Toronto Star Article on Bettman

Fugu

Guest
Man you guys can make mountains out of molehills, and derail subjects while you're at it.

Who cares what some people think of Cox, Simmons or Strachan personally? They're paid by their employer to follow topics and write about them... That means opinions too. It's no revelation that Bettman is disliked in that particular corner of the universe. Sometimes the criticism is justified, unless some of you want to claim that Gary can do no wrong. And at other times he's following orders or trying to navigate some minefields as best as he can. When the paper doesn't like what the writer produces, you won't have to read their stuff anymore. Oh wait. You don't have to do that now either.

Apparently Balsillie was originally courted by the NHL to look at buying the Pens. When he declined to pay $175 MM for a team while giving up any right to manage said team as he saw fit with some 11th hour conditions, he backed out. The NHL has every right to try to protect it's brand, image and location of franchises. Balsillie has every right to spend his millions how he wants to, not how Bettman et. al. might want him to do so, virtually as a silent partner but putting up 100% of the capital.

I don't think anyone has handled this very well, to be honest. Both sides are trying to force the other one into doing something they really don't want to do. Yet I don't believe anyone is really going to blink-- there's no reason to do so. The only wild card really is Leipold.
 

taxman309

Registered User
May 31, 2007
53
0
The NHL has every right to try to protect it's brand, image and location of franchises. Balsillie has every right to spend his millions how he wants to, not how Bettman et. al. might want him to do so, virtually as a silent partner but putting up 100% of the capital.

Any franchisor as part of their product and name protection has the right to tell the franchisee how to spend some of their money. From territory restrictions to what vendors to use, the franchisor tells the franchisee what to do.

If you don't want to abide by the franchise agreement, you buy a different franchise.
 

GSC2k2*

Guest
Man you guys can make mountains out of molehills, and derail subjects while you're at it.

Who cares what some people think of Cox, Simmons or Strachan personally? They're paid by their employer to follow topics and write about them... That means opinions too. It's no revelation that Bettman is disliked in that particular corner of the universe. Sometimes the criticism is justified, unless some of you want to claim that Gary can do no wrong. And at other times he's following orders or trying to navigate some minefields as best as he can. When the paper doesn't like what the writer produces, you won't have to read their stuff anymore. Oh wait. You don't have to do that now either.

Apparently Balsillie was originally courted by the NHL to look at buying the Pens. When he declined to pay $175 MM for a team while giving up any right to manage said team as he saw fit with some 11th hour conditions, he backed out. The NHL has every right to try to protect it's brand, image and location of franchises. Balsillie has every right to spend his millions how he wants to, not how Bettman et. al. might want him to do so, virtually as a silent partner but putting up 100% of the capital.

I don't think anyone has handled this very well, to be honest. Both sides are trying to force the other one into doing something they really don't want to do. Yet I don't believe anyone is really going to blink-- there's no reason to do so. The only wild card really is Leipold.

All of those points are well made as usual, although I would add the following:

1. In some respects, it is useful to point out the credibility of the messengers, as many people on this board, including many newer folks, may not be familiar with those guys and may take their pronouncements as the gospel. That is done with a disturbing degree of regularity.

2. It should be pointed out that your reference to "11th hour conditions" was definitively denied, with details, by Bill Daly.

3. The NHL is not asking Balsillie to be a "silent partner" with "100% of the capital". It is insisting on him being a 1/30th partner putting up 1/30th of the capital (more or less). Balsillie is effectively saying that this is not a JV, but rather insisting that he can do his own thing. It comes down to how one envisions the NHL.

4. Leipold really has very little leverage, so long as (if) the NHL rejects the ownership application while following its procedures.
 

Fugu

Guest
All of those points are well made as usual, although I would add the following:

1. In some respects, it is useful to point out the credibility of the messengers, as many people on this board, including many newer folks, may not be familiar with those guys and may take their pronouncements as the gospel. That is done with a disturbing degree of regularity.

Why thank you, GC!

I personally enjoy the anti-__________ (insert topic) opinions. Keeps us all on our toes. It's a good exercise to entertain these just to see if one has covered their ground well.


2. It should be pointed out that your reference to "11th hour conditions" was definitively denied, with details, by Bill Daly.

Please explain where he has done this. I understood that these "11th hour" requirements now would face any prospective owner, however what I read earlier was that these were imposed at the last minute, where Balsillie was close to closing the deal? I am completely open the possibility that my info may not be current or complete on this topic.

