This isn't over

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nyr7andcounting

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Feb 24, 2004
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Jaded-Fan said:
Face it people, season is toast. No one would risk yanking everyone else around yet another time. They made their final shot, then one more. If they still were negotiating they would have said 'meeting again tomorrow' instead of releasing dueling recrimination press releases. I see no purpose if they were going to go back to serious negotiations to play these games otherwise. It is officially done. I only hope that they have enough sense to step back and hammer something out before September, but I am doubtful. This will likely have to play all the way out through replacement players and the complete breaking of the union.

Its very possible that they said no progress in order to get the media off of their backs. They could have continued the meeting last night and Sunday morning for all we know....it's better off we don't know so that if a deal isn't reached we aren't dissapointed for the 3rd time.
 

Jaded-Fan

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nyr7andcounting said:
Its very possible that they said no progress in order to get the media off of their backs. They could have continued the meeting last night and Sunday morning for all we know....it's better off we don't know so that if a deal isn't reached we aren't dissapointed for the 3rd time.


All cloak and dagger theories aside, it is done:

With no new meetings planned, NHL chief legal officer Bill Daly said it was too late to save this season, and that the league's focus would turn to getting a deal done for the 2005-06 season set to start in October.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/02/20/NHL.TMP
 

ResidentAlien*

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Brindfan said:
It just means that like myself. You got to see guys like LaFleur, Bossy, Gretzky, Orr, Dryden, Makita, Parent, both Espositos, Clarke, Trottier, Coffey, Bourque, and so many other hall of famers, play this wonderful game.
..the Mahavolichs, Robinson, Plante, the road runner..yup you'all are old :)
 

Crows*

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Jaded-Fan said:
All cloak and dagger theories aside, it is done:

With no new meetings planned, NHL chief legal officer Bill Daly said it was too late to save this season, and that the league's focus would turn to getting a deal done for the 2005-06 season set to start in October.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/02/20/NHL.TMP


Thena again who thought they would even be talks and almost uncancel the season after it was cancelled.
 

Jaded-Fan

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HoCkeYfAnAtiC30 said:


You do not get it. Apparently, based on the NHL not going to $45 million, they are more fearful of getting an offer with a $45 million Cap then they are of losing $70 million from ESPN. They just must not have the money. In any event, how much money is that? Just over $2 million a team? Is that worth being saddled with a deal that will kill you for six years? If they come back does anyone doubt that they will get some telelvision deal? So, if it is only $35 million even the teams have lost a bit over $1 million each. Well worth it not to cave don't you think? That ESPN deal is less of a hammer over the owners than the player's must have thought it was. They should have thanked every god in the pantheon that the owners brought back that wednesday offer one more time and jumped all over it. The offer next season will be much less. Even if they would win before the NLRB the league would go bankrupt before having to pay it. There is no way the players can win. If the owners have been idiots in this the players once more have proven to the world that they can out-idiot anyone.
 

codswallop

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Jaded-Fan said:
You do not get it. Apparently, based on the NHL not going to $45 million, they are more fearful of getting an offer with a $45 million Cap then they are of losing $70 million from ESPN. They just must not have the money. In any event, how much money is that? Just over $2 million a team? Is that worth being saddled with a deal that will kill you for six years? If they come back does anyone doubt that they will get some telelvision deal? So, if it is only $35 million even the teams have lost a bit over $1 million each. Well worth it not to cave don't you think? That ESPN deal is less of a hammer over the owners than the player's must have thought it was. They should have thanked every god in the pantheon that the owners brought back that wednesday offer one more time and jumped all over it. The offer next season will be much less. Even if they would win before the NLRB the league would go bankrupt before having to pay it. There is no way the players can win. If the owners have been idiots in this the players once more have proven to the world that they can out-idiot anyone.

I do believe that the stance the owners are taking is for the betterment of the league in the long haul. Not entirely mind you, but at least enough to stem the tide. A complete financial overhaul of the league for the good is pretty much a utopian concept, given the collective aspect they operate under.

