Why the hubub over Sweden...

Discussion in 'International Tournaments' started by NYVanfan, Feb 22, 2006.

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  1. NYVanfan

    NYVanfan Registered User

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    ...supposedly tanking last game to get the Swiss in elimination game 1?

    I don't get it.
    So what?
    They should play hard to give someone else the easy first game?
     
  2. Vagrant

    Vagrant The Czech Condor

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    Because playing to lose is bad form in any avenue, and it's magnified in Olympic hockey. You're playing for the pride of your country.
     
  3. Gozer

    Gozer Registered User

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    I don't think it would have been that huge of a thing if just the swedish coach had shut his mouth before the game, or spew out the usuall garbage you say when asked that question.
     
  4. Gozer

    Gozer Registered User

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    It's not like russia or finland broke much of a swett last night either. Two teams that have played much better in the tournament.
     
  5. Jazz

    Jazz Registered User

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    I don't have a problem with them doing it (I'm pretty sure this is not the first time it has happened, nor will it be the last...)

    My problem is that that coach should have kept his mouth shut about it....
     
  6. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    MODS LOCK THIS THREAD NOW.

    our coach NEVER admitted we should tank the game. It's a misquote.
     
  7. ryz

    ryz Registered User

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    I'm not sure people are mad because they tanked the game, but more that the coach came out in the press and said it in the first place. It showed very bad form to bring a statement like that to the public.
     
  8. Predatore

    Predatore Registered User

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    No one is claiming he did either, if you read the posts. Thread will live until / if it gets out of hand. So far, nothing bad.
     
  9. Vagrant

    Vagrant The Czech Condor

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    Calling for Moderators to lock a thread is a violation according to our FAQ. I'll let it go for the time being.

    I see no reason for this thread to be closed simply because it's a contradiction of personal feelings. As long as it stays amiable and there is no flaming involved, it will stay open.
     
  10. Spungo*

    Spungo* Guest

    If this is true, Sweeden is the Ben Johnson of this years Olympics. Taking a dive is a disgrace and no real man would do that. Can you picture Mark Messier losing on purpose? I sure as cake can't.

    I hate to say it, but this kind of thing is what seperates Canada (and to a lesser extent America) from some European hockey teams. Honour and respect for the game mean something to us.

    Again, I'm only calling Sweeden the Ben Johnson of this Olympics *if* they really did lose on purpose.
     
  11. Vikke

    Vikke ViktorAllvin twitter

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    Of course they didn't lose on purpose. They just didn't try very hard to win.
    1. Late game, QF 18 hours after.
    2. Meaningless game.
    3. Easier QF if losing.

    1+2+3=6. 6=good.
     
  12. copperandblue

    copperandblue Registered User

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    Running up to the Olympics there was the whole Tocchet Gambling thing. The biggest concern to Bettman and the NHL as a whole was that Hockey was bet on, inside info was provided to set the line and games were intentionally compromised on the ice.

    The integrity of the league was on trial and had there been proof that any of the above actually occured - most specifically that games on the ice were intentionally compromised - the speculation was that the league would not be able to recover from the fall out for a very very long time and may even be relegated to a fringe sport in the same light that boxing is.

    Now in this case, IF Sweden actually tanked a game on purpose (personal opinions aside) then what is the difference from what is described above and widely considered the worst possible scenario for a sport/league and Sweden throwing the game? Outside the obvious gambling connection that is.

    Fixing games - which is essentially what this boils down to - is unacceptable at any level and in any sport.

    Say what you will about the modern Olympics and the ever emerging argument that your not trying unless your cheating combined with the drive for corporate dollars, there are still a naive few that believe it is still about the spirit of competition and the drive for excellence. The notion of throwing a game on purpose flies in the face of those beliefs all together and simply further amplifies the argument of if the Olympics are an out dated idea all together.

    In my mind, the best thing that could happen would be that proof is provided that Sweden did indeed throw the game and the IOC suspended the Swedish contingent from icing a mens hockey team at the next Olympic games. Not because I have a problem with Sweden or their hockey players but because I think the only way of eliminating such a thing from happening again would be to make the punishment more severe than the gain.

    However, before I get jumped on for such a suggestion, I will say that I don't imagine anything will be "proven" and no message or punishment will be levied. Everything will go on as usual and the question (particularily if Sweden goes to the gold medal game) will linger at all future Olympics whenever an upset occurs.
     
  13. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    I am glad to announce that all the players including lidstrom and sundin said that no one talked about tanking in the match, they just played bad. Why is it so hard to believe that losing 0-3 against slovaks isnt bad? sweden lost 0-5 against russia which also lost to slovaks.

