Speculation: What will Canes do at deadline?

What will Canes do at deadline?


  • Total voters
    83

tarheelhockey

Offside Review Specialist
Feb 12, 2010
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I think Francis saw what the team looked like without Jordan, realized he isn’t going on the road trip against 2 playoff teams and that they will be 7 points out by March 1 and no move he could’ve made would change that.

You can argue that’s not appropriate or you can’t have that mentality it whatever but it’s the truth.

I don't have an answer for that. If he gave up, he gave up. I think we have a right to be disappointed in a leader who gives up.
 

The Faulker 27

Registered User
Nov 15, 2011
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Sauna-Aho
If he doesn't get aggressive this offseason I'm gonna be calling for him to be let go unfortunately. I really hope he can find a way as I really want him to be a successful GM for our team.

If he doesn't add significant scoring talent, and figure out the goalie situation, I don't think we'll have to worry about GMRF being around for the entire 2018-2019 season. Course, the current crop could turn it around, and put it all together, but I'm not holding my breath on that. Especially not Darling. I don't see any bounce back in him, but I'm a bit jaded right now. This team is more than a couple 3rd liners away from making it. Although, I surmise we'll see a lot of wishful thinking, and adding replacement level players. Setting a record for missing the playoffs in a league that's been around since 1917 doesn't look overly awesome, and the GM is ultimately responsible at the end of the day.
 

Svechhammer

THIS is hockey?
Jun 8, 2017
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I think Francis saw what the team looked like without Jordan, realized he isn’t going on the road trip against 2 playoff teams and that they will be 7 points out by March 1 and no move he could’ve made would change that.

You can argue that’s not appropriate or you can’t have that mentality it whatever but it’s the truth.
I think Francis doesn't have a damn clue what it takes to take the franchise from where it is now to where it needs to be to be a legitimate contender. With or without Jordan, we're one of the poorest scoring teams in the Metro, with glaring weaknesses down the line. He promised us he was all in on getting a 1C leading into the 2017 offseason, and we're still waiting on him to make good on that promise. He sold us on going all in on the playoffs this year and anything less was a failure, and we did not make a single notable personnel move since the start of the season despite being on the wrong side of the playoff cut line.

Broken and unfulfilled promises are defining this era of the Carolina Hurricanes, and front and center of that mindset is Ron Francis. He talks a good game, but he's too concerned with having a perfect arrangement of pawns to care that we have an exposed King, no queen, ineffective Rooks & Castles, and 4 too many Knights.
 

Sens1Canes2

Registered User
May 13, 2007
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So many metaphors!!!!

I’m with tarheel on this one...you’ve accumulated assets for this very purpose, when you have a chance to do something you haven’t done in a while, well, it’s time to try something different than “standing pat.”

I’m curious as to whether they were interested in Brassard. He wasn’t a rental and had a nice cap hit. Next year even if Necas was ready, Brassard could have played 2C and avoided the kid doing heavy lifting.

Anyways, not much of a bone thrown to the players OR the fans, some of whom just watched cheapskates like me take in 10 games for $97 while they paid full price. I don’t know. Something should have happened. The prices really weren’t that high.
 

Joe McGrath

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Oct 29, 2009
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I think Francis doesn't have a damn clue what it takes to take the franchise from where it is now to where it needs to be to be a legitimate contender. With or without Jordan, we're one of the poorest scoring teams in the Metro, with glaring weaknesses down the line. He promised us he was all in on getting a 1C leading into the 2017 offseason, and we're still waiting on him to make good on that promise. He sold us on going all in on the playoffs this year and anything less was a failure, and we did not make a single notable personnel move since the start of the season despite being on the wrong side of the playoff cut line.

Broken and unfulfilled promises are defining this era of the Carolina Hurricanes, and front and center of that mindset is Ron Francis. He talks a good game, but he's too concerned with having a perfect arrangement of pawns to care that we have an exposed King, no queen, ineffective Rooks & Castles, and 4 too many Knights.

