The Taylor Hall Thread II: Taylor Ham Edition

[Kurt Cobain]

I don't think it's safe to say Parise is a better finisher and better around the net. With both players you could say we're best playing around the net. This season for Taylor Hall is the equivalent season as the same age as Parise's breakout year. That's the year when he put up 45 goals and 94 points, which was our best scoring team since like 2001 which is sad. Taylor was stuck playing with young talented players who didn't know what they were doing. parise was playing with some of the most smartest well rounded players that were in the league.

Parise's time here always seems positive to me. Yeah the early exits from the playoffs weren't fun. However, we had fun regular seasons especially 2006 and that 2012 playoffs with Parise as captain was unforgettable. A conference championship isn't a Stanley Cup but it's quite an accomplishment and something we fans should appreciate at least in hindsight, especially when knock the Rangers out in overtime of the ECF.

Hall PPG - .35
Parise PPG - .38

Parise was my favorite player post lockout, but I was dispointed he wasn't a perrennial 40+ goal scorer. I know it's easier said than done especially playing on some of the worst offenses in 30 years. I just had high hopes on him being the greatest American player or at least forward, delusions of grandeur I suppose. After the following season he scored 38 since then he's been a 25-29 goals guy which something the wild might be disappointed by. I love Parise but Hall is just better at everything in my opinion besides two way game and the better goal scoring will become much more evident by the end of next season or sometime next season. The only thing that can stop him is injuries.

Hall is just about to enter his prime and I fully expect 35+ goals year in year out, sprinkled with a 40 goal year once or twice, barring injury. When everything is said and done Hall will be the better goal scorer without a doubt, especially with high end prospects improving and a FA signing or one to two of those high end free agents, that's just by the end of this season or by some point this year. He's left an organization trending upwards and the went to one also trending upwards. This team is young and improving little by little, we got the goaltender, have to sure up the defense with an FA signing hopefully and hopefully Santini shows what he's capable of. Plus we need a top 6 right winger I have to check out the upcoming RW free agents this coming off season.. Alright I'm done blanking.

 

[Edmonton East]

Kovalchuk > Hall

1. Elias
2. Kovalchuk
3. Hall
4. Parise

Nope. At their absolute best during their respective time with NJ, Parise was definitely better than Kovalchuk. It isn't even close.

I think Hall will be better than Kovy as well during his tenure.

 

[Zippy316]

Nope. At their absolute best during their respective time with NJ, Parise was definitely better than Kovalchuk. It isn't even close.

I think Hall will be better than Kovy as well during his tenure.

They are all debatable. At their peaks in NJ, they are all just as good for different reasons.

Kovalchuk was dominant at points in 2011-12. Parise had some terrific seasons in 2007-08 and 2008-09. Hall has been terrific thus far and I don't think we've seen his bet yet.

 

[NjDevs4994]

Right when that puck popped out to Hall last game I knew he would score it. Haven't felt that way about any of our forwards since Parise or Kovy. It's nice to have someone with elite finishing ability again.

 

[severian]

Nope. At their absolute best during their respective time with NJ, Parise was definitely better than Kovalchuk. It isn't even close.

I think Hall will be better than Kovy as well during his tenure.

Agreed. The Devils got peak Parise. We didn't have peak Kovalchuk.

We might be getting peak Hall, and I'm really excited about that prospect. He's really worth the price of admission.

 

[Feed Me A Stray Cat]

Right when that puck popped out to Hall last game I knew he would score it. Haven't felt that way about any of our forwards since Parise or Kovy. It's nice to have someone with elite finishing ability again.

Hall strikes me as more of a volume player than a finisher player. He generates tons of chances and gets a lot of shots on net, but he isn't necessarily great at finishing.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...id=0&type=individual&sort=ishpct&sortdir=DESC

Hall's actually towards the bottom of the league in ES shooting percentage over the last four years (103 / 139).

Not any real slight on him, because he generates so many chances / shots that he doesn't need to convert at a high rate to put up goals and points.

 

[Feed Me A Stray Cat]

Would you believe that Hall averages more assists/60 minutes at ES than Crosby? His playmaking ability is seriously underrated.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...&type=individual&sort=iassists60&sortdir=DESC

1. Thornton - 1.74
2. Getzlaf - 1.64
3. Hall - 1.57
4. Crosby - 1.55
5. Benn - 1.50

You wouldn't naturally think of this comparison due to their differing positions, statures and playing styles, but Hall's numbers are strikingly similar to Getzlaf's (Hall / Getzlaf):

G60: 0.76 / 0.73
A60: 1.57 / 1.64
P60: 2.33 / 2.36
PA60: 0.98 / 1.02

In nominal terms, both have 44 ES goals over the last four years, while Getzlaf has 99 ES assists and Hall has 91.

 

[Edmonton East]

They are all debatable. At their peaks in NJ, they are all just as good for different reasons.

Kovalchuk was dominant at points in 2011-12. Parise had some terrific seasons in 2007-08 and 2008-09. Hall has been terrific thus far and I don't think we've seen his bet yet.

I disagree and that's okay.

Parise did everything (complete player) for this team from 2008 to 2010 and produced more than Kovy ever did in NJ during their peaks. Parise's peak was higher with NJ and obviously if you want to factor in full tenure with the organization, Parise had the much greater impact. That's why I can't see Kovy ever being above Parise.

Small sample size, but I think Hall is much more consistently visible every single game than Kovy ever was with this team. Of course Kovy was great as well, I'm not saying he wasn't.

I followed Hall when he was with the Oilers a ton and he was always one of my favorite non-Devs. This is why I was arguing for weeks on the mainboard disproving Klefbom's bs comments with statistics. So I clearly had high expectations for Hall, and he has still managed to overachieve from my perspective. Henrique has been horrendous and this guy is constantly driving offense by himself.

