Halla
Registered User
- Jan 28, 2016
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2) Yes. Also Johnsson is in anyways because Leo is hurt.
so you can probably wipe away a 1st and 2nd/3rd
The decision to keep the expiring contracts - is it going to backfire
- Thread starter MJ65
- Start date
2) Yes. Also Johnsson is in anyways because Leo is hurt.
so you can probably wipe away a 1st and 2nd/3rd
The players we have in their 1-2 year
Matthews
Marner
Nylander (plus 20 games)
Brown
Hyman
Kapanen
Johnson
Zaitsev
Dermott
How many sophmore did we want?
Matthews
Marner
Nylander (plus 20 games)
Brown
Hyman
Kapanen
Johnson
Zaitsev
Dermott
How many sophmore did we want?
Sophomores this season
Hyman
matty
nylander
marns
zaitsev
andy
brown
rooks
dermott
kappy
borg
johnsson
Superstar
"Be water, my friend."
- Jun 25, 2008
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You forgot our 2nd round pick also scored the 3rd goal tonight to shift the momentum back our way after boston made it 2-1...and leads our team in playoff scoring so far...2 goals, 4pts in 5 games...not bad.
yeah sure but that doesnt mean they will resign... so if we get eliminated we wont be as good next year unless we get lucky and someone big signs with us...
TheGoldenJet
Registered User
This thread is awfully quiet today. Of course the decision backfired, as many of us on here said it would.
Anyone with half a brain could see that Boston, Tampa Bay, and Pittsburgh were better and more experienced teams than this young Leafs squad.
And all 3 teams went “all in” at the deadline (or well before) to get even better, something Lou said the Leafs were unwilling to do. That should have forced Leafs management to at least recoup some assets on deadline day for JvR, but they decided not to. And gained nothing from it that they wouldn’t have had anyway (first round exit), wasting good assets in the process. Just gotta hope they don’t make the same mistake with Gardiner, he is worth just as much as JVR, if not more.
Anyone with half a brain could see that Boston, Tampa Bay, and Pittsburgh were better and more experienced teams than this young Leafs squad.
And all 3 teams went “all in” at the deadline (or well before) to get even better, something Lou said the Leafs were unwilling to do. That should have forced Leafs management to at least recoup some assets on deadline day for JvR, but they decided not to. And gained nothing from it that they wouldn’t have had anyway (first round exit), wasting good assets in the process. Just gotta hope they don’t make the same mistake with Gardiner, he is worth just as much as JVR, if not more.
That was my fear - we were not ready and it was pretty evident from this series
We should have traded JVR, Bozak and Komarov, this team need serious retooling but we lost the opportunity to recoup some assets
Daisy Jane
everything is gonna be okay!
- Jul 2, 2009
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okay you want someone to say something?
anyone with half a brain could see that they were better - but as people have been saying all day long the Leafs handed/gave away that series.
Again. if you want to argue that the leafs should have given the players away - no one is disputing that. What you and a crap tonne of other people were advocating was wrong. You do not lop off a chunk of your team before the playoffs regardless if they are 'ready' or not.
what you and a lot of people also fail to acknowledge that there wasn't a lot of even 'reported' interested (outside of Dreger) for either Bozak or JVR or Komarov. Nothing. nada. zilip. zilch. It's not like there was a hard reported rumor/offer whatever of this is what they would get for JVR and you could be all "okay this has some legs to it." you hoped that we could get a bunch of picks for them right now, and I said it all year, if the offer was there to help this team (IE: NHL ready players who could help contribute) I think Lou would have made the moves because he was obviously trying to do something (Ie: trying to get another 1st round pick to make a move for McDonagh, and no one bit, and there is only one player on this team who has a 1st round pick value who would have been available)
you and others keep saying we should have given them away. TO Who? WHO wanted them? Answer. no one who wanted to pay up a 1st round + some prospects or whatever. You can say there is value in them but apparently not enough to have anyone pay up. so even though they should have done it (a lot earlier) there are very few teams that would have.
What they should have done was get defense. that's Lou's mistake so get mad at him for that, not getting rid of players that obviously no one wanted to pay up for.
I can only laugh at people for blindly believing that the team was ready to contend for the cup
The management was not prepared to trade these players, so obviously there was no interest (as these players were never in the market)
We should accept the fact that we were not good enough to compete with or without JVR
The management was not prepared to trade these players, so obviously there was no interest (as these players were never in the market)
We should accept the fact that we were not good enough to compete with or without JVR
TheGoldenJet
Registered User
Lame excuses are for losers. The Leafs lost. They were not the better team, end of story.
So stubborn. Those Leafs fans who agreed with me that the Leafs needed to trade JVR (among the other UFAs) either this summer or during the season, were 100% right. The playoffs showed this to be true. Those of you arguing otherwise are now faced with the reality of a 1st round exit and a loss of multiple high picks at the 2018 draft. That is the price you pay for gambling on an unlikely Cup run, and falling short as expected. When the entire table around you goes all in, it may be smart to take a step back.
Where is this ‘rule’ written? St. Louis traded Stastny and still made the playoffs, and have assets to show for it. Chicago has done the same. Colorado trades their second best player during the season, gets a massive haul of futures back, and actually improved as a team by playing the kids, sometimes they’ll surprise you. How good would Kapanen be right now if we had given him and entire year of 2nd line RW icetime? What about Johnsson?
