The present is bright and so is the future.

[JD1]

Frankly I question whether Anderson is a good enough goalie at 35 to backstop this team to a cup. Can't imagine he'll be better as he ages.

Best move in free agency for this team's present and future might be to go all in on a true #1 goaltender like Bishop.

Not sure he'd want to come back to a team that traded him though.

ya going all in on bishop sounds good cause he's a proven number 1 that can get it done when it counts. his own team didn't go all in on him

back to the books Hale you need to do more studying on other team's assets

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I would give up A LOT to get Draisaitl in a Sens uniform, unfortunately I don't see Edmonton parting with him. Drai would be a beast of a number one centre here.

8.5 million over 6 years and 4 first round picks might do it

 

[Hale The Villain]

ya going all in on bishop sounds good cause he's a proven number 1 that can get it done when it counts. his own team didn't go all in on him

back to the books Hale you need to do more studying on other team's assets

Tampa didn't re-sign Bishop because they have Vasilevskiy. Their cap issues means they can't give Bishop the money he deserves, and why would they when they have a young #1 in Vasilevskiy signed for much cheaper.

He's had two Vezina caliber seasons in his last 4 years. You want to argue he's not a proven #1 goaltender?

 

[Samsquanch]

Because of terrible cap management we haven't had the money to be able to attract free agents to Ottawa. 23 MILLION in cap space would garner a good player or two on July 1st. Pretending otherwise is asinine. If we wanted to we could have DOUBLED the salaries of Vanek (2.6M), Vermette (1.75M), Stalberg (1.5M), Marchessault (0.75M), and Seidenberg (1M), and still had a ton of cap space left over.

And Ryan's contract wasn't through free agency, it was a re-signing. Might as well have been a UFA given how much Murray gave him though.



Like I said, we'd have 23 MILLION in cap space to fill in those holes. Nothing would have stopped us from making the Phaneuf trade again. Hell we probably could have saved Lindberg and/or the 2017 2nd, cause we wouldn't have had to dump Michalek and Greening with the ridiculous cap space we'd have.

You know what 23M in cap space on July 1st, 2016 gets you?

Okposo (6M)
Staal (3.5M)
Russell (3.1M)
Vanek (2.6M)
Vermette (1.75M)
Grabner (1.65M)
Stalberg (1.5M)
Seidenberg (1M)
Eaves (1M)
Marchessault (0.75M)

Now that's some depth.

Obviously we don't need 8 more good forwards and 2 more good defensemen, and obviously we could not sign a lot of these guys at the salaries they went for, as we'd have to up their salaries to convince them to come to Ottawa, but it does illustrate that having cap space come free agency is a valuable asset.

Good luck winning with your team, it doesn't illustrate anything.

It's a hodgepodge mix of players that doesn't get us anywhere close to being a legitimate contender. Why try to rewrite history with a bunch of maybes?

We already have depth, and we're very competitive with the guys we already have. And we have all our top prospects and picks to either sit on or trade for a big #1C if we ever have the chance.

I'm so glad we have real hockey people running our team. I just don't think that some people here understand how teams work behind the scenes in the lockeroom.

The trades addressed other areas of need on the team, and have by all accounts worked wonders.

 

[Canadian Time]

Good luck winning with your team, it doesn't illustrate anything.

It's a hodgepodge mix of players that doesn't get us anywhere close to being a legitimate contender. Why try to rewrite history with a bunch of maybes?

We already have depth, and we're very competitive with the guys we already have. And we have all our top prospects and picks to either sit on or trade for a big #1C if we ever have the chance.

I'm so glad we have real hockey people running our team. I just don't think that some people here understand how teams work behind the scenes in the lockeroom.

The trades addressed other areas of need on the team, and have by all accounts worked wonders.

Agreed. It's the Tim Murray method of building a team, throw a bunch of individual misfits together and believe you can make it work. It has never worked and never will.

I like this team and the direction they are going. Lots of good here to get behind.

 

[JD1]

Tampa didn't re-sign Bishop because they have Vasilevskiy. Their cap issues means they can't give Bishop the money he deserves, and why would they when they have a young #1 in Vasilevskiy signed for much cheaper.

He's had two Vezina caliber seasons in his last 4 years. You want to argue he's not a proven #1 goaltender?

ya sure I'll argue. Why not.

Regardless what you may believe, NHL teams do not give up elite starting goaltending at Bishop's age - especially for a bag of pucks which is what they got.

Bishop had two seasons where he was a distant 2nd and a distant 3rd from a Vezina. One of those seasons Price was injured. Goalie stats and vezinas are often team awards and I recall TB being pretty good. He came off his "vezina" calibre season last year and his own coach wouldn't name him the starter over some unheralded 22 year old. He sucked in TB this year. He went to LA and he sucked worse.

