Value of: Toronto - Calgary (Nylander + Hamilton)

[Volica]

Flames fans wishing hamilton can get them nylander.

More like hamilton for bracco + 2nd

Morgan Klimchuk + 2nd for Rielly.
Done.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Morgan Klimchuk + 2nd for Rielly.
Done.

You are going to send Klimchuck 1st a 2nd and Tkachuk for Rielly???

 

[Menzinger]

Hamilton is a great player, but he’s too old and not quite good enough for the Leafs to trade Nylander for.

Not to mention, if Nylander has a 70+ point season next which is well within reality, his value would jump considerably

 

[Volica]

You are going to send Klimchuck 1st a 2nd and Tkachuk for Rielly???

Pointing out how absurd that was.
Just an FYI, Matt Tkachuk, not a single player on Toronto other than Matthews (who clearly has much more value) I'd move for.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Pointing out how absurd that was.
Just an FYI, Matt Tkachuk, not a single player on Toronto other than Matthews (who clearly has much more value) I'd move for.

Oh, well I saw that you were missing some players in your proposal, so I guessed. I would keep Tkachuk if he were my player too!

 

[super6646]

Flames fans wishing hamilton can get them nylander.

More like hamilton for bracco + 2nd

LOL. Sure, and I guess #1 D-men grow on trees too eh - because that's how much you seem value them. XD

 

[Tkachuky]

Hamilton is a great player, but he’s too old and not quite good enough for the Leafs to trade Nylander for.

Not to mention, if Nylander has a 70+ point season next which is well within reality, his value would jump considerably

He’s too old.... hahahahahahahHahah.

 

[CgyFlamesftw]

Hamilton is a great player, but he’s too old and not quite good enough for the Leafs to trade Nylander for.

Not to mention, if Nylander has a 70+ point season next which is well within reality, his value would jump considerably

Too old? Da f***.

 

[CaptainCrunch67]

Hamilton is a great player, but he’s too old and not quite good enough for the Leafs to trade Nylander for.

Not to mention, if Nylander has a 70+ point season next which is well within reality, his value would jump considerably

You just came across as clueless, congratulations. You know he's 24.

I'm going to reverse this though. Nylander on his own isn't enough to get Hamilton.

 

[connormcmuffin]

McDavid must really be trash then.

Shallow take, remind me why the Leafs need Hamiton for Nylander +

Context matters

 

[connormcmuffin]

Too old? Da ****.

Compared to Nylander yes, Hamilton is pretty much at his ceiling, Nylander is still developing to his.

 

[connormcmuffin]

You just came across as clueless, congratulations. You know he's 24.

I'm going to reverse this though. Nylander on his own isn't enough to get Hamilton.

Lol, Captain Crunch is calling me clueless, so cute.

Nylander is coming off an ELC Hamilton has a couple seasons left until he'll become massively overpaid for declining UFA years. Which asset has the most long term return for the investment. Nylander prime years are ahead of them while Hamilton is pretty much in his prime.

The age difference matters in this context but you, me, everyone reading this already knows that, so spare me the 'clueless' bs.

Oh and Hamilton is right handed Jake Gardiner, dude is meh.

 

[Lunatik]

Compared to Nylander yes, Hamilton is pretty much at his ceiling, Nylander is still developing to his.

Defensemen are rarely to never at their ceiling at age 24. Jesus Christ some of the shit spewed on here is mind numbingly bad.

 

[connormcmuffin]

Defensemen are rarely to never at their ceiling at age 24. Jesus Christ some of the **** spewed on here is mind numbingly bad.

Is he going to develop a transition game that he's never had.... imagination land is where Hamitlon is going to get better after a career year.

Are you upset

 

[Doyoulikeapples*]

Add a first to Hamilton and I may trade nylander for him.

 

[Kybb79]

I watched all playoff games Toronto and Boston. Why would Calgary make this trade Nylander is so soft. Honestly i didn't notice him against Boston.

