Will Butcher off to a hot start

[VoidCreature]

Barrie doesn't play the entire PP, but the previous season he wasn't great in his own end (albeit the team was a tire-fire). Having defensemen that can play PK, or give Barrie the prime offensive minutes is more important than having a sheltered PP specialist for the #2 PP unit.

If you say so, man. Erik Johnson's put up 6 points on the PP in each of the last 3 seasons, Butcher's one point off that total in 5 games. His minutes at even strength are comparable to Nemeth and Barberio, and neither of those guys are big time PKers.

It's not like your PP is dynamite, either. Cumulatively over the last 5 seasons the only teams with a lower percentage than you are the Nucks, Panthers and Golden Knights. If I was an Avs fan I know I'd want Butcher playing.

 

[PAZ]

If you say so, man. Erik Johnson's put up 6 points on the PP in each of the last 3 seasons, Butcher's one point off that total in 5 games. His minutes at even strength are comparable to Nemeth and Barberio, and neither of those guys are big time PKers.

It's not like your PP is dynamite, either. Cumulatively over the last 5 seasons the only teams with a lower percentage than you are the Nucks, Panthers and Golden Knights. If I was an Avs fan I know I'd want Butcher playing.

The big difference is that both Nemeth and Barberio don't need to be sheltered. Nemeth has been rock solid and looks great beside Barrie because he makes simple plays and knows his role. An argument can be made for Barberio this season (he's not looking great), but again based off last year's performance where Barberio looked decent, Butcher would not be playing on the Avs.

As for PP being atrocious the past 5 years has more to do with the setup (PP coach) than the personnel. Yes, Butcher would help but a 5 game sample size doesn't change my perspective on him. If he's still producing at a PPG pace or looks competent defensively halfway through the season i'll gladly eat a crow. But as of now, Butcher and the Avs simply aren't a fit.

 

[VoidCreature]

The big difference is that both Nemeth and Barberio don't need to be sheltered. Nemeth has been rock solid and looks great beside Barrie because he makes simple plays and knows his role. An argument can be made for Barberio this season (he's not looking great), but again based off last year's performance where Barberio looked decent, Butcher would not be playing on the Avs.

As for PP being atrocious the past 5 years has more to do with the setup (PP coach) than the personnel. Yes, Butcher would help but a 5 game sample size doesn't change my perspective on him. If he's still producing at a PPG pace or looks competent defensively halfway through the season i'll gladly eat a crow. But as of now, Butcher and the Avs simply aren't a fit.

See, I just think your standards are too high here. You don't want him unless he's a point per game defender? There are like three of those in the whole league. It's not like Butcher is Eric Gelinas here where he's making glaring defensive errors every shift.

If he puts up 15 power play points that rates him top 30 among all defensemen most years. Barrie puts up roughly that many.

To each his own I guess.

 

[HBK27]

The big difference is that both Nemeth and Barberio don't need to be sheltered. Nemeth has been rock solid and looks great beside Barrie because he makes simple plays and knows his role. An argument can be made for Barberio this season (he's not looking great), but again based off last year's performance where Barberio looked decent, Butcher would not be playing on the Avs.

As for PP being atrocious the past 5 years has more to do with the setup (PP coach) than the personnel. Yes, Butcher would help but a 5 game sample size doesn't change my perspective on him. If he's still producing at a PPG pace or looks competent defensively halfway through the season i'll gladly eat a crow. But as of now, Butcher and the Avs simply aren't a fit.

Admittedly, I know very little about Nemeth and Barberio but looking at their history they appear to be fringe NHL players. Barberio is 27, on his 3rd team and averaged 48 NHL games a year the past 4 years. Nemeth is 25 and averaged 33 NHL games a season the past 3 years while spending time each season in the AHL. I know defensemen take longer to develop and maybe these guys have finally found their groove, but as a rebuilding team they probably could've used the younger guy with more upside. Again, I know little about the Avs D though.

As for being sheltered, yeah 5 games into his career he's been sheltered...doesn't mean that will continue for the rest of this season or his career. Happens to a lot of young d-men starting out in this league.

 

[PAZ]

See, I just think your standards are too high here. You don't want him unless he's a point per game defender? There are like three of those in the whole league. It's not like Butcher is Eric Gelinas here where he's making glaring defensive errors every shift.

If he puts up 15 power play points that rates him top 30 among all defensemen most years. Barrie puts up roughly that many.

To each his own I guess.

The PPG was more of an exaggeration, but he'd have to continually produce and develop for me to believe the Avs made a huge mistake, since the only way I believe the relationship could've been salvaged would be by guaranteeing Butcher a roster spot.