What caught my eye was the detail claiming regardless of what happened with the new arena plans in Pittsburgh (Plan A and B falling through), that Balsillie could not move the team. I'll grant that he appeared interested in the team in order to move them (apparently as did at least one other bidder?), and that is what drove the Penns price up as well. Again it does appear that each side tried a power play-- lock down the money, then discuss moving issues OR give me the right to move them and then I give you the money.....

3. The NHL is not asking Balsillie to be a "silent partner" with "100% of the capital". It is insisting on him being a 1/30th partner putting up 1/30th of the capital (more or less). Balsillie is effectively saying that this is not a JV, but rather insisting that he can do his own thing. It comes down to how one envisions the NHL.

While I understand what you mean when you say 1/30th of the NHL, it really is a lot more or a whole lot less depending on which team is owned. The Leafs, Rangers, or Habs are worth a lot more than 1/30th of the total value of all franchises if one sums them up. (As a sidebar, I wonder if the idea has ever been floated that the NHL votes should somehow reflect the actual worth of each group?)

Consider Bain and how they divided up their $3+ billion offer. It was not an equitable distribution over 30 teams. Yet, belonging to the NHL club is a prerequisite for maintaining the values as NHL franchises, and to that extent the collective interest must be balanced against the individual interests too.


4. Leipold really has very little leverage, so long as (if) the NHL rejects the ownership application while following its procedures.

That is the kicker. Leipold can sell his team if he wants to, and there is nothing that says a team cannot ever be moved. However there are procedures in place that do require the league and any individual owner to follow their bylaws (the validity of some of these of course may be open to legality issues, but that's outside my area of even layman's knowledge). With millions at stake, it behooves all parties to do so and not open up the matter to outside intervention (in the legal sense, a la Davis). Whatever the litmus test is that the NHL uses, it has to be consistent and used under all scenarios.
 

Fugu

Guest
Any franchisor as part of their product and name protection has the right to tell the franchisee how to spend some of their money. From territory restrictions to what vendors to use, the franchisor tells the franchisee what to do.

If you don't want to abide by the franchise agreement, you buy a different franchise.

Actually, no. I do not believe this is accurate at all since arena deals vary, vendors aren't equally present in all markets, the NHL is marketed in two different countries, etc. The owner has a very specific set of bylaws that govern how the NHL - the league - operates in matters affecting ALL franchises. Bettman cannot instruct Wirtz on what to do about his TV deals, nor can the NHL tell teams what to charge for tickets. They even are restricted collectively in how they can sign players thanks to the collective bargaining agreement, needed to keep the league from violating antitrust laws.

The league as a group (the BOGs) decide what to pay the commissioner, what dues and fees teams pay, how league money is divvied up.... and whether or not to expand, allow a sale of a team within the established guidellines, or similarly to allow a relocation. Some matters even require the input or approval of the NHLPA as agreed to in the CBA.
 

taxman309

Registered User
May 31, 2007
53
0
Who is the exclusive supplier for sweaters for the upcoming season?

I believe that all arena deals will probably reference the NHL and the NHL bylaws in some fashion, too.
 
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Fugu

Guest
Who is the exclusive supplier for sweaters for the upcoming season?

I believe that all arena deals will probably reference the NHL and the NHL bylaws in some fashion, too.


There are league vendors and local/arena vendors and other service providers. I did not know you were referencing the former. On the matter of arenas, I don't believe that is true. There may be minimum requirements that have to be met, but that's probably it. I do admit I'm not an expert on arena matters, so I'll defer to anyone else who wants to expand or clarify.
 

taxman309

Registered User
May 31, 2007
53
0
Go to you local MacDonalds or Wendy's or whatever and ask them if they are given a list of local vendors to use. I expect you might be surprised.
 

Fugu

Guest
Go to you local MacDonalds or Wendy's or whatever and ask them if they are given a list of local vendors to use. I expect you might be surprised.

Oh please stop with the McDonald's analogies. McDonald's is multibillion corporation that sells a franchise to individuals, none of whom have to be millionaires. The NHL is a collective of mostly billionaires who own one team each, and as a group must agree on principles and governance to protect their interests and investment. They need each other because you have to have other teams to play against. If you're going to come back with some further comment about Wendy's or McD's... please expect that someone will ask you to do some research and present the NHL bylaws and compare them a McD's franchise contract. I think it is you who will be surprised.
 

