What's the latest offer by NHLPA? Still the one from december 9th?

[Pepper]

Sorry there has been so many meetings & discussions that I forgot whats the latest PA is offering, still the 24% rollback with ridiculously low luxury tax?

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[Cloned]

I believe that is their official last proposal, yes. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[futurcorerock]

Yeah that was the last one. Since Linden "heroically" jumpstarted the talks, it's been ALL-NHL in terms of proposals.

 

[RangerBoy]

The NHLPA offer of a 24% rollback for all player under EXISTING contracts

$850,000 maximum annual salary plus signing bonus
$212,500 maximum annual signing bonus
$850,000 limit on total "A" bonuses per year, with $212,500 limit on each "A" bonus

Unlimited "B" and "C" bonuses

Very limited ability of a Club to take a Group II player to arbitration

Payroll Tax:

20% tax for dollars over $45 million payroll
50% tax for dollars over $50 million payroll
60% tax for dollars over $60 million payroll

5% increases in tax rates for repeat offenders

Negotiated increase in payroll threshold in subsequent years

110% for players earning $660,000 or less
105% for players earning between $660,000 and $1 million
100% for players earning more than $1 million

 

[RangerBoy]

The NHLPA offer of a 24% rollback for all player under EXISTING contracts

$850,000 maximum annual salary plus signing bonus
$212,500 maximum annual signing bonus
$850,000 limit on total "A" bonuses per year, with $212,500 limit on each "A" bonus

Unlimited "B" and "C" bonuses

Very limited ability of a Club to take a Group II player to arbitration

Payroll Tax:

20% tax for dollars over $45 million payroll
50% tax for dollars over $50 million payroll
60% tax for dollars over $60 million payroll

5% increases in tax rates for repeat offenders

Negotiated increase in payroll threshold in subsequent years

110% for players earning $660,000 or less
105% for players earning between $660,000 and $1 million
100% for players earning more than $1 million

The NHLPA thinks that offer was the answer to ending the lockout.All of the players reacted in such anger when the offer was rejected by the NHL on December 14

Listening to the NHLPA,their offer could bring the world peace and harmony

 

[Greschner4]

The NHLPA thinks that offer was the answer to ending the lockout.All of the players reacted in such anger when the offer was rejected by the NHL on December 14

Listening to the NHLPA,their offer could bring the world peace and harmony

The NHLPA offer was a joke and their outrage that it was turned down so abruptly is an even bigger joke.

Way too much emotion and emotionalism from their side.

 

[chiavsfan]

Exactly, I think if the PA wants to be taken more seriously, they would realize that their last (AND ONLY) proposal was a complete and utter joke, that would only put a small band-aid on the current situation.

The NHL has made at least 3 formal proposals, yet the PA keeps saying they are the ones offering all these concessions. WHERE?????

I think the PA gets a lot stupider (yes I said stupider, which is not a real word) everyday.

 

[Pepper]

So if that's the best PA can offer, they have absolutely no moral ground whatsoever to appear "angry" or "shocked" or whatever by NHL's offers. I mean that offer is so far from reality that it's not even funny.

NHLPA better make a new, REAL offer or the labor board will have a slamdunk case in finding out that PA has done nothing to reach a deal.

 

[crossxcheck]

So if that's the best PA can offer, they have absolutely no moral ground whatsoever to appear "angry" or "shocked" or whatever by NHL's offers. I mean that offer is so far from reality that it's not even funny.

NHLPA better make a new, REAL offer or the labor board will have a slamdunk case in finding out that PA has done nothing to reach a deal.

I thought I read somewhere yesterday that the PA said it is too late in the game for "offers." Which, to me, means the only choice is to get together and slam it out. take a deal where both sides compromise (like that's going to happen).

 

[DJA]

Come on fellas, we all know the PA can't be bothered with making meaningful proposals. They'd rather "sit out for the rest of their lives".

 

[DJA]

I think the PA gets a lot stupider (yes I said stupider, which is not a real word) everyday.

Which, for an organization with members such as McCabe, Domi, Guerin, Esche, and Modano, is quite a feat.

 

[Levitate]

the NHL proposals have pretty much been the same things repackaged over and over...not really "new" proposals

i think the players anger over their proposal being rejected wasn't so much that the owners didn't just sign it right then and there, but that the owners dismissed everything about it and walked away without bothering to negotiate

 

[SuperNintendoChalmrs]

Quiet now......the NHLPA is busy putting together a new proposal.......a 5 game regular season for free with 50k in the playoffs and a minimum salary cap in 2005-06 per team of 75 million dollars. A 5% luxury tax kicks in at 200 million......I wonder if Esche would go along with that?

