TSN: The ratification vote and news conference has been set for Friday.

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Jobu

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littleD said:
Reading Mark Spector in the National Post this morning, he said that the NHL doesn't even know when they want to hold their news conference. Could be Thursday, could be Friday. I personally wouldn't surprised if they dragged on until Monday.

And how bush league does the NHL continue to look when the heads of the league and the players assosciation can't even get together for a news conference announcing the return of the game?

How exactly are they supposed to get together with the NHL hunkered down in New York, and the players in Toronto? The PA is briefing agents on Thursday and Friday and the players on Wednesday and Thursday.

If you want then together, be prepared to wait until Monday at the earliest. There are other things that are more important with the NHL ready to open up for business.
 

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Jobu said:
OK, first of all, you guys need to grab a clue. Saturday circulation is generally WAY higher than weekday circulation. The Toronto Star, for example, circulates over 650,000 Saturday copies and less than 500,000 on a weekday.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=tsmediakit/Render&c=Page&cid=1078234009627

The same is true for most, if not all, other papers. Moreover, Saturday readers spend materially more time reading the paper than on weekdays.

Secondly, golf, baseball, racing, etc. has nothing to do with timing, nor should it. In New York, supposedly a market we are supposed to care a lot about, had Yankees-Red Sox previews on the front page the day after the announcement -- a day on which there was NOTHING else in sports going on.

Papers in Canada and other big markets will carry it, duh, and others won't. It doesn't matter what the timing is.

Maybe you need to grab a clue. There are cultural differences between Canada and the United States and this is a great example of one of them. In Canada the Saturday paper is a big deal. Yup, there was nothing better than grabbing a copy of the Saturday fish wrap and catching up on all the news you missed over the week as well as scoping out all the great sales going on in the area. That ain't the way it is down here. The Saturday papers are pathetic and are not worth getting. Friday is the big day for American papers, having most of the best features. As someone else pointed out Friday is the best day of the week to announce bad news because no one buys the Saturday paper. People are too busy doing other things (sports, shopping, etc.) and filling their day with as much excitment as they can to be bothered with the news. People really don't take notice of the news again until Monday. Its a very interesting cultural difference between our two countries, one that you have to experience to understand.
 

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The Iconoclast said:
Maybe you need to grab a clue. There are cultural differences between Canada and the United States and this is a great example of one of them. In Canada the Saturday paper is a big deal. Yup, there was nothing better than grabbing a copy of the Saturday fish wrap and catching up on all the news you missed over the week as well as scoping out all the great sales going on in the area. That ain't the way it is down here. The Saturday papers are pathetic and are not worth getting. Friday is the big day for American papers, having most of the best features. As someone else pointed out Friday is the best day of the week to announce bad news because no one buys the Saturday paper. People are too busy doing other things (sports, shopping, etc.) and filling their day with as much excitment as they can to be bothered with the news. People really don't take notice of the news again until Monday. Its a very interesting cultural difference between our two countries, one that you have to experience to understand.

Interesting, since weekday circulation of the New York Times is the same as that on Saturday. And guess what? Sunday is even higher. Same with the Boston Globe.

http://www.nytco.com/investors-nyt-circulation.html
https://bostonglobe.com/advertiser/mrktdata/bostonglobemrkt/circulation/circbk.pdf

Talk about cultural differences all you want, but the same number of papers are printed, sold and presumably read.

And let's not even talk about the fact that many people now get their news from the TV and Internet vs. the newspaper.

Frankly, if the US is so sensitive of a market that announcing the new season on a Friday doesn't get enough press, there is no use. Again, the fact that the Red-Sox Yankees preview trumped the agreement in principle is all the proof you need that you can't sell hockey in the US. Sad, but true.

I continue to laugh at the people who suggest Crosby should end up in New York. Sidney who?
 

Jobu

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littleD said:
There's this great invention, it's called an airplane. And they go pretty fast too...

