The Physicality Myth

ottomaddox

Registered User
Oct 31, 2017
10,592
4,600
Toronto
Physicality and hitting are real.

We have the history of hockey to fall back on.

Look at the history of leafs vs. Ottawa. We had a tough time in the regular season beating Ottawa, but beat them (physicality over their skill). We did have better goalies, but mainly we stuck to our game and finished our checks.

No one is saying you need to have Dion Phaneuf style open ice hits (Calgary era) to win. You just need to be better than 1 handed light stick checking.
 
  • Like
Reactions: coupe93

56 Years No Cup

New and Improved Username!
Nov 12, 2007
7,670
6,563
Sorry OP but your premise is a massive fail. Matthews is one of the Leafs biggest players but he's butter soft physically.

It's all about the "want to". The desire. The heart.

I hope 34 can find his way soon.
 

Joedoggy

Registered User
Feb 7, 2017
929
287
I've read this from you many many times.

What do you mean by it exactly, because at 6'1", it's not likely something that Babcock would suffer from? (at least in its normal context)



Excellent post.

It is my hope that they can find a couple of guys that have a combination of skill, toughness and determination to fill the open spots next next year.

Mind games thru bully tactics with players/personel...Me guy, I guy, its all about me..the list is much longer ..you would have to know the man(Main reason no one could stand him in detroit)
Every body knows me, i am the reason?.....I didn't have last change thats why we lost......These the statements ..you will here often from a man with small man syndrome.....Size has zero to do with it in his case..he bullies due to position. Smartest man in the room ..Just ask him
 
Last edited:

egd27

Donec nunc annum
Sponsor
Jul 8, 2011
16,381
11,920
GTA
Mind games thru bully tactics with players/personel...Me guy, I guy, its all about me..the list is much longer ..you would have to know the man(Main reason no one could stand him in detroit)
Every body knows me, i am the reason?.....I didn't have last change thats why we lost......These the statements ..you will here often from a man with small man syndrome.....Size has zero to do with it.

Ok, thanks for explaining.
You're describing a psychological condition, but it's not small man's syndrome.
 

skacore

Registered User
Nov 7, 2010
3,198
174
We have probably the best forechecker in the league, one of the toughest players, a legitimate NHL player who has contributed year after year, sitting in the stands watching his teammates get ran. Martin was good enough for us all season long but now all of a sudden we don’t have room for him when we may need him the most? It makes no sense to me. Some of you guys talk about him like he’s Colton Orr. He’s taken a regular 4th line shift for YEARS, he can skate, shoot, chop in. It’s idiotic we aren’t taking advantage of our own assets right now.
 

SportsJunkie

Registered User
Jan 29, 2013
179
52
Toronto
Use our speed and skill is driving me nuts! Yes use it but we don't need 12 forwards who are fast and skilled!

Toughness, grit, hard hits etc is still required and we are only in the first series....only gets tougher as the playoffs go on.
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
The size impact on the bruins yes to be greatly exaggerated (Marchand is MAYBE 5.9).

The Leafs were matching the Bruins hit for hit and didn’t see anyone’s really shy away from puck battles.

If anything the Bruins our-skilled the Leafs. Bergeron Marchand were making passes to one another with their eyes closed like they were out on a frozen pond, Pasta looked incredibly fast and deadly.

The Leafs need to fix their special teams for tonight’s game rather than making sure everybody gets an extra hit in
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
We have probably the best forechecker in the league, one of the toughest players, a legitimate NHL player who has contributed year after year, sitting in the stands watching his teammates get ran. Martin was good enough for us all season long but now all of a sudden we don’t have room for him when we may need him the most? It makes no sense to me. Some of you guys talk about him like he’s Colton Orr. He’s taken a regular 4th line shift for YEARS, he can skate, shoot, chop in. It’s idiotic we aren’t taking advantage of our own assets right now.

Well, he wasn’t fine all season long. Babcock made him a healthy scratch 1/2 way through.....
 

Suntouchable13

Registered User
Dec 20, 2003
43,031
18,045
Toronto, ON
We have probably the best forechecker in the league, one of the toughest players, a legitimate NHL player who has contributed year after year, sitting in the stands watching his teammates get ran. Martin was good enough for us all season long but now all of a sudden we don’t have room for him when we may need him the most? It makes no sense to me. Some of you guys talk about him like he’s Colton Orr. He’s taken a regular 4th line shift for YEARS, he can skate, shoot, chop in. It’s idiotic we aren’t taking advantage of our own assets right now.

