TSN Top-50 Players

[KingKhron]

I'm waiting for sportsnet or something to put Matthews at like 25 and all of a sudden "the media experts have spoken"

I wouldn't freak out if they did and I won't freak out because he's rated 8th. Some people tend to have more of a wait to see linear development mindset and some expect it. I don't want to really get in an actual debate with anyone about this but take someone like Hedman for example. I would have no problem if someone was to rate him higher than Matthews right now. He's an incredible player and I've seen him be the best player in a Stanley Cup Final that they lost(again, just my opinion). Would that really matter? People treat the difference of 10th to 30th as if it's an epic downgrade but Benn and Seguin would be near the top two years ago, dropped a fair bit after last year and I think will get right back to the top after this season. Does that mean they're different players at all in that timespan? Not really.

 

[LeafFever]

I wonder how much McKenzie knows about hockey. He's the best insider in the game but I've never heard him speak about systems or anything that would fall under the umbrella of a "hockey mind". Don't get me wrong, I imagine he knows plenty but I'm just curious how extensive his hockey knowledge is. Some media are former players and would have a knowledge of the science of hockey and the dynamics of a dressing room far beyond most here but they also say the most mind numbing crap you've ever heard from someone on a sports channel, so their intelligence seems highly questionable too. Looking at you, Jeff O'Neill.

I think Mackenzie is careful more than most in giving his opinion. He only wants to state what he knows or has heard. He never presents himself as some hockey expert.

 

[KingKhron]

I think Mackenzie is careful more than most in giving his opinion. He only wants to state what he knows or has heard. He never presents himself as some hockey expert.

He's my favourite and TSN should hold on to him with a death grip because he brings them great respect as they lose the financial battle for relevance. Just never actually thought about the fact he doesn't seem to wax philosophic about systems a coach employs or things of the like too often. Not likely interesting to others but it was for me. Probably should have kept it to myself due to that likelihood haha.

 

[Pi]

Wow the NHL Network is even more biased than Toronto Sports Network writers. They have Matthews at 8.

Is there a catchy fake acronym we can give the NHLN like we have for TSN?

 

[LeafFever]

Wow the NHL Network is even more biased than Toronto Sports Network writers. They have Matthews at 8.

Is there a catchy fake acronym we can give the NHLN like we have for TSN?

It can't be that Leaf players are good. It has to be that people are biased.
People will not be happy unless there are 0 Leaf players in the top 50.

 

[KingKhron]

Wow the NHL Network is even more biased than Toronto Sports Network writers. They have Matthews at 8.

Is there a catchy fake acronym we can give the NHLN like we have for TSN?

One day the Nico Hischier Love Network but it's too soon.

 

[Pi]

It can't be that Leaf players are good. It has to be that people are biased.
People will not be happy unless there are 0 Leaf players in the top 50.

You know what’s funny? The guy that isn’t even on either lists is likely going to put up 75-80 points this season.

 

[KingKhron]

It can't be that Leaf players are good. It has to be that people are biased.
People will not be happy unless there are 0 Leaf players in the top 50.

I think you're overreacting. The mainboards is a place for trolls to pop up and you're feeding them plenty. I don't think you have to be so defensive for your players. All good truths come out in the end. Only a fool would think Matthews isn't an amazing player with an incredible ceiling. Let someone come in a say he's too high or x player is better. Just be comfortable in what you believe.

 

[Gurilla]

Matthews is a great player but there's no way he should be in the top 10 yet. He's becoming overrated.

 

[KingKhron]

You know what’s funny? The guy that isn’t even on either lists is likely going to put up 75-80 points this season.

Maybe. People thought RNH would one day be a 80-90 point center one day when he put up 52 points in 62 games as a rookie. This game will always find a way to surprise you.

 

[LeafFever]

Matthews is a great player but there's no way he should be in the top 10 yet. He's becoming overrated.

You don't think he should be top 10 for 2017-18 season? Why?

