playing with Eichel and ROR for over half the season? Girgensons defensive game is useful... but he's an offensive dud. Zemgus had the greatest opportunity among our younger depth, and he did the least with it.
Larsson: F
Expectation: Checking line center
Outright terrible this season. But bottom 6 centers DO get the linemates excuse, and Larsson's linemates were a joke for most of the season. His 54% faceoffs, and heavy dzone starts were useful. His hands and feet were not.
Nolan: D
Expectation: Scrub/Enforcer
A scrub who didn't enforce. He played 69 games this year... how is that possible?
O'Reilly: C+
Expectation: Selke Caliber top 6 center
Hit his numbers. Didn't lead. The offseason narrative is going to run the gamut. I still think he's a huge part of any success we are gonna have over the next 5 years.
Okposo: C-
Expectation: 20 goal, top 6
Weird season. Okposo scored, produced a respectable stat line. But he looked really bad doing. His puck handling was an abomination, it was a Beaulieu level comedy. I hope that there is still some recovering/rebounding in his game.
Pominville: D
Expectation: Declining depth scorer.
He's toast. He got more opportunity than he deserved. Happy he was able to finish some plays, but he was completely miscast within the top 6.
Pouliot: F
Expectation: Top 9, Depth scorer
What a piece of garbage. Low/No effort players are the worst. It's one thing when Pominville's wheels are completely gone. Pouliot is worse, he personifies the identity of this team. His addition did damage.
Reinhart: B+
Expectation: Top 6 breakout 3rd season.
Brutal start to the season. Best player on the team in the 2nd half. Showed true development and growth in all areas of the game. Possibly the lone bright spot this year. Improved from .29 (11 pts in 38 games) to 0.89 (39 in 44).
Rodrigues: B
Expectation: 23 man roster, depth scorer, work way up lineup
I expected Erod here sooner, but once he was healthy and a regular in the lineup, he outperformed expectations. I still have a lot of concerns regarding his defensive game, and game play IQ. But the kid makes plays. A 40 point pace on a half season's work, is encouraging.
Wilson: C-
Expectation: 4th liner
It's hard to both exceed expectations while also being the most overrated player on the season. Wilson is bad. He belongs as a 13th forward. The guy puts up Jordan Nolan metrics, and everyone loves him. So weird.
Wilson: C-
Expectation: 4th liner
It's hard to both exceed expectations while also being the most overrated player on the season. Wilson is bad. He belong
Josefson: D
Expectation: 4th liner
Josefson played a small handful of good games to start the year... And those games got him a pass for being bad whenever he was healthy enough to be back in the lineup. Maybe it was injuries, but he was just bad.
Baptiste: C+
Expectation: Rochester, call up depth
Baptiste made the most of his opportunities. I don't see a long term future with him. But I am fine with him as a 13th-14th forward. He'd very likely clear waivers to start next season in Rochester, if we build the appropriate depth at the NHL level. But if he's here, he shouldn't be a regular.
Griffith AND Moulson: F
Expectation: This is bad
It was worse.
Mittelstadt: A
Expectation: Didn't expect to see him in Buffalo this year
The game was a too fast for him. You could see him thinking the game. He's got development time ahead.... but, his skill was absolutely apparent. 5 in 6 is no joke at his age, on this team, and the end of a shit season. The future is bright with this one
Defense:
Antipin: C
Expectation: 3rd pair offensive D
WTF Housley? Is the language barrier really that great? From his first game, it was obvious he was the most capable of executing within the system.... Antipin's usage by Housley is the 2nd most perplexing narrative of the season.
Beaulieu: F
Expectation: Offensive defensemen that fit the system
I... think I was excited about this trade....
Bogosian: F
Expectation: Core Top 4 D
That was predictable
Gorges: C
Expectation: Waived
Actually provided some useful minutes. He took a back seat to the new leadership group.... and it showed.
McCabe: F
Expectaiton: Core Top 4 D
Someone else said it best, "Hands down my biggest disappointment of the season".
