Why does Kessel have the same rating as Malkin??

[The_Eck]

I'm glad you have realistic expecations.

Just like nobody expects crosby to attain gretzky's level but he is still nevertheless labelled a 'generational talent'.

 

[espo*]

I've already acknowledged that Crosby has superior balance and leg strength. He's a more physically mature person who has a differant build. I still think Kessel has the definate edge in top end speed and acceleration.

Well we are not disagreeing here and never have.I guess it comes down to if you think top end acceleration and top end speed is the be all and end all of skating ability. But i can't see you really buying that however.

if you combined crosby's skating skills and Kessels you just may have the best skater in the game.unfortunately,that is not what Kessel posseses. Maybe he can in time,right now he's mostly all top end wheels
and acceleration.While thats beautiful,it does'nt necessarily make you a better skater overall then another player with the skating gifts Crosby has.

 

[turnbuckle*]

Is that so surprising? I think it's more likely Kessel becomes the next Pavel Bure than Malkin becomes the next Mario Lemieux. That is Malkin's ceiling-right?

Have you considered applying to be Kessel's publicist? You've spent more hours here commenting on, defending and lauding Kessel than George Bush's publicist has spent on Dubya in two terms.

Just a suggestion - but why not chill out on other people's thoughts and comments about your prodigal son for awhile and see how he does at the NHL level before feeling obligated to compare him to Pavel Bure because other people have the audacity to pump up Malkin?

 

[crosby_87]

Is that so surprising? I think it's more likely Kessel becomes the next Pavel Bure than Malkin becomes the next Mario Lemieux. That is Malkin's ceiling-right?

I thought Kessel's ceiling is the "greatest american born hockey player in history"? That still makes me laugh every time I hear it.

 

[Til the End of Time]

That might be a bit credible if Crosby led the team to anything more than a miserable bottom five finish. Yea he's only eighteen, but saying that he's been a winner everywhere he's played is bogus.

But he has been a winner just about everywhere he's played. He won at Darmouth, he won at Shattuck's, he carried a former last place Oceanics team to the Memorial Cup only to lose to perhaps the greatest Junior team ever.

And of course he wasn't much of a winner last season. No one could have turned the Penguins around in one year. But given time, we have every reason to believe he'll turn the Penguins from a bottom feeder into a contender, just like he did in Jr. Surely a teenager gets more than one season to turn around an NHL team.

If you wouldn't consider Crosby a winner when looking at his career thus far, what young player of similar age deserves that label?

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I thought Kessel's ceiling is the "greatest american born hockey player in history"? That still makes me laugh every time I hear it.

It makes me laugh harder that you can judge him on that before having ever stepped a foot in the NHL.

Give me that crystal ball you're using so I can get some lotto numbers.

Your post is laughable.

And I'm not saying he will, but he's going to be a damn good NHLer.

 

[Crosbyfan]

I thought Kessel's ceiling is the "greatest american born hockey player in history"? That still makes me laugh every time I hear it.

I think Malkin's ceiling is Beliveau offensively and Gainey defensively. If he comes close to both that's getting close to Lemieux with a different game. Kessel may very well be the next Bure but Malkin doesn't have far to go to match that already albeit with a less exciting style.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

But he has been a winner just about everywhere he's played. He won at Darmouth, he won at Shattuck's, he carried a former last place Oceanics team to the Memorial Cup only to lose to perhaps the greatest Junior team ever.

And of course he wasn't much of a winner last season. No one could have turned the Penguins around in one year. But given time, we have every reason to believe he'll turn the Penguins from a bottom feeder into a contender, just like he did in Jr.

If you wouldn't consider Crosby a winner when looking at his career thus far, what young player of similar age deserves that label?

I knew what you meant, and in fact anticipated the critique in answering you before. By 'winner' it means raising his game when it counts . . . that he seems to have another gear that he goes to when the game is on the line or matters for some reason. I have noticed it and it is something that marks truly special players. Like Michael Jordan who everyone just knew was going to make the championship winning shot with less than a second left. Even though everyone knew that it was going to him. He just took it to another gear and did it. Crosby has that. And Jordan played for many a sucky team before he got that chance. Did not change the player that he was though.