 

[Lunatik]

Is he going to develop a transition game that he's never had.... imagination land is where Hamitlon is going to get better after a career year.

Are you upset

Not in the slightest. Why would your blatantly obvious lack of knowledge of this subject upset me?

 

[connormcmuffin]

Not in the slightest. Why would your blatantly obvious lack of knowledge of this subject upset me?

"Jesus Christ some of the **** spewed on here is mind numbingly bad." Sure...

I love getting condescended to by someone that can't tell the difference between a player an ELC and an RFA, that has not ever looked at an age production curve.

What age do most defenseman peak, can you tell me that Wutang

 

[Lunatik]

"Jesus Christ some of the **** spewed on here is mind numbingly bad." Sure...

I love getting condescended to by someone that can't tell the difference between a player an ELC and an RFA, that has not ever looked at an age production curve.

What age do most defenseman peak, can you tell me that Wutang

Thinking you post mindnumbing stupid shit is not the same as being upset. Not sure why that is so difficult for you to understand.

Also where did I say a single thing about an ELC or RFAs? Hint: I didn't. Sto[p blatantly making things up, you are only making yourself look even worse.

It's widely known that forwards hit their primes at younger ages than defensemen, because developing the defensive game in the NHL takes experience. So being 3 years different in age, really isn't as big of a deal as you are trying to make it out to be. The fact you referred to a 24 year old top pairing defenseman as "too old" is really all that needs to be said about the intelligence you are bringing to the table to this conversation.

 

[loyaltotheend]

I sincerely wish any of you claiming Hamilton isn't a number 1 would back that up statistically.

You won't be able to

I'm at work and only have my phone. Can you please post his stats away from Giordano that show he's an undisputed #1?

I got my doubts, but who knows. Prove me wrong

 

[Liferleafer]

I watched all playoff games Toronto and Boston. Why would Calgary make this trade Nylander is so soft. Honestly i didn't notice him against Boston.

I watched all of Calgary's playoffs games as well.....the whole team,incuding Hamilton, were just plain invisible....like seriously, didn't notice any of them.

 

[Flameshomer]

I'm at work and only have my phone. Can you please post his stats away from Giordano that show he's an undisputed #1?

I got my doubts, but who knows. Prove me wrong

It's been posted a few times on this site already, which is why I challenged in the opposite direction, but here you go:

Player 1	Player 2	GP	TOI	CF	CA	CF%	FF	FA	FF%	SF	SA	SF%	GF	GA	GF%	SCF	SCA	SCF%	HDCF	HDCA	HDCF%	HDGF	HDGA	HDGF%	On-Ice SH%	On-Ice SV%	PDO	Off. Zone Faceoffs	Neu. Zone Faceoffs	Def. Zone Faceoffs	Off. Zone Faceoff %
Dougie Hamilton	Mark Giordano	82	1261:28	1507	1080	58.25	1141	837	57.68	784	590	57.06	53	48	52.48	652	467	58.27	284	176	61.74	22	24	47.83	6.76	91.86	0.986	530	472	450	54.08
Dougie Hamilton	w/o Mark Giordano	82	168:07	200	175	53.33	139	134	50.92	100	100	50.00	11	11	50.00	87	86	50.29	38	38	50.00	6	6	50.00	11.00	89.00	1.000	9	14	28	24.32
w/o Dougie Hamilton	Mark Giordano	82	161:52	184	161	53.33	138	114	54.76	97	88	52.43	5	6	45.45	89	78	53.29	38	34	52.78	2	4	33.33	5.15	93.18	0.983	28	18	35	44.44
w/o Dougie Hamilton	w/o Mark Giordano	82	2301:43	2286	2214	50.80	1709	1653	50.83	1165	1162	50.06	78	93

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Conclusion: best together but hamiltons numbers away from gio are better than the reverse. Aka Hamilton is not just an offensive d man and is not getting carried around on the pairing.
I don't think anyone is really arguing that gio isn't too pair worthy but Hamilton is just as good. He's not as physical but imo that might come with age.

