The Mt. Rushmore game: Who didn't earn their money?

Discussion in 'Detroit Red Wings' started by HockeyinHD, Apr 16, 2018.

  1. HockeyinHD

    HockeyinHD Registered User

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    Rules:

    -You get 4 spots. Ranked or not, your call.
    -Only based on the 2017-18 season.
    -Only using 2017-18 cap number.
    -Only based on players, so you guys don't just say Holland and Blashill plus two players every time.

    Which 4 guys would you have chiseled into the side of a mountain so people could look back for all time and see the four guys who most underperformed their comp in the NHL for the Wings in 2017-18?

    Here's mine: Howard, Nielsen, Dekeyser, Green. I'm honestly stunned I couldn't get Abby or Helm on this list, but even though their contracts are on the spectrum between 'bad' and 'oh come on', they both had decent enough years to at least get them in the vicinity.

    Dekeyser: He's my #1, by a mile. I could not think of a single encouraging thing about either him, his year, or his future. There is literally nothing positive I can say about him. My child will nearly graduate High School before I can stop looking at Dekeyser in a Wings jersey. I am not thrilled by this, as my child has yet to hit puberty.

    Nielsen: The clear #2. There are a decent number of encouraging, positive things I can say about Nielsen... it's just that they are things I should be able to say about a 24 year old checking line center entering the first year of his bridge deal for 2.5 and not a 33 year old dude making 5 and a bleeping quarter per.

    Howard and Green share the Bronze (mixing metaphors now) for having almost identical 2018's relative to their contracts. Both are paid as top tier players at their positions, and both were much more like slightly below league average players at their positions. That disparity pushes them past Abby and Helm (another matched pair) on my personal mountainside.

    Honorable mention, perhaps with their likeness carved into a tree on a pleasant dell nearby: Abby, Helm, Nyquist. I mean, Gustav... you are an offensive player making 4.75 and you have 1 more ES point than Helm? Come on.

    Not included: Mrazek and Tatar, who by getting traded for relative hauls certainly earned whatever their contracts were this year, even though their on-ice play sucked.
     
  2. Claypool

    Claypool Registered User

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    Darren Helm has a cap hit of $3.8 million. He's a 30 point player. How hasn't he earned his money? That's the going rate of that type of player.
     
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  3. kliq

    kliq Registered User

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    Howard's not really paid like a "top tier" goalie. His 5.291 caphit ranks 15th in the league. He's paid like an average starter, and he is an average starter. Considering the D he had in front of him, I can't say he "under-performed".

    Also, you seem to have unrealistic expectations from players. You say

    "Gustav... you are an offensive player making 4.75 and you have 1 more ES point than Helm? Come on."

    When you are making in the 4-5mil range, expectation are typically between 40-50 points. You can argue that Nyquist under-performed a bit, but he's pretty much right where he should be.

    Strip any team of all elite talent and put everyone a line higher then they should be, and perceived lack of production will be a thing but it's not Nyquist's fault that he's on the 1st line when he really should be on the 2nd or 3rd line. Add in the fact that we don't have a good coach, and it is what it is.

    I don't want to crap on the players because they are all pretty much all miscast.
     
  4. PelagicJoe

    PelagicJoe Registered User

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    DDK, Helm, Neilsen, and the last spot goes to Blashill.
     
  5. Pavels Dog

    Pavels Dog Registered User

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    Not even close to being Abby and Helm for me.

    1. Dekeyser - 5million and the best thing I can say is he’s rarely noticeable.

    2. Kronwall - absolute mess in 2 out of 3 zones. Decent in the o-zone this year but not worth his money by a longshot anymore.

    3. Nielsen - Like the player but overpaid for his role.

    4. Mrazek - can’t ignore this guy being paid like a #1B and playing like an ECHLer.
     
  6. Heaton

    Heaton Moderator

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    1. Dekeyser
    2. Nielsen
    3. Abdelkader
    4. Nyquist

    I didn't include Kronwall because he has a built in excuse with his health, the dude should retire. Abdelkader was paid off his history of scoring 20 goals on a line with Datsyuk/Z, now he's a 4th liner who had moderate success.

    I wouldn't care about Abdelkader if he were 27 or 28 and we knew when this team rebuilt he could still be effective, but he's 31, we'll be lucky to get 30 points out of him next year.
     
  7. WingsMJN2965

    WingsMJN2965 Registered User

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    People seem to forget that Howard is one of the only reasons Detroit isn't the worst team in the league and was in a playoff spot until Thanksgiving.

    He was posting a .925% until early December behind one of the worst pro defensive units I've ever seen. He certainly came back down to earth, but when Jonathan Ericsson is your top defender, who wouldn't?
     
