Who's better Tavares or Stamkos?

Hunter Gathers

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Feb 27, 2002
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No... No he isn't.

He pretty much is. He will have to **** up royally in order for someone to pass him at this point. He's basically scoring goals at will.

The only way someone passes him now is if he's Jason Spezza'd. IE when they start criticizing for the sake of criticizing (which is already happening now!).

Only then will he be passed over.
 

RUSqueelin*

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Nov 2, 2005
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Anybody who wouldn't take Tavares with their pick needs a lobotomy - or has already had one. Perhaps Milbury would trade the pick for....
 

JackBauer

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May 16, 2006
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let's review:
-played in the OHL as a 15 yr old (special rule)
-scored 72 goals as a 16 yr old (broke gretzky's record) and won CHL POY (over Pat Kane who is 2 yrs older and is thus far doing very well in the NHL)
-His 134 points as a 16 yr old is 1 behind Crosby. Crosby played less games but was also on a much better team
-has 28 pts in 14 games thus far (and we have no reason to believe that he won't run away with the CHL scoring crown this year, once he actually gets going)

-considering that as a player 2+ years younger, he kept pace points-wise and ran away goals-wise from players like Kane, Gagner, Voracek, and Bobby Ryan, AND he put up 134 points in his 2nd year in the CHL, AND he still has 2 more years to play so to not think that he'll shatter Kane's 145, Spezza's 105, and Staal's 98 (in their draft years) is absolutely ridiculous. he may even hit Crosby's 168.

**I'm not saying he's on the same level as Crosby, I'm just saying that he's so far beyond Stamkos that its laughable.
 

timlap

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Jun 19, 2002
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. . . I'm just saying that he's so far beyond Stamkos that its laughable.
Then you are also saying that Bob Mackenzie is reporting inaccuracies or that 7 out of 10 scouts are laughable. Which are you saying?
 

HABSMANIA21*

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id take stamkos i know that. how many of you guys have seen tavares play live, and how many of you guys have seen stamkos play live. i have seen both live and stamkos is better. tavares racks up the points, not a flashy guy(not that he needs to be) but stamkos is way more dynamic. i think tavares could bust to be honest.
 

JackBauer

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May 16, 2006
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Then you are also saying that Bob Mackenzie is reporting inaccuracies or that 7 out of 10 scouts are laughable. Which are you saying?

yes, yes i am.
it's like reporting that 7 out of 10 scouts would take Patrick Kane over Sidney Crosby (if they were in the same year). scouts don't always give accurate impressions to the media.

would you draft stamkos over tavares? please enlighten me as to why stamkos is better than a player tavares. tavares put up a lot more goals and points, a year younger, on a worse team last year. he'll do the exact same thing this year. so unless he's incredibly lazy, has a criminal record, takes steroids or stamkos is a hitting/shot-blocking machine, i can't think of a reason to not pick tavares.
 

PuckheadMcGillycuddy

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Aug 12, 2002
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I'm no probability or statistics expert, but I had a problem right when I read the article initially nearly two months ago with the small sample size of scouts. Ten scouts isn't a big enough group to get a true view. If it was 70 out of 100, that would be a different story. But perhaps McKenzie just happened to talk to the seven scouts in existence who would actually take Stamkos over Tavares.
 

Tinalera

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Feb 3, 2007
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I posted this elsewhere, but I'd hardly call Stamkos behind Travares "laughable"- after his slow start he's only 8 pts behind Travares in O scoring at 9th, he's on a 1.5 pt per game average with the last few games getting 2-3 points. The scouts were absolutely crammed in when Sarnia was playing Sagniaw(what an odd game that was). I think both Talents are incredible, Travares is more of a pure goal scorer, Stamkos is an all around player, both are great talents. Travares and Stamkos will both get drafted high, and will both I think have careers that do well, and I think we'll be discussing Stamkos and Travares the way Crosby vs Ovechkin is discussed now- I just wonder why the sudden anger at Stamkos?

BTW, does anyone know if Stamkos and Travares are buddies off the ice or at least friendly with one another? If so, I'm sure the two of them are laughing at this debate. I haven't heard what Travares feels, but Stamkos has said going 1st in the draft isn't a priority, that just making the NHL is an honour, he could go 10th and he'd be fine(though I don't think he's gonna drop lower than fifth, and I've got a sneaking suspicion Atlanta is going to grab him if they can-they like drafting from the Sting, having Painchaud and Pospisil already on their farm team, it would be a Sarnia reunion.)
 