Martin has lost a step. It was clear as day. If you put him on the 4th line, you can no longer trust that line to potentially play against Marchand. They already got run over in game 1 by that line, imagine with Martin on it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Menzinger

cannucky

Registered User
Aug 18, 2011
1,933
890
Itr's playoff time Euro hockey is for p***yes and p***yes don't win cups , all the XBox experts here spouting about a game they never really played , I was the opposite of the earlier poster , I was a year younger due to a late december birthday so I was always smaller than the guys I played contact sports against , I survived and thrived by being an evil , mean , sob "even god hates a coward " . Where is Borgman ? where is Martin ? never mind Fehr who was banished by bobsonCock , We got run off the ice by the Caps last year , after Polak went down we were done like dinner so Shanny goes out and finds a big 4th line center to replace Boyle and we roll a big physical young D for 3/4 season , then at the end Euro boy replaces him with a charmin 10 ply D man who should be replacing Morgan Lebda not Borgy . What are your excuses going to be when they start pounding on us tonight ? what are you going to say if they succeed in sidelining Marner or Mathews ? If Martin was on the bench last game maybe Naz can think "let Marty take care of it" but with only Polak , Leo and himself in the lineup with any testicles he knows he has to run that prick no ifs and or buts about it .This is on a selfish coach that thinks he is going to reinvent the NHL into something it isn't and never will be .Upper management sees the problem , takes steps to address it , the coach runs those players off and supplants them with more of the problem .
 

Suntouchable13

Registered User
Dec 20, 2003
43,031
18,045
Toronto, ON
Itr's playoff time Euro hockey is for *****es and *****es don't win cups , all the XBox experts here spouting about a game they never really played , I was the opposite of the earlier poster , I was a year younger due to a late december birthday so I was always smaller than the guys I played contact sports against , I survived and thrived by being an evil , mean , sob "even god hates a coward " . Where is Borgman ? where is Martin ? never mind Fehr who was banished by bobsonCock , We got run off the ice by the Caps last year , after Polak went down we were done like dinner so Shanny goes out and finds a big 4th line center to replace Boyle and we roll a big physical young D for 3/4 season , then at the end Euro boy replaces him with a charmin 10 ply D man who should be replacing Morgan Lebda not Borgy . What are your excuses going to be when they start pounding on us tonight ? what are you going to say if they succeed in sidelining Marner or Mathews ? If Martin was on the bench last game maybe Naz can think "let Marty take care of it" but with only Polak , Leo and himself in the lineup with any testicles he knows he has to run that prick no ifs and or buts about it .This is on a selfish coach that thinks he is going to reinvent the NHL into something it isn't and never will be .Upper management sees the problem , takes steps to address it , the coach runs those players off and supplants them with more of the problem .

Polak looked like shit in game 1. Did not do a thing to help his team. We don't need more Polaks and Leos. We need more players that can be physical but can also play the game at a high level. Polak and Leo are slow and terrible.
 

djdev

Registered User
Dec 26, 2015
5,872
5,138
costa rica
A team coached by A man who never played the game at a high level, is soft.. has small man syndrome and coaches a euro sale game is not going to have a heavy team (Detroit also)
Players that can play heavy are sat in Leaf land.
Babcock is all about Babcock pure and simple.. Lets see you line change your way out of this series without playing your heavy player you are sitting cause he offended your EGO..

Small man syndrome clouds Badcocks mind once again, but he loves his Babsocks..lol

It will get worst also..with players leaving...More softcock euro hockey/more pain.

This team is built on one concept "How fast can you run away from physicality"..the Babcock way!
are all of your other 309 posts as dumb as this? genuinely curious :huh:
 
  • Like
Reactions: CanadasTeam

SportsJunkie

Registered User
Jan 29, 2013
179
52
Toronto
Polak looked like **** in game 1. Did not do a thing to help his team. We don't need more Polaks and Leos. We need more players that can be physical but can also play the game at a high level. Polak and Leo are slow and terrible.
I agree with you but players that can be physical and play the game at a high level are rare plus typically don't last long...

Need to play physical I would have Martin in the lineup 100% the top 3 lines need more ice time anyway
 

moon111

Registered User
Oct 18, 2014
2,890
1,283
Polak looked like **** in game 1. Did not do a thing to help his team. We don't need more Polaks and Leos. We need more players that can be physical but can also play the game at a high level. Polak and Leo are slow and terrible.
Exactly, we need players who skate around and don't know how to play positionally. Taking your man is highly over-rated. Skating around like a chicken with your head cut off is the path to the Cup.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Menzinger

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
Polak looked like **** in game 1. Did not do a thing to help his team. We don't need more Polaks and Leos. We need more players that can be physical but can also play the game at a high level. Polak and Leo are slow and terrible.

