Why retooling is the best option for the Habs

Discussion in 'Montreal Canadiens' started by Phozzwald, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. LaP

    LaP Registered User

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    Literally speaking a reset would not make sense. A reset would basically be keeping the same core and try again by shuffling the lines and such. When you reset a PC it stays the same. It just try again to do the things correctly. When you reset an odometer it stays the same. It just starts again from his original state. For fun let's take the words literally. Let's use computer science as an example :

    - If you rebuild a PC tower you'll change everything. Maybe you'll keep the case but that's it. You're not rebuilding your PC if you don't change the whole thing. It's the equivalent of trading Price, Weber and Patch and rebuild with picks and young players.
    - If you "retool" maybe you'll change the gpu, add some ram but you'll surely keep at least the case and the motherboard minimum or else it's a rebuild. It's the equivalent of adding Tavares to replace Danault.
    - If you tweak you keep the same PC. You might overclock the cpu and gpu, turn some services off in windows, update the bios, ... It's the equivalent of making minor changes while mostly keeping the same team like graduating Juulsen on a 3rd pairing and moving Drouin to the wing and replacing him by a UFA not much better than him or Danault.
    - If you reset you keep the same PC and you make no change. You just reset and hope the PC will do the job right this time. It's the equivalent of doing nothing and hoping Price will do the job next season.
     
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  2. Sorinth

    Sorinth Registered User

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    Well Bergevin already did the tear down portion by getting rid of Subban, Markov, Radulov, Sergachev, we just never did rebuild portion.

    When you retool, most of your best players are still your best players, like how Boston's best players are still Begereon, Marchand. In our case the new guys are all supposed to be our best players. Our team won't be built around Weber/Pacioretty/Drouin it will be built around Tavares & Dahlin. Sure some of those players will stick around in lesser support roles, but it's irrelevant, the team will be built with a completetly different image.

    EDIT: If instead of Tavares we go out and get Stastny or O'Reilly that would be a retool, because the guy we are adding is at a similar level to our existing top players.
     
  3. Captain Wolverine

    Captain Wolverine Registered User

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    Gallant has been incredible, but advanced stats pointed to guys like Marchy, Smith, Miller and Schmidt being excellent players that deserved more playtime. And that's ignoring Karlsson's insane season, good vets like Fleury, Perron and Neal and the young guys the team actually wanted that we know had great upside.
     
  4. Captain Wolverine

    Captain Wolverine Registered User

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    Well, tearing down for a retool is about getting assets back. Markov and Radulov walked, Subban got Weber who is still a really good player despite being worse and older than Subban. And trading Sergachev for Drouin isn't really a retool move, its just a trade.

    And in the very unlikely event that Montreal gets Dahlin and Tavares, Montreal will be building around them AND Weber/Price/Drouin/Gallagher and maybe Pacioretty and Galchenyuk. Much like Boston added guys like McAvoy, Carlo and Pastrnak to their pre-existing core.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018 at 3:32 PM
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  5. Habs Icing

    Habs Icing Formerly Onice

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    Well that's what the Idiot promised us in the mid-season presser. A reset.
     
  6. OldCraig71

    OldCraig71 Registered User

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  7. Ozymandias

    Ozymandias #fireBumgevin

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    An improbable hypothetical you call a guarantee??

    Please stop posting before you make an ass of yourself even further.
     
  8. habsgirl5000

    habsgirl5000 Registered User

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    re-tooling?.......LOL!!

    yeah lets "re-tool" for another 25 years!!....see where that gets us!!! :laugh::laugh:

    after another 25 years we can make the decision to rebuild,

    you think the leafs stanley cup drought has been long?.....we will be breaking their record!!
     
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  9. Sorinth

    Sorinth Registered User

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    Isn't tearing down and then retooling simply rebuilding?

    You may have missed my edit, but it's about quality of the new players vs the current ones. The guys Boston added are of similar quality to their existing ones, so it certainly fits more along the retooling lines (Though some would argue they actually just had a short rebuild). When talking about Tavares/Dahlin only Price is even a comparable, everyone else is a step well below.

    Regardless it doesn't matter what we call it, the only way we can avoid a stretch of terrible seasons is to add several elite players. If we only add good instead of elite players like say Stastny we won't go anywhere.
     
  10. mariolemieux66

    mariolemieux66 Registered User

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    Not sure if signing a free agent to a 13mil contract is the way to go.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018 at 5:19 PM
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  11. Milhouse40

    Milhouse40 Registered User

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    They were deadlast the year prior....there's was no season that year...so yeah, they were lucky
     
  12. LaP

    LaP Registered User

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    They were dead last the last season before the lottery. The fact there was no season before the lottery did not magically make their team any better. Their kids and their vets were one year older as it was for all the other teams.
     
