WBS Penguins 2017-18 Season Thread: Pens out in first round, black aces are up

[Gurglesons]

I'm not sure why he's getting scratched. Judging from Sully's comments it's about how he supports the play, and Donatelli's comments seem to suggest that. They like their call-ups to play a certain way whether we like it or not, and I imagine they're trying to drill that into Sprong.

He's probably wondering why a plug like Jooris (1 point in 4 AHL games) is getting the call too...so maybe scratching him after a game when he scored is trying to highlight that it's not just about production.

I don’t know why he is getting scratched, but our AHL team has been extremely effective at developing players over the last four years so I feel like they know what they are doing.

 

[Peat]

I don’t know why he is getting scratched, but our AHL team has been extremely effective at developing players over the last four years so I feel like they know what they are doing.

Yup.

That's how I feel.

However, I also feel that maybe with Sprong they're trying to get him to play a game that isn't his, and he'll either crash and burn not learning it, or end up somewhere else and be extremely effective when playing his own game.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I don’t know why he is getting scratched, but our AHL team has been extremely effective at developing players over the last four years so I feel like they know what they are doing.

For sure. But Sprong is a different sort of prospect than WBS has churned out for us.

What made Sprong such an exciting prospect is that he's a pure sniper, rather than a plucky burner or a cerebral offensive guy. As skilled as Guentzel is, he still fits the latter mold. We'll see if a finesse player like Sprong can come up the same way.

 

[Andy99]

For sure. But Sprong is a different sort of prospect than WBS has churned out for us.

What made Sprong such an exciting prospect is that he's a pure sniper, rather than a plucky burner or a cerebral offensive guy. As skilled as Guentzel is, he still fits the latter mold. We'll see if a finesse player like Sprong can come up the same way.

Yep...my worry is that they are trying to turn a Kessel-type into Kuhnackl....they should just be trying to fine tune the offensive details of his game to make him a better sniper. Forget defense. He’ll get there eventually as he matures. Next year he just needs to be an effective shooter to help us. That’s what he should focus on. Forget the rest....there are plenty of other players playing in the nhl who can score but aren’t good away from the puck ......

 

[thecore]

It’s really hard to handle players like Sprong from a developmental standpoint. Look at Drouin. He was the best player on the ice at time two years ago in the playoffs and now he’s sucking. IMO, the penguins are smart to let him work through some ups and downs in the AHL. But if they think they can mold him into Marian Hossa, they will ruin him. And more practically, they don’t have the time for him to develop that much. He has to be on the roster next year. His development should be centered around what it takes to play with Crosby or Malkin next year.

 

[Gurglesons]

For sure. But Sprong is a different sort of prospect than WBS has churned out for us.

What made Sprong such an exciting prospect is that he's a pure sniper, rather than a plucky burner or a cerebral offensive guy. As skilled as Guentzel is, he still fits the latter mold. We'll see if a finesse player like Sprong can come up the same way.

I’d argue Kapanen had a similar skill set to Sprong when drafted and look like Toronto has turned him into.

The Penguins as an organization win because even players like Sheary and Jake can play 200 ft game. If Sprong wants to play here, put up or shut up.

Look at Kessel.

 

[Andy99]

I’d argue Kapanen had a similar skill set to Sprong when drafted and look like Toronto has turned him into.

The Penguins as an organization win because even players like Sheary and Jake can play 200 ft game. If Sprong wants to play here, put up or shut up.

Look at Kessel.

Kessel rarely has played a 200foot game here...POs and earlier this year before he was injured. That’s it. I can’t believe you put Sheary and 200-foot game in the same sentence....lol....he’s been benched too many times to count, only exceeded by the amount of times the guy falls down and loses a board battle....

 

[Gurglesons]

Kessel rarely has played a 200foot game here...POs and earlier this year before he was injured. That’s it. I can’t believe you put Sheary and 200-foot game in the same sentence....lol....he’s been benched too many times to count, only exceeded by the amount of times the guy falls down and loses a board battle....

This is simply not true. Sheary and Kessel both back check, get in the corners and play both sides of the ice.

They don’t just float around and snap pucks.

 

[Andy99]

This is simply not true. Sheary and Kessel both back check, get in the corners and play both sides of the ice.

They don’t just float around and snap pucks.

Sprong didn’t do that either when he played here in January. Go watch those games again...very little floating. His bigger problem was getting open offensively to take a shot....

 

[Gurglesons]

Sprong didn’t do that either when he played here in January. Go watch those games again...very little floating. His bigger problem was getting open offensively to take a shot....