  8. Redder Winger

    Redder Winger Registered User

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    Mrazek and Tatar were not very good for their money.

    But they're not here, so no point in considering them for chiseling.

    1. Nielsen - Just not very good. Only what? 4 more years?
    2. Nyquist - All that first unit PP time. All that first line time. All that salary. And for third line production.
    3. Howard - Nice start. But he was awful. I LOL at media people who give him an A or B for his season. WHAT IN THE ****.
    4. Daley - Tons of minutes. No production. Could have went with Green, Ericsson, Kronwall or Dekeyser here. That's saying something.
     
  9. Lazlo Hollyfeld

    Lazlo Hollyfeld Tanking

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    On the surface yes.

    But 7 of those 30 points came in the last 10 games (way to turn it on when it counts Darren).
    For a guy who's here in great part for his defensive play he had a lot of brutal turnovers this season, many ending up in the back of his net.
    The $3.8 million doesn't account for the term that it gets it down to that level.


    My list is Nielsen, Nyquist, Green, Dekeyser.
     
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  10. golffuul

    golffuul Registered User

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    DeKeyser, Helm, Nyquist, and Daley.

    I originally had Howard in front of Daley, but realized that no goaltender can back up the defence corps that Detroit has and not have a 4+ GAA
     
  11. Flowah

    Flowah Registered User

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    I have Green waaaaaaaaaay ahead of Daley in terms of not being worth the cost.

    Daley costs like half what Mike Green does. It's not like Green was some offensive weapon or defensive stalwart back there this season.
     
  12. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    Helm was one of our hardest working players all season! All members of our team had lots of brutal turnovers, Helm didn't have any more than anyone else. Points at the end still count towards your pt totals, otherwise McDavid gets the same flak as he was terrific at seasons end (when the Oilers were well out) and finished 1st because of it. Not only that, but Helm isn't here for offense, he is here for PK and forechecking which he does very well despite all the unearned flak he takes. Athanasiou gets more ice time per game and a lot more PP time, and offensive linemates and he had a whole 2 pts more, while giving a piss poor effort 70% of the time, and being terrible defensively.

    Trevor Daley was fine for what he is, a 4-6 d-man who was asked to play well above his abilty which will make anyone look worse. Honestly what were people thinking Daley was going to do for us? He is getting a reasonable salary as well, I mean look at the rest of the league on the blueline, filled with overpaid 4-6 guys in the 3+ range. This season would have been far worse to watch without a veteran like Daley giving us reasonable defence for a reasonable defence.

    -----------------
    Frans Nielsen has to be the front runner for didn't bring enough offence for the money he gets, and he wasn't exactly awesome in his own end as well. Can blame linemates all you want, but reality is, good offensive players produce with anyone.

    Gus Nyquist, did he even hit a lousy 40 pts, not sure? 5 million for less than 20 goals, 50 pts for a non physical, non defensive forward, is downright frustrating. His effort level at times is also pathetic. Also he is attached to Henrik Zetterberg's hip, how on earth do you not hit 25 goals playing with him all year. Z is still a great passer and playmaker even if slow, playing with him and not hitting good numbers is truly mind-boggling. Him being gone might be the best move this team could make for the team itself and Zetterberg. Mantha probably cruises to 30 goals with Z as his center all season.

    Danny Dekeyser is just so average at everything. He is a $2 million dollar defenceman at most, getting $5 million and excelling at nothing. He honestly is not a lot better than Ouellet who is also so average at everything.

    Justin Abdelkader had a decent season for the most part, decent level of pts, and what not, but considering that he gets PP time he barely outscored Helm who gets none, and just isn't the same physical presence he was a few years ago.

    Mike Green had a great start to the season, then trailed off offensively and looked pretty slow at his seasons end, and it is kind of hard to get excited about a mid 30 pt defenceman who gets 6 mil a season and struggles in his own end at times.
     
  13. Sadekuuro

    Sadekuuro Registered User

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    Oh c'mon, you know he's going to be re-signed.
     
  14. WingsMJN2965

    WingsMJN2965 Registered User

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    College it is!
     
  15. RedWingsfan55

    RedWingsfan55 Registered User

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    1. Kronwall overpaid veteran.
    2. Nielson overpaid veteran for too long.
    3. Mrazek maybe should be #2 or #1 complete garbage goalie.
    4. Tough one for me. Between dekeyser, Helm and and Ericsson.
     
  16. golffuul

    golffuul Registered User

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    I only put Daley ahead of Green because Green was actually producing in the first half of the year before injuries started to pile up. Daley has been terrible all year.
     
  17. WingedWheel1987

    WingedWheel1987 Registered User

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    Not in any particular order; Gator, DD, Nielsen and Kronwall.
     

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