Where you and I differ is that I see that quality in Malkin too. The Pens are going to have two of the more intense players in hockey for a while . . .hopefully for much longer than a while. But as for what you meant by 'winner' I understood and agree totally.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I think Malkin's ceiling is Beliveau offensively and Gainey defensively.

 

[Abyss]

I hope someone finds this thread this time next year, should lead to some good laughs.

 

[espo*]

It should indeed.

 

[The_Eck]

What's so laughable about that statement??? I know you hate the penguins, but please show some objectivity and maturity in your posts. Have you actually seen malkin play?? Many scouts compare his skating style and abilities to lemieux and beliveau. As for his defensive game, he is by far better than both AO and Crosby and is a threat on the penalty kill.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

What's so laughable about that statement??? I know you hate the penguins, but please show some objectivity and maturity in your posts. Have you actually seen malkin play?? Many scouts compare his skating style and abilities to lemieux and beliveau. As for his defensive game, he is by far better than both AO and Crosby and is a threat on the penalty kill.

I laugh at the fact someone saying the guy's ceiling is that of two of the best players of all-time.

I absolutely laugh at that. I spit out what I was eating, actually.

I like comparing players to guys in a reasonable way. That wasn't that reasonable.

I'd say his ceiling is a Sergei Fedorov type player right now. And until he proves that wrong in the NHL, that's as far as I'd go.

Comparing him to two of the greats is Pejorative Slured. Downright laughable.

 

[Til the End of Time]

I knew what you meant, and in fact anticipated the critique in answering you before. By 'winner' it means raising his game when it counts . . . that he seems to have another gear that he goes to when the game is on the line or matters for some reason. I have noticed it and it is something that marks truly special players. Like Michael Jordan who everyone just knew was going to make the championship winning shot with less than a second left. Even though everyone knew that it was going to him. He just took it to another gear and did it. Crosby has that. And Jordan played for many a sucky team before he got that chance. Did not change the player that he was though.

Where you and I differ is that I see that quality in Malkin too. The Pens are going to have two of the more intense players in hockey for a while . . .hopefully for much longer than a while. But as for what you meant by 'winner' I understood and agree totally.

Well thank you for your help in explaining why Crosby is a winner.

I feel like a shameless homer defending my favorite team's prospects on the main board here which I like to try and avoid, so I think I am going to bow out of this thread for now.

And we'll just have to wait and see with Malkin. I just... I dunno.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

I laugh at the fact someone saying the guy's ceiling is that of two of the best players of all-time.

I absolutely laugh at that. I spit out what I was eating, actually.

I like comparing players to guys in a reasonable way. That wasn't that reasonable.

I'd say his ceiling is a Sergei Fedorov type player right now. And until he proves that wrong in the NHL, that's as far as I'd go.

Comparing him to two of the greats is Pejorative Slured. Downright laughable.

I actually do buy the Mario comparisons though. Not that he will score anywhere near what Mario did or even dominate like him. But watching Malkin skate, that long smooth deceptive stride that makes him seem to be almost lazy out there and yet when you look up he has blown by everyone. His total control of his body, his reach, his shot. He more than anyone that I have seen has the ghost of Mario to me, but as to how he looks out there. The results we will have to wait for.

 

[MN_Gopher]

We can argue potential untill we are blue in the face and all laugh at each other and manipulate stats as we choose.

Crosby is the most ready NHLer there probally ever has been. And maybe the most ready pro athlete to come into his sport and dominate at his age.

But how many of you that know the NBA. Would still take LeBron and Carmello over Dwayne Wade. It was very claer at the time who was better. But what a difference a couple of years make.

There are late bloomers like Thornton. If the NBA draft was at the age 18 Micheal Jordan would have fell farther than 3rd. He was not ready. He actually got cut from varsity in high school. Blair Thomas goes 2nd, Emmitt Smith goes 17th. Draft position and what was done the previous year mean nothing really. Things can change very quickly.

I never said Kessel would be better next year. Or is better right now. But he is raw young man with tons of offensive abilities.

I need to stop raging at night. This is going to seven by the end of the day.

