WJC: Team Finland 2018 U20 WJC Roster Talk
- Thread starter ChicagoBullsFan
- Start date
Am I the only one who liked our coaching? Sure the end result was disappointing, but I liked the style of hockey Finland played. Apart from the Canada game Finland was quick in transition, and the team improved every game. What failed was what was pointed out before the tournament as the teams weaknesses: centers and goaltending. As far as coaching the negatives were an inability to defend rushes from the other team, both odd man and even strength rushes, as well as not driving enough to the net on our own rushes, and that's on Ahokas. Also they should have tried other goaltenders, UPL is still resting on the laurels of his U18 feats. I don't agree that he's a terrible goalie prospect, he clearly has the size, athleticism and puck handling ability, but he needs the fundamentals of positioning and posture. He was regularly beat five-hole and short side. Get him a good goalie coach and he'll be fine.
Hockeyisl1fe
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Juhani Tamminen is the answer. Actually according to him he invented the whole game, he surely would know the deep secrets of winning on a small rink.
BB88
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This was simply pathetic.
Right now I don't want to see Luukkonen ever again on goal, if you can't expect your goalie to make a save, or if he can't make a save what is he doing on one of the best junior teams at the WJC.
Defense was great and gave Luukkonen a shot, Juolevi was the biggest + for me in this tournament, he won some fans back.
1st& 4th lines were good. Kuokkanen was a complete bust.
Koppanen the biggest surprise at F.
We could have coached this team to make the top8.
Right now I don't want to see Luukkonen ever again on goal, if you can't expect your goalie to make a save, or if he can't make a save what is he doing on one of the best junior teams at the WJC.
Defense was great and gave Luukkonen a shot, Juolevi was the biggest + for me in this tournament, he won some fans back.
1st& 4th lines were good. Kuokkanen was a complete bust.
Koppanen the biggest surprise at F.
We could have coached this team to make the top8.
Hockeyisl1fe
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Välimäki was one of our better players in the first 3 games, but he couldn't continue on that level. I agree on Heiskanen being disapointing, although Kuokkanen still takes the cake.
Critical13
Fear is the mind-killer.
I don't remember Kuokkanen's name being called a single time other than taking a PS today. Invisible.
JustaFinnishGuy
Joonas Donskoi avi but not a SEA fan ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I disagree on Tolvanen whole heartedly, since I'm a NSH fan.
Tolvanen will be ran through Milwaukee, but he won't be there for long. He is the replacement for James Neal as soon as this year if Poile chooses to do such a decision.
Poile needs a trade deadline acquisition into this team to bring more depth and scoring touch - Smith and Fiala along with Johansen have all gone MIA many times across a 82 game season.
In the playoffs last year we lacked C depth- doubt Poile wants the same to happen to our wingers this year.
Tolvanen will surely be an NHL regular the next year. He has shown much more than Fiala has in his respective D+1 year and Tolvanen really looks NHL ready, although he needs work with board battles and funnily enough, offensive awareness towards shooting or passing in a situation.
BB88
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As far as our skaters go the D-men were fine, if somewhat underwhelming given their skill level. Jokiharju was the most consistent. Juolevi picked it up in later stages after a bad start. Välimäki was good for 3 games and then disappeared, although never really bad. Heiskanen was underwhelming, but not really bad either. Vaakanainen, Salo and Kotkansalo were non-factors.
The first and fourth lines were good after Räsänen was slotted between Tolvanen and Vesalainen, even if Tolvanen was snakebit. The fourth line was better than I could have hoped for. The second line was disappointing, Heponiemi scored a couple off of broken plays, but there was no synergy or puck support on that line and Kuokkanen was by far the most disappointing player. Koivula always felt like he was a stride behind the play. The third line was about the same as the second, but also had lower expectations, so they get more of a pass, although Ikonen clearly could have done better. Tuulola was good on the boards and not much else. Innala skated around and didn't really do anything.