 

[LeafFever]

I think you're overreacting. The mainboards is a place for trolls to pop up and you're feeding them plenty. I don't think you have to be so defensive for your players. All good truths come out in the end. Only a fool would think Matthews isn't an amazing player with an incredible ceiling. Let someone come in a say he's too high or x player is better. Just be comfortable in what you believe.

It's more than this place. There is media outside Toronto with articles about a big bias and we hear it everywhere. It getrs tiresome and is untrue.
A Leaf wins an award for the first time in 25 years. The fix is in!

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

I know McDavid is the new flavour of the generation, but he hasn't touched Crosby. Malkin should push everyone down and slot third, which would push Matthews out of the top ten. He deserves to be in the conversation yet isn't quite top ten imo. Kessel not being on this list reeks of Toronto bias though. He was fantastic this prior season but doesn't even make the top 50? Ridiculous.

 

[VanIslander]

Matthews is a great player but there's no way he should be in the top 10 yet. He's becoming overrated.

40 goals for a 19 year old who scored 32 at even strength (the NHL most!!) and 279 shots taken his rookie season, on a team with other young stars expected to also improve in the coming year, with Marleau added to the powerplay... only better results are forecasted!

 

[Gurilla]

You don't think he should be top 10 for 2017-18 season? Why?

I don't doubt he'll get there soon, but right now guys like Tavares and Doughty are both better.

 

[LeafFever]

40 goals for a 19 year old who scored 32 at even strength (the NHL most!!) and a staggering 279 shots taken his rookie season, on a team with other young stars expected to also improve in the coming year, with Marleau added to the powerplay... only better results are forecasted!

All the stats say he should be top 10.
That even stregth stat is quite mind-boggling in today's game. People on here are biased.

 

[LeafFever]

I don't doubt he'll get there soon, but right now guys like Tavares and Doughty are both better.

Do you understand that it's based on what will happen this season? They are saying he'll be better than those 2. What is wrong with that? Look what he did at 19.

 

[LeafFever]

I know McDavid is the new flavour of the generation, but he hasn't touched Crosby. Malkin should push everyone down and slot third, which would push Matthews out of the top ten. He deserves to be in the conversation yet isn't quite top ten imo. Kessel not being on this list reeks of Toronto bias though. He was fantastic this prior season but doesn't even make the top 50? Ridiculous.

LOL now Kessel not being on the top 50 list is Toronto bias? He was PPG with Bozak and barely cracked the top 50 when he was on Toronto. How do you expect him to make it with worse stats playing with better players in Pittsburgh?
Kessel had a run of being a top 5 NHL scorer over 5 full seasons and still barely made the list.
I'm not understanding how you can claim it's a Toronto bias. The guy was horribly underrated on Toronto. It's not like he was top 10 in Toronto. He was always in the 40's the few times he made it.

He was fantastic according to you. He had 70 points. He had 82 in Toronto playing with Bozak. So it does make sense he drops rather than rises on the list. That equals being out of the top 50.

 

[KingKhron]

It's more than this place. There is media outside Toronto with articles about a big bias and we hear it everywhere. It getrs tiresome and is untrue.
A Leaf wins an award for the first time in 25 years. The fix is in!

Well, understand that the rest of the country gets to hear how Jeff O'Neill would take Matthews over McDavid without question or an article about the leagues crackdown and then they interview Matthews, Babcock, etc. about it and on and on. Hey, it's the nature of market economics and I get it but you can see that it breeds resentment in other fan bases, which in turn causes them to lash out at the Leafs, which causes Leafs fans to be defensive and fight back. It's just an ugly cycle really.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

People on here know more than Bob Mackenzie?

These lists aren't comprised of a single opinion. In fact, Ray Ferraro vehemently disagreed, on-air, when McDavid was ranked 35th without having played a single game at the NHL level. These lists often bring in journalists or commentators with little "expert" knowledge beyond recent trends. It's why Toews constantly beat out Malkin despite it making little to no sense based on their respective abilities or the seasons in question. Another factor is what importance each person places on certain attitudes. Many people here, for instance, value defense statistics or a balanced package over flashy offense when ranking defensemen hence the disparity between where Karlsson, Subban, Doughty, Burns and etc. place.