And please don't give me any cap BS. That's called asset management and Yzerman has proven pretty adept at it. He clearly decided that if he has to choose between Bishop and one of his quality relatively young players he'd get rid of Bishop. TB has a lot of young talent and they chose to keep all of it over Ben Mr Elite Bishop. Because they felt safer with a 23 year old. Steve Yzerman decided he wasn't going "all in" in his quest for a cup with Bishop and traded him away for nothing.

You're on these boards all the time posting hypothetical lineups and talking about if mgmt. did this or mgmt. did that. This isn't a video game. You seem to live in a fantasy.

 

[Sting]

We'd be a contender with a true #1 center and one star forward.

Tavares looks to be the only chance our team has of acquiring one because I don't think White or Brown will be one.

I do think White has a good shot of being a top 6 forward though, and potentially an impact one.

If we don't grab a 1st line center, the reality is our Cup window is going to close before we find one.

I'm really proud of what this team has become and what its accomplished so far this year, but I wouldn't be so optimistic about the future knowing that there are a lot of teams with several high end talents in their rookie or sophomore seasons...none of which we have.

 

[Sensinitis]

ya going all in on bishop sounds good cause he's a proven number 1 that can get it done when it counts. his own team didn't go all in on him

back to the books Hale you need to do more studying on other team's assets

No kidding, Vasi is one of the most promising young goalies I've seen in years.

If we don't grab a 1st line center, the reality is our Cup window is going to close before we find one.

I'm really proud of what this team has become and what its accomplished so far this year, but I wouldn't be so optimistic about the future knowing that there are a lot of teams with several high end talents in their rookie or sophomore seasons...none of which we have.

While I agree with your main point, our window just opened.

It's not closing unless Dorion makes us worse.

We still have players who are growing (Ceci, Dzingel, and Stone/Hoffman/Turris to an extent), as well as two potential impact players coming in next year (Chabot, White).

It's looking good. We really need Dorion to make the right moves this summer to push us even more forward.

 

[HousePerseus]

Ritchie was a late 1st.

Ritchie was taken 10th overall, not really a "late 1t"

 

[Samsquanch]

No kidding, Vasi is one of the most promising young goalies I've seen in years.



While I agree with your main point, our window just opened.

It's not closing unless Dorion makes us worse.

We still have players who are growing (Ceci, Dzingel, and Stone/Hoffman/Turris to an extent), as well as two potential impact players coming in next year (Chabot, White).

It's looking good. We really need Dorion to make the right moves this summer to push us even more forward.

I agree with all of this.

I would be willing to go hard after any one of Tavares or McKinnon, or to a lesser extent Giroux, Duchene, Jeff Carter, and maybe a few others.

If be willing to part with any combination of Chabot, Turris, White, Brown, Harpur, Jaros, 1st round pick, depending on the player of course.

Getting a Tavares would keep the window open for at least another 3 or 4 years for us imo, and we would be a real threat to win in each of those years. Its the right move. We need to try to win with Karlsson in his prime. Period.

 

[SanderSen]

When you have a 26 year old generational player, the window is opening.

The D is the most exciting with Chabot in the pipeline and the youth playing now.

 

[Xspyrit]

I would try and trade for Nugent-Hopkins and a 2nd for Ceci, andTurris. He is 24 and He's a former #1 and could beast out in the next couple years. Then id sign Big Joe this summer for 2 years.

Sens get bent. Turris has more value than RNH and you could get a lot better than a 2nd for Cody Ceci.

Only things I'm mad about were giving up Dahlen, and adding the 2nd to Brassard for having a cheap owner.

Those are the only things I'd consider mortgaging the future.

Exactly this. The rest is all smoke and fumes

To get:

Brassard, Ryan, Phaneuf, Burrows, Stalberg, Condon, Wingels

...Sens management gave up:

Zibanejad, Silfverberg, Ritchie, Noesen, Dahlen, Lindberg, 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 5th (+ 20M in cap space)

That's a heck of a lot more than one prospect.

I wish I could understand asset management to have a discussion about this

Wingels for a 7th? Wingels small contributions are already worth much more than a 7th round pick.

Condon for 5th? Condon contributions are already worth much more than a 5th round pick.

Stalberg for a 3rd? Stalberg contributions are already worth more than a 3rd round pick.

Burrows? Burrows contributions over 2.33 years will probably be worth a lot more than a 2nd round pick. Unfortunately that pick was a prospect already drafted in Jonathan Dahlen. This one I regret, but still wish we got Burrows but for a different package.

