William Karlsson Vs William Nylander

[JAS 39 Gripen]

so Nylander has to prove things to impress you but the guy who has only topped 25 pts once since being drafted 7 years ago, and shot at an unsustainable sh% doesnt?

Yup,, Wild Bill's awesome and thrice the defensive center that Nylander is. Like everybody else that throws around the "unsustainable sh%", you sound like someone that believes that Karlssons gonna go from scoring 43-ish to 10-ish. I think it's resonable to believe that he'll be around 30-ish in the upcoming years. It's not like all of his goals where snipes etc - a lot of them came b/c of Bills great net-presence and positioning.

 

[Tkachuky]

Nylander (drafted 4 years ago) 135pts in 185 games
Karlsson (drafted 7 years ago) 128pts in 265 games


but of course the leaf will lose the poll. karlsson was a nobody until he was almost 25

Hate to admit it, but i agree. Saw the same thing in Karlsson vs Monahan poll....

For me, Karlsson needs to put a couple of seasons where he performs like this year or close to. Not saying he needs to score 40+ over and over, but this season is incredible. Still admire his play/stats. Hope he keeps it up.

 

[DRW204]

This is a tough question. Karlsson doesn't have the track record and this was his only season as a top 6 player where as in CBJ he was bottom 6 defensive C. Having said that this year, regular season and PO's considered, by far trumps anything Nylander has done. The guy is a tenacious defensive player while actually playing as a top line C, and has been 0.5 GPG/0.94PPG for nearly 100 games this year.

Obviously given the question, there is tremendous risk that this is an aberration, however the innate chemistry he, Marchessault and Smith have wont allow his production to dip below ~30g ~30a/60ish pts player IMO. I am going to go with Karlsson, reluctantly.

 

[Rob Brown]

Nylander (drafted 4 years ago) 135pts in 185 games
Karlsson (drafted 7 years ago) 128pts in 265 games


but of course the leaf will lose the poll. karlsson was a nobody until he was almost 25

This.

If Karlsson has a similar season to this one then that would change things, but right now Nylander has done more over the full body of work.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Karlsson is the player Nylander hopes to be.

Strange how in Sweden and in his entire CBJ time, it was the reverse.

 

[Pyrophorus]

I'll take Karlsson til Nylander proves that he can be more than a fringe 1st line winger whos success dosnt depend on if he plays with an elite #1 C (Matthews, Bäckström).

You would have had an opportunity to see both. Why would you choose the player, who had NEVER beaten that other one, nor was ever expected to be as good. You watched them, prior to this season, haven't you?

 

[Pyrophorus]

Yup,, Wild Bill's awesome and thrice the defensive center that Nylander is. Like everybody else that throws around the "unsustainable sh%", you sound like someone that believes that Karlssons gonna go from scoring 43-ish to 10-ish. I think it's resonable to believe that he'll be around 30-ish in the upcoming years. It's not like all of his goals where snipes etc - a lot of them came b/c of Bills great net-presence and positioning.

...but that's all he's ever done before.
Clarkson and Kulemin, never scored 30 again...

 

[tony d]

Went with Nylander.

 

[DRW204]

Strange how in Sweden and in his entire CBJ time, it was the reverse.

What do you think Nylander's stats would look as a bottom 6 defensive oriented C playing with the likes of Anderson, Calvert, Hartnell and Rene Borque with a grand total of 38 PP mins in 2 years and 300+ mins of SH toi?

edit - lol not sure why i wrote Prout.

 

[Pyrophorus]

What do you think Nylander's stats would look as a bottom 6 defensive oriented C playing with the likes of Prout, Anderson, Calvert, Hartnell and Rene Borque with a grand total of 38 PP mins in 2 years and 300+ mins of SH toi?

Nylander did play with Colin Greening, Zach Hyman and Parenteau.
If he is miscast-why did no one think to play him higher, in those 2 years.
Was he miscast in Sweden too? Why didn'r he set the AHL alight, like Nylander did.

Yes, Karlsson produced more this year, for an unusual change.

 

[bsu]

All of those in here that think Karlsson is going to not be as good next year definitely don't watch any Vegas games. He shoots such a high percentage because he only shoots good shots and most are one timers or tap ins. He's basically the reverse of Ovi who shoots everything.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

All of those in here that think Karlsson is going to not be as good next year definitely don't watch any Vegas games. He shoots such a high percentage because he only shoots good shots and most are one timers or tap ins. He's basically the reverse of Ovi who shoots everything.

I'm with you on this. Wild Bill isn't taking shots from the half wall very often. He takes a great deal of high dangerous shots. His anticipation also leaves him with a lot of chancesoff add man rushes.

Sure he's probably not going to shoot 23%, but it certainly not unreasonable to expect him in the 17 to 18 range. You Vegas fans oh John Tortorella and Jarmo kekalainen a great deal of thanks

 

[bsu]

He is really damn good at getting open

 

[HabsTown]

I hate the Leafs, but I'm going with Nylander here.

 

[DRW204]

Nylander did play with Colin Greening, Zach Hyman and Parenteau.
If he is miscast-why did no one think to play him higher, in those 2 years.
Was he miscast in Sweden too? Why didn'r he set the AHL alight, like Nylander did.

Yes, Karlsson produced more this year, for an unusual change.

