Series Talk: WCSF Vancouver Canucks vs Edmonton Oilers. (Series tied 3-3)

[Leonardo87]

Vancouver Canucks vs Edmonton Oilers
WCSF

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[Sergei Shirokov]

Seems like the EDM side is scapegoating Skinner a bit for last night. I get he's been bad in the series & frustration is mounting, but last night was as much on the skaters as him. McDavid & Foegele gift Boeser A+ chances & the Canucks held the Oilers to 0 goals @ 5v5.

Not sure how smart it was for Knoblauch to basically put it all on Skinner in the post-game. But as an opponent by all means mess with your goalies head.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Vancouver is kinda mid needs to injure Mcdavid in order to win

Dang. Given that he's totally fine I guess the Canucks are doomed.

 

[Chairman Maouth]

This was just a vote on respect of the Canucks. The lower the number , the less respect.

Can't disagree with that.

A few nights ago TNT did a report about the four playoff teams remaining in the West. They went into detail about Dallas, Colorado and Edmonton. After those three teams were covered they said, "...plus there's the Vancouver Canucks." That's all.-- like the Canucks are an inconsequential afterthought. Now up in the series 2-1 over the Stanley Cup favourites, maybe they won't be an afterthought anymore.

 

[mriswith]

If only Soucy had nutshotted him, aimed a high stick at his face and cut his face open and then slewfoot McDavid instead of trying to cross check his chest, that would have been fine as per precedent this series.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

The Oilers should consider getting Ryan Reaves in the offseason, even if they end up going on to win this series.

You can't argue with the amazing performance he had in the playoffs as a deterrent. Sure, he might be a bit pricey, but I think the Oilers can afford to take some of their money out of their goaltending budget to get someone who will ensure McDavid can hack and wack with impunity.

Plus, it'd be like the good ole days. Remember Semenko?

 

[Filthy Dangles]

OT but I love when the Oilers get scored on at home because Gangsters Paradise on the Organ might be the best arena sound in the NHL.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Anyhoo enough about the scrum at the end of the game, how about that Silovs kid!
What a story so far!

 

[ManofSteel55]

If only Soucy had nutshotted him, aimed a high stick at his face and cut his face open and then slewfoot McDavid instead of trying to cross check his chest, that would have been fine as per precedent this series.

As if both teams haven't been doing all sorts of dirty crap to one another. Take off the blinders, your coach wanted fewer penalties called. They're calling fewer penalties.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Your panties are showing.

I see you switched shampoo brands.

Nice stealth edit btw.

 

[Perfect_Drug]

Seems like the EDM side is scapegoating Skinner a bit for last night. I get he's been bad in the series & frustration is mounting, but last night was as much on the skaters as him. McDavid & Foegele gift Boeser A+ chances & the Canucks held the Oilers to 0 goals @ 5v5.

Not sure how smart it was for Knoblauch to basically put it all on Skinner in the post-game. But as an opponent by all means mess with your goalies head.

You realise all hockey games have several A+ chances right?
A goalies job is to save a few of them.

Skinner does not save a single one of them. He has the lowest Expected save% in the league by a landslide right now. The advanced stats are showing he is currently one of the worst goalies in the past 20 years when they started tracking shot quality.

He has poor positioning, poor mechanics, and poor reads. He doesn't cut angles, he doesn't challenge, and doesn't know when or how to poke, or be aggressive. I know its an easy narrative because defensive breakdowns? But EVERY goal ever scored is a defensive breakdown.



But I challenge you to show me a SINGLE save Skinner made this series that was post-to-post, or one that was spectacular. Show me a single video where he saves a shot that was destined to go in.

Even the best defensive teams occasionally allows a breakway.
Imagine EVERY breakaway is an automatic goal now. Imagine a goalie that can not save a single breakaway in an entire playoff series. That's currently how Skinner is playing.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

You realise all hockey games have several A+ chances right?
A goalies job is to save a few of them.

Skinner does not save a single one of them. He has the lowest Expected save% in the league by a landslide right now. The advanced stats are showing he is currently one of the worst goalies in the past 20 years when they started tracking shot quality.


He has poor positioning, poor mechanics, and poor reads. He doesn't cut angles, he doesn't challenge, and doesn't know when or how to poke, or be aggressive.

He's a battler, though. He just needs to battle through this.

His compete level is off the charts and I think the worst thing the Oilers coach could do is not give him a vote of confidence and stick with his guy.

 

[ManofSteel55]

I see you switched shampoo brands.