Phaneuf? Phaneuf contributions already proves that Ottawa hit a home-run on that trade. Getting a veteran #2-3 D solid as a rock for a 2nd and an average prospect, while unloading 14 M$ of dead salary? That's insane asset management actually. I'm surprised that an asset management expert can't see that.

Ryan? Yes Silfverberg is great but Ryan did out-produce him by a wide margin the first 3 years. Silf won the production battle this year. Nothing guarantees that it will be the same story next year. Ritchie is not that special (2014 was weak) and takes a spot that we filled and will fill with somebody better. Noesen was claimed off waivers. It's a miracle that he overcame his injuries and played in the NHL. In 2 years, Silfverberg will also be signed to a big contract and will also have pressure to produce in his late 20's early 30's. That trade was short term loss for longer term gain for Anaheim and the opposite for Ottawa. It was also to save the face after the fact that Alfie left for Detroit.

Brassard? This trade is probably a wash even though I will always miss Zbad. Yes giving up a 2nd on top of Zibanejad seems excessive but Brassard has a bargain of a contract (10.0 for 3 full years) and just had scored 60 and 58 points the last 2 seasons. Something Zibanejad has never did and might never do. Zibanejad is amazing some games, but is inconsistent, that's why he was traded. I think the main reason why this trade happened is that Zibanejad wasn't identified as a main core piece that the organization wanted to eventually pay over 5.5 per year.

It's crazy that when we really look at the reality, it doesn't paint a portrait as catastrophic as what you were saying.

my but you have a high opinion of your opinions.

I spend a good amount of time reading these boards so I know what I am talking about and with respect to anything related to this franchise you are one of this boards more negative posters.

# realism

I don't find this poster particularly realistic. He has some good points, but some of the things he says are just out of it. I've seen a ton of posters like that in the last decade. They would be of course the best GM in the league by far if you could just "listen to them". But they forgot one thing : all those real GMs out there operate within only one real world.

Not sure he'd want to come back to a team that traded him though.

Sure, he's probably mad at Ottawa who gave him his first real shot to be a NHL goalie and traded him to a place where he could be a starter and prove himself. All that, because Ottawa lost an asset management trade!

Anyway moot point, I don't think Bishop will continue to be "elite" in people's eyes, depending on where he ends up playing. Nothing about his talent screams elite. He's big and good positionally but he can be exposed if the team in front of him isn't dominant, like this season or the years he was with Ottawa.

 

[DueDiligence]

We'd be a contender with a true #1 center and one star forward.

Tavares looks to be the only chance our team has of acquiring one because I don't think White or Brown will be one.

I do think White has a good shot of being a top 6 forward though, and potentially an impact one.

If we don't grab a 1st line center, the reality is our Cup window is going to close before we find one.

I'm really proud of what this team has become and what its accomplished so far this year, but I wouldn't be so optimistic about the future knowing that there are a lot of teams with several high end talents in their rookie or sophomore seasons...none of which we have.

You could say the same for a dozen teams. Think if the Leafs added Karlsson. How good would they be? Add two great offensive players to the Habs. They would be favorites to win the cup. Bottom line is that those two players are going to be almost impossible to obtain.

 

[Tuna99]

Sign K

Sign Joe Thornton to a 1 year contract, he's at least solve the PP

 

[jason2020]

You could say the same for a dozen teams. Think if the Leafs added Karlsson. How good would they be? Add two great offensive players to the Habs. They would be favorites to win the cup. Bottom line is that those two players are going to be almost impossible to obtain.

For the Leafs it would be about cap space if they get Ek that means Mariner and Nylander are gone.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

For the Leafs it would be about cap space if they get Ek that means Mariner and Nylander are gone.

lol, nope. Any team with a decent GM will jettison a 3rd or 4th liner to make cap space.

 

[jason2020]

lol, nope. Any team with a decent GM will jettison a 3rd or 4th liner to make cap space.

The Leafs have around $25 million in cap space for 2019-2020 with 12 players to sign including there 5 rookies.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

The Leafs have around $25 million in cap space for 2019-2020 with 12 players to sign including there 5 rookies.

And you think they're going to dump their best pieces and keep the trash? Come on, man! Think!

 

[Sensfanatic]

I just don't see this team being competitive in the next few years. They are too small up front (particularly up the middle) and they don't have enough mobility and skill on defence. The skilled players they have are not going to improve much (age wise they are at their peak or declining) and I'm not sure adding Chabot and White will be enough.
Management has made some very poor decisions based on an overall lack of vision and need for short term results.
Toronto, Boston and Tampa will all be much better next year and I wouldn't be surprised if we miss the playoffs entirely.
Hate to be so skeptical, but I think this series with the Rangers and to some extent the series with an injury depleted Boston team really exposes issues when compared to elite teams.

