Teams not granted expansion

Discussion in 'The Business of Hockey' started by Cropduster, Apr 4, 2007.

  1. Cropduster

    Cropduster Registered User

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    does anyone remember or have a link to which cities were bidding for teams back when Minnesota, Atlanta, Columbus, and Nashville got their awarded franchises? The city's who tried but didnt get them?
     
  2. Irish Blues

    Irish Blues Still on hiatus

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    http://www.canoe.ca/97NHLExpansion/zexex5.html

    Houston (3 bids; only one got to the final round)
    Oklahoma City (got to the final round)
    Hampton Roads, VA
    Hamilton, Ontario
    Raleigh-Durham, NC (offer rescinded when Karamanos announced the Hurricanes would move to Raleigh)
     
  3. Jets4Life

    Jets4Life Registered User

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    I wouldn't mind seeing a team in Houston. The WHA Aeros were relatively sucessful in the 70's, and they have a good history of supporting minor league hockey.
     
  4. The Muffin Stud

    The Muffin Stud Registered User

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    Wha..? Who....? Where....? :dunno:
     
  5. kdb209

    kdb209 Registered User

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    Houston would almost certainly have gotten a team in the last round of expansion if they had had an appropriate venue at the time - the Summit (later the Compaq Center, and now home to the Lakewood Church mega church) was built in 1975 and only seated 15K for hockey. The Toyota Center (new home of the NBA Rockets) was not even in the planning stages back then, and didn't open until late 2003.

     
  6. garnetpalmetto

    garnetpalmetto Global Moderator

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    Hampton Roads has a decent minor league hockey tradition - they lasted some 11 years in the ECHL as the Hampton Roads Admirals from 1989 until 2000 when they bolted for the AHL and changed names to the Norfolk Admirals. Prior to that, the Hampton/Norfolk area has been home to several teams - in roughly chronological order:

    Tidewater Wings (AHL) 1971-1972
    Virginia Wings (AHL) 1972-1975
    Hampton Gulls (SHL) 1974-1977
    Tidewater Sharks (SHL) 1975-1977
    Hampton Gulls (AHL) 1977-1978
    Hampton Aces (NEHL) 1978-1979
    Hampton Aces (EHL) 1979-1981
    Hampton Roads Gulls (ACHL) 1982-1983
    Hampton Roads Admirals (ECHL) 1989-2000
    Norfolk Admirals (AHL) 2000-present
     
  7. EbencoyE

    EbencoyE Registered User

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    Did they have an arena in the planning stages when they put in the bid? I assume the league probably thought they were too close to Washington or the market wasn't big enough.

    Wasn't Hampton Roads vying for the Washington Nationals' new stadium to be built there too? Thought I they were one of the choices along with Alexandria.
     
  8. garnetpalmetto

    garnetpalmetto Global Moderator

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    I believe they did - a 20,000 seat arena in downtown Norfolk just north of the current Norfolk Scope where the Admirals currently play. If memory serves, the team (but not the arena) was to be owned by George Shinn and would have been called the Hampton Roads Rhinos.

    Edit: Found this link which discusses the arena - looks like it would have seated 18,500 for hockey and would have cost around $143 million. Some interesting stuff in general in here.

    http://www.facilityplanners.com/news/pdf/Rhinos 101.pdf
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2007
  9. Gnashville

    Gnashville HFBoards Hall of Famer

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    Interesting Winnipeg, Hartford, and Quebec DID NOT put in Bids and did not get teams. Funny how everyone thinks they should have been granted teams without even applying for franchises. Bettman just hates them I guess
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2007
  10. Weary

    Weary Registered User

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    The call for expansion bids went out in June of 1996. The Nordiques left Quebec in 1995. The Jets left Winnipeg in 1996. The Whalers left Hartford in 1997.
     
  11. GSC2k2*

    GSC2k2* Guest

    Nothing was stopping Winnipeg or Quebec.
     
  12. Weary

    Weary Registered User

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    No. But given the timing, I think it's easy to understand why they did not (and obvious to understand why Hartford could not). The fact that none of the three submitted an expansion bid is, when you get down to it, not that interesting.
     
