NBA Toronto Raptors thread

[Virtanen18]

Build through the draft. I don't expect big free agents to sign in Toronto, so the only way to get a superstar player is through the draft. It's a waste of time to build around Lowry and DeRozan if a team is looking to win a championship. The Raptors did about as well as could be expected with such a roster, and Ujiri did a good job complementing those two, but the problem is that he was trying to complement them in the first place. DeRozan and Lowry are the second and third options on a championship contender, not the first and second. There is more than enough NBA history to tell us this.

I just don't see the point in blowing up a good team and hoping to luck into a team as good as this one in the future through the draft.

 

[JackSlater]

I just don't see the point in blowing up a good team and hoping to luck into a team as good as this one in the future through the draft.

I already said the point. The Raptors do not have the foundation required to win a championship. No team is going to win a championship with DeRozan and Lowry as its best players. You blow up the team (as the Raptors should have done two years ago) so that you can build a stronger team down the road. NBA champions are built around top 5, maybe top 10 players and the Raptors don't have any. As noted, the Raptors are unlikely to acquire such players through free agency.

 

[Virtanen18]

I already said the point. The Raptors do not have the foundation required to win a championship. No team is going to win a championship with DeRozan and Lowry as its best players. You blow up the team (as the Raptors should have done two years ago) so that you can build a stronger team down the road. NBA champions are built around top 5, maybe top 10 players and the Raptors don't have any. As noted, the Raptors are unlikely to acquire such players through free agency.

You can still be happy with a very good team. Maybe with a new coach you get more competitive. Don't have to always blow it up just cause you're not a contender in a league where it's really hard to win, especially with LeBron and the warriors around.

Not to mention it would suck ass for the large portion of fans who enjoy this team, who enjoy watching a great regular season before packing the ACC or Jurassic whatever for the playoffs.

 

[JackSlater]

You can still be happy with a very good team. Maybe with a new coach you get more competitive. Don't have to always blow it up just cause you're not a contender in a league where it's really hard to win, especially with LeBron and the warriors around.

Not to mention it would suck ass for the large portion of fans who enjoy this team, who enjoy watching a great regular season before packing the ACC or Jurassic whatever for the playoffs.

I agree that it's somewhat a matter of perspective. If the goal it to just win a bunch of games and make a fun environment then yes, the Raptors have done a good job. It's certainly preferable to the Rob Babcock era when the team stunk and didn't build for anything. If the goal is a championship above all else however it isn't really a reasonable strategy. Blowing up the team certainly doesn't guarantee a championship but it does provide the chance to build something better. Barring some unprecedented free agent signing or an unprecedented (given the talent of the team) run the Raptors just aren't going to win a championship. I'm guessing that if asked Ujiri would say that he wanted the championship, but to be fair I'm not sure that ownership would prefer that route.

 

[dahrougem2]

If all you're interested in is being a good regular season team, you've got the wrong mentality imo.

 

[King Mapes]

I just don't see the point in blowing up a good team and hoping to luck into a team as good as this one in the future through the draft.

Yeah this isn't the NHL where you just build through the draft. You need to be incredibly lucky. This is still a very good team with a chance to win the East next year. We just need to get rid of Ibaka

 

[Virtanen18]

I agree that it's somewhat a matter of perspective. If the goal it to just win a bunch of games and make a fun environment then yes, the Raptors have done a good job. It's certainly preferable to the Rob Babcock era when the team stunk and didn't build for anything. If the goal is a championship above all else however it isn't really a reasonable strategy. Blowing up the team certainly doesn't guarantee a championship but it does provide the chance to build something better. Barring some unprecedented free agent signing or an unprecedented (given the talent of the team) run the Raptors just aren't going to win a championship. I'm guessing that if asked Ujiri would say that he wanted the championship, but to be fair I'm not sure that ownership would prefer that route.

Yeah, that's my point sorta. As a Kings fan, I haven't seen the playoffs in like 40 years. So I sympathize with those who don't want to give up a really good thing for a chance at a great thing. It's okay to be really good and a constant playoff team. If the draft doesn't pan out, or you get a really good player that gives you a few extra wins but still not good enough, then you got to start over again after few years. It's not easy to build a team this good.

 

[JackSlater]

Yeah, that's my point sorta. As a Kings fan, I haven't seen the playoffs in like 40 years. So I sympathize with those who don't want to give up a really good thing for a chance at a great thing. It's okay to be really good and a constant playoff team. If the draft doesn't pan out, or you get a really good player that gives you a few extra wins but still not good enough, then you got to start over again after few years. It's not easy to build a team this good.

As I'm really only interested in the team winning a championship, I consider that the Raptors have been doing largely a waste of time. It isn't building to a championship. If the goal is to have a good regular season, get some home games in the playoffs and maybe make the conference finals, which may be enough for some, then the Raptors have done a good job. If it is to actually win a championship then they have done poorly. I would much rather have bad years that potentially lay the foundation for a championship than have a team this good that isn't actually good enough to win a championship. The path to the NBA championship for the vast majority of NBA history is through acquiring superstar players. If the only way the Raptors can do that is through the draft then that is the path that should be taken, and if that becomes much easier through losing records then that's fine.