Now, we don't know for certain what ESPN will do and we don't know what the bigger sponsors will do. But even the threat of losing such influential partners is a major concern, and it goes beyond mere dollars.

Faith, trust, a belief that you can generate revenues; these are reasons why certain institutions offer and/or loan out money. It's done on merit, future expectations playing a large role. Sans details, this is a fairly simplistic view of what you could term "investments". Every business has to account for this and any changes that they can possibly see occuring.

Both parties are playing with fire right now. Their cash cows have hinted at reluctance; that is never a good sign. And the faith of potential sponsors is at risk as well. The NHL could recover from this hit, though it's a pretty high probability that it would take quite a while. Given the current state of the league, that's not the best probability to play off of.

Saving this season would be of tremendous help. Even guaranteeing the league would start up in October despite this lost season would help a bit. Anything less, we're in trouble. Fans, players, owners; everyone.
 

futurcorerock

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Key Fact: No "deal" has come of this, from either side.

I like the theory of getting the media off their backs. Thats too much pressure for bargaining groups to say that there will be a season, let alone an announcement by 6pm Saturday Evening. Hard to say that they'd get a deal done in 6 hours when said "differences" remained.

Plus, I bring up the question of the last lockout: For all the old timers here on the boards.. do you recall the last "announcement" that a season was saved? By what i've heard from personal accounts, it came largely as a surprise to the media and fans.

It just doesnt make sense why the owners and players would let these talks go defeated like this. No sense at all.
 

mr gib

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Smail said:
Don't be so negative. The owners will use the "impasse" card next year early on and the majority of players will cross, the union will break and hockey will be on again.
we won't see any of the older star's though - and in vancouver our team will be broken up - thus losing our chance to win the cup -
 

NJD Jester

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HoCkeYfAnAtiC30 said:

ESPN is posturing for the next TV rights deal. That's all this is.

The cable universe is too big to worry about what ESPN does/doesn't want. It's not like ESPN has exactly *helped* hockey over the last decade, has it?

And wouldn't it be nice for the NHL to help its old buddy Rupie Murdoch launch that anti-ESPN cable sports network he's been rumbling about...
 

futurcorerock

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E's blog finally is posting rumors again, so the train ride is starting up again.

Not saying E knows what he's talking about, but he's a pretty good writer and reading him has some value. You can gague some proactive action within the negotiations based on his "rumors". Somethings going to happen soon.
 

DownFromNJ

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Although I don't believe a word Eklund says, I wouldn't be surprised by his comments. I also wouldn't be surprised that by lieing and building a huge fanbase, he actually acquire a real source or two.

All I know is that the NHLPA would be dumb not to take the 42.5.
 

Psycho Papa Joe

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Los Tiburones said:
THEY ARE IRRATIONAL. THEY ARE MORONS. THEY AREN'T ACTING LIKE THIS IS A BUSINESS (never mind a sport that fans want to watch). THEY DONT CARE ABOUT FAN GOOD WILL AND THE DESTRUCTION OF THE LEAGUE. THEY DONT CARE ABOUT LOSING ESPN. THEY DONT CARE ABOUT ANYTHING BUT DESTROYING EACH OTHER. NO DEAL WILL BE MADE EVER, BECAUSE NEITHER SIDE WANTS TO HAVE TO SAY THAT THEY LOST THE GREAT LABOR WAR OF 2004-2005. TOTALLY PATHETICALLY STUPID. .
It's the highest stake pissing contest I have ever seen. Maybe they should decide it by rock paper scissors, whoever has the strongest daddy or amazing feats of strength.
 

NJD Jester

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DownFromNJ said:
All I know is that the NHLPA would be dumb not to take the 42.5.

Only as dumb as the NHL for not taking $45 and a 24% rollback.

