GDT: 10/17/2019 Game 7: Detroit Red Wings @ Calgary Flames (9pm EST)

[Claypool]

You guys didn't seriously think the team was going to be as good as the first couple of games, did you?

No one seriously thought this. People did think the team would at least be competitive most nights and keep the games close, which they have not lately.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

You guys didn't seriously think the team was going to be as good as the first couple of games, did you?

After those games some people were talking about potentially competing for the playoffs.

I admire their optimism. And assume they're also die hard Lions fans.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I think the only thing more painful that game is hearing Murph and Keating try to string together cohesive thoughts on the game.

 

[Gniwder]

A half ass slash to the back of the leg was worth guaranteeing a loss? Okay.

Blash guaranteed a loss the moment he broke up the first line. I'm probably gonna quit watching games, it's back to having a useless plug on each line when the useless plugs were playing well on the 4th line.

 

[Bondurant]

Reality stinks!

 

[Shaman464]

So do you disagree or agree for trading for a 2C this season (sooner, rather than later)?

Do you agree or disagree with the Veleno timeline? If so, why/why not?

I think Detroit should be drafting centers.

Veleno doesn't look AHL ready this season. No way he breaks into the NHL this season

 

[Shaman464]

You guys didn't seriously think the team was going to be as good as the first couple of games, did you?

No one could have. I was hoping at least the top line would do a slightly better job of adjusting though. The other teams now know that the others lines are beer leaguers and put all their effort into shutting down the top line. And BLM have done nothing to rise above that.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Because JV is likely 2-3 yrs away from today of being a 50pt+/2-way defensively responsible 2C.

I percieve JV's timeline as:
19-20: mostly GR, 9-40gp in Det as 3W
20-21: in DET ~40gp as 3W & ~40gp 3C
21-22: in DET ~40gp as 3C/2W, ~40gp as 2C

Agree w/timeline? Disagree w/timeline? ...If so, why?

Timeline is fuzzy at best, but I don’t think we can make a deal to accomplish what you are hoping for. Dipping into the young and controllable players we have will not be the remedy, and the payoff would be marginal improvements in the short term with long term negative implications. We shouldn’t be seeking out established players because by the time all the youth does come together you’re talking about that established player being in their decline.

If we are going to look externally for that position, I think it would be more along the lines of. Veleno being in GR, seeing how the draft plays out this upcoming year, Veleno transitioning to the NHL, and if you don’t have the heir to the 2C throne, then you dip into the free agent market and get an established guy without having to give up the assets we are trying to accumulate right now.

I hate to say it, but we have to trust the process now. SY has taken a position of methodical growth by not rushing anyone along their timelines, and I want him to stick to it. Whatever direction we want to take, we need to give it the time to reach its point where the returns roll in, not shift gears due to impatience.

 

[Winger98]

So do you disagree or agree for trading for a 2C this season (sooner, rather than later)?

Do you agree or disagree with the Veleno timeline? If so, why/why not?

I think the Wings have too many holes right now to go after a modest upgrade at 2C. for all of the crap we give Nielsen and Filppula, they'd look a lot better if they weren't being asked to center Ehn, Erne, Glendening, Hirose, Gator, Helm, etc. every night.

Unless the team implodes and this goes on for another five games or more, I'd be surprised to see any significant roster change before January. And even then what we'll likely see are players moved up from GR to get their feet wet over the last half of the season before going into next season as the expected starters.

 

[theYman]

I think the Wings have too many holes right now to go after a modest upgrade at 2C. for all of the crap we give Nielsen and Filppula, they'd look a lot better if they weren't being asked to center Ehn, Erne, Glendening, Hirose, Gator, Helm, etc. every night.

Unless the team implodes and this goes on for another five games or more, I'd be surprised to see any significant roster change before January. And even then what we'll likely see are players moved up from GR to get their feet wet over the last half of the season before going into next season as the expected starters.

And also Blashill fired. Especially if he keeps doing shit like this from here on out. Messing with chemistry is not good coaching.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

I think Detroit should be drafting centers.

Veleno doesn't look AHL ready this season. No way he breaks into the NHL this season

Re: "drafting C's", yes, absolutely agree

Re: "JV not being AHL ready right now" by mid-late 19-20 season, if he's still AHL crappy and not ready for NHL, then that further proves my point to trade for a 2C.

I'd dangle a Ras/2nd/Hirose +Tuomisto? caliber & see what that'd fetch. No way I trade Veleno/Zadina/Cholo/Larsson. Hronek is obviously a keeper & here to stay for good.

 

[Shaman464]

Re: "drafting C's", yes, absolutely agree

Re: "JV not being AHL ready right now" by mid-late 19-20 season, if he's still AHL crappy and not ready for NHL, then that further proves my point to trade for a 2C.