 

[King Mapes]

In order to win you need a superstar like James or Curry. So the notion of "lets build through the draft" is silly. This team is very good, they just can't play against James. He has owned us.

 

[Stylizer1]

As I'm really only interested in the team winning a championship, I consider that the Raptors have been doing largely a waste of time. It isn't building to a championship. If the goal is to have a good regular season, get some home games in the playoffs and maybe make the conference finals, which may be enough for some, then the Raptors have done a good job. If it is to actually win a championship then they have done poorly. I would much rather have bad years that potentially lay the foundation for a championship than have a team this good that isn't actually good enough to win a championship. The path to the NBA championship for the vast majority of NBA history is through acquiring superstar players. If the only way the Raptors can do that is through the draft then that is the path that should be taken, and if that becomes much easier through losing records then that's fine.

The Raptors are stuck in the middle of the pack even though they have really good regular seasons. They don't have the assets to get any better and are too good to draft elite talent. This happens to a lot of NHL teams who over estimate their success and make moves that on paper look great but does nothing to improve the holes that are not exploited through 82 games. The Raptors are in a poor conference playing against poor teams that look better than they are because of playing mostly other poor to average teams that have decent records. Cleveland only needed to coast and make the playoffs because they knew no one was really a threat. They were always waiting for Boston.

 

[Reality Check]

In order to win you need a superstar like James or Curry. So the notion of "lets build through the draft" is silly. This team is very good, they just can't play against James. He has owned us.

Indiana blew out these same Cavs twice and forced them to a game 7. Boston is in the process of blowing the Cavs out in games 1 and 2.

Toronto is broken. Period.

 

[King Mapes]

Indiana blew out these same Cavs twice and forced them to a game 7. Boston is in the process of blowing the Cavs out in games 1 and 2.

Toronto is broken. Period.

Cavs are in the Raps head. Period. Everybody knows that. But there is like 2-3 serious contenders every year so no point to just blow it up and hope to get a team this good within 10 years.

 

[c9777666]

Moreso LeBron is in Toronto’s heads.

If he leaves the Cavs, you think that psychological edge Cleveland has will still be there?

 

[Stylizer1]

Cavs are in the Raps head. Period. Everybody knows that. But there is like 2-3 serious contenders every year so no point to just blow it up and hope to get a team this good within 10 years.

Or Cleveland has a team full of veterans who can handle the pressure because they have been there before..

 

[NJDevs26]

Awkward...

 

[Dr Pepper]

Raps end up with both feet in their mouth on that one.

Three years of incompetence against a conference "rival" - usually rivalries aren't as one-sided - and it's the coach who gets the axe? The same year he's nominated for being the best coach in the league?

Yeah, smart play Ujiri.

 

[Stylizer1]

DeRozan posting cryptic messages now? Keep that shit off social media and talk with friends and family or professionals. Mental health is a serious issue in society and it is good when people can share their feelings but in this case it looks like he is seeking attention.

 

[Silencio]

I wonder if Toronto was located in Pennsylvania or California or Texas whether the media would be hyping the Raptors up as a possible LeBron free agency destination. You'd think the team that just finished as the number 1 seed in the eastern conference and is missing that one superstar player to take them to the next level would at least merit some consideration, but not a peep. (Yes I know there would be cap issues, but for LeBron you make it work.)

 

[Stylizer1]

I wonder if Toronto was located in Pennsylvania or California or Texas whether the media would be hyping the Raptors up as a possible LeBron free agency destination. You'd think the team that just finished as the number 1 seed in the eastern conference and is missing that one superstar player to take them to the next level would at least merit some consideration, but not a peep. (Yes I know there would be cap issues, but for LeBron you make it work.)

Not good enough supporting cast and he would make Lowry dispensable. Maybe playing with Lebron DeRozan becomes better.

 

[Dr Pepper]

I doubt Lebron has any interest in taking his talents north of the border.

That said, Toronto is in obvious need of a big shakeup so maybe they'll roll out the red carpet and make a push for him.

Maybe that's why they're holding off on announcing a new head coach?

 

[Stylizer1]

Maybe the Raps were too hasty firing Casey with lebron gone.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Maybe the Raps were too hasty firing Casey with lebron gone.

Probably. East has opened up for them, big time.

It's looking like they're going to try, again, with the same core group that has failed every year prior. If it doesn't work this time around, with no threat of "LeBronto", blow it the **** up.

That said, I'll have a big ol' laugh if the Pistons reach the finals before Toronto does.

 

[dahrougem2]

Let's not kid ourselves, the Raptors were not going to beat either Boston or Philadelphia even with LeBron gone.

 

[Hadoop]

That said, I'll have a big ol' laugh if the Pistons reach the finals before Toronto does.

Would love for this to come true, but have you seen the Pistons the last few years? There's a reason why they can't even succeed in being mediocre.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Would love for this to come true, but have you seen the Pistons the last few years? There's a reason why they can't even succeed in being mediocre.

Yeah they're a far cry from the days of Ben Wallace, no doubt.

Maybe a full year of Blake Griffin will help the resurgence.

Hiring the coach of the year obviously can't hurt either.

Thanks, Masai.