When Does the USA Surpass Canada as the #1 Hockey Country?

Status
Not open for further replies.

AgentNaslund*

Guest
They never will. But they have other sports they are superior to us in. So If i was an American sports fan I will not worry about not being as good to Canada in ice hockey.
 

Kafka

Registered User
Mar 1, 2002
5,355
1
Montreal
Visit site
That question falls in the same group as: "When will the Leafs win a Stanley Cup? or "When will Canada take part to the FIFA World Cup"...... :shakehead

Team Russia, T.Rep., Sweden and even Finland (or team Ontario, Quebec+maritimes, West) have more chances.
 

Vic Rattlehead*

Guest
Kafka said:
That question falls in the same group as: "When will the Leafs win a Stanley Cup? or "When will Canada take part to the FIFA World Cup"...... :shakehead

Team Russia, T.Rep., Sweden and even Finland (or team Ontario, Quebec+maritimes, West) have more chances.
No they don't. USA is quickly rising in hockey.
 

NYR469

Registered User
Feb 27, 2002
5,785
0
Visit site
Jovanovski = Norris said:
The only advantage that Canada has is that hockey is still our #1 sport while it is the #4 or #5 favorite team sport in the US.

that isn't the only advantage and it isn't the biggest advantage either...

the biggest advantage canada has is that is cold and kids can play outdoors on ponds all day long. the US might have 300 million people but how many of those people live in california, florida, texas, etc where it is too hot to have frozen ponds??

practically every nhler has a story of playing on a pond as a kid. well the kid from a warm area that can only play in an indoor arena where you are often paying $300 to play 1-2 games/week with no practice has no chance against the kid who can skate for free from morning to night...

thats why most of the US-born talent is produced in minnesota, michigan, wisconsin, maine, mass...they are all up north and cold during the winter.
 

Devonator

Registered User
Jan 5, 2003
4,643
2,390
As soon as their is a Team Quebec?? Well, that may be in a few years...

However, I cannot see the U.S. ever surpassing us simply because up here we live in a Frozen Tundra half the year and we have nothing else too do except play hockey......it simply is in our life blood up here.........

Now if you want too talk about International Football, well the U.S. is going to be a superpower in that sport very soon and indefinately.....much too the chagrin of Europeans and South Americans too be sure.....

In Hockey, I would think Canada would usually remain # 1 with the Russians and Americans challenging us but never quite dominating the sport like we do......
 

Guy Legend

Registered User
Jun 2, 2005
2,534
1
St. Louis
The US's population is far too great. Heck, California alone is the size of Canada...

The day will come where America will become the number one producer of hockey talent.

Right now, the country is largely untapped. In non-traditional markets in the south, hockey has really sprung up as a game people play now. While expansion is bad in the short run in terms of talent in the league, it will end up doing the opposite. The league will benefit as a whole, something we can all appreciate.

The number of Americans in each draft has been rising (including the number of quality players). The 2006 draft will continue that trend. :clap:

But if it makes some canadians sleep better at night, I can say "never".... ;)
 

RangersFan88*

Guest
When Does the USA Surpass Canada as the #1 Hockey Country?

..... when russia and the czech republik are gone ^^
 

AvsGuy

Hired the wrong DJ again
Sep 13, 2002
10,594
2,738
Regina, SK
The U.S. will surpass Canada on most levels of hockey when they start beating us in games that matter.

5-2. enough said.
 

Hockeycanada*

Guest
I'd put my money on Russia passing Canada before tUS does. Still, Canada is still producing most of the top superstars.

When does US pass Canada? Not in my lifetime.
 

syc

Registered User
Aug 25, 2003
3,062
1
Not Europe
Visit site
Population size has nothing to do with quality of athletes. Like another posted stated look at the Czechs with 8 million people that managed to develop great hockey and soccer players. Or look at Holland and their soccer system. If population mattered then England, Germany, France, Italy, ect should be leaps and bounds better then the Czechs and Dutch.

Soccer is the #1 sport in Russia by far and they have what 20 times the population of the Czech Republic but they are not known for developing great soccer players.

The only way the US will be better then Canada at hockey is if the US hockey fedoration hired Canadian hockey people to run US hockey.
 

Resolute

Registered User
Mar 4, 2005
4,125
0
AB
Jovanovski = Norris said:
My question is, when do you guys think the USA will surpass Canada as the premier hockey country in the world? In both quality and quantity.