I'd dangle a Ras/2nd/Hirose +Tuomisto? caliber & see what that'd fetch. No way I trade Veleno/Zadina/Cholo/Larsson. Hronek is obviously a keeper & here to stay for good.

I'd add Cholo to the trade list. He's a middle pairing guy.

 

[Gniwder]

And also Blashill fired. Especially if he keeps doing **** like this from here on out. Messing with chemistry is not good coaching.

It's also not good for the fans. I'm probably not gonna watch any more games until BLM line is re-united. That line makes 1/3 of the game worth watching (the line averaged 20 minutes per game). Now there's nothing worth watching. Every line looked like ****.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

I'd add Cholo to the trade list. He's a middle pairing guy.

He'd be next on my trade bait list, but only for a better D, with an add on our end.

 

[Shaman464]

And also Blashill fired. Especially if he keeps doing **** like this from here on out. Messing with chemistry is not good coaching.

Why bother? The team can't be one line. AA hasn't been good this season, and the top line hasn't responded to getting smothered after the first 3 games.

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

Timeline is fuzzy at best, but I don’t think we can make a deal to accomplish what you are hoping for. Dipping into the young and controllable players we have will not be the remedy, and the payoff would be marginal improvements in the short term with long term negative implications. We shouldn’t be seeking out established players because by the time all the youth does come together you’re talking about that established player being in their decline.

If we are going to look externally for that position, I think it would be more along the lines of. Veleno being in GR, seeing how the draft plays out this upcoming year, Veleno transitioning to the NHL, and if you don’t have the heir to the 2C throne, then you dip into the free agent market and get an established guy without having to give up the assets we are trying to accumulate right now.

I hate to say it, but we have to trust the process now. SY has taken a position of methodical growth by not rushing anyone along their timelines, and I want him to stick to it. Whatever direction we want to take, we need to give it the time to reach its point where the returns roll in, not shift gears due to impatience.

What do you see as JV's timeline?

You're probably right on all the other stuff, I'm just so impatient right now.

 

[Gniwder]

Why bother? The team can't be one line. AA hasn't been good this season, and the top line hasn't responded to getting smothered after the first 3 games.

One line is better than no lines.

 

[Shaman464]

One line is better than no lines.

But over the last couple games it was fundamentally 0 lines. The other teams did what nay competent team would do and smothered the BLM line.

 

[Gniwder]

But over the last couple games it was fundamentally 0 lines. The other teams did what nay competent team would do and smothered the BLM line.

That's what teams do to all top lines, put them back together and let them show that they can be the top line. If our best players can't play against the opponent's best defensive players, then the team is screwed anyways. Mix up the lines and they're all useless, Helm isn't going to get a lucky garbage goal every game.

 

[Shaman464]

That's what teams do to all top lines, put them back together and let them show that they can be the top line. If our best players can't play against the opponent's best defensive players, then the team is screwed anyways. Mix up the lines and they're all useless, Helm isn't going to get a lucky garbage goal every game.

Well, the last couple games before tonight they weren't stepping up.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I think Detroit should be drafting centers.

Veleno doesn't look AHL ready this season. No way he breaks into the NHL this season

You’ve determined that after 3 games? But no, he probably doesn’t get more than maybe 5-10 games this year at most.

We should be drafting centers. And D-men. And wingers. And goalies. What don’t we need?

I'd add Cholo to the trade list. He's a middle pairing guy.

Last thing we need is to start trading any of the few D we have with legit upside. Hronek, Cholo, Seider and McIsaac should be untouchable for now.

 

[Gniwder]

Well, the last couple games before tonight they weren't stepping up.

True, but it's also the only combo that works. I watched the same thing wit the Caps rebuild. Top line of Ovy-Backstrom-Semin, when the top line didn't score they lost. Let them figure out their game by keeping them together.

The bigger problem is that AA hasn't gotten anything going. When No Hands Helm is your second leading scorer on the team, your team is gonna lose a lot of games. (Helm actually has twice as many SOG as AA right now.)

 

[MBH]

Because JV is likely 2-3 yrs away from today of being a 50pt+/2-way defensively responsible 2C.

I percieve JV's timeline as:
19-20: mostly GR, 9-40gp in Det as 3W
20-21: in DET ~40gp as 3W & ~40gp 3C
21-22: in DET ~40gp as 3C/2W, ~40gp as 2C

Agree w/timeline? Disagree w/timeline? ...If so, why?

I don't see Veleno playing as a winger in Detroit.
He's a natural center and has pretty solid two-way instincts.
Even so, 21-22 sounds reasonable as arrival as a 2C. Maybe even optimistic.

 

[odin1981]

And also Blashill fired. Especially if he keeps doing **** like this from here on out. Messing with chemistry is not good coaching.

Maybe it's directed by management to keep $ for next deals down? Like split the top line on away games and "experiment", while home games give something for the fans to cheer for.

 

[Mickey Redmond]

Fire Blashill already.