Speculation: Toronto & the Islanders

Spirit of 67

Registered User
Nov 25, 2016
7,061
4,938
Aurora, On.
Based on reading Tavares comments over tbe last 8 seasons and comments from credible sources over those yrs who have spoken about Tavares, I do think wants to be top dog,the Crosby on his team and not the Malkin.
I do not think he wants to be Matthews sidekick and does not have to with the number of teams and offers he will get in 7-8 weeks.
There are several very good teams like St.Louis, SJ, Columbus that could offer a talented team, strong front office and where he would be top dog. Those are tbe franchises I worry about.
SJ is a smart bet. Should he choose to leave that is.
 

redbull

Boss
Mar 24, 2008
12,593
654
I think that’s exactly the course of action L&M chose since last year, keep JT happy. The Clutterbuck resigning, keeping Weight as coach, keeping Snow as GM after last year, the Bailey signing, were all done with an eye towards getting Tavares to resign. If this was the plan all along I think they put Tavares ahead of the team and that’s wrong.

That makes no sense. Tavares, by all reports, was close to Parenteau, Moulson, Okposo, Nielsen, Martin -- let's not pretend the mistake on the Clutterbuck deal was to appease Tavares. Putting Tavares ahead of the team is also pure speculation. I'd argue Tavares put the team ahead of himself by taking so little on his second contract, giving up UFA years, probably hoping to win some games. Loser!


Based on reading Tavares comments over tbe last 8 seasons and comments from credible sources over those yrs who have spoken about Tavares, I do think wants to be top dog,the Crosby on his team and not the Malkin.
I do not think he wants to be Matthews sidekick and does not have to with the number of teams and offers he will get in 7-8 weeks.
There are several very good teams like St.Louis, SJ, Columbus that could offer a talented team, strong front office and where he would be top dog. Those are tbe franchises I worry about.

I don't buy that either. It takes a lot of talent to be a top team and thinking there could/should be an undisputed "top dog" is also naïve. Look at all the cup winners in the last 10 years - Crosby/Malkin, Fleury/Murray, Toews/Kane/Crawford, Kopitar/Doughty/Quick

Top dog? who really gives a crap. Does anyone care if you always lose and miss the playoffs? Most here will have to google to find out who Marcel Dionne is, or Dale Hawerchuk, superstars who never won anything, on obscure teams.

Tavares is 27, he has a chance at some hardware if he walks away. He'd be stupid to think being "top dog" matters more than winning.

In fact, I'd say he'd be motivated to show he's as good as Matthews.

And although Auston is a superstar already, don't think he wouldn't benefit by having a guy like Tavares around the next 6-7 years. Shanahan ain't stupid and he's shown the NHL he can get his man, if he wants (see: Lou, Babcock, Hunter, etc.)
 
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CREW99AW

Registered User
Mar 12, 2002
40,928
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Th

I don't buy that either. It takes a lot of talent to be a top team and thinking there could/should be an undisputed "top dog" is also naïve. Look at all the cup winners in the last 10 years - Crosby/Malkin, Fleury/Murray, Toews/Kane/Crawford, Kopitar/Doughty/Quick

Top dog? who really gives a crap. Does anyone care if you always lose and miss the playoffs? Most here will have to google to find out who Marcel Dionne is, or Dale Hawerchuk, superstars who never won anything, on obscure teams.

Tavares is 27, he has a chance at some hardware if he walks away. He'd be stupid to think being "top dog" matters more than winning.

In fact, I'd say he'd be motivated to show he's as good as Matthews.

And although Auston is a superstar already, don't think he wouldn't benefit by having a guy like Tavares around the next 6-7 years. Shanahan ain't stupid and he's shown the NHL he can get his man, if he wants (see: Lou, Babcock, Hunter, etc.)

From Tavares first season he has made comments indicating what a fan of Crosby's he is, how Crosby put Pittsburgh on his back to win.
I do not buy that Tavares wants to play Malkin to Matthews Crosby or that he cares what Shanahan wants or thinks. Tavares will have no shortage of highly respected franchises and GMs offering him huge $ and he will be able to step into several situations as #1C , on a team with legitimate Stanley Cup chances.
 

sabremike

Friend To All Giraffes
Aug 30, 2010
22,544
33,789
Brewster, NY
Toronto's glaring fatal weakness is on defense so yeah, it makes all the sense in the world for them to blow all their cap space on a center:shakehead Dear God.
 

LeafChief

Matthew Knies Enthusiast
Mar 5, 2013
14,555
22,601
Scarborough
Honestly I think if you guys get Lamoriello, you'll love him.