Sourced from: Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick

 

[loyaltotheend]

It's been posted a few times on this site already, which is why I challenged in the opposite direction, but here you go:

Player 1	Player 2	GP	TOI	CF	CA	CF%	FF	FA	FF%	SF	SA	SF%	GF	GA	GF%	SCF	SCA	SCF%	HDCF	HDCA	HDCF%	HDGF	HDGA	HDGF%	On-Ice SH%	On-Ice SV%	PDO	Off. Zone Faceoffs	Neu. Zone Faceoffs	Def. Zone Faceoffs	Off. Zone Faceoff %
Dougie Hamilton	Mark Giordano	82	1261:28	1507	1080	58.25	1141	837	57.68	784	590	57.06	53	48	52.48	652	467	58.27	284	176	61.74	22	24	47.83	6.76	91.86	0.986	530	472	450	54.08
Dougie Hamilton	w/o Mark Giordano	82	168:07	200	175	53.33	139	134	50.92	100	100	50.00	11	11	50.00	87	86	50.29	38	38	50.00	6	6	50.00	11.00	89.00	1.000	9	14	28	24.32
w/o Dougie Hamilton	Mark Giordano	82	161:52	184	161	53.33	138	114	54.76	97	88	52.43	5	6	45.45	89	78	53.29	38	34	52.78	2	4	33.33	5.15	93.18	0.983	28	18	35	44.44
w/o Dougie Hamilton	w/o Mark Giordano	82	2301:43	2286	2214	50.80	1709	1653	50.83	1165	1162	50.06	78	93

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Conclusion: best together but hamiltons numbers away from gio are better than the reverse. Aka Hamilton is not just an offensive d man and is not getting carried around on the pairing.
I don't think anyone is really arguing that gio isn't too pair worthy but Hamilton is just as good. He's not as physical but imo that might come with age.

Sourced from: Line Stats - Natural Stat Trick

First of all thank you for the reply.

It looks like very limited use when not paired with Giordano? 168 minutes over 82 games... is that all from this year? Even in such a small sample (certainly compared to 1260 minutes together) those numbers are decent but not amazing to me.

Don't misunderstand me either. I'm not trying to argue he's no good, nor do I agree with other ridiculous posts trying to say his value is low. All I'm saying is I don't think he's shown he is a guy to carry the top pair.

 

[Flameshomer]

First of all thank you for the reply.

It looks like very limited use when not paired with Giordano? 168 minutes over 82 games... is that all from this year? Even in such a small sample (certainly compared to 1260 minutes together) those numbers are decent but not amazing to me.

Don't misunderstand me either. I'm not trying to argue he's no good, nor do I agree with other ridiculous posts trying to say his value is low. All I'm saying is I don't think he's shown he is a guy to carry the top pair.

Respectfully I disagree. The gio-hamilton pair has been consistently rated one of the best pairs in the league by pundits over the last three seasons. The stats I just posted show that Hamilton is not being carried by gio, in fact he enhances gios stats. If he can do that I would reckon he could carry his own pair.
You are correct that they didn't play often apart, but 160 minutes is still ~8 full games at 20 minutes a night. Its ~10% of a season. Not insignificant. And the raw truth is that they are just better together so why play them apart

 

[loyaltotheend]

Respectfully I disagree. The gio-hamilton pair has been consistently rated one of the best pairs in the league by pundits over the last three seasons. The stats I just posted show that Hamilton is not being carried by gio, in fact he enhances gios stats. If he can do that I would reckon he could carry his own pair.
You are correct that they didn't play often apart, but 160 minutes is still ~8 full games at 20 minutes a night. Its ~10% of a season. Not insignificant. And the raw truth their is that they are just better together so why play them apart

We will agree to disagree. Thanks for the discussion