I’ll take the coaching staff that is making him watch x and os from the press box over an eight game stretch.

 

[vikingGoalie]

I dunno, but I really hope they don't screw him up. It's totally maddening to me that Connor Sheary can get chance after chance with never eating a nacho, have a HUGE dry spell scoring, AND be horrible defensively. Don't get me wrong, Sheary can be an effective player he's shown that to us. But he simply has not played that way for much of the season.
Then you get Sprong, who actually played defensively better then advertised. Who showed some elite flashes, but then wasn't shooting the puck as much as he should. All over the course of 8 games and somehow that's enough seen to send him the A until next season. Granted Sheary is a finished product, and t 20 year old Sprong is not. But a talented finisher is something that no other prospect that we've developed has had. So whether we can successfully develop one of those is yet to be seen.

I still have my money on a personality conflict between the coach and D.S. is the reason why he's not on the big club. Same reason we no longer have Ian Cole on the team. Granted Ian is not *the* reason we might fail for 3 cups in a row. But our team is definitely better with him on the team rather then Sheary.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I’d argue Kapanen had a similar skill set to Sprong when drafted and look like Toronto has turned him into.

The Penguins as an organization win because even players like Sheary and Jake can play 200 ft game. If Sprong wants to play here, put up or shut up.

Look at Kessel.

The issue is whether WBS can work with a player like Sprong, not whether Toronto can, and I don't think we can count KK as any kind of success story yet regardless. I wouldn't exactly be over the moon if Sprong scored 8 points in 29 games from the 4th line next year.

And Sheary does not play a 200 foot game. He's poor defensively, which is kind of the point.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

It’s really hard to handle players like Sprong from a developmental standpoint. Look at Drouin. He was the best player on the ice at time two years ago in the playoffs and now he’s sucking. IMO, the penguins are smart to let him work through some ups and downs in the AHL. But if they think they can mold him into Marian Hossa, they will ruin him. And more practically, they don’t have the time for him to develop that much. He has to be on the roster next year. His development should be centered around what it takes to play with Crosby or Malkin next year.

Drouin doesn't suck. He's not a good center though.

 

[RizzleMcRib]

I dunno, but I really hope they don't screw him up. It's totally maddening to me that Connor Sheary can get chance after chance with never eating a nacho, have a HUGE dry spell scoring, AND be horrible defensively. Don't get me wrong, Sheary can be an effective player he's shown that to us. But he simply has not played that way for much of the season.
Then you get Sprong, who actually played defensively better then advertised. Who showed some elite flashes, but then wasn't shooting the puck as much as he should. All over the course of 8 games and somehow that's enough seen to send him the A until next season. Granted Sheary is a finished product, and t 20 year old Sprong is not. But a talented finisher is something that no other prospect that we've developed has had. So whether we can successfully develop one of those is yet to be seen.

I still have my money on a personality conflict between the coach and D.S. is the reason why he's not on the big club. Same reason we no longer have Ian Cole on the team. Granted Ian is not *the* reason we might fail for 3 cups in a row. But our team is definitely better with him on the team rather then Sheary.

What offensive flashes was he showing? He wasn't getting shots on net. Other than the 1 game where he had 3 points, he wasn't responsible for any of the other 11 points Crosby had while he was up. So I don't know where these offensive flashes are coming from.

 

[Gurglesons]

The issue is whether WBS can work with a player like Sprong, not whether Toronto can, and I don't think we can count KK as any kind of success story yet regardless. I wouldn't exactly be over the moon if Sprong scored 8 points in 29 games from the 4th line next year.

And Sheary does not play a 200 foot game. He's poor defensively, which is kind of the point.

Point about Kapanen is they had him build his game to a point where he can PK, and be used as a fourth liner while still having his offensive predigree. 8 points in 29 games on the fourth line is decent enough.

I think a lot of the issue with the treatment come from this unrealistic expectation that he’d suddenly be a twenty goal scorer if played up here.

On the Sheary note let’s agree to disagree. I don’t think his defensive chops are what make him a liability.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Point about Kapanen is they had him build his game to a point where he can PK, and be used as a fourth liner while still having his offensive predigree. 8 points in 29 games on the fourth line is decent enough.

I think a lot of the issue with the treatment come from this unrealistic expectation that he’d suddenly be a twenty goal scorer if played up here.

Kap always had that defensive component to his game though. He's Sami's son, and it was in contemporary scouting reports.

I would be disappointed if Sprong came onto the Pens and was used in anything like Kap's role, or had Kap's production.

On the Sheary note let’s agree to disagree. I don’t think his defensive chops are what make him a liability.