  13. OneMoreAstronaut

    OneMoreAstronaut Reduce chainsaw size

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    *gag*
     
  14. kdb209

    kdb209 Registered User

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    Even if any of them had, it would have been a complete non-starter. None of them had an acceptable arena and none of them had any plans in place to build one.

    Houston was nixed because of the Summit - Winnipeg, Quebec, and Hartford would have been likewise because of the Winnipeg Arena, Le Colisée, and the Hartford Shopping Center.
     
  15. Matthew

    Matthew F.A.R.T on Mike Todd

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    Didn't Cleveland try or was that just my imagination?
     
  16. HF_Rangers

    HF_Rangers Registered User

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    If you check Google Groups, you can find some old articles on expansion. I'll dig a few up right now.

    EDIT: Here's some discussions from over 10 years ago:
    http://groups.google.com/group/rec....98d3ecdaa2615c6?q=NHL+Expansion&lnk=ol&hl=en&
    http://groups.google.com/group/rec....=NHL+Expansion&rnum=21&hl=en#d1fcc089da823367
    http://groups.google.com/group/rec....nsion+Milwaukee&rnum=1&hl=en#6265ef256e0315ae
    http://groups.google.com/group/rec....nsion+Milwaukee&rnum=4&hl=en#0ffd58bcbc0ea334

    As an added bonus for someone who asked about Cleveland, here's a rant from 1985.http://groups.google.com/group/net....sion+Cleveland&rnum=10&hl=en#cea17886e781d710

    Cleveland never applied for expansion as far as I know, even in the early stages of the 1990's. The Gunds took their share of the North Stars and created the San Jose Sharks, even though they owned the Cleveland Cavaliers and were building a new arena. After the Barons debacle of the 1970's, I don't think Cleveland would ever get a sniff of the NHL, quite sadly. At least Columbus has a team to call their own, I think that was the best choice for pro hockey in the Buckeye State.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2007
  17. Hawker14

    Hawker14 Registered User

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    Yeah that is interesting.

    It's also interesting Bettman didn't go a full year of a lockout in '94 to get a salary cap and revenue sharing to help Winnipeg, Hartford or Quebec.

    He sure as heck did ten years later to keep bottom feeders like Nashville around though. Pretty pathetic that even with a $ 12 million revenue sharing cheque bumping up the payroll, paid attend can't even reach 14,000 per game at the Nashville Arena, with prices among the lowest in the league. Now, due to lack of fan support, the team can leave in 2008.

    No wonder no company will risk putting their name on the arena.
     
  18. GSC2k2*

    GSC2k2* Guest

    If they do not, will you leave?
     
  19. Melrose Munch

    Melrose Munch Registered User

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    That's not very nice.
     
  20. kdb209

    kdb209 Registered User

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    Actually Bettman wanted a salary cap in '94 and very well might have led the lockout for a full year, but the Big Market owners cut a deal over Bettman's objections in 1995. That was why GB got the supermajority clause put into his contract when it was renewed - to prevent the same thing from happening again.

    But why let facts get in the way of a perfectly good anti-GB rant.
     
  21. Irish Blues

    Irish Blues Still on hiatus

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    You forgot to include, "and a chance to bash Nashville/Carolina/Phoenix while touting how Winnipeg would allegedly do better."
     
  22. GKJ

    GKJ Global Moderator

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    Could you imagine these boards if Hampton Roads, Virginia got an NHL team?
     
  23. Foy

    Foy Registered User

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    It's the largest metropolitan area in the United States without a top-level professional sports team.

    It's the cities of Newport News, Virginia Beach, Hampton, Norfolk, and Portsmouth all blended together.
     
  24. krudmonk

    krudmonk Registered User

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    Isn't that what every town says now? I hear it way too much.
     
  25. Foy

    Foy Registered User

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    Except that it's true at 1.6 milllion people. It's even mentioned in it's wikipedia article.
    As of 2003, it was the 33rd largest metropolitan area in the US, ahead of NHL franchises like the Carolina Huricanes, the Nashville Predators, and Buffalo Sabres.
     

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