The first and fourth lines were good after Räsänen was slotted between Tolvanen and Vesalainen, even if Tolvanen was snakebit. The fourth line was better than I could have hoped for. The second line was disappointing, Heponiemi scored a couple off of broken plays, but there was no synergy or puck support on that line and Kuokkanen was by far the most disappointing player. Koivula always felt like he was a stride behind the play. The third line was about the same as the second, but also had lower expectations, so they get more of a pass, although Ikonen clearly could have done better. Tuulola was good on the boards and not much else. Innala skated around and didn't really do anything.
It's not up to Nashville's needs, it's up to whether Tolvanen is ready or not. If he isn't, then he'll be in Milwaukee for a while after the early look. Generally, NSH doesn't rush its prospects. And as of right now, Tolvanen is most definitely not NHL ready. He's close though, and may be by the start of the next season, but it's not a guarantee.
Whether you disagree or not, please take note that I still consider him a player we shouldn't count on to return next year. So I still consider his odds of not being available for the WJC rather good. If we get him, he'll be a nice bonus. But it's not a done deal.
Past Considerations
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FinPanda
Team Finland 2022 WHC champions
I think Kuokkanen was still injured. I can't see him really being that bad as he showed in this tournament.
Periwinkle
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Overall a very incoherent tournament. It seemed that when the team got it "on" it was a very good performance. Even though the coaching did try to include some more NA style elements to the game- with varying level of success- the biggest issue was our old friend, lack of goal-scoring. There's no need to excessively blame Luukkonen, but he was average at best and didn't show anything extra in any game . As soon as it was time for shoot-out I "knew" we'd lose, considering the two elements needed- great finishing by the forwards and great goaltending- favored the Czechs.
I'm by no means terribly knowledgeable about game systems but even to a layman like me there were lots of bizarre elements in Finland's game. Like the commentators often remarked, carrying the puck instead of passing (leading to attacks being halted at the blue line because others had to wait for the puck), often the first man being so deep and shooting so early that there were very few players to shoot rebounds in, lots of desperate shots from the blueline/outside the circle even when there was plenty of space and time to find a better shot. In the powerplay what struck as odd was that instead of keeping the puck moving fast the game was intentionally (?) brought to a standstill so that the opposition had plenty of time to block shooting lines.
I think we had a team with a very good chance at a medal, honestly we were better at second half of the game against the tournament favorites USA. Perhaps bronze could have been realistic this year, had all clicked. Instead, no one besides Koppanen exceeded expectations and here we are.
Some remarks on some players:
Tolvanen- overall still one of the best of our forwards, but obviously he was under a lot of scrutiny and the expectations were high that he still was a disappointment. Considering his reputation as a shooter I thought his best moments were actually as a playmaker. This is fine but considering the team lacked- despite expectations- great goal scoring talents his 20+(?) shot on the logo were more than frustrating. Also the very junior hockey type blind passes were arrogant/stupid, although he seemed to stop doing them in later games. He seemed to have a quieter phase at the end of fall season in the KHL , and now mediocre WJC's, hope he gets out of his funk. I guess he is still on track to make the Olympic team?
Heiskanen - I honestly didn't think he was as bad as many complained. He wasn't great either. To me it seemed that it either was or he felt like his role was to be a secure, stable D (not really stay-at-home type, but still a more defensive role) because his partner and many other D were more offensively inclined? I thought he mostly played quite well, although considering the #3 overall status I get why people expected more.
Vaakanainen - So-so. Ended up in my minus column because I just have no patience for taking stupid penalties in games like these.
Juolevi - As the old wisdom goes, for a D being unnoticeable may actually be a good thing, and I thought overall he was solid with some good assisting the O.
Innala - why was this guy on the team? He seemed like some slower version of Pihlström with lots of "energy" that leads to nothing, and with wooden hands.
Kuokkanen - yikes.