Admittedly, I know very little about Nemeth and Barberio but looking at their history they appear to be fringe NHL players. Barberio is 27, on his 3rd team and averaged 48 NHL games a year the past 4 years. Nemeth is 25 and averaged 33 NHL games a season the past 3 years while spending time each season in the AHL. I know defensemen take longer to develop and maybe these guys have finally found their groove, but as a rebuilding team they probably could've used the younger guy with more upside. Again, I know little about the Avs D though.

As for being sheltered, yeah 5 games into his career he's been sheltered...doesn't mean that will continue for the rest of this season or his career. Happens to a lot of young d-men starting out in this league.

I agree Butcher has more upside than the two, but as with the response above the Avs would've had to gone to great lengths to sign Butcher, and based on the depth chart it didn't make sense. Nemeth and Barberio provide some level of stability and you know what you're getting. But there were high hopes for Mironov who was highly touted based off his play in the KHL to take The #5/6 spot. He didn't transition as expected, but I think Sakic already gave some sort of guarantee to Mironov that he'd have every chance to succeed in the NHL, he can't offer that to every player.

 

[Devils090]

Well, his team's shooting up 16% and therefore he's piling up secondary assists with his offensive deployment. He probably ends the season at under 30 points.

He's a 3rd pair PP specialist.

Can't wait to revisit this one

 

[SeidoN]

He probably ends the season at under 30 points.

hes already at 8 only 5 games in. even when he cools off, it would be hard for him not to hit 30 by seasons end

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

It's not like your PP is dynamite, either. Cumulatively over the last 5 seasons the only teams with a lower percentage than you are the Nucks, Panthers and Golden Knights. If I was an Avs fan I know I'd want Butcher playing.

Easy there tiger. Butcher on our 2nd PP unit isn't going to make a world of difference for a team with a systemic PP weakness. He's not a spark plug for goals.

Let's not forget that not long ago Blandisi was this gem find that we discarded. How's he looking now?

 

[MapleLeafs9]

It's a hot start, nothing more. Happens to a lot of players that are skilled but aren't THAT skilled. Remember Craig Smith when he had 20 points his 1st 20 games or something like that his rookie year? He finished with 36 points in 72 games and has not done anything note worthy in his career since. Same thing will happen to Butcher.

 

[HBK27]

Easy there tiger. Butcher on our 2nd PP unit isn't going to make a world of difference for a team with a systemic PP weakness. He's not a spark plug for goals.

Let's not forget that not long ago Blandisi was this gem find that we discarded. How's he looking now?

Blandisi still looks good - he had a great preseason and most Devils fans were really surprised he didn’t make the roster. It had to do with Blandisi not having to clear waivers to be sent down, not wanting to use him on the 4th line (Coleman and Gibbons have both been fantastic on that line), and carrying 8 defensemen (again, not wanting to lose one on waivers since Butcher and Santini, the only two that don’t have to clear waivers, both earned spots in the top 6).

Blandisi or Quenneville will be the first callups from Binghamton – both are off to good starts, 4 points in 3 games for Quenneville and 3 points for Blandisi. Realistically, the emergence of Bratt cost one of them a roster spot.

 

[tucker3434]

The Avs botched the Butcher deal for sure, but we’re dealing with a very small sample size right now. The Devils are on fire, on pace for a 131 point season. Let’s give it at least another 5 games before we give Butcher the Norris.

 

[HBK27]

It's a hot start, nothing more. Happens to a lot of players that are skilled but aren't THAT skilled. Remember Craig Smith when he had 20 points his 1st 20 games or something like that his rookie year? He finished with 36 points in 72 games and has not done anything note worthy in his career since. Same thing will happen to Butcher.

Love when people double-down on this...we've already been told he'll never even make the NHL, now it's nothing more than a hot start and his career will still fizzle out.

Of course this level of production won't last and who knows what type of career he carves out, but it's always funny when people are SO SURE of what's going to happen. Looking forward to revisiting this thread in the future.

 

[HBK27]

The Avs botched the Butcher deal for sure, but we’re dealing with a very small sample size right now. The Devils are on fire, on pace for a 131 point season. Let’s give it at least another 5 games before we give Butcher the Norris.

Can't blame the Avs too much as it seems Roy botched things and surely NJ was a much better opportunity for Butcher. Avs at least made out getting Kerfoot, who also landed in a much better spot. Much like Avs fans say Butcher doesn't make their roster, I doubt Kerfoot would've made NJ's roster this season - though I still really wish he would've signed with the Devils.

