Prospect Info: #19 OA - C/W Evgeny Svechnikov, QMJHL

[Dotter]

So far, it appears to be an unfortunate break for Detroit. But with Bertuzzi's success, that one was a fortunate break. It all evens out in the end.

Sucks for Svech because I think he had the potential to be a really important player for our team.

 

[Hen Kolland]

It shouldn't be hard for the Wings to find room to keep Svech around next season, right?
Let's work it out. Let's assume we don't trade AA or Helm or whoever.
We have 8 winger jobs available.
1. Mantha
2. Bertuzzi
3. Athanasiou
4. Zadina
5. Fabbri
6. Helm
7. Abdelkader
8. Erne
9. Perlini
10. Ehn
---
11. Rasmussen*
12. Smith
13. G. Smith
14. Svechnikov
15. Hirose
---
*I list Ras as winger even if the Wings want him to be a C. Not sure he's ever a C in this league. Also, even if he's a C, that means one of Flip/Nielsen/Glendening move to the wing, so it's a wash.

Now, this team probably walks away from Perlini. Maybe Ehn or Erne too. You also have room for a healthy scratch or two.

Personally, I think the Wings would keep Ehn, who can play center, and drop Perlini. Ehn can be your 13/14 foward. Abby is probably another healthy scratch.

So:
1. Mantha
2. Bertuzzi
3. Athanasiou
4. Zadina
5. Fabbri
6. Helm
---
And then Ras/Svech/Hirose/Smith battle for those last two jobs with Erne, Ehn and Abby.

Of course, a trade changes that.

Also, it’s extremely likely that Lafreniere, Byfield, and Stutzle could make the jump immediately. As well as the potential Swedes. And Veleno. All of which I’d put money on breaking in as a winger in the NHL, outside of maybe Veleno.

 

[MBH]

With 17 minutes tonight - Mathias Brome is at 184 career minutes.
0-0-0 -6 13 shots.
Evgeny Svechnikov is at 183 minutes.
2-2-4 -3 26 shots.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

With 17 minutes tonight - Mathias Brome is at 184 career minutes.
0-0-0 -6 13 shots.
Evgeny Svechnikov is at 183 minutes.
2-2-4 -3 26 shots.

Keep in mind when Svech scored 4pts/14gp in 17-18 we had a relatively much better roster. Zett, Larkin, Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha, Bertuzzi, Athanasiou, Nielsen, Helm, Kronner, Green, DDK, LGD. Compare that roster to current. Also, I understand your perspective though.

Detroit Red Wings 2017-18 roster and scoring statistics at hockeydb.com

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

With 17 minutes tonight - Mathias Brome is at 184 career minutes.
0-0-0 -6 13 shots.
Evgeny Svechnikov is at 183 minutes.
2-2-4 -3 26 shots.

Brome sucks man.

 

[MBH]

Keep in mind when Svech scored 4pts/14gp in 17-18 we had a relatively much better roster. Zett, Larkin, Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha, Bertuzzi, Athanasiou, Nielsen, Helm, Kronner, Green, DDK, LGD. Compare that roster to current. Also, I understand your perspective though.

Detroit Red Wings 2017-18 roster and scoring statistics at hockeydb.com

Top minutes at 5 on 5
Svech
Frk 63 minutes
Glendening 47 minutes
Athanasiou 37 minutes
Nielsen 34 minutes
Larkin 24 minutes
Mantha 24 minutes
Abdelkader 20 minutes
Hirose 17 minutes
vs
Brome
Larkin 75 minutes
Glendening 42 minutes
Bertuzzi 41 minutes
Zadina 25 minutes
Nielsen 16 minutes
Filppula 16 minutes
Ryan 15 minues

So Brome's most common linemate is Larkin.
Svech's is Frk.