We definitely disagree. This is the very first I've ever seen or heard of Sheary having a 200 ft game.

 

[Gurglesons]

Kap always had that defensive component to his game though. He's Sami's son, and it was in contemporary scouting reports.

I would be disappointed if Sprong came onto the Pens and was used in anything like Kap's role, or had Kap's production.


We definitely disagree. This is the very first I've ever seen or heard of Sheary having a 200 ft game.

Sheary plays the boards and backchecks. I don’t think you can point to a player in our top nine that doesn’t. Obviously players like Hagelin and Rust or the best at it, but there is a reason Sheary was able to handle first line duty under Sullivan.

I also think it is funny a lot of the complaints regarding Sheary are centered around him basically doing one thing and one thing well and the argument is we replace him with Sprong.

 

[Peat]

I think a lot of the issue with the treatment come from this unrealistic expectation that he’d suddenly be a twenty goal scorer if played up here.

Well, he is on a twenty goal season pace in the NHL

 

[Gurglesons]

Well, he is on a twenty goal season pace in the NHL

And I’d be really happy with that. I think most people see that as a baseline in terms of production though. If Sprong could be like a 35 point winger that hits high teens in goals while playing with Malkin or Crosby, I’d be stoked.

Honestly, I get the idea of bringing him up, but when it comes down to it we have three top nine RWers in Hornqvist, Rust, and Kessel that should all be playing in the top nine as RWers.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Sheary plays the boards and backchecks. I don’t think you can point to a player in our top nine that doesn’t. Obviously players like Hagelin and Rust or the best at it, but there is a reason Sheary was able to handle first line duty under Sullivan.

I can say without any hesitation that Sheary is our worst defensive forward presently on the roster. He's a defensive non-factor.

He does support the play well though, even if he's falling down and/or losing possession because somebody breathed on him most of the time, which is why he's getting those looks.

I also think it is funny a lot of the complaints regarding Sheary are centered around him basically doing one thing and one thing well and the argument is we replace him with Sprong.

If Sheary was actually doing that one thing well, it wouldn't be an issue. The problem is that he isn't, which means he's doing no things well.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

And I’d be really happy with that. I think most people see that as a baseline in terms of production though. If Sprong could be like a 35 point winger that hits high teens in goals while playing with Malkin or Crosby, I’d be stoked.

Honestly, I get the idea of bringing him up, but when it comes down to it we have three top nine RWers in Hornqvist, Rust, and Kessel that should all be playing in the top nine as RWers.

Rust looked better on 3LW the last few games than he's looked on Sid's RW at any point this year.

 

[RizzleMcRib]

I can say without any hesitation that Sheary is our worst defensive forward presently on the roster. He's a defensive non-factor.

He does support the play well though, even if he's falling down and/or losing possession because somebody breathed on him most of the time, which is why he's getting those looks.



If Sheary was actually doing that one thing well, it wouldn't be an issue. The problem is that he isn't, which means he's doing no things well.

Neither was Sprong, but you can bury Sheary on the 4th line unlike Sprong.

 

[Gurglesons]

He does support the play well though, even if he's falling down and/or losing possession because somebody breathed on him most of the time, which is why he's getting those looks.

If Sheary was actually doing that one thing well, it wouldn't be an issue. The problem is that he isn't, which means he's doing no things well.

See, I agree 100%, I wouldn’t say Sheary has trouble following the play and at least being in the spot to make the appropriate play. His issue is execution and falling down.

And I agree, I would try out Sprong. I just think it is funny people want to simply swap the players. If I’m a Pens fan I’m way more excited by what Simon and ZAR have shown me in NHL minutes than Sprong.

 

[Peat]

And I’d be really happy with that. I think most people see that as a baseline in terms of production though. If Sprong could be like a 35 point winger that hits high teens in goals while playing with Malkin or Crosby, I’d be stoked.

Honestly, I get the idea of bringing him up, but when it comes down to it we have three top nine RWers in Hornqvist, Rust, and Kessel that should all be playing in the top nine as RWers.

Not if Kessel gets his own line, Horny is stapled to Geno, and Rust continues to splutter with Sid.

Part of me wonders if, when fit, ZAR and Rust could emulate Hags and Horny with Geno, allowing Horny to go back with Sid and putting Hags with Brassard and Kessel. And I'm not just suggesting this to blow up KIRK's brain if he ever sees this.

In any case, I don't see a lot more to say about Sprong. I just hope he's not 13th forward here next season, or it's gonna get mental...

 

[Turin]

So who here actually watches Sprong in Wilkes-Barre?