Nice stealth edit btw.

I edited it because I realized it was a tasteless and unfair comment. Nothing stealthy about it, I just changed it because it wasn't a fair comment to make and isn't productive for the conversation. I shouldn't have posted it at all, but I did, regretted it, and edited it. That's what the edit button is for.

Not sure what the shampoo comment is in relation to though.

 

[YippieKaey]

Something that stood out to me:

How much the bench was celebrating the Zad penalty for tossing Kane over the boards. It’s almost like they knew it’s the only way to score and they had achieved a way to balance the scoring.

Then the reaction to the bench minor and all of them complaining when they realized they had to score 4 on 4 or 5 on 5.

No more smiles. Insane team culture.

Yeah and Kane had that "the joy of duping" smile people get when they get away with wrongdoings. Im pretty sure the refs saw that and decided to call a bench minor for it.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Not sure what the shampoo comment is in relation to though.

You being able to see their panties.

 

[ManofSteel55]

You being able to see their panties.

View attachment 870159

Interesting that the ones crying about penalties and the NHL playing favorites all the time are the same ones accusing of people crying.

 

[GrumpyKoala]

He's a battler, though. He just needs to battle through this.

His compete level is off the charts and I think the worst thing the Oilers coach could do is not give him a vote of confidence and stick with his guy.

He's perfect

 

[PuckG]

The intent is benign. It's a scrum. A scrum that Mcbaby escalates. It's an unfortunate outcome, sure.

The other incidents I mentioned have far more malicious intent. That is simply a fact.

What are you even talking about?

You’re the one that brought up intent when you brought up Trouba’s intended elbow in your examples.

You’re not even remembering your own points in your hurry to whine about McDavid.

 

[Mafic]

Summarized my thoughts in the hearing thread:

This is how I saw it as well.

As the buzzer goes, Soucy is engaging McDavid behind the net.

1. Soucy pushes McDavid
View attachment 869917

2. Off balance, McDavid winds up for a slash
View attachment 869918

3. McDavid follows through with the slash to Soucy's leg with some force, but clearly held back from what he could have done. View attachment 869919

4. Soucy responds with a chop to McDavid's leg.
View attachment 869921

5. Soucy continues the scrum by winding up for a crosscheck to McDavid's chest. Meanwhile, Zadorov takes exception to seeing his partner slashed after the buzzer and gives McDavid a crosscheck from behind.
It appears Soucy's original crosscheck was heading toward the white horizontal stripe on McDavid's jersey.
View attachment 869924


6. McDavid, not expecting a check to the back, crumples as Soucy throws his crosscheck. Soucy's crosscheck appears to connect around the chin/neck.
View attachment 869925




Ultimately, this feels like an unfortunate series of events in a scrum after the buzzer. I think McDavid and Soucy's actions are kind of a wash in playoff hockey. If you slash a guy after the buzzer, expect physical retribution. I expect the refs may have taken both players if this happened during play.
Zadorov as the 3rd man in is the problem. His crosscheck to McDavid's back is certainly worth a penalty, and he has been fined as a result.

For a suspension to be warranted, I would want to see an intentional crosscheck aimed at McDavid's chin/neck. McDavid falling while Soucy is throwing a crosscheck at McDavid's chest happens in less than a second, so I think you have to give Soucy a bit of the benefit of the doubt here.

This is a tough review for the DOPS, but I guess the suspension is due to the outcome rather than the act. This appears to be a normal, albeit heated playoff scrum if McDavid is not knocked from behind by Zadorov. McDavid falls as Soucy is throwing the crosscheck, and Soucy has no time to react.

Soucy's crosscheck is generally a penalty. McDavid's slash is also generally a penalty, and in this case it's the primary incident that starts the scrum. Not because it was a particularly dangerous slash that warranted a crosscheck, but because the game was over and it's a petty and unsportsmanlike act. Of course that's going to get a response from the Canucks, it would be disappointing if it didn't.

I think if this happens during a normal stoppage in play, Oilers end up on the powerplay, score, and we move on. Either Zadorov goes off for a crosscheck, or Zadorov and Soucy go off for crosschecks along with McDavid for the slash (or Hyman for the 4th-man in crosscheck).

After the hit, Soucy completely stops engaging with the scrum, attempts to help McDavid up. You can see him talking and probably apologizing with an arm around him seconds after the hit. I'm sure Soucy was more than happy to get physical with McDavid, but it's pretty clear that the outcome of catching McDavid around the neck was an accident.
Kudos to McDavid for bouncing back after that. For the comments on diving - really? What would he gain at this point? McDavid is not expecting a hit from behind and understandably falls.