 

[Sting]

I just don't see this team being competitive in the next few years. They are too small up front (particularly up the middle) and they don't have enough mobility and skill on defence. The skilled players they have are not going to improve much (age wise they are at their peak or declining) and I'm not sure adding Chabot and White will be enough.
Management has made some very poor decisions based on an overall lack of vision and need for short term results.
Toronto, Boston and Tampa will all be much better next year and I wouldn't be surprised if we miss the playoffs entirely.
Hate to be so skeptical, but I think this series with the Rangers and to some extent the series with an injury depleted Boston team really exposes issues when compared to elite teams.

Admittedly I'm very pessimistic as well but this sums up my thoughts. This playoff run has given us some good memories but it'd abundantly clear this team was never close to contending.

Going a step further, and I'm sure I'll catch flak for this, but the current state of our franchise likely means we won't be contenders for another 10 years. Why? Well, we're not going to let Karlsson walk, we know that much.

Chances are, there's going to be a lull period where we try to replace Anderson. Maybe Condon takes the reigns, but I think he'll have difficulty being a team's go-to guy.

It's also clear that Turris and Brassard don't cut it as a #1/#2 for a contender. Unless Logan Brown miraculously becomes a franchise center...we're going to be trying to solve this problem for a long time. Now, New York has shown you can get by without one as long as you have 4 lines of great depth. That's very difficult to develop and maintain in a cap era.

We've quite obviously sacrificed a good chunk of our future for immediate help that hasn't exactly been help. I initially liked the Burrows trade but I'm not so sure now that he has become invisible. Stalberg for a 3rd was also poor asset management given what guys like Stafford went for at the deadline.

I feel the team needs a true reset like Toronto was able to do but we know that management won't allow that to happen. I feel like a broken record because I've been saying this since 08-09 or so.

 

[SixthSens]

Admittedly I'm very pessimistic as well but this sums up my thoughts. This playoff run has given us some good memories but it'd abundantly clear this team was never close to contending.

Going a step further, and I'm sure I'll catch flak for this, but the current state of our franchise likely means we won't be contenders for another 10 years. Why? Well, we're not going to let Karlsson walk, we know that much.

Chances are, there's going to be a lull period where we try to replace Anderson. Maybe Condon takes the reigns, but I think he'll have difficulty being a team's go-to guy.

It's also clear that Turris and Brassard don't cut it as a #1/#2 for a contender. Unless Logan Brown miraculously becomes a franchise center...we're going to be trying to solve this problem for a long time. Now, New York has shown you can get by without one as long as you have 4 lines of great depth. That's very difficult to develop and maintain in a cap era.

We've quite obviously sacrificed a good chunk of our future for immediate help that hasn't exactly been help. I initially liked the Burrows trade but I'm not so sure now that he has become invisible. Stalberg for a 3rd was also poor asset management given what guys like Stafford went for at the deadline.

I feel the team needs a true reset like Toronto was able to do but we know that management won't allow that to happen. I feel like a broken record because I've been saying this since 08-09 or so.

This soooo much.

Look at how long the Leafs spent looking for that #1 centre after Sundin left.

And, like you also said, they need a re-set. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening until Melnyk decides to sell the team.

 

[pt_mck]

ya going all in on bishop sounds good cause he's a proven number 1 that can get it done when it counts. his own team didn't go all in on him

back to the books Hale you need to do more studying on other team's assets

Bishop had a $5.95M cap hit
Vasilievsky has a $3.5M cap hit

cap space matters

sens need a longer term solution in net

Sens can't just give up on Anderson at the moment though

 

[Icelevel]

Agreed. It's the Tim Murray method of building a team, throw a bunch of individual misfits together and believe you can make it work. It has never worked and never will.

I like this team and the direction they are going. Lots of good here to get behind.

The Tim Murray method? What do you base this on. I would happily trade rosters and prospects with Buffalo. Under Boucher that team is better than us. Pretty confident in saying that.

A lot of ottawa's current players need replacing/upgrading. All over the lineup

 

[jason2020]

The Tim Murray method? What do you base this on. I would happily trade rosters and prospects with Buffalo. Under Boucher that team is better than us. Pretty confident in saying that.

A lot of ottawa's current players need replacing/upgrading. All over the lineup

Ottawa is a very young team that is part of the issue.

 

[jason2020]

This soooo much.

Look at how long the Leafs spent looking for that #1 centre after Sundin left.

And, like you also said, they need a re-set. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening until Melnyk decides to sell the team.

The Leafs were abit different they were old had bad contracts and no future they had no choice but to rebuild.