 

[Tetsuo]

Top minutes at 5 on 5
Svech
Frk 63 minutes
Glendening 47 minutes
Athanasiou 37 minutes
Nielsen 34 minutes
Larkin 24 minutes
Mantha 24 minutes
Abdelkader 20 minutes
Hirose 17 minutes
vs
Brome
Larkin 75 minutes
Glendening 42 minutes
Bertuzzi 41 minutes
Zadina 25 minutes
Nielsen 16 minutes
Filppula 16 minutes
Ryan 15 minues

So Brome's most common linemate is Larkin.
Svech's is Frk.

Okay, but now compare the quality of opposition Svech played against vs what Brome plays against. I can guarantee that Brome is playing more minutes against teams top players than Svech was, given the fact that (as you and others have pointed out) Svech wasn't given a huge role while he was up in Detroit. The composition of Detroit's top 6 is much inferior at present than it was a few years ago, especially considering that Bert has been injured. This does not excuse Brome's lack of production, but it also doesn't mean Svech would be doing much better than Brome. We don't have much in the way of useful statistics to compare them.

That said, I do agree with you that there is no reason for the Wings not to play Svech over Brome. It's not like it can get much worse! Besides, it would be the best way for them to rectify a truly woeful 2015 Draft.

 

[izlez]

Okay, but now compare the quality of opposition Svech played against vs what Brome plays against. I can guarantee that Brome is playing more minutes against teams top players than Svech was, given the fact that (as you and others have pointed out) Svech wasn't given a huge role while he was up in Detroit. The composition of Detroit's top 6 is much inferior at present than it was a few years ago, especially considering that Bert has been injured. This does not excuse Brome's lack of production, but it also doesn't mean Svech would be doing much better than Brome. We don't have much in the way of useful statistics to compare them.

That said, I do agree with you that there is no reason for the Wings not to play Svech over Brome. It's not like it can get much worse! Besides, it would be the best way for them to rectify a truly woeful 2015 Draft.

Brome is being gifted first line minutes and we're spinning it as "tough matchups"?

 

[Frk It]

With 17 minutes tonight - Mathias Brome is at 184 career minutes.
0-0-0 -6 13 shots.
Evgeny Svechnikov is at 183 minutes.
2-2-4 -3 26 shots.

Is it better to have Svechnikov/Rasmussen on the 1st line in GR or the 3rd line in Detroit?

Genuinely curious what people think on that. Because I would like to see both Svechnikov/Rasmussen in Detroit, but I don't think they would be given a big role.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Is it better to have Svechnikov/Rasmussen on the 1st line in GR or the 3rd line in Detroit?

Genuinely curious what people think on that. Because I would like to see both Svechnikov/Rasmussen in Detroit, but I don't think they would be given a big role.

I'd like to see Svech given a shot this year. I like his game as a 3rd line winger.

Rasmussen does absolutely nothing for me. I know he's got fans cheering hard for the guy because we all want the 9th overall pick from the 2017 draft to do well with us, but the dude is reaffirming that he was a reach.

 

[jaster]

I have to believe there is a factor, health-related or otherwise, regarding Svechnikov that we don't know about. It just makes no sense, having seen him in those 4 games last season, and given this roster, that he hasn't cracked a lineup that has featured 62 man-games between Filppula, Nielsen, Gagner, Erne, Helm, and Brome.

 

[Laser Rayzor]

I know he's been injury prone and hasn't met expectations but I really dislike the way Svech has been handled. He should be in the NHL full time, even as a 4th line scrub. If he can't hack it then cut him loose but it's better than keeping him in GR until he suddenly develops or (more likely) f***s off to Russia.

 

[MBH]

Okay, but now compare the quality of opposition Svech played against vs what Brome plays against. I can guarantee that Brome is playing more minutes against teams top players than Svech was, given the fact that (as you and others have pointed out) Svech wasn't given a huge role while he was up in Detroit. The composition of Detroit's top 6 is much inferior at present than it was a few years ago, especially considering that Bert has been injured. This does not excuse Brome's lack of production, but it also doesn't mean Svech would be doing much better than Brome. We don't have much in the way of useful statistics to compare them.

That said, I do agree with you that there is no reason for the Wings not to play Svech over Brome. It's not like it can get much worse! Besides, it would be the best way for them to rectify a truly woeful 2015 Draft.