 

[Lanny MacDonald*]

the NHL proposals have pretty much been the same things repackaged over and over...not really "new" proposals

i think the players anger over their proposal being rejected wasn't so much that the owners didn't just sign it right then and there, but that the owners dismissed everything about it and walked away without bothering to negotiate

"Repackaged" over and over. Wow, that's original. Did that come straight from Bob Goodenow's brain to your keyboard? This whole "repackaged" thing kind of makes me laugh. That's what negotiating is all about. Developing a framework and then adjusting the numbers within that framework to attempt to come to a compromise. The NHL originally gave the players six frameworks which they would work from, and they ignored them. The players delivered their "proposal" and the NHL took several days to work the numbers and meld it into the framework they have had their people working on. The NHL has delivered offers in this same framework and adjusted the parameters accordingly. They have made repeated efforts to appeal to the players, making some large concessions. Maybe not large enough for the players, but they are there. Now the players are about to re-present their original offer and have an improved dog and pony show to go along with it? That's negotiation?

I think the NHLPA is double dog daring the NHL to call and impasse and bring in replacements. There is no way that the NHLPA brings the exact same offer to the table and thinks this will be accepted and will not immediately terminate talks and kill the season. I'm not sure what the NHLPA is thinking, but it looks like they are trying to drive this towards an impasse.

 

[Levitate]

what large concessions have the owners made? where?

 

[Pepper]

Owners have increased their salary cap by more than 33%, from 32M to 42M.

Have PA increased their luxury taxes or lowered luxury tax limits by that much? HELL NO!

 

[shakes]

Sorry to interrupt this player bashing thread, but why is it that a crap proposal by the owners is "something to work with" but a crap proposal by the NHLPA is not?

Yeh, thats what I thought. And now back to your regularly scheduled hypocrisy.

 

[Levitate]

they increased the "cap" but then hobbled it with an attempt to make ownership "idiot proof" with the whole tie to revenues. especially with the wide variety in ways in which NHL teams collect revenues, it makes for an ugly deal.

if it was just a straight $32-42 mill cap, at this point i'd say the players could take it and be getting a decent deal out of the cap area...i'm more in favor of something in the $45 mill range, but if it let the players get a more fair deal in other parts of the CBA, then fine. I've always been of the opinion that if the owners will go high enough on a cap, the players should take it.


and you know what, i think the NHLPA should have been making some more offers in here, but i think the reason they never bothered with making offers involving a revision of their luxery tax concepts is because of the way the owners scorned the deal in the first place...honestly i think what should have happened is the two sides started this "talking" a lot sooner after that, not even offering deals, but just figuring out what they could...there's no reason to have waited this long and both sides deserve to by lynched for taht

 

[GKJ]

People obviously don't understand the propagande the NHL is setting up with the players.


If the players make the final proposal, it will look like the owners cave in, so the owners are going to keep making offers so it looks better for the players when they agree to it.

And besides, if the owners are going to keep making offers, there's not much of a difference for the NHLPA makes one when the NHL is making one every week because everyone knows what's going to be in each offer anyways.


People who look at this objectivly and don't go around screaming how the players or owners are greedy ******** can see this. Otherwise, refer to the rant thread.

 

[Ar-too]

Sorry to interrupt this player bashing thread, but why is it that a crap proposal by the owners is "something to work with" but a crap proposal by the NHLPA is not?

Because players like Todd Marchant refer to a salary cap as being thrown in jail or forced into slavery.

 

[Egil]

they increased the "cap" but then hobbled it with an attempt to make ownership "idiot proof" with the whole tie to revenues. especially with the wide variety in ways in which NHL teams collect revenues, it makes for an ugly deal.

if it was just a straight $32-42 mill cap, at this point i'd say the players could take it and be getting a decent deal out of the cap area...i'm more in favor of something in the $45 mill range, but if it let the players get a more fair deal in other parts of the CBA, then fine. I've always been of the opinion that if the owners will go high enough on a cap, the players should take it.


and you know what, i think the NHLPA should have been making some more offers in here, but i think the reason they never bothered with making offers involving a revision of their luxery tax concepts is because of the way the owners scorned the deal in the first place...honestly i think what should have happened is the two sides started this "talking" a lot sooner after that, not even offering deals, but just figuring out what they could...there's no reason to have waited this long and both sides deserve to by lynched for taht

PROFIT SHARING Levitate. That is a HUGE concession from the owners.

 

[Lanny MacDonald*]

PROFIT SHARING Levitate. That is a HUGE concession from the owners.

Don't confuse the boy.

 

[HockeyCritter]

The NHLPA thinks that offer was the answer to ending the lockout.All of the players reacted in such anger when the offer was rejected by the NHL on December 14

Listening to the NHLPA,their offer could bring the world peace and harmony

At least the owners waited five days before rejecting that offer . . . . the same can't be said of the PA (and why weren't they working on a counter-proposal).

**sigh**