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grifftopia*

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the really laughable thing is that if stamkos is easily the unanimus #1 in 08 and everyone of us is saying they would pick tavares, well some of those scouts would take tavares 3rd... i really do not understand nhl scouting...
 

massivegoonery

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Jul 31, 2007
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If we merged the two drafts, to me the top tier looks like:

Tavares
Hedman
Pietrangelo
Stamkos
Doughty

That's my rough list at the moment. I'm pretty comfortable with the Tavares > Stamkos and the Hedman > Pietrangelo > Doughty rankings, but as far as forwards vs. defense, that's going to have to be up to team need. All three of those d-men are smoking hot and guys like that don't come around that often. If my team was ok in forwards but lacking a dman anchor, I wouldn't have that much of a problem jumping up and taking Hedman with the first pick in 09.
 

The Scouting Report

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Oct 2, 2007
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The key difference between Stamkos and Tavares is five on five play. On the contrary to what many think Tavares has developed into a solid defensive center. His knock is occasionally being lazy getting back, but he is pretty good in his own end.

However the real difference is that Stamkos does not produce much 5 on 5. In fact he does very little, an unbelievable threat on the PP but 5 on 5 he needs to work on.
 

JackBauer

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May 16, 2006
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I posted this elsewhere, but I'd hardly call Stamkos behind Travares "laughable"- after his slow start he's only 8 pts behind Travares in O scoring at 9th, he's on a 1.5 pt per game average with the last few games getting 2-3 points. The scouts were absolutely crammed in when Sarnia was playing Sagniaw(what an odd game that was). I think both Talents are incredible, Travares is more of a pure goal scorer, Stamkos is an all around player, both are great talents. Travares and Stamkos will both get drafted high, and will both I think have careers that do well, and I think we'll be discussing Stamkos and Travares the way Crosby vs Ovechkin is discussed now- I just wonder why the sudden anger at Stamkos?
QUOTE]

but tavares is still outscoring him and hasn't heated up thus far. he outscored him by a wide margin last year and the bottom line is that he's a year younger.
 

Blind Gardien

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Apr 2, 2004
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However the real difference is that Stamkos does not produce much 5 on 5. In fact he does very little, an unbelievable threat on the PP but 5 on 5 he needs to work on.
No real offense intended towards Justin DiBenedetto or Devin Didiomete, but I just find it's hard for a single player to really control play 5-on-5 anymore. Those guys just aren't Brett MacLean. But then when you add Wilson and Katic on the point, get Didiomete doing his thing down low, it's a much better opportunity for the line to function to its strengths. I think it's a situation that's very common in the OHL these past few seasons. A really good PP unit can really pile up the points with the frequency of minor penalty calls these days. And despite the somewhat slow start for Sarnia overall, I think the Stamkos line has generally been + or even so far.

I find Stamkos to really be paying attention (sometimes too much attention?) to watching his duties, to coming back, maybe not always taking the risks and chances that he could be. I've only seen 3 games, mind you.

That said, I've also been impressed with Tavares so far this year... with Clutterbuck gone, I guess it's natural that Tavares would start taking some more responsibility, and he's looking better in the faceoff circle and on the PK than I ever recall. It's a natural progression for a player to step up with such responsibilities as he gains seniority in the league, but it's still good to see that the progression is there with Tavares.
 

David

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Feb 28, 2002
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TSN has an article on it's website debating whether or not Tavares would be the number 1 pick in this ut year's draft. 7/10 scouts say Stamkos would be their choice. I know Stamkos is a great player and should be a star in the NHL someday but how do you pass up on a talent like Tavares. Tavares is a talent that doesn;t come along very often. These scouts may say this now but i think they would change their tune on the actual draft day. I know the argument is insignificant since they won't be drafted in the same year but interesting nonetheless.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=217783&hubname=nhl

I think that this was more of a knee jerk reaction by many to the poor showing that Tavares had during the Russia Canada series...if you look at all the factors, many which have been mentioned in this thread, I think that Tavares is easily a safer, better overall pick than Stamkos, esp. since we're comparing a 17 year old with an 18 year old in this survey which is already indicating that Tavares has a much higher ceiling in the long run.
 

AgentNaslund*

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in 2005, all gms were asked if they had the 1st pick, and Crosby and Kessel was in the same year, who they pick? I was quite shocked that 12 chose Kessel.

but n e ways....... this Taverse kid sounds good....
 

DreamCatcher*

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I think that this was more of a knee jerk reaction by many to the poor showing that Tavares had during the Russia Canada series...if you look at all the factors, many which have been mentioned in this thread, I think that Tavares is easily a safer, better overall pick than Stamkos, esp. since we're comparing a 17 year old with an 18 year old in this survey which is already indicating that Tavares has a much higher ceiling in the long run.

John Tavares is only 6 months older then Stamkos.
 

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