Ignorance is bliss, isn't it? :help:

Agents are in Toronto meeting with the PA throughout Friday and the weekend in all likelihood. A little more important to the PA than a photo op.
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
Interesting, since weekday circulation of the New York Times is the same as that on Saturday. And guess what? Sunday is even higher. Same with the Boston Globe.


Talk about cultural differences all you want, but the same number of papers are printed, sold and presumably read.
That's right, presumably. Circulation is the number of subscriptions and the number of newstand papers. If a newstand has gets 200 papers delivered and sells 3, they still have "sold" 200. Works the same way with album sales. As for Sunday... some people subscribe to only the Sunday paper, or a Sunday/Wednesday/Friday subscriptio or some other combo.

People don't read the papers on Saturday. They get them delivered to their house, but they don't read them to the extent they do on Sunday or any other day not named Monday. It's why the government and corporations make all their bad news announcements on Fridays, because the public doesn't pay attention.
 

Jobu

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Dr Love said:
That's right, presumably. Circulation is the number of subscriptions and the number of newstand papers. If a newstand has gets 200 papers delivered and sells 3, they still have "sold" 200. Works the same way with album sales. As for Sunday... some people subscribe to only the Sunday paper, or a Sunday/Wednesday/Friday subscriptio or some other combo.

People don't read the papers on Saturday. They get them delivered to their house, but they don't read them to the extent they do on Sunday or any other day not named Monday. It's why the government and corporations make all their bad news announcements on Fridays, because the public doesn't pay attention.

Proof? As if the average newsstand sells 3 of 200 papers and subscribers simply toss the Saturday paper each weekend.

And if they did, following your reasoning, the best time to announce would be Saturday, then, since Sunday papers = most circulation and most readership.
 

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Dr Love said:
It's why the government and corporations make all their bad news announcements on Fridays, because the public doesn't pay attention.
This phenomenon was on an episode of West Wing. The staff didn't plan any big events for the president on Friday because no one reads the paper on Saturday.
 

littleD

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Jobu said:
Ignorance is bliss, isn't it? :help:

Agents are in Toronto meeting with the PA throughout Friday and the weekend in all likelihood. A little more important to the PA than a photo op.

Please. The only reason Goodenow is not going to be in New York on Friday, or whenever the PC is, is because he just can't stand to be in the same room as the NHL heads, and he doesn't want to be questioned about his defeat in front of them.

If he wanted to be there, he would be there. That's cool if he doesn't. Maybe they can find a new head of the PA in time to be there.
 

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Holly Gunning said:
This phenomenon was on an episode of West Wing. The staff didn't plan any big events for the president on Friday because no one reads the paper on Saturday.

OK, so let's assume this to be the case. Then why isn't all big news announced on Saturday?

http://www.naa.org/marketscope/DSN/DSNAud2004.pdf

Weekday readership stands at 48% of the total adult (18+) population. This means 99.9 million adults in the U.S. read an average issue of a daily newspaper.

Sunday readership stands at 56% of total adults. This translates into a nationwide
audience of more than 116 million readers of an average issue of a Sunday newspaper.
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
Proof? As if the average newsstand sells 3 of 200 papers and subscribers simply toss the Saturday paper each weekend.
Yes, and it counts as 200 sold, because they bought 200 papers from the newspaper. This is common knowledge. Some papers actually collect the old ones and keep track, but that's generally smaller papers, and in a place like NYC it's just not feasible.

And if they did, following your reasoning, the best time to announce would be Saturday, then, since Sunday papers = most circulation and most readership.
The best time to announce what, the agreement? The NHL clearly doesn't care about that.

Holly Gunning said:
This phenomenon was on an episode of West Wing. The staff didn't plan any big events for the president on Friday because no one reads the paper on Saturday.
Yeah, they did. I think it was called "Take Out the Trash Day."
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
OK, so let's assume this to be the case. Then why isn't all big news announced on Saturday?
Well, for one, places like corporations and the goverment are closed on Saturday. That's a pretty important part of it.
 