    Or did canada tank as well who lost 0-2 to swiss which we beat 6-2?
     
  14. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    IOC has already checked the game, and they decided it was not a TANK. So why do we still dicuss this? We played bad get over it.
     
  15. Leo Naphta

    Leo Naphta Registered User

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    The coach never claimed Sweden should tank. In fact, he said Sweden should try and equalize if we were losing - he even indicated Sweden would pull the goalie if it was close.

    Sweden just saved energy for todays game. Just like every other team did yesterday.
     
  16. copperandblue

    copperandblue Registered User

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    Yes I know what the official IOC position is on the game.

    My comments are based on the general idea of an Olympic team throwing a game on purpose. The fact that the Swedish coach brough this whole issue to light which was promptly followed up with a game where "they didn't play well" simply puts Sweden in the position of "example" while discussing it.

    If anyone needs to "get over" anything I would suggest that it is you. As it is right now, you can't seem to seperate the discussion of the issue from Sweden being front and center inside of it.
     
  17. Freudian

    Freudian Clearly deranged

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    Alternatively IOC will fix the scheduling so not all quarterfinals are the day after the last group game. Pretty much every team took a day off yesterday. Seven out of the eight quarterfinalists played their backup goalie.

    Sweden took a day off, so did Slovakia, Finland, Russia and (if you want to be nice to them) Canada.
     
  18. Vagrant

    Vagrant The Czech Condor

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    The IOC is no more qualified to say that Sweden tanked the game than I am to say that they tanked the game. Unless they were shooting goals into their own net, anything that happens in hockey for good or bad can be made to look intentional or accidental. Nobody really knows the intent of the players, and thus the topic is still active in discussion.
     
  19. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    If it's based on a general idea, do you really think sweden would be the first ever to do this? Russians, Czechs and Canadians have always played their best hockey during the playoffs and not in group play.


    Swedish teams have never been know to play their best hockey when it counts. So this team is different.
     
  20. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    do you really think sweden would be the first ever to do this? Russians, Czechs and Canadians have always played their best hockey during the playoffs and not in group play.
     
  21. Jobaas

    Jobaas Registered User

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    Maaan you rock if i was canadian i would have a tear in my eye and turn on the national anthem.
     
  22. copperandblue

    copperandblue Registered User

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    Perhaps they will change the schedule but if the game was thrown on purpose then no change in scheduling will fix it. It will simply require a different excuse to be fabricated when it happens again.

    It didn't appear to me that goaltending was an issue so in regards to that specific example it is a none issue in this case. Further to that, the controversy would not even exist if the suggestion of throwing/resting/taking it easy (use whatever word or phrase you want to) did not come out of a coaches pie hole in the presence of the international media. If nothing is said and the game came off in exactly the same way, the discussion today is about how bad of a game that was to watch...not about who was doing what on purpose.

    Again, I am not railling against Sweden here. I don't frankly care one way or another about them or what they do. I am not even really invested in the Olympics all that much either (I find the whole notion of the Olympics to be a farce) so sanctions against any offending team isn't really a concern to me. My comments are based on the general idea of why throwing a game on purpose is wrong.

    Since you brought it up, as far as the other teams go which of them stood to gain by taking the day off? Outside of Sweden it appears that only Russia stood to gain from doing so and they actually won. That puts the spotlight squarely back on Sweden...if you choose to keep them there.
     
  23. NyQuil

    NyQuil Neon NyQuil

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    Basically, the Swedes have a mental midget in charge.

    No one would have batted an eye if he'd given the stock answer which is:

    "In a tournament such as this, you can lose any game against any opponent."

    And he could have even added:

    "And we know that better than anyone."

    He created controversy where there wasn't any and tainted the tournament for his team from now on.

    Whether or not Sweden tanked the game, B-A took a little bit of luster off of Sweden's performance no matter where they finish.
     
  24. SChan*

    SChan* Guest

    B-A says he was misquoted.

    This is what Sundin said:

    "Nobody in the dressing room said that we should tank the game"

    mats sundin was very upset over the through that peopel think they should have tanked. "We just played a bad game he said"
     
  25. Freudian

    Freudian Clearly deranged

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    Every team that took it easy yesterday had something to gain from it - being fresh for the QF. Marian Hossa said after the game vs Sweden "Neither team wanted to waste energy today. We all have a game tomorrow".

    Canada have lost a lot of group stage matches with a lack of effort. They don't particularly care because they know the tournament starts when the knockout stage starts. Should Canada also be banned for not giving 100% each game?
     
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