In terms of quantity, the answer is so obvious the question should not even have been asked: When there are more American NHLers than Canadian.

In terms of quality, let's see the Americans actually win more than the odd tournament every five years before we even mention them in the same sentence.
 

sbutler66

Registered User
Feb 25, 2004
179
0
Jovanovski = Norris said:
Canada has arguably been the #1 hockey country in the world in terms of producing the best hockey players. It has been as such since the inception of the game and despite the recent rise of European players, I don't see a country like Sweden, Finland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Russia and other countries taking the lead considering that soccer is still the most popular sport in most of those countries and that their standard of living is still lower than that of Canada's.

However, the United States can potentially, and realistically, catch up soon. The population of the United States is around 300 million while the population of Canada is around 30 million. The standard of living in both country is relatively equal. The only advantage that Canada has is that hockey is still our #1 sport while it is the #4 or #5 favorite team sport in the US.

Some think the movement is already occuring with the US outputting high-profile prospects like Phil Kessel, Alvaro Montoya, Jack Johnson, Bobby Ryan, Jack Skille, Dustin Brown, Brian Lee, Rob Schremp, AJ Thelen, Ryan Suter, Zach Parise et al. Others argue that it will still take several decades for at least the US psyche about hockey to change or establish a better development system.

My question is, when do you guys think the USA will surpass Canada as the premier hockey country in the world? In both quality and quantity.

Firstly countries such as Sweden and Finland have a standard fo living as high, if not higher than Canada, so I don't see how that is relevant.

In terms of players, depends if you talk about quality or quantity as you rightly mentioned. At the moment Canada rules in both. I think Canada will always rule in terms of quantity, just the way kids grow up with the game. As far as high end talent goes the US is catching up with some of the Candadian kids. Canada will continue to produce those players, it's more a question of can the Americans sustain the improvement. Hopefully...the more skilled players the better.

One last point, the lockout went to show how invaluable the states are to the NHL. Does that have extra weighting in your mind as the #1 hockey country?? In my mind it doesn't. Throughout the lockout hockey in Canada still thrived and continued at all age groups. I think the lockout just underlined how entertaining the junior leagues are.
 

weezman

Guest
Kaizer said:
Heh... China has about 1.3 billions, football is very popular there but they still suck.
Czech Republic has about 8-10 millions and they are among the best in football and hockey.
It's hard to compare based only on population.


Football isn't and never will be anything more than an amusing pasttime there. The mainstream psyche of the people prevent them from being tops in the world at any sport, iow: they don't care enough about it to try hard.
 

TK79

Registered User
Jul 5, 2002
1,191
2
Helsinki, Finland
Visit site
Jovanovski = Norris said:
Canada has arguably been the #1 hockey country in the world in terms of producing the best hockey players. It has been as such since the inception of the game and despite the recent rise of European players, I don't see a country like Sweden, Finland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Russia and other countries taking the lead considering that soccer is still the most popular sport in most of those countries and that their standard of living is still lower than that of Canada's.

However, the United States can potentially, and realistically, catch up soon. The population of the United States is around 300 million while the population of Canada is around 30 million. The standard of living in both country is relatively equal. The only advantage that Canada has is that hockey is still our #1 sport while it is the #4 or #5 favorite team sport in the US.

Some think the movement is already occuring with the US outputting high-profile prospects like Phil Kessel, Alvaro Montoya, Jack Johnson, Bobby Ryan, Jack Skille, Dustin Brown, Brian Lee, Rob Schremp, AJ Thelen, Ryan Suter, Zach Parise et al. Others argue that it will still take several decades for at least the US psyche about hockey to change or establish a better development system.

My question is, when do you guys think the USA will surpass Canada as the premier hockey country in the world? In both quality and quantity.

First of all get your facts right. The standard of living using 2004 GDP per capita (a common indicator for measuring this):

2. United States 40 100 $
15. Canada 31 500 $
22. Finland 29 000 $
26. Sweden 28 400 $
59. Czech Republic 16 800 $
63. Slovakia 14 500 $
82. Russia 9 800 $

source:

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html

The figures for Canada, Finland and Sweden are very similiar, all with a noticable drop off from the U.S. So you could argue that the standard of living in Canada is about the same as the Nordic countries, but not as good as the United States. However, the eastern European countries are still lagging far behind.