He played with them for a whopping 22 games in his cup of coffee in 15-16. Parenteau had 20 goals 41pts/77gp that year which is far better than the guys I listed for CBJ. their usages were no where near the same. Nylander had more PP time (albeit he didn't score alot on the PP) in his 22 games in 15-16 than Karlsson's entire time in CBJ. There was also a larger variance in the zone starts between the two. The situations of Nylander in TOR and Karlsson in CBJ is no where near the same. Like I said, if given the role to Centre two under 0.5 ppg players with heavy dZone starts, little to no PP time and lots of PK time i don't anticipate many players putting up gaudy point totals.

i cant comment on why he was miscast b/c i am not part of CBJs staff, but the team did put up 108 pts with a top 5 pp and top 10 pk in 16-17. They also had the 2nd least amount of GAs and were 6th in GF. Perhaps they felt like whatever roles the players had at the time was sufficient and didn't think they needed to change it up? Don't know. But 91 pts in 97 GP during his time in a top 6 role is nothing to scoff at. There is obvious risk that he won't repeat those numbers, but imo the chemistry him/smith/marchessault have put his floor pretty high.

 

[bert]

How in the world is this tied?!

 

[bert]

so Nylander has to prove things to impress you but the guy who has only topped 25 pts once since being drafted 7 years ago, and shot at an unsustainable sh% doesnt?

Maybe because he has actually done it? OR maybe its because he is a natural center? Or maybe its because he is incredible defensively and hard on the puck. While Nylander who is very skilled shys away from contact?

Do you watch anyone else but the leafs? I am guessing you dont considering your arguments here.

 

[93LEAFS]

All of those in here that think Karlsson is going to not be as good next year definitely don't watch any Vegas games. He shoots such a high percentage because he only shoots good shots and most are one timers or tap ins. He's basically the reverse of Ovi who shoots everything.

Even if that is true, using a proxy based on shot location such as individual xGF he scored almost double the goals he should have at 5v5. Now, elite players continually beat that metric, but not by that type of margin. In all situations he beat it by 17 goals (it expected 25). The only others to beat it by a comparable margin is Laine and Eric Staal. Laine's shot is so unreal he may be able to do it consistently, but Staal's season is probably a one off year. Not saying he's going to regress to a 25 goal scorer, but he may more likely be in the 35 range.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Maybe because he has actually done it? OR maybe its because he is a natural center? Or maybe its because he is incredible defensively and hard on the puck. While Nylander who is very skilled shys away from contact?

Do you watch anyone else but the leafs? I am guessing you dont considering your arguments here.

Never done it, or anywhere close before?
Nylander is a natural center.

 

[Spirit of 67]

Voted Will Ny. Track record suggests he’s a safer bet.
Of course, home town vote as well.

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

Amazed how close this looks. If we revisit in a year and it's not close, I'd only be surprised if it's Karlsson and not close. Seems like Nylander's such a safer bet for 7 years.

 

[heretik27]

Nylander (drafted 4 years ago) 135pts in 185 games
Karlsson (drafted 7 years ago) 128pts in 265 games


but of course the leaf will lose the poll. karlsson was a nobody until he was almost 25

Evander Kane scored 30 goals as a 20 year old in the NHL and Mark Scheifele had 34 total points as a 20 year old in the NHL. We all know who the better player is currently, why does it matter that Karlsson didn't break out until his mid 20's? Marty St Louis barely broke into the NHL at age 23, and only played his first season with Tampa at age 25, notching 40 points and then 35 the following year when he was 26. WK looks like a pretty legit skater out there for Vegas, if he's scoring at such a high rate it's probably because he's been getting into prime positions to score those goals. Regression may be expected statistically, but he's still performing at a very high level.

I wouldn't chalk it up to anti-Leaf bias, some people just might legitimately believe Karlsson has what it takes to be a star in this league moving forward, whereas Willie is still in the getting-there stage. When Scheifele went on a tear in the last 25~ or so games in 2016 with Little injured he led the entire league in points. Jets fans were hyped, but wanted to see more. Understandable given it was like a 26 game sample, but we're looking at a 97 game sample size this season with Karlsson, is he just going to magically regress after almost 100 games?

 

[Halla]

I’m new on this site and I find this site is full of petty people.

Ehlers scores 0 goals in the playoffs and is beating Karlsson in the same poll by a 2 to 1 ratio

I think this site is full of jealous people who can’t stand the leafs having a bright future Lol.

i voted for ehlers in that thread too. karlsson was a 24 year old with career highs of 9g/25pts before this season and now he is being thrown against these kids that were 60pt players at 20?

even jets fans would agree nylander=ehlersd more or less.....but yeah ehlers wins in a landslide but nylander loses
tells you everything you need to know about this board. when a leaf wins though, it will be because of the homer fans
and the next poll will be "toronto fan picking ...." kinda thing

welcome to the site

 

[Halla]

What do you think Nylander's stats would look as a bottom 6 defensive oriented C playing with the likes of Anderson, Calvert, Hartnell and Rene Borque with a grand total of 38 PP mins in 2 years and 300+ mins of SH toi?

edit - lol not sure why i wrote Prout.

im guessing he would still have more than 6g

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

Karlsson pretty easily for me even with regression hell end up similar offensive stats as nylander.