He brought such a sense of stability to the Leafs organization and it was something they really needed. The Leafs were a laughing stock before he got there and he brought order and a bit of fear that the players needed.

You always hear about teams needing a 'culture change' but he actually accomplished it.

The Islanders have some solid pieces and are way ahead of where the Leafs were when Lou came to Toronto. I think NYI get a bad reputation for the way Wang handled the team (I believe he is gone now?) and Snow may be a good GM but it feels like chaos surrounds him. I think this would be a solid move.
 
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aronjudge11

Registered User
Jul 2, 2017
1,017
222
I hear Malkin has told other teams in NEED of a GM or president .that he will give permission to speak to Snow.
 

redbull

Boss
Mar 24, 2008
12,593
654
Honestly I think if you guys get Lamoriello, you'll love him.

He brought such a sense of stability to the Leafs organization and it was something they really needed. The Leafs were a laughing stock before he got there and he brought order and a bit of fear that the players needed.

You always hear about teams needing a 'culture change' but he actually accomplished it.

The Islanders have some solid pieces and are way ahead of where the Leafs were when Lou came to Toronto. I think NYI get a bad reputation for the way Wang handled the team (I believe he is gone now?) and Snow may be a good GM but it feels like chaos surrounds him. I think this would be a solid move.

Isles don't have any solid pieces. Just Barzal. They have zero prospects on defense after Pulock/Toews (who aren't exactly elite), an elite goalie prospect who may never come to the NHL, and some risky forwards when you have JT maybe walking, Eberle/Lee going to be UFAs and you have to wonder how well the supporting cast will do without Tavares.

It's a real disaster.

I'll agree with you on Lou Lamoriello - but I'll believe it when I see it.

Knowing the Islanders, they'll probably have him reporting to Garth Snow. How's that for an April fool's sad-joke.

Toronto's glaring fatal weakness is on defense so yeah, it makes all the sense in the world for them to blow all their cap space on a center:shakehead Dear God.

Well, Pittsburgh added Kessel to Malkin/Crosby and won two cups in a row.

The best GMs in hockey find a way to get elite players and fill holes in other areas.

If you think the Leafs can't fix a cap problem you haven't been paying attention - just ask Stephane Robidas, David Clarkson, Joffrey Lupul, many more. And guess what, when you have incredibly talented young players, you can EASILY replace Bozak/JVR/Komarov dollars with JT dollars and fill-in the caps with Andres Johnsson, Carl Grundstrom and even deal William Nylander for another solid young defenseman to complement Dermott, Liljegrin, Rielly.

When you get a chance at an elite centre at 27, you go for it.
OR, you waste nine years of the same player and pray he re-signs.
 
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LeafChief

Matthew Knies Enthusiast
Mar 5, 2013
14,555
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Scarborough
Isles don't have any solid pieces. Just Barzal. They have zero prospects on defense after Pulock/Toews (who aren't exactly elite), an elite goalie prospect who may never come to the NHL, and some risky forwards when you have JT maybe walking, Eberle/Lee going to be UFAs and you have to wonder how well the supporting cast will do without Tavares.

It's a real disaster.

I'll agree with you on Lou Lamoriello - but I'll believe it when I see it.

Knowing the Islanders, they'll probably have him reporting to Garth Snow. How's that for an April fool's sad-joke

I like Beauvillier quite a bit and Bellows might be a real nice piece going forward. If Ho-Sang would smarten uo he could be a nice piece as well. Plus the two top 15 1st rounders this year. Hit on those and that's a decent start. Pulock seems pretty solid as well.
 

CREW99AW

Registered User
Mar 12, 2002
40,928
3,389
Honestly I think if you guys get Lamoriello, you'll love him.

He brought such a sense of stability to the Leafs organization and it was something they really needed. The Leafs were a laughing stock before he got there and he brought order and a bit of fear that the players needed.

You always hear about teams needing a 'culture change' but he actually accomplished it.

The Islanders have some solid pieces and are way ahead of where the Leafs were when Lou came to Toronto. I think NYI get a bad reputation for the way Wang handled the team (I believe he is gone now?) and Snow may be a good GM but it feels like chaos surrounds him. I think this would be a solid move.

Snow preaches accountability, which is mind boggling when you consider Snow has been GM for 12 seasons and the highlight is a playoff series win. He has become the teflon GM.

Lou L was not my first choice because of age, but any new Exec who can come in and bring high expectations and demand accountability can only be a positive move.
 