Nelson: B
Expectaiton: Top 4 D... in Rochester
Talk about a bright spot. Nelson has put himself in the long term conversation. A conversation he was not even remotely a part of at the beginning of the year. Small wins.
Ristolainen: C-
Expectation: 1st Pair, All Situations
Pretty disappointed. I'll make the excuse that coaching/system changes have had a very negative impact on his development. I wonder if it's correctable.
Scandella: B+
Expectation: Top 4 Defensive Defensemen
Everything we expected, and a little more. Looked to be wearing down towards end of season. He should not be a 23 minute a night defensemen.
Falk: C
Expectation: #8-9 Defensemen
I'm not as down on Falk. He's a lunchpale player, and you could do worse for what SHOULD have been our #8-9 defensemen. Unfortunately, he was essentially our #4-5 defensemen during the 2nd half of this year, and that is a role he is not capable of playing.
Guhle: C+
Expectation: Top D Prospect
Tale of two sides of the ice. Man, Guhle was super impressive with the puck, driving play, shots on net, ozone play. But all of that good... was completely obliterated by his completely inept defense. He's got a lot of work to do, and needs to add functional hockey strength to his base. Reminded me a lot of the early glimpses of Brian Campbell pre-lockout.
Tennyson: F
Expectation: They can't be serious
Oh my god... they ARE serious
Goal:
Johnson: D-
Expectation: Capable Backup
Nice knowing you, Patrick Lalime.
Lehner: D+
Expectation: Capable Starter
Too many holes in his technique to carry on. We didn't even get to see Psycho Lehner this year.
Jack Eichel: C+
Expectation: Franchise Star in Year 3
Simple. Expectations were not close to being met. A 30 goal "pace" is not enough. Defensive game is still lacking. Skill is there. Leadership is not. 10 mil players don't get the linemates excuse. 10 Mil players turn Pascal Dupuis in to 20 goal scorers. Improved his scoring from .93 (last year) to .95... in a "more offensive system". Improved scoring from .92 in first half (35 pts in 38 games), to 1.0 in 2nd half this year (29 pts in 29 games in 2018).
Zemgus Girgensons: F
Expectation: Versatile top 9 forward who contributes throughout the lineup with a solid defensive game and depth scoring.
How do you manage 8 assists playing with Eichel and ROR for over half the season? Girgensons defensive game is useful... but he's an offensive dud. Zemgus had the greatest opportunity among our younger depth, and he did the least with it.
Larsson: F
Expectation: Checking line center
Outright terrible this season. But bottom 6 centers DO get the linemates excuse, and Larsson's linemates were a joke for most of the season. His 54% faceoffs, and heavy dzone starts were useful. His hands and feet were not.
Nolan: D
Expectation: Scrub/Enforcer
A scrub who didn't enforce. He played 69 games this year... how is that possible?
O'Reilly: C+
Expectation: Selke Caliber top 6 center
Hit his numbers. Didn't lead. The offseason narrative is going to run the gamut. I still think he's a huge part of any success we are gonna have over the next 5 years.
Okposo: C-
Expectation: 20 goal, top 6
Weird season. Okposo scored, produced a respectable stat line. But he looked really bad doing. His puck handling was an abomination, it was a Beaulieu level comedy. I hope that there is still some recovering/rebounding in his game.
Pominville: D
Expectation: Declining depth scorer.
He's toast. He got more opportunity than he deserved. Happy he was able to finish some plays, but he was completely miscast within the top 6.
Pouliot: F
Expectation: Top 9, Depth scorer
What a piece of garbage. Low/No effort players are the worst. It's one thing when Pominville's wheels are completely gone. Pouliot is worse, he personifies the identity of this team. His addition did damage.
Reinhart: B+
Expectation: Top 6 breakout 3rd season.
Brutal start to the season. Best player on the team in the 2nd half. Showed true development and growth in all areas of the game. Possibly the lone bright spot this year. Improved from .29 (11 pts in 38 games) to 0.89 (39 in 44).