 

[tucker3434]

Can't blame the Avs too much as it seems Roy botched things and surely NJ was a much better opportunity for Butcher. Avs at least made out getting Kerfoot, who also landed in a much better spot. Much like Avs fans say Butcher doesn't make their roster, I doubt Kerfoot would've made NJ's roster this season - though I still really wish he would've signed with the Devils.

I haven’t seen Butcher play this season, even missed the Avs-Devils game due to a wedding. If the stats are an accurate representation of his game, then he likely would have made the Avs. Our PP could definitely use that kind of help. There would have likely been some consternation over putting Bigras, Zadorov, and Butcher all in the lineup at the same time, but all appear to be doing just fine. Plus, we expected more from Mironov than we’ve seen so far. So Butcher would have had an opportunity here.

I thought Butcher’s skating would cause him a lot more problems at the NHL level, but maybe I was wrong. It’s hard to nail down the upside of some of these young guys. I know the concensus of our prospects on our board has changed a lot since September. You never really know til they’re actually on the ice at the highest level.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Easy there tiger. Butcher on our 2nd PP unit isn't going to make a world of difference for a team with a systemic PP weakness. He's not a spark plug for goals.

Let's not forget that not long ago Blandisi was this gem find that we discarded. How's he looking now?

Blandisi had a solid year last season, had an excellent preseason, and to be honest I was shocked he didn't make the team. He also has 3 point in 3 AHL games so far this year. I expect him to play a role on the Devils at some point this season. He's 23. Are you trying to imply he stinks or is a bust? lol.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Blandisi had a solid year last season, had an excellent preseason, and to be honest I was shocked he didn't make the team. He also has 3 point in 3 AHL games so far this year. I expect him to play a role on the Devils at some point this season. He's 23. Are you trying to imply he stinks or is a bust? lol.

No, I'm trying to imply expectations should be tempered using him as an example.

 

[HBK27]

One understated benefit of Butcher is that he can play the left or right side. He’s been switching depending on who NJ plays as the 6th defenseman between Mueller (LD), Prout (RD) or Lovejoy (RD) – making it easy to rotate those guys in.

 

[Devils090]

It's a hot start, nothing more. Happens to a lot of players that are skilled but aren't THAT skilled. Remember Craig Smith when he had 20 points his 1st 20 games or something like that his rookie year? He finished with 36 points in 72 games and has not done anything note worthy in his career since. Same thing will happen to Butcher.

It happened to one guy once so it definitely happen to Butcher too.

Great logic

 

[BomaLightDevils]

It's a hot start, nothing more. Happens to a lot of players that are skilled but aren't THAT skilled. Remember Craig Smith when he had 20 points his 1st 20 games or something like that his rookie year? He finished with 36 points in 72 games and has not done anything note worthy in his career since. Same thing will happen to Butcher.

Got to admire how your tanking has been going. Laughable organization with how you have done things, luckily Bettman loves that Toronto is coming back to the top. Imagine if there was a salary cap for of ice personnel!!

Back to butcher, love what he is doing when you consider he stepped right in and delivered on the PP and 5 vs 5. You can talk all you want about ice time and points but remember how many years it took Morgan Rielly to just look decent in the NHL!!

 

[MapleLeafs9]

Got to admire how your tanking has been going. Laughable organization with how you have done things, luckily Bettman loves that Toronto is coming back to the top. Imagine if there was a salary cap for of ice personnel!!

Back to butcher, love what he is doing when you consider he stepped right in and delivered on the PP and 5 vs 5. You can talk all you want about ice time and points but remember how many years it took Morgan Rielly to just look decent in the NHL!!

Jesus lol

 

[Jets012]

I do think Butcher will be a long-term reliable bottom 4 defense that can QB the PP, but I will admit that some Devils fans need to pump the breaks on this guy. I cannot forsee him keeping up this massive point total base. I wouldn't be surprised if he finishes under 30 Points like the poster above said.

Now Bratt is another story. I think that man is legit. Butcher I think is a nice player, but he isn't THIS good.

 

[HBK27]

I do think Butcher will be a long-term reliable bottom 4 defense that can QB the PP, but I will admit that some Devils fans need to pump the breaks on this guy. I cannot forsee him keeping up this massive point total base. I wouldn't be surprised if he finishes under 30 Points like the poster above said.

Now Bratt is another story. I think that man is legit. Butcher I think is a nice player, but he isn't THIS good.

I don't think Devils fans are claiming he's going to be more than this...

 

[JimEIV]

Another assist tonight. 9 points in 6 games.

 

[ScottyK]

 

[HenriquesJawLine]