I'm by no means terribly knowledgeable about game systems but even to a layman like me there were lots of bizarre elements in Finland's game. Like the commentators often remarked, carrying the puck instead of passing (leading to attacks being halted at the blue line because others had to wait for the puck), often the first man being so deep and shooting so early that there were very few players to shoot rebounds in, lots of desperate shots from the blueline/outside the circle even when there was plenty of space and time to find a better shot. In the powerplay what struck as odd was that instead of keeping the puck moving fast the game was intentionally (?) brought to a standstill so that the opposition had plenty of time to block shooting lines.
I think we had a team with a very good chance at a medal, honestly we were better at second half of the game against the tournament favorites USA. Perhaps bronze could have been realistic this year, had all clicked. Instead, no one besides Koppanen exceeded expectations and here we are.
Some remarks on some players:
Tolvanen- overall still one of the best of our forwards, but obviously he was under a lot of scrutiny and the expectations were high that he still was a disappointment. Considering his reputation as a shooter I thought his best moments were actually as a playmaker. This is fine but considering the team lacked- despite expectations- great goal scoring talents his 20+(?) shot on the logo were more than frustrating. Also the very junior hockey type blind passes were arrogant/stupid, although he seemed to stop doing them in later games. He seemed to have a quieter phase at the end of fall season in the KHL , and now mediocre WJC's, hope he gets out of his funk. I guess he is still on track to make the Olympic team?
Heiskanen - I honestly didn't think he was as bad as many complained. He wasn't great either. To me it seemed that it either was or he felt like his role was to be a secure, stable D (not really stay-at-home type, but still a more defensive role) because his partner and many other D were more offensively inclined? I thought he mostly played quite well, although considering the #3 overall status I get why people expected more.
Vaakanainen - So-so. Ended up in my minus column because I just have no patience for taking stupid penalties in games like these.
Juolevi - As the old wisdom goes, for a D being unnoticeable may actually be a good thing, and I thought overall he was solid with some good assisting the O.
Innala - why was this guy on the team? He seemed like some slower version of Pihlström with lots of "energy" that leads to nothing, and with wooden hands.
Kuokkanen - yikes.
BusQuets
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Have to agree. He had like half the tenacity and speed in these games compared to what he had in the NHL start of the season.
ChicagoBullsFan
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Are you f***ing kidding me?
Juhani '' don tami'' Tamminen isn't nothing else than wanna be Don Cherry.
If Finland wants succeed in north american rink the coach needs to north american.
Hockeyisl1fe
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Canada4Gold
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yeah, they've gone to a Canada, other country, Canada, other country, ... pattern for a little while now. Putting one in the USA has resulted in 3 in a row in North America which makes it seem like Europe may have been abandoned, but they'll be back to every other tournament in Europe again until they return to USA again or change the pattern.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
Good. I'm tired to Don tami.
Thank god he left MTV's hockey analysts position. That old fossil should have been retired 20 yrs ago.
Thank god you are not.
Dropping out of the tournament at this point was not on the coaching staff. They outplayed Czechs and still found a way to lose.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
Suoraa puhetta Pikkuleijonien MM-katastrofista – ”Miten ihmeessä tämä voitiin sössiä?”
Watch and listen this and think again. Have a nice day.
FinPanda
Team Finland 2022 WHC champions
Why you are so mean to everyone who disagrees with you? You could be a lot nicer.
Past Considerations
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Did you watch and listen that yourself? Where was the part where they advocated firing Ahokas and hiring some North American instead?
Periwinkle
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- Apr 3, 2014
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So because those guys said so it must be so...?
I can agree with lot of what they said but there was some eye-roll worthy stuff there as well. Finland's defense was so bad on our own end that Finland never got managed to interrupt the opponent's pressure (mylly) once...? What is Rantanen even talking about? I also didn't get why they didn't place any of the blame on the players but all on the coaching. (Not a fan of the overly aggressive posturing either.)
Jets fan, couldn't catch most of the games so I was hoping someone could tell me how Vesalainen looked.
ChicagoBullsFan
Registered User
Show me where i'm mentioned that Rantanen and Nyholm have said Ahokas should fired.
Don't start re-write my comments.