Was definitely not a fan of watching the Bruins guys just skating around Polak when he was out on the PK
 
  • Like
Reactions: thewave

dimi78

Registered User
Aug 9, 2008
4,348
294
It's not so much the weight or height of the players it's more so how they play.

Toronto does not play a heavy game by any stretch of the imagination. They're largely a rush team who plays high event hockey. They they don't excel on the cycle and struggle defending it. They're not built for the trenches so to speak.
Playing off the cycle physicality using your size to protect the puck is just one way of doing that. It's usually the players who aren't that skilled that a whole bunch on here call a waste of time 3rd line 4th line checkers blah blah blah that play that type off hockey. However there is more ways to play off the cycle. The best player ever playing off the cycle was this wimp called Gretzky. The greatest at playing off the cycle for the longest time in the NHL were the Sedin twins.... The greatest cycling line ever to play hockey was the old Russian Red Army line the KLM line. They skated circles around the opposition with short passes and constantly moving.

The Leafs have one line. That's it just 1 line that struggles to sustain an offensive cycle 5v5 and it's largely do to one lazy @SS player in JVR. Momentum shifts trends has been almost always that line the opposition eats up and largely it isn't there play on the defensive side that's the culprit but there weak cycle game.

Every team in the league has it's issues defending the cycle. The League has changed with the rules implement to eliminate the clutch & grab. The Defensive zone for the longest time is nothing more but a positional game where it's success is largely depended on goaltending making the first save. Strong defensive teams don't defend in the D zone. They defend the neutral zone and sustain puck possession playing off the cycle. The difference is in the how they play the cycle to our Leafs. They don't necessary cycle to score but essential they're defending in the offensive zone with the puck. That's the last element this team has not excelled at in there game and it won't happen with JVR types on the team.
 

Judas Tavares

S2S (Sundin2Sandin)
Sponsor
Feb 9, 2007
10,163
3,557
Agreed that you need players with the will and desire to play physical. You just need to go out and find those players. You hope you have that in guys like Kortshkov, Grundstrom and Johnsson. What you don't do is go out and draft Tyler Biggs or Jamie Devane and hope they become some wrecking machine. You draft players will skill, smarts and two-way play and hope physicality, will and desire is part of their DNA, regardless of their size.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Menzinger

Magic Man

Registered User
Mar 30, 2012
7,276
2,568
Your Worst Nightmare
The Leafs out hit Boston in case no checked the boxscore. 42-37. They out blocked them 15-8. From my eye test the Leafs were the more physical team. Boston did outshoot Toronto 40-27 and they owned the special teams game. But, they didn't out tough anyone, ask Wingels.
 
  • Like
Reactions: stuart5035

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
6,684
Matt Martin played all 6 games against Washington last year.

Marner was quoted today as saying the loss of Kadri is big. He was like their “protector” out there.

Don’t think it matters?
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
Matt Martin played all 6 games against Washington last year.

Marner was quoted today as saying the loss of Kadri is big. He was like their “protector” out there.

Don’t think it matters?

No.

Martin playing 5 minutes a game against Boston’s 4th line doesn’t change anything this series.
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
The Leafs out hit Boston in case no checked the boxscore. 42-37. They out blocked them 15-8. From my eye test the Leafs were the more physical team. Boston did outshoot Toronto 40-27 and they owned the special teams game. But, they didn't out tough anyone, ask Wingels.

Hey now, let’s not let’s tangible facts get in the way of anything
 

Menzinger

Kessel4LadyByng
Apr 24, 2014
40,975
32,364
St. Paul, MN
It kept the Washington series pretty close.

How's the current plan working out so far?

The idea that Martin played a major role in that Washington series is fairly absurd.

As for the Bruins - it’s their top two lines have been dominating the Leafs (as have their PP). Martin wouldn’t be on the ice for a single second of any of that. Martin is only capable of playing against 4th lines and he doesn’t play any special teams.
 

Pookie

Wear a mask
Oct 23, 2013
16,172
6,684
The idea that Martin played a major role in that Washington series is fairly absurd.

As for the Bruins - it’s their top two lines have been dominating the Leafs (as have their PP). Martin wouldn’t be on the ice for a single second of any of that. Martin is only capable of playing against 4th lines and he doesn’t play any special teams.

The idea that a "protector" helps a team's confidence is absurd?

Weird then that Marner would use that in describing the loss of Kadri.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->