Jobu

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littleD said:
Please. The only reason Goodenow is not going to be in New York on Friday, or whenever the PC is, is because he just can't stand to be in the same room as the NHL heads, and he doesn't want to be questioned about his defeat in front of them.

If he wanted to be there, he would be there. That's cool if he doesn't. Maybe they can find a new head of the PA in time to be there.

Keep thinking that. What will be your excuse when the NHLPA has its own news conference on Friday or sometime thereabouts?

I laugh at all the people eating up all this Goodenow will be gone, Goodenow will recommend voting down the CBA, Goodenow and Saskin don't get along garbage. Pure and incorrect propaganda.

Did Goodenow want a cap? No, he told the players to prepare for a two-year stoppage. When the players wilted, Goodenow had to, as leader of the union. Does he wholeheartedly endorse the agreement? Doubtful. Will he recommend ratification? Duh.

You guys just love to eat it up.
 

Jobu

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Dr Love said:
Yes, and it counts as 200 sold, because they bought 200 papers from the newspaper. This is common knowledge. Some papers actually collect the old ones and keep track, but that's generally smaller papers, and in a place like NYC it's just not feasible.

Proof?

Please show me that the Saturday newspaper is read by materially less people for a materially less amount of time. It's certainly not the case anywhere outside the US, in fact, it is quite the opposite.
 

Jobu

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Dr Love said:
Well, for one, places like corporations and the goverment are closed on Saturday. That's a pretty important part of it.

Well then they are a bunch of idiots! What kind of marketing and sales and PR departments would be closed on the day prior to the best day to make a splash in the media?!

:shakehead

Unless, of course, this conspiracy theory of yours and the West Wing is complete and utter bunk.
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
Proof?

Please show me that the Saturday newspaper is read by materially less people for a materially less amount of time. It's certainly not the case anywhere outside the US, in fact, it is quite the opposite.
Like I already said, it's common knowledge. Good for those other countries, I'm talking about the US.

Jobu said:
Well then they are a bunch of idiots! What kind of marketing and sales and PR departments would be closed on the day prior to the best day to make a splash in the media?!

:shakehead
ROTFL. Where to start. Well, first off there's the problem of that requiring people to work on a weekend, which ain't gonna happen. And then of course if it's good news, why waste it on a Sunday? It'll get covered appropriately if it's good if it's released on a Monday instead of a Saturday, maybe more so because your announcement might be on page 3 on a Sunday whereas on a Wednesday it would be on page one, depending on your company.


Jobu said:
Unless, of course, this conspiracy theory of yours and the West Wing is complete and utter bunk.
I'm not the one who brought up The West Wing, so don't paint me with that brush.
 

Jobu

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Dr Love said:
Like I already said, it's common knowledge. Good for those other countries, I'm talking about the US.

Right.


ROTFL. Where to start. Well, first off there's the problem of that requiring people to work on a weekend, which ain't gonna happen. And then of course if it's good news, why waste it on a Sunday? It'll get covered appropriately if it's good if it's released on a Monday instead of a Saturday, maybe more so because your announcement might be on page 3 on a Sunday whereas on a Wednesday it would be on page one, depending on your company.

In this day and age, most large companies, and certainly the government, have staff working every day. It's not hard to have a few PR people in to work weekends, especially on the heels of big announcements.

And why waste good news on Sunday? Well, like I showed, newspaper circulation and readership is the highest on that day. Wasn't that your problem with the NHL releasing its news on Saturday?

Now you're flip-flopping. By your reasoning, Saturday is a great day, since without anything else going on, the NHL will have page one to itself.
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
In this day and age, most large companies, and certainly the government, have staff working every day.
No, they don't.

Jobu said:
It's not hard to have a few PR people in to work weekends, especially on the heels of big announcements.
Big announcements take more than "a few PR people." You're talking out your ass.