Baloney. Check Lou’s post-TDL interview from February. He specifically mentions that he didn’t deliberate long about whether or not to hold onto his UFAs; he wanted to keep them for the playoffs, and that was that. Lou admitted that they were never seriously shopped during the season (if we can take him at his word). Also, there was some interest in JVR that we know of, despite the Leafs not actively shopping him.
All in all, keeping the UFAs was a bad decision. That should be obvious now, even to the most stubborn posters on this board *cough cough*
As for acquiring Dmen: yes, picks can do that for you as well. Picks from trading the likes of JVR and Bozak away. I wonder what two 2018 1st rounders and three 2018 2nd rounders could bring back?
GoonieFace
Registered User
GoonieFace
Registered User
Chicago was in cap hell, they had no choice to trade guys. Plus, they had just won the Stanley Cup which changes the whole narrative. Bad comparison.
GoonieFace
Registered User
There is a substantial benefit to making the playoffs and gaining valuable experience. Did they Leafs have a chance and making some noise in the playoffs? Of course they did. This wasn't a team that squeaked in, they finished with the 7th most points in the league.
They already have a very young and inexperienced group of players. Like it or not, you need some veteran players to insulate the younger players by playing in certain situations. Having a Kapanen and Johnsson get some real experience in the AHL is valuable in the long run. Why the rush to push these kids into a situation that they may fail at. This is why you keep the JVR's and Bozak's around. You have a successful season, and you owe it to the guys that got you there to see how far they can take it. You don't dump 50 goals worth of players a month before a record setting season ends to acquire a few extra draft picks. What kind of message does that send to that group of players who worked all season to get where they are.
Some of you will never understand this, so this is probably just a waste of time.
Gary Nylund
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- Oct 10, 2013
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Agree 100%. It's funny, you could say that after 6 games and 2 periods we were the better team by just a little bit so how much does one period change? The answer IMHO is that it changes everything. They completely crushed us when everything was on the line, it was like men vs boys. They know how to win, we don't. No question whatsoever that they were/are the better team.
Colorado - great example IMO.
And this hasn't been talked about it much but I mentioned this as far back as the off-season - a huge side-benefit of trading JVR would be playing time for the kids be it Kapanen, Johnsson, Leivo or whoever else. And it's an excellent question, how good would Kapanen be? Maybe we even beat Boston if we go that route. I kind of doubt it but it's possible.
GoonieFace
Registered User
Colorado traded Duchesne because he was a problem in the dressing room as well. Kapanen got 40 games of NHL experience plus post season, he was able to work his way into a more prominent role instead of being thrown into a role he may not have succeeded at. Johnsson also got to play 1st line minutes and PP in the AHL, which is necessary to adapt to the NHL game from Europe, once again throwing him into a more prominent role may have backfired.
FerrisRox
"Wanna go, Prettyboy?"
Last year's 99-point St. Louis Blues team sold off Kevin Shattenkirk at the deadline.
You can pretend it's an unprecedented idea to sell off assets you don't plan to retain even during a winning season, but that doesn't make it true.
Gary Nylund
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Regardless of why Colorado made the trade, the fact is the kids stepped up and did well, no reason that couldn't have happened here. You're right though, the same may not have happened here, no way to know for sure how it would have turned out.
It's amazing how many people are pretending this never happened. Literally hundreds of times I've seen people say this. A M A Z I N G!
ShaneFalco
Registered User
The Leafs had holes that weren't addressed (C and D) . Trading JVR last summer could have helped address those needs, or could of helped now if it were picks/prospects. And as others have mentioned, it would have allowed other guys to get into the lineup and if they weren't ready, they could have made a minor deal. JVR is no leader, and his "vet presence" would not have been missed IMO.
Water under the bridge now. Now the important thing is what they do going forward, and who is going to do it
Water under the bridge now. Now the important thing is what they do going forward, and who is going to do it
GoonieFace
Registered User
Its not necessarily the veteran presence. Its more so about buying time and allowing the younger players to work their way into a more prominent role, instead of being forced into one.
For the record, I cannot stand JVR, but I understand the rationale to keep him. The Leafs have a decent group of younger players ready to step in, and with the FA options in Europe, they can afford to miss out on acquiring a few picks and ensure the team grows as they see fit.
And how do you expect to become a team that knows how to win? By selling and telling the players on the roster that management doesn't believe in them? Or by bringing in players who do know how to win, and bettering their chances of winning themselves?
And yes, it's possible we win with Kapanen in JVR's spot. Any change could make that possible, because we were that close. It's possible playing Komarov and Martin would have would have helped us beat Boston. I kind of doubt that, too. And it sure isn't a good argument to make.
I think the closest we were getting was with Bozak, JVR, and Plekanec. I'd happily try that combination again. But, sadly, the Leafs might not have this kind of forward depth for years to come, so I'm glad they tried it while they had the chance.
New User Name
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- Jan 2, 2008
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I was one who wanted the Leafs to explore the market for JVR, Bozak etc.
I was also against trading seconds this year and last year.
It's my opinion the Leafs wasted valuable assets that very well could have been used to move up in the draft or acquire more players.
It's just an opinion, just as yours is.
Having Kapanen and Johnsson play more if JVR/Bozak/Komarov were moved, very well could have been beneficial and that experience help them beat the Bruins.
Obviously we'll never know, as we'll never know what we could have done with additional picks.
We know what happened keeping JVR/Bozak.
I do find the bold condescending though.
I don't profess to be right, nor should you.
GoonieFace
Registered User