Rodrigues: B
Expectation: 23 man roster, depth scorer, work way up lineup
I expected Erod here sooner, but once he was healthy and a regular in the lineup, he outperformed expectations. I still have a lot of concerns regarding his defensive game, and game play IQ. But the kid makes plays. A 40 point pace on a half season's work, is encouraging.
Wilson: C-
Expectation: 4th liner
It's hard to both exceed expectations while also being the most overrated player on the season. Wilson is bad. He belongs as a 13th forward. The guy puts up Jordan Nolan metrics, and everyone loves him. So weird.
Wilson: C-
Expectation: 4th liner
It's hard to both exceed expectations while also being the most overrated player on the season. Wilson is bad. He belong
Josefson: D
Expectation: 4th liner
Josefson played a small handful of good games to start the year... And those games got him a pass for being bad whenever he was healthy enough to be back in the lineup. Maybe it was injuries, but he was just bad.
Baptiste: C+
Expectation: Rochester, call up depth
Baptiste made the most of his opportunities. I don't see a long term future with him. But I am fine with him as a 13th-14th forward. He'd very likely clear waivers to start next season in Rochester, if we build the appropriate depth at the NHL level. But if he's here, he shouldn't be a regular.
Griffith AND Moulson: F
Expectation: This is bad
It was worse.
Mittelstadt: A
Expectation: Didn't expect to see him in Buffalo this year
The game was a too fast for him. You could see him thinking the game. He's got development time ahead.... but, his skill was absolutely apparent. 5 in 6 is no joke at his age, on this team, and the end of a shit season. The future is bright with this one
Defense:
Antipin: C
Expectation: 3rd pair offensive D
WTF Housley? Is the language barrier really that great? From his first game, it was obvious he was the most capable of executing within the system.... Antipin's usage by Housley is the 2nd most perplexing narrative of the season.
Beaulieu: F
Expectation: Offensive defensemen that fit the system
I... think I was excited about this trade....
Bogosian: F
Expectation: Core Top 4 D
That was predictable
Gorges: C
Expectation: Waived
Actually provided some useful minutes. He took a back seat to the new leadership group.... and it showed.
McCabe: F
Expectaiton: Core Top 4 D
Someone else said it best, "Hands down my biggest disappointment of the season".
Nelson: B
Expectaiton: Top 4 D... in Rochester
Talk about a bright spot. Nelson has put himself in the long term conversation. A conversation he was not even remotely a part of at the beginning of the year. Small wins.
Ristolainen: C-
Expectation: 1st Pair, All Situations
Pretty disappointed. I'll make the excuse that coaching/system changes have had a very negative impact on his development. I wonder if it's correctable.
Scandella: B+
Expectation: Top 4 Defensive Defensemen
Everything we expected, and a little more. Looked to be wearing down towards end of season. He should not be a 23 minute a night defensemen.
Falk: C
Expectation: #8-9 Defensemen
I'm not as down on Falk. He's a lunchpale player, and you could do worse for what SHOULD have been our #8-9 defensemen. Unfortunately, he was essentially our #4-5 defensemen during the 2nd half of this year, and that is a role he is not capable of playing.
Guhle: C+
Expectation: Top D Prospect
Tale of two sides of the ice. Man, Guhle was super impressive with the puck, driving play, shots on net, ozone play. But all of that good... was completely obliterated by his completely inept defense. He's got a lot of work to do, and needs to add functional hockey strength to his base. Reminded me a lot of the early glimpses of Brian Campbell pre-lockout.
Tennyson: F
Expectation: They can't be serious
Oh my god... they ARE serious
Goal:
Johnson: D-
Expectation: Capable Backup
Nice knowing you, Patrick Lalime.
Lehner: D+
Expectation: Capable Starter
Too many holes in his technique to carry on. We didn't even get to see Psycho Lehner this year.