Jobu said:
And why waste good news on Sunday? Well, like I showed, newspaper circulation and readership is the highest on that day. Wasn't that your problem with the NHL releasing its news on Saturday?
I specifically narrowed that to companies that wouldn't get the attention they would on a weekday.

Jobu said:
Now you're flip-flopping.
Hardly.

Jobu said:
By your reasoning, Saturday is a great day, since without anything else going on, the NHL will have page one to itself.
Not really, and like I already said, the NHL doesn't care what day they announce.
 

Jobu

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Dr Love said:
No, they don't.

Yes, they do. Maybe not at the local diner where you waitress.

Big announcements take more than "a few PR people." You're talking out your ass.

How hard is it to issue a press release or call the local reporter/editor? Even a press conference doesn't take a whole lot of work. You're crazy if you think 21st century corporations in a global environment stop the clock at 5pm on Friday.

I specifically narrowed that to companies that wouldn't get the attention they would on a weekday.

Hardly.

Umm, see above.

Not really, and like I already said, the NHL doesn't care what day they announce.

As they shouldn't.
 

Dr Love

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Jobu said:
Yes, they do. Maybe not at the local diner where you waitress.
Tough guy.


How hard is it to issue a press release or call the local reporter/editor? Even a press conference doesn't take a whole lot of work. You're crazy if you think 21st century corporations in a global environment stop the clock at 5pm on Friday.
You know what, I should ceed to you, since you obviously know all about public relations. You clearly have a firm grasp on the employees who work there too, who are, much to my disbelief, thrilled to have to work on weekends for no extra pay, and already work on the weekends to start with. All this time living with a staffer at a major PR firm and what do I know.
 

Lanny MacDonald*

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Jobu said:
Interesting, since weekday circulation of the New York Times is the same as that on Saturday. And guess what? Sunday is even higher. Same with the Boston Globe.

There is a very simple explanation for the spike in weekend distribution. The weekend editions are huge giveaways because of all the advertising. Many advertisers get free copies to have on hand to support their ads. Many will purchase extra copies and give those away as well. Hotels also include the paper in the stay for most room sales, and the majority of those spike on the weekends. The combination of those two together easily make up for the spike. People just don't read the papers down here on weekends, no matter how many stats you want to throw out. Anyone living down here will tell you.
 

ceber

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Dr Love said:
It's why the government and corporations make all their bad news announcements on Fridays, because the public doesn't pay attention.

It's more because the stock markets are closed and people have a couple of days to cool down. It prevents big swings in stock price. Businesses and governments have a good reason to release bad news when people can't react to it immediately. I'd argue the situation with the NHL is a lot different. The weekend is not that bad for sports news. Heck, even some of the major sports play the majority of their games on the weekend. Doesn't seem to hurt them. ;)
 

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ceber said:
It's more because the stock markets are closed and people have a couple of days to cool down. It prevents big swings in stock price. Businesses and governments have a good reason to release bad news when people can't react to it immediately. I'd argue the situation with the NHL is a lot different. The weekend is not that bad for sports news. Heck, even some of the major sports play the majority of their games on the weekend. Doesn't seem to hurt them. ;)

I agree with this post. I think people are really over-analyzing things here. Weekends are huge newsdays in sports. And I think the timing is just coincidental regardless. There is a lot of work to be done here and maybe, despite our continued frustrations, a methodical approach is still best.
 

Dr Love

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ceber said:
It's more because the stock markets are closed and people have a couple of days to cool down. It prevents big swings in stock price.
That's another reason as well, for things that will impact the stock market (I guess nowadays everything impacts the stockmarket though). But also to get everything rolled into one newscycle that no one pays attention to. A combination, really.

I'd argue the situation with the NHL is a lot different. The weekend is not that bad for sports news. Heck, even some of the major sports play the majority of their games on the weekend. Doesn't seem to hurt them. ;)
I agree, but the NHL doesn't care, so it's a useless point to debate.
 
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