Rumor: Trade Rumors/Proposals/Free Agents 2017-2018

[Sens of Anarchy]

Well, yeah.

Ryan and Karlsson both knew what was happening, and they both had concrete talks about it for Ryan to say this. Ryan didn't throw "somebody backed out" in there by mistake...

He not only brings himself in, but drags another named teammate, Karlsson at that, into it.

Obviously speculation, as is assuming Dorion backed out, but it all points to one thing to me. They were ready to move them, but the other team got cold feet.

Now .... He dragged Karlsson into it? He was being traded with Karlsson. He knew it ,... Everyone involved knew it.. He didn't do the dragging. Dorion in his "listening" on deals for Karlsson decided that he should also "listen" on deals where Ryan was dragged into it. He did not break any news. He said what he knew, and was made to believe. That was not far off from what was being reported by the insiders... Ryan and Karlsson were very likely communicating about it as it was transpiring. And just as many of us assumed Dorion spun it afterwards. Karlsson , likely after speaking with Dorion did as well.. I am not saying Karlsson misled anyone , maybe he was just being a good captain and following what he was told.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I'm not just talking about this specifically. I'm talking about the constant swirling around of information. It seems as though every move we are considering internally is leaked to the media somehow. There are many teams around the league who run an incredibly tight ship in terms of what gets out, but we don't seem to be one of them.

It starts at the top. I should not expect absolute loyalty from my employees if I did not conduct myself in a way that commanded respect.
Dorion is inexperienced.
Lee is a tag along
Melnyk is just an asshole with a capital A
The team imploded this year
Belleville and development is brutal

They have left precious little for anyone to be proud of

 

[TheBradyBunch]

It starts at the top. I should not expect absolute loyalty from my employees if I did not conduct myself in a way that commanded respect.
Dorion is inexperienced.
Lee is a tag along
Melnyk is just an *******
The team imploded this year

100%. I am not blaming the employees/leakers whatsoever. Hard to have loyalty to the organization when the head is rotten.

 

[branch]

It starts at the top. I should not expect absolute loyalty from my employees if I did not conduct myself in a way that commanded respect.
Dorion is inexperienced.
Lee is a tag along
Melnyk is just an ******* with a capital A
The team imploded this year
Belleville and development is brutal

They have left precious little for anyone to be proud of

This team has been operating with the same shoestring boys club for the last 11 years. We shouldn't be surprised.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

This team has been operating with the same shoestring boys club for the last 11 years. We shouldn't be surprised.

So nothing has changed as far as you are concerned? Ok

 

[branch]

So nothing has changed as far as you are concerned? Ok

We've employed the same core group of hockey execs since then. Why would it change? This team has failed internally to evolve with the direction of the sport.

 

[Langdon Alger]

there's all kinds of factors Dave including what you've mentioned but the reality is every team has bad draft choices, trades and poor play. 10 years. that's 70 draft picks. I think a team with 12 or 13 homegrown products is considered wildly successful?

Take away Pittsburgh, Washington, Chicago, LA and Boston. What's left? How many of what's left made the playoffs more frequently?

this isn't the 80s....8 of 16 in our conference make it. all else being equal the odds are 50%. but it's not equal. one team has Crosby and Malkin. Another team has Ovechkin. That tilts the odds for them. only 6 of 14 left make it.

San Jose and Anaheim have made the playoffs pretty consistently in the last decade. Montreal has made it just as often as we have, actually probably more. This is just off the top of my head.

It’s such a cop out to say it’s all parity. It shows that some people around here have very low standards and don’t hold anyone in the organization accountable for being bad at their jobs. They just say cool words like “meh”.

 

[Wondercarrot]

Again, everything in your post is speculation by definition. I'm not saying you're wrong or right, but that's just what it is. It obviously wasn't a GM or an agent that told them that, or it would have been worded differently.

Again, everything in your post is speculation by definition. I'm not saying you're wrong or right, but that's just what it is. It obviously wasn't a GM or an agent that told them that, or it would have been worded differently.

Shawn Simpson said it is quite likely his agent as Newport Sports is 100% plugged in.

"When a player has news about a potential trade. That information usually comes from his agent. And in the case of Ryan & Newport sports, it's almost always very factual and accurate."

 

[BonkTastic]

We've employed the same core group of hockey execs since then. Why would it change?

Well, we used to employ a lot more of them.

Part of the problem is that we've hemorrhaged talent at the higher levels of hockey ops, and either flat-out have not replaced them, or replaced from within and then not replaced those positions.

I might argue that the bigger problem right now has been the shrinking of Hockey Ops over the last 3-ish years, more than it has been a cronyism problem like you suggest (though clearly, your point is still a big issue with how the org is run, I'm not trying to suggest otherwise).

 

[aragorn]

Geez, this thread sounds angry today. Does it really matter who did what first? The fact is that the Sens were trying to move Karlsson but wanted to include Ryan in the deal to get out from his contract. I think that has become common knowledge that we can all agree with, EM seems to want to reduce his player salary expenditures. Whether they had a deal or didn't is really irrelevant because the deal never went through but from what we are hearing in the media they were certainly open to dealing both Karlsson & Ryan.

Now we have to wait until the draft and/or the summer to go through this process again & it's quite likely that any Karlsson deal would likely include Ryan too. Maybe someone should start a poll to see what most people think will happen, will they re-sign Karlsson or trade him? Will they have to include Ryan in the deal or not? My guess is that they have until July 1, 2019 to either re-sign Karlsson or trade him & I'm leaning towards them trading both Karlsson & Ryan before next season to save money & rebuild.