  13. Electricity

    Electricity Registered User

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    Lol yeah, you're technically right. I was just disagreeing with their view that the Habs D was serviceable.
     
  14. lo striver

    lo striver jeunesse, vitesse, karakteresse, attitudese!

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    that article is about
    [​IMG]
     
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  15. Burke the Legend

    Burke the Legend Registered User

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    Buddy, Gallagher just scored 30 goals, he's not a 2nd liner. This is getting ridiculous. Byron is not a 3rd liner either.

    I know it's "cool" to dump hard on the club right now but they actually have decent depth and talent on the wings.
     
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  16. Laurentide

    Laurentide Registered User

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    Maybe he was just saying that he doesn't believe that Windows is better than Linux.

    Seriously though, just because Bergevin doesn't believe in the concept of windows doesn't mean they aren't a real thing. When he was hired he was looking at a 5 year window. It's only when he finished the 5 years without success that he suddenly decided that windows don't exist. He's just looking for an indefinite mandate to keep chasing his own tail.
     
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  17. Ozmodiar

    Ozmodiar Registered User

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    With regards to a rebuild, I think a little too much emphasis is placed on where they finish in the standings.

    The objective should be to collect several 1st and 2nd round picks for 2 or 3 seasons, divesting of players who will be looking for big raises or who won't be a core piece 3 years down the line. If they do that, their draft position will be high enough to find good players.

    There's a lot of good talent from mid 1st to mid 2nd round - players often discussed here, such as Barzal, Chabot, Eriksson Ek, McAvoy, Borgstrom, Steel, Kyrou, Thomas, Tolvanen, Chytil.

    Bergevin has a good start on this with his 4 2nd round picks. If they can add another 1st and prospect for Max, that will help. Other players they could look at, perhaps next season, would be Byron, Petry and Shaw.

    In the meantime, scout the European leagues, keep FA signings to short terms, sell at TDL's.

    2 or 3 years from now, hit the FA market and make trades to fill needs.
     
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  18. Milhouse40

    Milhouse40 Registered User

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    They would have added Malkin right away.
    But that beside the point. To get the 1st overall back then, you needed to finished deadlast. It was a pure lottery. Everybody who got a top 10 pick that year were lucky.

    But lets just not act like it was their plans all along.
     
  19. BLONG7

    BLONG7 Registered User

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    This.........is why people are furious...........and Molson, sits and watches?? WTF?
     
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  20. Runner77

    Runner77 **********************************************

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    Let's play the what-if game and assume that such a UFA is actually willing to sign with Montreal, which I don't believe will happen, but whatever.

    For a GM on a short leash who is going to do everything to save his job? Absolutely, yes. Signing an expensive UFA is the only way to go.

    For an organization without quality disposable depth? Absolutely, spend to the cap, hand over fist and overpay for a UFA.

    For an organization starved for a star quality forward? Absolutely.

    For a GM who should be wary about wanting to maximize the prime years or whatever prime years there are for Weber and also in consideration of Price's prime years as he's going to be 30 years old to start the season - no question, the answer is absolutely yes.

    No matter what their secret plan is or what they call it, reset or preset, there are no two ways around this -- Bergevin's tenure is on the line and he has two expensive players locked in into their 30s that will be useless if they remain with the team and if the team went for a rebuild.

    Add to this the high probability that the major reason ownership is not being overly aggressive with Bergevin and is showing some patience still, is the elephant in the room, one that would cost in the neighborhood of $40-$50 Million to bring in a new GM, who would then want to replace all the sycophants and country club members that Bergevin extended last summer.

    Finally, Bergevin has little interest in improving the team 3 or 4 years from now when he won't be around to see it. We're condemned to play the short game.
     
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  21. ItzaGreat

    ItzaGreat Registered User

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    Tavares at 14 millions incoming.
     
  22. BLONG7

    BLONG7 Registered User

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    This is now all on Molson..................this is exactly the reason, we need a real hockey guy as President of hockey operations...
    There have been sooooooooo many bad decisions made by MB and Molson. I would think Molson's board of directors, are not amused.
     
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  23. Lafleurs Guy

    Lafleurs Guy Global Moderator

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    Our window has passed. Forget re-tooling and start rebuilding. If we were going to go for it, it should've happened last summer. Instead we had the worst offseason that I can remember. We had our shot and we blew it.

    Scrap everything and start over...
     
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  24. mariolemieux66

    mariolemieux66 Registered User

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    Where is the puke emoticon?
     
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  25. groovejuice

    groovejuice Without deviation progress is not possible

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