GSC2k2*

Guest
Oh please stop with the McDonald's analogies. McDonald's is multibillion corporation that sells a franchise to individuals, none of whom have to be millionaires. The NHL is a collective of mostly billionaires who own one team each, and as a group must agree on principles and governance to protect their interests and investment. They need each other because you have to have other teams to play against. If you're going to come back with some further comment about Wendy's or McD's... please expect that someone will ask you to do some research and present the NHL bylaws and compare them a McD's franchise contract. I think it is you who will be surprised.
I agree, Fugu, that the analogy is an incorrect and simplistic one (mind you, you used the "selling my house" analogy earlier, so ... tsk, tsk ;)). The NHL is actually closer in structure to a hybrid of a JV and a consortium, albeit one in which profits are not shared. It acts like a JV but shares profits like a consortium.
 

Fugu

Guest
I agree, Fugu, that the analogy is an incorrect and simplistic one (mind you, you used the "selling my house" analogy earlier, so ... tsk, tsk ;)). The NHL is actually closer in structure to a hybrid of a JV and a consortium, albeit one in which profits are not shared. It acts like a JV but shares profits like a consortium.

I was trying to keep it simple with regard to the seller's perspective and the buyer's perspective. The seller looks for certainty and wants to maximize their gain. Time and money can be factors. A buyer(s) obviously can finance the deal in a number of ways, but the seller will look at their attributes differently depending on what they want to accomplish and how quickly. I do think the house analogy is fair. If I received two offers tomorrow, I'd look at the value of the offers (total $), how long it would take for the buyer to close (because I carry the costs until I do sell so I have to start subtracting that from my potential gain), and how certain I felt the buyer could actually line up the funds. Besides....if I start using financial terms, I might get accused of impersonating Henry M. Paulson Jr. ;)

The JV and consortium analogies are good however.
 

rj

Registered User
Jan 29, 2007
1,478
1
Indiana
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/070625

4:19 PM (in progress): Tragically, I missed most of Bettman's speech before he announced the Blackhawks were on the clock. But here's how it probably went down:

"Ladies and gentleman, we're coming off another wonderful season highlighted by the most damaging TV contract in professional sports history and a finals between an obscure Canadian team and the 357th biggest market in the United States. And now, we're about to introduce a 5-foot-9 American kid who's built like Bailey from "Party of Five" as our first pick. I couldn't be happier -- 15 years ago, David Stern sent me to the NHL to ruin this league and I have delivered in spades. Thank you, thank you very much. Thank you, you're too kind. And now, the 2007 draft!"

Up next: my old hockey team, the Boston Bruins. I broke up with them in 2001 ( http://espn.go.com/page2/s/simmons/011026.html ) because their owner (Jeremy Jacobs) is a heartless miser; now I'm an NHL widow. And you know what? I'm fine with that. I'm not even feeling any pangs of remorse because new Bruins GM Peter Chiarelli looks like Machine from "8MM," or because the great Cam Neely is introducing this pick. ... That's right, center Zach Hamill, ranked 16th on TSN's list. Awesome. Anytime you can get the 16th guy at No. 8, you gotta make that move. Burn in hell, Jacobs. Burn in hell.
 

andy*

Guest
http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/227848

I'm sure theres bound to be plenty of thoughts on this one.

Instead, Bettman avoided dealing with the issue at all. The biggest news of the day then became that Jeremy Jacobs, Bettman's No. 1 supporter, who has singlehandedly remade the once proud Boston Bruins into a failed franchise, is now chairman of the board.

It's 100% right, Hopefully Bill Wirtz does NOT become the Assistant chairman of the board.:naughty:


Just one businessman quietly talking turkey with 29 prospective partners. Balsillie's got his own plane. He certainly could have rejigged his schedule. Maybe he could have offered a thought or two on how the NHL might achieve greater success in the wireless world.
I totally agree and :biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh::biglaugh:, They need it
 

Lil' Jimmy Norton*

Registered User
Jan 31, 2005
1,056
0
Pittsburgh, PA
Bettman is a failure as the Commissioner. He keeps trying to push hockey into the southern US where there is little interest. Nevermind Nashville, Florida is bleeding to death and they are next on the block. No TV contract worth a piece of bear **** in the US..the NBC freebie is a joke and the Versus is another Joke.

He looks like a clown on this one and if I was an NHL owner I'd convene a board of governors vote immediately and have Bettman explain to all owners why Leiopold should walk on a 240 million dollar offer to accept 190 million and the move the team to the FAILED KC market. Makes no sense it smells bad and this could be headed to court real fast and the NHL does not need that kind of press.
 

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