 

[JD1]

San Jose and Anaheim have made the playoffs pretty consistently in the last decade. Montreal has made it just as often as we have, actually probably more. This is just off the top of my head.

It’s such a cop out to say it’s all parity. It shows that some people around here have very low standards and don’t hold anyone in the organization accountable for being bad at their jobs. They just say cool words like “meh”.

I don't think it's a cop out at all. for every team that's made the playoffs more than 50% of the time you have a team that has made it less. in the east.

look at Philly, Carolina, buffalo, NYI, Florida, Columbus. we first made the playoffs in 97 and made them 11 years in a row. the past 10 have been pretty average.

 

[JD1]

It does when it flies in the face of what our GM is saying as lip service. The other team pulled out, Dorion was ready to pull the trigger, which is the opposite of what he's relayed.

where does it say who pulled out?

 

[BondraTime]

where does it say who pulled out?

I had said after that was speculation based on my interpretation, that I incorrectly put out there in a definitive manner

 

[JD1]

I had said after that was speculation based on my interpretation, that I incorrectly put out there in a definitive manner

I read that article. There's a lot said in there by Ryan and a lot said by Brennan. Ryan clearly used the word speculation.

what I find surprising for a fan base is how quickly people here are to interpret something in the most negative way possible

I just read two pages of this thread. there just isn't enough information out there to understand what happened. speculating one way is no different than speculating a different way.

all that is certain is that discussions were held and they are still senators.

 

[Langdon Alger]

I don't think it's a cop out at all. for every team that's made the playoffs more than 50% of the time you have a team that has made it less. in the east.

look at Philly, Carolina, buffalo, NYI, Florida, Columbus. we first made the playoffs in 97 and made them 11 years in a row. the past 10 have been pretty average.

It’s a cop out if you blame it all on parity. If you acknowledge if it’s one of the reasons, I think that’s fair.

 

[BondraTime]

I read that article. There's a lot said in there by Ryan and a lot said by Brennan. Ryan clearly used the word speculation.

what I find surprising for a fan base is how quickly people here are to interpret something in the most negative way possible

I just read two pages of this thread. there just isn't enough information out there to understand what happened. speculating one way is no different than speculating a different way.

all that is certain is that discussions were held and they are still senators.

It's my interpretation, not everyone's. Most/all people that responded to it viewed it the way you did, disagreeing with me.

That's how I interpreted it, had nothing to do with automatically going to the negative side.

 

[JD1]

It’s a cop out if you blame it all on parity. If you acknowledge if it’s one of the reasons, I think that’s fair.

well let's call it that then

so much is based on luck. if we draft Kopitar instead of Lee 12 or 13 years ago then we probably have 3 more playoffs and a few more series wins.

what I find really incompetent is the perennial bottom feeders. how can they not get better?

I just find us in the middle. need another couple of elite players to consistently make it every year

 

[JD1]

It's my interpretation, not everyone's. Most/all people that responded to it viewed it the way you did, disagreeing with me.

That's how I interpreted it, had nothing to do with automatically going to the negative side.

sorry I didn't mean you specifically and I can see your interpretation

I mean in general with this fan base and any news about the org.

 

[The Lewler]

I posted this earlier in the Karlsson thread but it got kinda crazy in there , so I didn't get much discussion going.

#1. I want them to re-sign EK65 and am going to be apoplectic if they do it, regardless of the return.

#2. After the deals that were made at the deadline, who do you fine speculators think has the assets to offer a better deal then what was apparently offered for EK at the deadline?

Examples:

• I'm of the mind that Tampa Bay would appear to be out of the effort now that they gave up some assets and picks for McDonagh.
• Vegas appears to still have the cap space but they gave up a lot of picks for Tatar already, would they give up more picks and assets to get Karlsson? Does it depend how their playoff drive goes?

So who can/will offer a better package than what was offered at the deadline?

Carolina?

 

[armani]

It starts at the top. I should not expect absolute loyalty from my employees if I did not conduct myself in a way that commanded respect.
Dorion is inexperienced.
Lee is a tag along
Melnyk is just an ******* with a capital A
The team imploded this year
Belleville and development is brutal

They have left precious little for anyone to be proud of

I hear Lee also also holds the janitor title. I hear Dorion also holds Melnyk's briefcase (which holds Eugene's share of Bart's Bar tip jar) as the owner struts around CTC.

 

[BonkTastic]

So who can/will offer a better package than what was offered at the deadline?

Carolina?

New 'Canes owner seems to want to make a big splash, and basically fired Francis for playing it too safe.

I'd put them on the list, for sure.

 

[armani]

Gabby time! He will score 15 next year.

 

[Langdon Alger]

well let's call it that then

so much is based on luck. if we draft Kopitar instead of Lee 12 or 13 years ago then we probably have 3 more playoffs and a few more series wins.

what I find really incompetent is the perennial bottom feeders. how can they not get better?

I just find us in the middle. need another couple of elite players to consistently make it every year

Teams like Arizona and Carolina hardly spend any money. I’m not surprised they never make it.

 

[Sens Mile]

Have we been linked to any NCAA players? Usually I see something by now but this year nothing

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

This team has been operating with the same shoestring boys club for the last 11 years. We shouldn't be surprised.

After so much time operating on a nothing budget, and losing key personnel, I'd be willing to bet morale is at an all-time low. It's one thing to bull your way through a few lean years, but no one should be expected to cut and cut and cut for 11 years and counting.