 

[Zippy316]

Hall strikes me as more of a volume player than a finisher player. He generates tons of chances and gets a lot of shots on net, but he isn't necessarily great at finishing.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...id=0&type=individual&sort=ishpct&sortdir=DESC

Hall's actually towards the bottom of the league in ES shooting percentage over the last four years (103 / 139).

Not any real slight on him, because he generates so many chances / shots that he doesn't need to convert at a high rate to put up goals and points.

On a chance like that, I think Hall finishes 9 times out of 10. Same with Cammalleri. I'd give the majority of our forwards a 6/10 or lower on that.

What seems to happen with Hall is the opposing defenders give him space because they don't want to get beaten by his speed. He doesn't have a threatening shot so they can afford to give him some space. From that perspective, it seems like a lot of Hall's chances are plays where he is kept to the outside in a low-scoring area. Often times, a sharp angle where a goalie can see the puck and take away all the chances.

His advanced stats just seem to reflect the way he plays the game and teams defend him.

EDIT: Just saw your last post and I'm not surprised. Teams seem to back off of him and give him space so they're not beaten by his speed. Gives him more room to make plays and find lanes. If we had a better finisher on his line, he'd probably have more points right now.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Would you believe that Hall averages more assists/60 minutes at ES than Crosby? His playmaking ability is seriously underrated.

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...&type=individual&sort=iassists60&sortdir=DESC

1. Thornton - 1.74
2. Getzlaf - 1.64
3. Hall - 1.57
4. Crosby - 1.55
5. Benn - 1.50

You wouldn't naturally think of this comparison due to their differing positions, statures and playing styles, but Hall's numbers are strikingly similar to Getzlaf's (Hall / Getzlaf):

G60: 0.76 / 0.73
A60: 1.57 / 1.64
P60: 2.33 / 2.36
PA60: 0.98 / 1.02

In nominal terms, both have 44 ES goals over the last four years, while Getzlaf has 99 ES assists and Hall has 91.

Pretty incredible stuff...If he can keep producing on the PP like this year, his overall production is gonna be great. Incredibly, last year he only had 4 goals and 8 assists on the PP. This year he already has 3 goals and 3 assists on the PP.

 

[Classic Devil]

I'm gonna go with Ryane Clowe on that one. Hated that stupid knee-jerk signing.

Clowe isn't really on the books.

 

[Edmonton East]

Pretty incredible stuff...If he can keep producing on the PP like this year, his overall production is gonna be great. Incredibly, last year he only had 4 goals and 8 assists on the PP. This year he already has 3 goals and 3 assists on the PP.

Out of all the dumb critical statements against Hall during the offseason, this sentiment was the worst. Oh yea, a highly skilled guy is actually a detriment to the powerplay when he is out there!

 

[Scorcho]

The Devils pay him, but his contract doesn't count towards the cap because they have him on LTIR.

Pretty sure the insurance actually pays him and savard

 

[goonybird]

Kovalchuk > Hall

1. Elias
2. Kovalchuk
3. Hall
4. Parise

They're the same person. shrug

 

[Triumph]

Nope. At their absolute best during their respective time with NJ, Parise was definitely better than Kovalchuk. It isn't even close.

I think Hall will be better than Kovy as well during his tenure.

It indeed is not close. Part of Kovalchuk's problems here came from the fact that the Devils didn't have a good system for him nor really good linemates whereas Parise under Sutter got to play in the perfect system with the perfect players for him.

I think Hall is a good finisher but his speed allows him to generate low-percentage shots that other players wouldn't be able to. Parise was the same way, he's never been a 'finisher' in terms of percentage but his rate was just so high.

As for other things being discussed here, Clowe is on the books as is Savard.

 

[MadDevil]

Out of all the dumb critical statements against Hall during the offseason, this sentiment was the worst. Oh yea, a highly skilled guy is actually a detriment to the powerplay when he is out there!

Kind of like how a terrible 5-on-5 player was somehow critical to the PP?

 

[Emperoreddy]

Some Oil fans are still quite hostile over all of this.

 

[Zippy316]

It indeed is not close. Part of Kovalchuk's problems here came from the fact that the Devils didn't have a good system for him nor really good linemates whereas Parise under Sutter got to play in the perfect system with the perfect players for him.

I think Hall is a good finisher but his speed allows him to generate low-percentage shots that other players wouldn't be able to. Parise was the same way, he's never been a 'finisher' in terms of percentage but his rate was just so high.

As for other things being discussed here, Clowe is on the books as is Savard.

Just because Kovalchuk wasn't used properly doesn't necessarily mean he is lesser of a player than Hall/Parise though.

To me, all three are in that tier with guys like E. Staal/Getzlaf/Perry. They have a few seasons of elite play but settle back down to that all-star level where they are still putting up just shy of a PPG. Debating them one way or another seems to be nitpicking considering they all play drastically different games and fill different roles. The one argument I might concede is that Hall/Parise play games that are more inclined to be the focal point of a system. For example, Parise set the tone for the team under those Sutter years of how they wanted to play and same goes for Hall right now.

It's definitely an interesting argument, but I doubt the mods are going to want to see it Kovalchuk's name any further...

 

[Cult of Hynes]

Some Oil fans are still quite hostile over all of this.

Pissy is the better word to describe some of them and their revisionist bs and facile arguments haha.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Pissy is the better word to describe some of them and their revisionist bs and facile arguments haha.

I'd use the word delusional.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Hall remains on fire.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Elite.

 

[The Wumpus]

Taylor Hall is an offensive machine.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Taylor remains the best thing about this team.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Hall 5th in the league in points per game