So Eklund starts posting the usual B.S. rumors. And then Canadian radio reports them as fact, The Hockey News chimes in with its report, everyone gets lathered up...and we still don't have NHL hockey until the ScabHawks play the Scabitals on Opening Night.
 

futurcorerock

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DownFromNJ said:
Although I don't believe a word Eklund says, I wouldn't be surprised by his comments. I also wouldn't be surprised that by lieing and building a huge fanbase, he actually acquire a real source or two.

All I know is that the NHLPA would be dumb not to take the 42.5.
The only lingering question is whether or not the renegade owners are dumb enough to kill 42.5

edit: If that's even the case. This has to be a kill job by the bargaining units to get the media off their backs. There were too many mixed signals for this thing to be dead. Mario/Wayne stragely upbeat doesnt mesh very well with Saskin and Daly saying "game over!"
 

Lanny'sDaMan

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Feb 19, 2005
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I do not understand all thisoptimism here. The season is over. If anything yesterday showed us that theowners have no intention of playing fair or having a season this year <if ever>. Even if the nhlpa decided to accept the owners last offer <which they said they catagorically refused> the owners would find other reasons not to play, probably citing the late date as a valid reason not to play.

It's time to wake up, take off the Rose coloured glasses and see reality. There will not be any NHL games this year. There will not be a playoff this year. Lord Stanley's Mug has been tarnished for all time.
 

SuperUnknown

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Baradin said:
I do not understand all thisoptimism here. The season is over. If anything yesterday showed us that theowners have no intention of playing fair or having a season this year <if ever>. Even if the nhlpa decided to accept the owners last offer <which they said they catagorically refused> the owners would find other reasons not to play, probably citing the late date as a valid reason not to play.

It's time to wake up, take off the Rose coloured glasses and see reality. There will not be any NHL games this year. There will not be a playoff this year. Lord Stanley's Mug has been tarnished for all time.

Damn curse of the Red Sox.
 
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DownFromNJ

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Mar 7, 2004
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Only as dumb as the NHL for not taking $45 and a 24% rollback.

The NHL has something to gain. They were losing money last year. The NHLPA doesn't. Again, read the article I wrote for my blog. My math shows it just doesn't add up.



blog
 

SENSible1*

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Baradin said:
I do not understand all thisoptimism here. The season is over. If anything yesterday showed us that theowners have no intention of playing fair or having a season this year <if ever>. Even if the nhlpa decided to accept the owners last offer <which they said they catagorically refused> the owners would find other reasons not to play, probably citing the late date as a valid reason not to play.

It's time to wake up, take off the Rose coloured glasses and see reality. There will not be any NHL games this year. There will not be a playoff this year. Lord Stanley's Mug has been tarnished for all time.

No, if the PA completely crumbled and came back accepting the deal the owners offered yesterday, the owners would take it and run, laughing all the way to the bank.

Unfortunately, it won't happen.
 

futurcorerock

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Baradin said:
I do not understand all thisoptimism here. The season is over. If anything yesterday showed us that theowners have no intention of playing fair or having a season this year <if ever>. Even if the nhlpa decided to accept the owners last offer <which they said they catagorically refused> the owners would find other reasons not to play, probably citing the late date as a valid reason not to play.

It's time to wake up, take off the Rose coloured glasses and see reality. There will not be any NHL games this year. There will not be a playoff this year. Lord Stanley's Mug has been tarnished for all time.
It's not over.

:p:
 

Otter

Registered User
"No, if the PA completely crumbled and came back accepting the deal the owners offered yesterday"

lol. Have you read Eklund recently? too funny. players might be doing that.


FYI I have no hope for this year what so ever.
 

NewBreed19

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futurcorerock said:
It's not over.

:p:
It's over! There is no way the union stops their stance on protecting the higher paid members of the association. They are not going to except the 42.5 and they are not going to put it to a vote either. They are fighting so that the rich players stay rich , they don't care about the other 650 or so that don't make as much. It's over; you live in a dream land. :D
 
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