You’re just making shit up at this point. You’re upset Francis didn’t fulfil goals he never said he had.

This season is a failure to be sure, but claiming he promised a 1C is just a complete fabrication.
 

tarheelhockey

Offside Review Specialist
Feb 12, 2010
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If he doesn't add significant scoring talent, and figure out the goalie situation, I don't think we'll have to worry about GMRF being around for the entire 2018-2019 season. Course, the current crop could turn it around, and put it all together, but I'm not holding my breath on that. Especially not Darling. I don't see any bounce back in him, but I'm a bit jaded right now. This team is more than a couple 3rd liners away from making it. Although, I surmise we'll see a lot of wishful thinking, and adding replacement level players. Setting a record for missing the playoffs in a league that's been around since 1917 doesn't look overly awesome, and the GM is ultimately responsible at the end of the day.

I think Vagrant had the right of it yesterday with this post:

as for the francis/peters speculation and the impact of new ownership, consider this scenario. you buy a team in a sport you know virtually nothing about and start crowd sourcing your new peers for insight. who in hockey can you see among owners that would be willing to say a negative word about ron francis? who among hockey executives period? who among anyone who has ever watched a hockey game? if the perception exists that francis has been neutered by financial inflexibility of the previous group, this year is a mulligan. if peters is indeed close to being fired, which is something highly doubtful in my estimation, it's an edict from francis and not ownership.... which is even less likely.

in fact, it would be concerning for me as a fan if dundon came out guns blazing and cleaned house. meddlesome wouldn't even begin to describe that when he doesn't even have a real basis for what constitutes success or failure in a venture that is entirely new to him. the situation is too nuanced for him to act that decisively in his first six months of ownership. plus, it's francis himself that is likely directing this crash course in hockey 101 with dundon. the human element involved there seems like job security at least in the immediate.

Francis has a sterling reputation in this league, and for good reason. The only things Tom Dundon knows about hockey are things that other people are telling him. Only one person can fire Francis, and that's Dundon. This adds up to Francis having a pretty long leash, especially considering he can point back to statements that this is only Year Four of the Five Year Plan.

This really isn't about Francis getting fired, IMO. It's about the tone he's setting for this organization long-term, the culture he's establishing here and the impact it's having on guys like Skinner and Faulk who have been spinning their wheels here for a long time. My fear is that we're going to end up with a team built around B-level stars like Aho/Slavin/Skinner/Faulk, and we're going to beat the **** out of them with losing until there's just nothing left to do but turn around and rebuild again in a few years. You look at organizations like Florida and Arizona and Edmonton where A-level prospects go to die, and that increasingly looks like the long term future of this organization.
 

The Stranger

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May 4, 2014
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I’m curious as to whether they were interested in Brassard. He wasn’t a rental and had a nice cap hit. Next year even if Necas was ready, Brassard could have played 2C and avoided the kid doing heavy lifting.

Anyways, not much of a bone thrown to the players OR the fans, some of whom just watched cheapskates like me take in 10 games for $97 while they paid full price. I don’t know. Something should have happened. The prices really weren’t that high.

RF gave up...RF is clueless...HFCanes is a tough crowd.

If you were RF, would you have sent the Canes 2018 1st, a prospect, and a roster player for Brassard?

The prices weren't that high...really...1st rounders for basically anyone half-decent...seems like standard TDL price premiums to me....a 1st 2nd and 3rd for Tatar...oy vey...he's just a bishop.
 

tarheelhockey

Offside Review Specialist
Feb 12, 2010
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RF gave up...RF is clueless...HFCanes is a tough crowd.

If you were RF, would you have sent the Canes 2018 1st, a prospect, and a roster player for Brassard?

The prices weren't that high...really...1st rounders for basically anyone half-decent...seems like standard TDL price premiums to me....a 1st 2nd and 3rd for Tatar...oy vey...he's just a bishop.