Right, you've entered damned if you do, damned if you don't territory arguments.
If he plays with Larkin, he's going to face tougher oppo.
If he plays with Frk and Glendening, he's on a shit line.

 

[MBH]

Is it better to have Svechnikov/Rasmussen on the 1st line in GR or the 3rd line in Detroit?

Genuinely curious what people think on that. Because I would like to see both Svechnikov/Rasmussen in Detroit, but I don't think they would be given a big role.

Why can't you give the role Brome had?

It's better for Svech, if he wants to be and we want him to be an NHLer, to play in the NHL. That's clear.

I think the same has to be true for Rasmussen pretty soon.

One guy in for Brome. One guy in for Gagner.
When Bert comes back you have a choice to make.
Best kid plays. Other two kids (including Smith) rotate in/out until there's another injury, COVID-19 case or trade.

 

[Frk It]

Why can't you give the role Brome had?

It's better for Svech, if he wants to be and we want him to be an NHLer, to play in the NHL. That's clear.

I think the same has to be true for Rasmussen pretty soon.

One guy in for Brome. One guy in for Gagner.
When Bert comes back you have a choice to make.
Best kid plays. Other two kids (including Smith) rotate in/out until there's another injury, COVID-19 case or trade.

I'd be fine with that. I have always liked what I have seen from Svech at the NHL level.

Filppula would be the guy I most want taken out of the lineup for one of these younger guys, but I already know that won't happen.

 

[Henkka]

I'd like to see Svech given a shot this year. I like his game as a 3rd line winger.

Rasmussen does absolutely nothing for me. I know he's got fans cheering hard for the guy because we all want the 9th overall pick from the 2017 draft to do well with us, but the dude is reaffirming that he was a reach.

It doesn't matter is he 9th overall or not.

I love the idea of big guy screening monster goalies and be very tough matchup center in his prime, when he does first build his physics. It could still take years. He is 21. Or maybe Söderblom is the guy, who knows, and Rasmussen will bust. Who cares, 6.rounder came did the job. Organization did win. Only what matters is that somebody came and did the job. But I hope both to succeed in some day. That would be awesome. Two nightmares against opposite team, who are not counted on points.

 

[MBH]

I'd be fine with that. I have always liked what I have seen from Svech at the NHL level.

Filppula would be the guy I most want taken out of the lineup for one of these younger guys, but I already know that won't happen.

Flip's already a healthy scratch, no?
My guess is Nielsen might come out next game.
Actually, based on Blash's track record, I bet he's looking real hard at removing Brome, Smith and Nielsen... Maybe for Flip, Glendening and Bert - if those other two are ready.

 

[Winger98]

Is it better to have Svechnikov/Rasmussen on the 1st line in GR or the 3rd line in Detroit?

Genuinely curious what people think on that. Because I would like to see both Svechnikov/Rasmussen in Detroit, but I don't think they would be given a big role.

Svech in Detroit, Rasmussen in GR.

With Svech, I think we need to see what he can do and it's coming time we need to make a decision. With Rasmussen, I think the games as the top center will do more for him than playing a minor role on our weak team.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

It doesn't matter is he 9th overall or not.

I love the idea of big guy screening monster goalies and be very tough matchup center in his prime, when he does first build his physics. It could still take years. He is 21. Or maybe Söderblom is the guy, who knows, and Rasmussen will bust. Who cares, 6.rounder came did the job. Organization did win. Only what matters is that somebody came and did the job. But I hope both to succeed in some day. That would be awesome. Two nightmares against opposite team, who are not counted on points.

I love the idea of having a big guy screening the goalie and causing havoc at the netfront as well. Rasmussen was called out by Mickey Redmond for doing the exact opposite of that when he was put there, though.

Svechnikov seems pretty strong on his skates and has decent enough hands. I wonder how he would fare in that kind of role.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Svech in Detroit, Rasmussen in GR.

With Svech, I think we need to see what he can do and it's coming time we need to make a decision. With Rasmussen, I think the games as the top center will do more for him than playing a minor role on our weak team.