 

[LeafFever]

Well, understand that the rest of the country gets to hear how Jeff O'Neill would take Matthews over McDavid without question or an article about the leagues crackdown and then they interview Matthews, Babcock, etc. about it and on and on. Hey, it's the nature of market economics and I get it but you can see that it breeds resentment in other fan bases, which in turn causes them to lash out at the Leafs, which causes Leafs fans to be defensive and fight back. It's just an ugly cycle really.

Is that more ridiculous than hearing John Garrett pick the Canucks to win the cup every single year? Have you listened to the crap that comes out of some areas outside of Toronto?
Saying Matthews is better is not really as controversial as you are making it out to be. The biggest homer BY FAR on TSN last year was Gary Lawless-A Jets fan from Winnipeg.

 

[LeafFever]

These lists aren't comprised of a single opinion. In fact, Ray Ferraro vehemently disagreed, on-air, when McDavid was ranked 35th without having played a single game at the NHL level. These lists often bring in journalists or commentators with little "expert" knowledge beyond recent trends. It's why Toews constantly beat out Malkin despite it making little to no sense based on their respective abilities or the seasons in question. Another factor is what importance each person places on certain attitudes. Many people here, for instance, value defense statistics or a balanced package over flashy offense when ranking defensemen hence the disparity between where Karlsson, Subban, Doughty, Burns and etc. place.

People on here horribly overrate defensive play. I have xseen it over and over.
In fact, before the Toews backlash there were plenty of people arguing Toews was better "Overall" than Crosby. And Karlsson was laughably underrated until they could not make the embarrsaing "Defensive" arguments anymore.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

LOL now Kessel not being on the top 50 list is Toronto bias? He was PPG with Bozak and barely cracked the top 50 when he was on Toronto. How do you expect him to make it with worse stats playing with better players in Pittsburgh?
Kessel had a run of being a top 5 NHL scorer over 5 full seasons and still barely made the list.
I'm not understanding how you can claim it's a Toronto bias. The guy was horribly underrated on Toronto. It's not like he was top 10 in Toronto. He was always in the 40's the few times he made it.

He was fantastic according to you. He had 70 points. He had 82 in Toronto playing with Bozak. So it does make sense he drops rather than rises on the list. That equals being out of the top 50.

Context is important.

In 2011-12, the league had multiple 90+ scorers while Malkin broke 100. This past season only McDavid scored 100 points while no one reached 90. Going down the list further, there will less players scoring between 70-80 points now than five years ago. Playoff wise, Kessel has amassed 45 points in 49 games the past two seasons playing with top five center Bonino and top winger Hagelin. So let's spare this idea he has amazing linemates to work with. Even as a Habs fan, he's been better than Pacioretty who made this list at 43th.

Regardless, I cite bias because the media has been widely critical of Kessel despite his improved play.

 

[LeafFever]

Context is important.

In 2011-12, the league had multiple 90+ scorers while Malkin broke 100. This past season only McDavid scored 100 points while no one reached 90. Going down the list further, there will less players scoring between 70-80 points now than five years ago. Playoff wise, Kessel has amassed 45 points in 49 games the past two seasons playing with top five center Bonino and top winger Hagelin. So let's spare this idea he has amazing linemates to work with. Even as a Habs fan, he's been better than Pacioretty who made this list at 43th.

Regardless, I cite bias because the media has been widely critical of Kessel despite his improved play.

The media was much more critical of Kessel when he was on the Leafs. This is fact. Do you honestly think he's getting near the same criticism?

And yes, scoring is down. But not enough to say a guy avg3 points the past 2 years on the Pens means he should not be down from when he was PPG with lesser talent. that's a lousy excuse.

 

[Warden of the North]

The media was much more critical of Kessel when he was on the Leafs. This is fact. Do you honestly think he's getting near the same criticism?

Agreed. And it goes beyond the media too. This board has had a reversal on Kessel since he left the Leafs.

He went from the ungrateful, petulant, overrated child to everyones favourite silly uncle within months.