Mrazek for a 3rd and a 4th
Vanek for waiver players
Shore for a 7th
Morrow for a 4th
Wingels for a 4th
Maroon for a 3rd and a prospect
Stewart for free

These are not great players, but they're not heavy prices either. If these guys have ANY impact on the quality of our NHL roster, they've already outperformed all but a few 4th rounders in a given year. If they actually create competition and elevate passengers like Stempniak and Nordstrom, then they've paid off. And if we still miss the playoffs, at least there was some sort of effort made. Not a great effort, but AN effort.

The funny thing is, better teams than ours see these guys as valuable. But our weak-ass organization can afford to pass them up because we really need to see if Phil di Giuseppe can hold off Warren Foegele for the coveted position of "guy whose jersey you'll see in a Goodwill in 2021".
 
Last edited:

dogbazinho

Registered User
May 24, 2006
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Fairfax, VA
I've always said this about JR. I've never particularly liked his season by season "GMing" but he was a masterful in his approach to taking advantage of the introduction of a salary cap. He saw an opportunity and played it to a Stanley cup.

I felt Francis had a similar opportunity, albeit lesser, with expansion. I'm not sure it was his own inactivity or if we just couldn't make deals due to Vegas aggressively colluding with teams to prevent trades but it's his greatest missed opportunity. It's even more high-lighted when you look at the rare quality of tenders and we left with an expensive-ass backup.
 

Sens1Canes2

Registered User
May 13, 2007
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Mrazek for a 3rd and a 4th
Vanek for waiver players
Shore for a 7th
Morrow for a 4th
Wingels for a 4th
Maroon for a 3rd and a prospect
Stewart for free

These are not great players, but they're not heavy prices either. If these guys have ANY impact on the quality of our NHL roster, they've already outperformed all but a few 4th rounders in a given year. If they actually create competition and elevate passengers like Stempniak and Nordstrom, then they've paid off. And if we still make the playoffs, at least there was some sort of effort made. Not a great effort, but AN effort.

The funny thing is, better teams than ours see these guys as valuable. But our weak-ass organization can afford to pass them up because we really need to see if Phil di Giuseppe can hold off Warren Foegele for the coveted position of "guy whose jersey you'll see in a Goodwill in 2021".

I was going to reply to the poster who replied to me (Stranger, maybe?) but I might as well just do this

⬆️

Hartman and Tatar and a few others were expensive. The rest? Not really.
 

Sens1Canes2

Registered User
May 13, 2007
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8,292
RF gave up...RF is clueless...HFCanes is a tough crowd.

If you were RF, would you have sent the Canes 2018 1st, a prospect, and a roster player for Brassard?

The prices weren't that high...really...1st rounders for basically anyone half-decent...seems like standard TDL price premiums to me....a 1st 2nd and 3rd for Tatar...oy vey...he's just a bishop.

But I’ll reply to the Brassard question. I think the return from the Canes would have been a bit different, don’t you? A conceivably better 1st rounder than the Pens would have negated the impressiveness of the prospect. Maybe it could have been a 2nd if the prospect was BETTER than the Pens’. And the roster player was a throw in, Pittsburgh knew that Ottawa was flipping Cole. That was a salary cap thing. Point is, I’m just curious if the effort was made on Brassard, as he is an inexpensive and fairly decent 2C that was locked up for another year. And you could flip him next deadline for some good assets if it didn’t work out the way you thought.
 

Joe McGrath

Registered User
Oct 29, 2009
18,055
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I was going to reply to the poster who replied to me (Stranger, maybe?) but I might as well just do this

⬆️

Hartman and Tatar and a few others were expensive. The rest? Not really.

What good would any of those guys have done? Mrazek maybe but I doubt they had any interest in carrying 3 goalies.

The Canes don’t have a problem with lack of marginal players, they have a problem of a lack of really good players. None of those guys are difference makers and difference makers are what they need.
 