As for your question I think the chances that the U.S supasses Canada in hockey in the near future are slim to none. All of the other top six countries can beat Canada in a elimination tournament however, since the margins are quite small.
 

Kaizer

Registered User
Apr 26, 2003
4,574
428
Berlin, Germany
Just wonder how GDP per capita relates with popularity of sport. If there is some correlation Brazil wouldn't win 5 world championships and be the best football team in the world with the best players. The same about Argentina.
 

Anksun

Registered User
Dec 13, 2002
3,616
1
Montreal
Visit site
Guy Legend said:
The US's population is far too great. Heck, California alone is the size of Canada...

The day will come where America will become the number one producer of hockey talent.

Right now, the country is largely untapped. In non-traditional markets in the south, hockey has really sprung up as a game people play now. While expansion is bad in the short run in terms of talent in the league, it will end up doing the opposite. The league will benefit as a whole, something we can all appreciate.

The number of Americans in each draft has been rising (including the number of quality players). The 2006 draft will continue that trend. :clap:

But if it makes some canadians sleep better at night, I can say "never".... ;)

You really need to understand something however. No matter how many rink you could build in the non-traditional markets, you will always still be severely far away in term of "playing time" than anywhere in Canada.

As a young kid, i would usually play hockey in the winter from 8am to 12am and 13pm to 17pm every single saturday and sunday and i was actually always there with plenty of other people. Although the videos games have somewhat gave another possibility to the young guys today, the popularity of hockey is still far greater there to even think the non-traditionals markets (even with 10 times the population) have actually a chance to catch it on.

While i think you might one day catch it on, it's not going to be in your lifetime.
 

DownFromNJ

Registered User
Mar 7, 2004
2,536
2
It'll happen sooner than people expect. Bobby Ryan is a great example. A #2 overall pick coming not out of New England or Minnesota... but out of New Jersey!.

New Jersey is a great example. As little as ten years ago, we had literally one third the ice rinks we do now. Few public schools had ice hockey teams. Today? Every public school in my home county has one. Two new rinks opened last year. The place is becoming a hockey loaded area.


Ten years from now, we'll be seeing good NHL hockey players being drafted out of Florida, California, and other places.


The US is ten times the size of Canada. It's only a matter of time.
 

Claypool_*

Guest
Canadians should be concerned that a nation where hockey isn't cared about at all still produces excellent NHL players and can compete internationally. If hockey was #1 in the US, not only would the NHL have no canadian teams, it wouldn't have any canadian players (or international players for that matter).
 

Habsaku

Registered User
Apr 28, 2003
5,554
0
Montreal
Visit site
Anksun said:
You really need to understand something however. No matter how many rink you could build in the non-traditional markets, you will always still be severely far away in term of "playing time" than anywhere in Canada.

As a young kid, i would usually play hockey in the winter from 8am to 12am and 13pm to 17pm every single saturday and sunday and i was actually always there with plenty of other people. Although the videos games have somewhat gave another possibility to the young guys today, the popularity of hockey is still far greater there to even think the non-traditionals markets (even with 10 times the population) have actually a chance to catch it on.

While i think you might one day catch it on, it's not going to be in your lifetime.
Yeah thats important to note, me and a few people basically used to wake up at 5 in the morning to skate on clean ice at minus 20 degrees for four hours straight.
 

Hawker14

Registered User
Oct 27, 2004
3,084
0
to be honest i don't really see it happening due to climate and socio-economic factors.

hockey is an expensive game to play organized, and many poorer americans play more inexpensive games like basketball, baseball and football.

all things being equal, many of canada's best athletes play hockey at some point (due to outdoor rinks, social programs, etc.), while very few of america's best athletes do.

just my opinion.
 

Claypool_*

Guest
hawker14 said:
hockey is an expensive game to play organized, and many poorer americans play more inexpensive games like basketball, baseball and football.


there's no poor people in canada?
 

Hawker14

Registered User
Oct 27, 2004
3,084
0
Claypool said:
there's no poor people in canada?

i should've been more clear. poor kids in canada have the climate to play hockey on outdoor rinks, all they need is a stick and skates. conversely, i would venture to say canada doesn't have the climate to produce the elite basketball and baseball players that the united states does.

most poor kids in america don't have access to hockey at an unorganized level due to climate.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->