A suspension should send a message to the offender and the league that an illegal play will not be tolerated and will be punished. I think the problem with this suspension is that it isn't discouraging crosschecking a guy to the neck - that outcome was clearly unintentional and the result of the victim taking a hit from the 3rd man in and suddenly falling too fast for the offender to react.
In effect, this suspension happens because a star gets hit in the neck, and if anything, it feels like it discourages players from defending themselves in a physical playoff series if they get slashed after the final buzzer.

 

[Rowlet]

While we're working this all out, Hyman also cross checked someone in the head

 

[jackjohnson]

Can't disagree with that.

A few nights ago TNT did a report about the four playoff teams remaining in the West. They went into detail about Dallas, Colorado and Edmonton. After those three teams were covered they said, "...plus there's the Vancouver Canucks." That's all.-- like the Canucks are an inconsequential afterthought. Now up in the series 2-1 over the Stanley Cup favourites, maybe they won't be an afterthought anymore.

I hope Vancouver keeps going further just to prove the experts and naysayers wrong. It would be glorious. Imagine if they ever won the cup this year, i know am just dreaming but HFboard will have a meltdown lol

 

[cotillion]

hockey players playin hockey

 

[abo9]

but no money to address the needs and Leon in 12months away from UFA and McDavid 24

I didn't say that there's no need to be addressed.

But what are they gonna blow up? They already have 9 UFA (including 7 forwards UFA).

Of the other "main" forwards:
- McDavid and Draisaitl you don't trade
- Hyman, RNH are on solid contracts and play solid hockey
- Bourgeault, Holloway they probably need

Leaves McLeod, Kane, Ryan. Hardly blow up worthy.

On D
- Nurse is untreadable
- Bouchard has warts but he's a 3.9M AAV, point-per-game defenseman
- They shouldnt trade Ekholm

Trading Ceci, Kulak is hardly worthy to be called a "blow up". But they're expensive.

On G,
- Skinner sucks in the playoffs, but he's also paid like a backup.
- They gotta get rid of Campbell lol

TLDR:
Their main cast is good and worth the money. Nurse and Campbell are untradeable. Kane might be...

 

[jackjohnson]

The Oilers should consider getting Ryan Reaves in the offseason, even if they end up going on to win this series.

You can't argue with the amazing performance he had in the playoffs as a deterrent. Sure, he might be a bit pricey, but I think the Oilers can afford to take some of their money out of their goaltending budget to get someone who will ensure McDavid can hack and wack with impunity.

Plus, it'd be like the good ole days. Remember Semenko?

Reaves would be a positive for the opponents, especially Canucks who will run circles around Reaves

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Interesting that the ones crying about penalties and the NHL playing favorites all the time are the same ones accusing of people crying.

The only thing I've really said is that the hearing (and possible suspension) is star player tax. Same shit would've happened if it were Crosby, Bedard, MacKinnon, Matthews, etc.

I said in the previous thread that things are going to get chippy and tempers are going to start to flare and it was my hope that it'd be the Oilers and not the Canucks (notably Miller as he's prolly the most emotional guy on the team.)

Banter and jokes aside, I think way too much is being made of the Soucy 'hit' and hyperanalyzing everything that's gone on in the series. IMO, there's been blown or soft calls for both teams and the officiating in general has been shit.

The series is a team with 2 upper echelon players going up against a mid-tier team whose talent ceiling isn't quite as high. If Edmonton had depth or even a serviceable goalie (which is something I had been saying since like...February or March) I doubt the games would be as close as they have been.

But the Canucks are hanging in there and are doing a good job at limiting McDavid's opportunities. They can't hope to stop him, just contain him, as the saying goes.

The fact that elements of the Oilers fanbase have been seething literally all season over the Canucks being hack frauds despite winning all games in the regular season against them, making the playoffs, winning the division and winning a playoff series and now 2 more games against the Oilers is what's made this so silly.

I do think the pressure is getting to Edmonton. There needs to be a big response from them tomorrow -- on the scoresheet, not by dressing the fourth line or whatever -- and try and get momentum back.

It's still anyone's series, but I'm not the one making misogynistic comments (and later deleting them.)

 

[arttk]

Reaves would be a positive for the opponents, especially Canucks who will run circles around Reaves

let's be clear, almost everyone run circles around Reaves.