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CREW99AW

Registered User
Mar 12, 2002
40,928
3,389
Isles don't have any solid pieces. Just Barzal. They have zero prospects on defense after Pulock/Toews (who aren't exactly elite), an elite goalie prospect who may never come to the NHL, and some risky forwards when you have JT maybe walking, Eberle/Lee going to be UFAs and you have to wonder how well the supporting cast

Pulock is coming off a 32 pt rookie season,despite practically zero 1st PP time. I think he also played less then 70 games.
20 yr old Beau is coming off a 20 goal rookie season.
JHS, has put up 22 pts in his first 43 nhl games,mostly on the 3rd line .
Bellows is coming off a strong junior season and turning pro.
If 22 yr old Sorokin wants to play in the nhl, he will have do so on LI.
Isles have 4 picks in the first 43 picks in the 2018 draft.
As for the soon to be ufas...both Eberle and CDH have said they hope for extensions, Bailey's $5m per extension is imo team friendly and less then I thought he would get. I guess we will bave to agree to disagree on the isles so called disaster.
 
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steveat

Registered User
Jun 4, 2011
12,057
2,003
Short term..like a 3 year contract is fine for Lou. I am sure he doesn't want to do this forever either. The thing is, he may be able to right the ship within those 3 years and leave his legacy to someone he feels is capable..like maybe his son.

The thing is..if he is going to bring in culture change..I don't think Snow will be on board...Something would have to give and Lou wont take this position without full autonomy.
 

CREW99AW

Registered User
Mar 12, 2002
40,928
3,389
Short term..like a 3 year contract is fine for Lou. I am sure he doesn't want to do this forever either. The thing is, he may be able to right the ship within those 3 years and leave his legacy to someone he feels is capable..like maybe his son.

The thing is..if he is going to bring in culture change..I don't think Snow will be on board...Something would have to give and Lou wont take this position without full autonomy.
We know that Tavares lived with Weight and his family when he broke into the nhl. Reportedly Tavares likes/respects Snow.
I have wondered if part of the reason for keeping an unsuccessful Snow and Weight,wasn't done to increase the chance to extend Tavares.
If Tavares bolts, it is easier to clean house and remove Snow,Weight and the assistant coaches.
 

buud

Ping Pong Predator
Oct 3, 2017
2,159
1,303
43N -79
i would be happy if LL is employed by the Isles for even a year. he comes in, makes a few tough decisions, gets everything on course, and then we hire good people to keep it going.

if Snow IS signed long term, maybe M&L can slide him over to head of scouting or something?
 

CREW99AW

Registered User
Mar 12, 2002
40,928
3,389
i would be happy if LL is employed by the Isles for even a year. he comes in, makes a few tough decisions, gets everything on course, and then we hire good people to keep it going.

if Snow IS signed long term, maybe M&L can slide him over to head of scouting or something?
Snow's drafting has been iffy at best. Weird that so many of the isles top 5 picks have been nhl disappointments while the mid-late first round picks have been bigger contributors. JT and Nino are probably the only top 5 picks under Snow, who have not flopped.

Let's not put Snow in such a key role.
 

CupHolders

Really Fries My Bananas!
Aug 8, 2006
7,441
5,736
Where did you hear this ? Who in their right mind would WANT Snow as their GM.

Charles Wang. That’s why he is still here. Wang was the only one to call the number listed on Malkin’s Pennysaver ad.
 

CupHolders

Really Fries My Bananas!
Aug 8, 2006
7,441
5,736
Assuming he has to stay in some capacity. These are some examples of responsibilities I would give Snow to manage:

1) The team’s charity work

2) Alumni outreach efforts (ie. The Captain’s golf outing)

3) Current player/family support initiatives. Run a team that helps players with day-to- day stuff (ie. assisting newly acquired players with registrating kids in school)
 

ThreeLeftSkates

Registered User
Nov 20, 2008
4,937
1,994
Assuming he has to stay in some capacity. These are some examples of responsibilities I would give Snow to manage:

1) The team’s charity work

2) Alumni outreach efforts (ie. The Captain’s golf outing)

3) Current player/family support initiatives. Run a team that helps players with day-to- day stuff (ie. assisting newly acquired players with registrating kids in school)
Give him a job where he has to smile and say thank you to people. He will quit within a week.
 

Jester9881

Registered User
May 16, 2006
14,350
3,460
Long Island NY
Garth Snow is a great GM if you want to collect young players and draft picks, and don't mind filling holes with AHL level players and waiver pickups. He will rarely ever cash in and trade prospects, young players or picks for much needed veteran help and he's good at building perennial bubble teams. Also if you're a friend of his, he will find a job for you somewhere, regardless of your ability.
 

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