I mean but Rasmussen is actually our second best center. Yes a lot of that is by default and terribly embarrassing from a talent and depth scenario but we can give him a big role while being in Detroit.

We cannot have all the youth coming at the same time. Ras doesn't need to be down anymore in my opinion. He is better than what we have and he outplayed a lot of them while in the lineup. Play him 15 minutes a night and some pp, we aren't going anywhere what is the hang up?

I don't agree with giving up on Svech, I think he has always looked okay at this level and he represents an upgrade currently. I am glad him and Rasmussen are together at least from that development but just feels like it could be happening in the NHL at this point. Neither has a please protect me attitude to them either is a part of what bothers me.

 

[MBH]

Svech in Detroit, Rasmussen in GR.

With Svech, I think we need to see what he can do and it's coming time we need to make a decision. With Rasmussen, I think the games as the top center will do more for him than playing a minor role on our weak team.

I get the idea of using Ras for a center on the top line in Grand Rapids.
On the other hand, I thought he was good enough at the NHL this last time around that we could build on what he has.
It's getting very near the point for Rasmussen (and Cholowski) where it's sink or swim time...where they've got to show the NHL speed reactions and decisions.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I get the idea of using Ras for a center on the top line in Grand Rapids.
On the other hand, I thought he was good enough at the NHL this last time around that we could build on what he has.
It's getting very near the point for Rasmussen (and Cholowski) where it's sink or swim time...where they've got to show the NHL speed reactions and decisions.

I am not sure slowing the game down for guys and giving them massive roles you are telling to make faster decisions makes a whole lot of sense either in terms of the organizational message. That messaging is illogical to them more than likely, the things you're asking to improve at are pushed better at the NHL level.

 

[MBH]

I am not sure slowing the game down for guys you are telling make faster decisions makes a whole lot of sense. Like your messaging to them are things that are pushed better at the NHL level.

Exactly.
I think Hronek and Zadina are struggling because they played in an awful league that was a lot slower than what they are used to, and it's taking time to adjust.

 

[Tetsuo]

I get the idea of using Ras for a center on the top line in Grand Rapids.
On the other hand, I thought he was good enough at the NHL this last time around that we could build on what he has.
It's getting very near the point for Rasmussen (and Cholowski) where it's sink or swim time...where they've got to show the NHL speed reactions and decisions.

This is true for Svech too. We may as well see if any of our 1st round picks from 2015-17 can actually generate offense at the NHL level. It's not like a season full of 2-1 losses is very fun to watch, which is what we are heading for. If we get some more goals scored and let in a few more that would be fine with me, if we are also getting valuable intel on where our prospects stand as of now. This season is already a wash, and I'm willing to write next year off too, but if we want to be competing in 2023 then Svech, Rasmussen and Cholowski turning a corner in their development will be huge to that end.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Exactly.
I think Hronek and Zadina are struggling because they played in an awful league that was a lot slower than what they are used to, and it's taking time to adjust.

I don't know, I think a lot of guys improve in the AHL. Like Ras and Cholo will improve, but what kind of gains are we looking for? What are our current weaknesses and opportunities organizationally? We can dictate how much these guys play, we can make those decisions. What is the point in being this bad if you're not going to do this stuff? I just kind of want the thought process here, and I am a little tired of them trying to sweep it under the rug like it isn't a legitimate question.

Ras, Cholo and Svech are players with talent, they have it, we have seen it at the NHL level. They are by no means perfect or finished products. But I think we have lost a lot of development time during the pandemic and I think especially with some of these older guys it is to sink or swim time. We are drafting too many players, we need to start making decisions, there are only so many roster spots and so many opportunities, we have no reason to be slow playing this on some of these guys. We will have to see how long it plays out, but I am concerned. We want them more developed for hopefully our last two foundation pieces in the next two drafts that should hopefully come faster. Raymond and Seider are going to big adds to this team. We cannot be doing this all at once, it just isn't realistic in my opinion.