Joe McGrath

Registered User
Oct 29, 2009
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But I’ll reply to the Brassard question. I think the return from the Canes would have been a bit different, don’t you? A conceivably better 1st rounder than the Pens would have negated the impressiveness of the prospect. Maybe it could have been a 2nd if the prospect was BETTER than the Pens’. And the roster player was a throw in, Pittsburgh knew that Ottawa was flipping Cole. That was a salary cap thing. Point is, I’m just curious if the effort was made on Brassard, as he is an inexpensive and fairly decent 2C that was locked up for another year. And you could flip him next deadline for some good assets if it didn’t work out the way you thought.

I’m guessing an effort was made, Ottawa wanted a 1st, Francis wanted to lottery protect it, they said no and that was that. Brassard is exactly the kind of player they should have been in on.
 

Boom Boom Apathy

I am the Professor. Deal with it!
Sep 6, 2006
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The Canes don’t have a problem with lack of marginal players, they have a problem of a lack of really good players. None of those guys are difference makers and difference makers are what they need.

Outside of Mrazak, if Francis had gone after one of those guys listed, this thread would still be filled with complaints, just different complaints.
 

The Stranger

Registered User
May 4, 2014
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Mrazek for a 3rd and a 4th
Vanek for waiver players
Shore for a 7th
Morrow for a 4th
Wingels for a 4th
Maroon for a 3rd and a prospect
Stewart for free

Replacing Ryan or Stemp with Maroon or Vanek in the top 9 most likely would be an upgrade...would've been fun to see the trade and watch the new blood in the lineup...so I understand some of the frustration.
 

HisIceness

This is Hurricanes Hockey
Sep 16, 2010
40,117
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Charlotte
I would do the Evander Kane trade (1st, 4th and a bad prospect) in a heartbeart.

You know, I was fine when Francis stayed away in 2015 when all the rumors seemed to hinting that a Kane for ? trade was happening on our end.

Today though, with all the depth problems we have, I would have too. Off-ice issues and all he'd be here with a new owner who wants to win.
 

tarheelhockey

Offside Review Specialist
Feb 12, 2010
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What good would any of those guys have done? Mrazek maybe but I doubt they had any interest in carrying 3 goalies.

The Canes don’t have a problem with lack of marginal players, they have a problem of a lack of really good players. None of those guys are difference makers and difference makers are what they need.

It's true that they're marginal players, but again -- teams better than ours are finding spots for those guys. Are the Carolina Hurricanes such a powerhouse that they don't have space for players that are finding room in NJ, Columbus, Boston, Winnipeg?

Again, even if all those guys do is bring a bit of energy and competition, send a signal to the players and fans that we're making small consistent steps to improve, that's worth more than a flippin' 7th or a waiver claim fee.

Outside of Mrazak, if Francis had gone after one of those guys listed, this thread would still be filled with complaints, just different complaints.

And those complaints would have been warranted too -- but they wouldn't have been half so damning.
 

Boom Boom Apathy

I am the Professor. Deal with it!
Sep 6, 2006
48,174
97,101
And those complaints would have been warranted too -- but they wouldn't have been half so damning.

Bullshit. I guarantee they would have been as much, if not more damning. We would have heard: "LOL, Francis too scared to make a big deal." "Great, when other teams are adding real talent, we're going dumpster diving." "We need a top 6 playmaking center, and Francis spends a 7th round pick on a 4th liner." and "Great, more waiver wire trash keeping Zykov, Saarela, Foegele, Wallmark from coming up and helping this team." etc, etc, etc...

I have no issue with the complaints. People are rightfully frustrated. Francis didn't fix the goalie situation (again), and didn't give this team enough talent to not be in this position at the deadline in the first place. But let's not act like if Francis traded a 7th round pick for Shore, we wouldn't have heard as much, if not more complaining, because we all know it would have been the case.
 

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