 

[The_Eck]

I laugh at the fact someone saying the guy's ceiling is that of two of the best players of all-time.

I absolutely laugh at that. I spit out what I was eating, actually.

I like comparing players to guys in a reasonable way. That wasn't that reasonable.

I'd say his ceiling is a Sergei Fedorov type player right now. And until he proves that wrong in the NHL, that's as far as I'd go.

Comparing him to two of the greats is Pejorative Slured. Downright laughable.

You could at least explain yourself rather than putting laughing symbols all over the place which is quite immature IMO.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

You could at least explain yourself rather than putting laughing symbols all over the place which is quite immature IMO.

I'd rather ridicule his Pejorative Slured post than actually respond to it.

 

[Crosbyfan]

I laugh at the fact someone saying the guy's ceiling is that of two of the best players of all-time.

I absolutely laugh at that. I spit out what I was eating, actually.

I like comparing players to guys in a reasonable way. That wasn't that reasonable.

I'd say his ceiling is a Sergei Fedorov type player right now. And until he proves that wrong in the NHL, that's as far as I'd go.

Comparing him to two of the greats is Pejorative Slured. Downright laughable.

You do realize what ceilings are?

 

[An Ape called Yoko]

I don´t think some of you realizes how good Malkin really is...

He is way better than Kessel.. its not even close to be honest.. Malkin will dominate like crazy next season.

I feel bad for Kessel though.. the hype that has surrounded him has only hurt him... "USAs answer to Canadas Crosby?" Not even close... he is not even as good as Swedens answer.. Nicklas Bäckström. However... im not saying Kessel won´t be a good player...sure he will.. he will rock! But good as Malkin which is what this thread is about...? Forget it!

 

[The_Eck]

We can argue potential untill we are blue in the face and all laugh at each other and manipulate stats as we choose.

Crosby is the most ready NHLer there probally ever has been. And maybe the most ready pro athlete to come into his sport and dominate at his age.

But how many of you that know the NBA. Would still take LeBron and Carmello over Dwayne Wade. It was very claer at the time who was better. But what a difference a couple of years make.

There are late bloomers like Thornton. If the NBA draft was at the age 18 Micheal Jordan would have fell farther than 3rd. He was not ready. He actually got cut from varsity in high school. Blair Thomas goes 2nd, Emmitt Smith goes 17th. Draft position and what was done the previous year mean nothing really. Things can change very quickly.

I never said Kessel would be better next year. Or is better right now. But he is raw young man with tons of offensive abilities.

I need to stop raging at night. This is going to seven by the end of the day.

I would still take lebron over d-wade. D-wade is undoubtedly the mvp of the playoffs but let's not forget he has a great supporting cast which is not the case with lbj and the cavaliers.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

You do realize what ceilings are?

No. I don't know what I'm talking about, obviously.

To say his ceiling is that of two of the better players in NHL HISTORY is more or less Pejorative Slured.

For now, I'd say his ceiling is that of a Fedorov like player. Maybe a tiny bit better. But Fedorov was a machine in his prime years and I honestly doubt Malkin is ever as good as he was.

 

[The_Eck]

I'd rather ridicule his Pejorative Slured post than actually respond to it.

You do realize that beliveau's ppg is 1.08 throughout his career right even though he played on a great team. Not saying that beliveau was not a great player, but comparing malkin to beliveau is not laughable. Furthermore, his defensive game is what many scouts are also raving about.

 

[The_Eck]

No. I don't know what I'm talking about, obviously.

To say his ceiling is that of two of the better players in NHL HISTORY is more or less Pejorative Slured.

For now, I'd say his ceiling is that of a Fedorov like player. Maybe a tiny bit better. But Fedorov was a machine in his prime years and I honestly doubt Malkin is ever as good as he was.

Elaborate.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Elaborate.

Fedorov is one of the better two-way players to play the game in the last 20 or so years. The guy was a beast offensively and defensively.

I watched him for years since I double as a Wings fan since my dad is a huge one.

Malkin is pretty awesome, but I highly doubt he turns out better than Fedorov was in his prime.

I HIGHLY doubt it.