Speculation: 2013 Leafs Trades/Proposals/Signings: Version V-Gardiner or O'Reilly

[Schenn]

We've been trying to get a number 1 C for a while now to no avail. No one gift wraps a number 1 C. You either draft one yourself or you sign one.

All I know is the same argument you're using for Jake Gardiner, who I'm a fan of, can be applied to Ryan O'Reilly here, except I'll go on and say that he's been an impact player in the NHL since he was drafted.

The intangibles that he possesses can not be taught. Let's take his playmaking skills for example and I'll quote a recent Hockey Prospectus article.



The fact is, that the sense I get from us that we need top end talent, but we want to give peanuts for them. The reality is that while Sherman is a duma**, he's not that big of a duma** either.

We were willing to go all in for Brad Richards who is up there in age and is struggling this year with the Rangers. Top that off with the fact that the guy signed a 9 year contract to boot. Would you want to do that with any available C in the free agent market?

O'Reilly might not belong in the same elite group as guys like Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Getzlaf, Sedin, Staal and Thornton but he belongs in the category of players like Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan and David Backes.

What you'll get with Reilly at the end is untapped potential on the offensive end and superior defense than any player in the elite group I mentioned above.

Thank You.

 

[Sonny21]

We've been trying to get a number 1 C for a while now to no avail. No one gift wraps a number 1 C. You either draft one yourself or you sign one.

All I know is the same argument you're using for Jake Gardiner, who I'm a fan of, can be applied to Ryan O'Reilly here, except I'll go on and say that he's been an impact player in the NHL since he was drafted.

The intangibles that he possesses can not be taught. Let's take his playmaking skills for example and I'll quote a recent Hockey Prospectus article.



The fact is, that the sense I get from us that we need top end talent, but we want to give peanuts for them. The reality is that while Sherman is a duma**, he's not that big of a duma** either.

We were willing to go all in for Brad Richards who is up there in age and is struggling this year with the Rangers. Top that off with the fact that the guy signed a 9 year contract to boot. Would you want to do that with any available C in the free agent market?

O'Reilly might not belong in the same elite group as guys like Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Getzlaf, Sedin, Staal and Thornton but he belongs in the category of players like Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan and David Backes.

What you'll get with Reilly at the end is untapped potential on the offensive end and superior defense than any player in the elite group I mentioned above.

Very well said.

 

[Smif]

HE is also a forward who got outscored by a d-man. So you C'mon?????

And he was 19yrs old for half the year as a rookie. Since age is such a big deal. Gards came up through the US university system. Which means less hockey than ROR would have played in the OHL.

D-men take longer yadda yadda yadda


Bottom line is RoR for Gards = bad idea

Last year ROR outscored Gards by 25 points and is a year younger. Colorado played a defensive system while Toronto played a run and gun offensive system. Compare apples to apples man.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

We've been trying to get a number 1 C for a while now to no avail. No one gift wraps a number 1 C. You either draft one yourself or you sign one.

All I know is the same argument you're using for Jake Gardiner, who I'm a fan of, can be applied to Ryan O'Reilly here, except I'll go on and say that he's been an impact player in the NHL since he was drafted.

The intangibles that he possesses can not be taught. Let's take his playmaking skills for example and I'll quote a recent Hockey Prospectus article.



The fact is, that the sense I get from us that we need top end talent, but we want to give peanuts for them. The reality is that while Sherman is a duma**, he's not that big of a duma** either.

We were willing to go all in for Brad Richards who is up there in age and is struggling this year with the Rangers. Top that off with the fact that the guy signed a 9 year contract to boot. Would you want to do that with any available C in the free agent market?

O'Reilly might not belong in the same elite group as guys like Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Getzlaf, Sedin, Staal and Thornton but he belongs in the category of players like Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan and David Backes.

What you'll get with Reilly at the end is untapped potential on the offensive end and superior defense than any player in the elite group I mentioned above.

Great post, I agree completely.

 

[charliolemieux]

We've been trying to get a number 1 C for a while now to no avail. No one gift wraps a number 1 C. You either draft one yourself or you sign one.

All I know is the same argument you're using for Jake Gardiner, who I'm a fan of, can be applied to Ryan O'Reilly here, except I'll go on and say that he's been an impact player in the NHL since he was drafted.

The intangibles that he possesses can not be taught. Let's take his playmaking skills for example and I'll quote a recent Hockey Prospectus article.



The fact is, that the sense I get from us that we need top end talent, but we want to give peanuts for them. The reality is that while Sherman is a duma**, he's not that big of a duma** either.

We were willing to go all in for Brad Richards who is up there in age and is struggling this year with the Rangers. Top that off with the fact that the guy signed a 9 year contract to boot. Would you want to do that with any available C in the free agent market?

O'Reilly might not belong in the same elite group as guys like Crosby, Stamkos, Malkin, Getzlaf, Sedin, Staal and Thornton but he belongs in the category of players like Dustin Brown, Ryan Callahan and David Backes.

What you'll get with Reilly at the end is untapped potential on the offensive end and superior defense than any player in the elite group I mentioned above.

Brown and Callahan and Backes?

RoR would need to make about 200 more hits per season to be compared to those three.

 

[charliolemieux]

Last year ROR outscored Gards by 25 points and is a year younger. Colorado played a defensive system while Toronto played a run and gun offensive system. Compare apples to apples man.

Ummm 3rd year as opposed to rookie year.. hello???

 

[Schenn]

Ummm 3rd year as opposed to rookie year.. hello???

Well you compared their rookie years. O'Reilly was 18, Gardiner was 21. That makes a difference as well.

 

[Schenn]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1352511

Next thread.

 

[charliolemieux]

,,........

 

[buntek]

And you do know that D-men get better with age right? Defense is still an issue for us. Besides, ROR is no sure-shot #1C. I don't think he is a #1C on a playoff team.

Given our defense situation, I hope we keep Gardiner. We give up wayyyyyy too many shots and chances.

This is what I wanted to write when I read the op. What he said

 

[ULF_55]

It wasn't as clear cut as that. Yes, Healy said that the Avs' have unrealistic expectations. But later PJ Stock said he was overrated, and Friedman interrupted him to state that many GMs feel he is a first line center. Healy then said that if the 2009 NHL draft was held today, ROR would be the second pick behind Tavares (apparently ahead of Duchene and Hedman), and Weekes concurred with this statement.

It was all over the board and frankly confusing.

It was a selling job on O'Reilly, and they didn't want to listen to Stock. A love in where they just because they didn't want to hear it.

Duchene would not be chosen after O'Reilly.

164 points in 232 games (70 goals)
107 points in 236 games (39 goals)

I'm taking the 1st. line center over the 2nd. line center.