Olympics: Switzerland Roster Discussion (Roster in post 1)

duga

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Except for the exclusion of Richards (but then again I understand the rational for Corvi and Almond) I think that every choice can be easily defended. I get why Scherwey, Vermin, Herzog and Bodenmann over Hoffman, Brunner, Fazzini etc. I also get why Corvi over :eek::eek::eek::eek:i, even if I personally would have taken :eek::eek::eek::eek:i. Specially since Richards won't be there, a center that can win faceoffs can be important.

The good thing is that there are actual choices to be made, this feels like a new, fresh feeling. Fischer can choose a roster that he believes fits better together, rather than just the maximum number of players than can actually play hockey, fill the rest and then try to figure out how to play.
He will probably do different choices for the world championship.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have depth!

While Im with you with pretty much all of your post.
One thing though, :eek::eek::eek::eek:i will never help your team improve FO% Just by the eyetest over all those years with ZSC, he's among the worst centers in the NLA on the dot, and would loose them regularly against wingers, after their center got sent away. He's way to weak to use his fine hands effectively face to face.

And when he can't glide on open ice, but has to play stationary or along the boards in the offensive zone, he's so weak that even the slightest push knocks him off the puck. Even if he looked rejuvenated with Praplan and Hollenstein at the Spengler Cup with space and time and is a joy to watch like that, the glaring weaknesses in his game were exposed too when the games thightened up. Unfortunately he isn't a step further than he was 5 years ago.

While Corvi is physically average, no where near as elegant a skater and as an unproven player, you don't know if or how he can transfer his talent to the higher level of play, something :eek::eek::eek::eek:i has done in the past, the holes in Corvi's overall game are nowhere near as big. He is somehow the more solid choice of the 2. And can actually shoot the puck.

Therefore Corvi over :eek::eek::eek::eek:i IMO.
 

jonas2244

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Richard is a different case I suppose, he might just lost the competition against Suter, Almond, Vermin and Schäppi or it could be something else, maybe around team-building as he has a strong character, not unlike RvA, doesn't always stick strictly to the gameplan, and likes to take stupid penalties once in a while.

His physical presence, FOskills and playmaking ability would've been very welcomed though.

I really think that it has to do something around the team, around his personality or something like that. Richard had a good WC and also a good Spengler Cup. His strenghts are pretty rare in Switzerland. But there is always something we don't know, we have no direct insight into the team and sometimes you just have to respect such a decision.

Do you guys think any of the players would get a shot at the NHL next season if they have a good tournament?

What about Haas, Praplan, Suter?

It's an open secret that all of those are scouted. And all 3 are of course interesting and in my opinion they all have NHL-potential.
 

Jon Riley

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While Im with you with pretty much all of your post.
One thing though, :eek::eek::eek::eek:i will never help your team improve FO% Just by the eyetest over all those years with ZSC, he's among the worst centers in the NLA on the dot, and would loose them regularly against wingers, after their center got sent away. He's way to weak to use his fine hands effectively face to face.
I reread what I wrote, and of course my phrasing did not make any sense...I ment to write that the face offs are one of the reasons to pick Corvi over :eek::eek::eek::eek:i..:eek::eek::eek::eek:i is horrible on the dot.
 

SwissGrog

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I reread what I wrote, and of course my phrasing did not make any sense...I ment to write that the face offs are one of the reasons to pick Corvi over :eek::eek::eek::eek:i..:eek::eek::eek::eek:i is horrible on the dot.
Well this year :eek::eek::eek::eek:i is 47% on the dot and 50% in defensive zone faceoff ....not great, but horrible is something else.
And while i would agree that the :eek::eek::eek::eek:i of September /October didn't deserve a nomination, the :eek::eek::eek::eek:i from the Spengler and Jan 18 with lugano looked decisively on fire. His line is carrying lugano at the moment.
 

stv11

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The problem with :eek::eek::eek::eek:i is that if you play him with Hollenstein and Praplan, you break a line that has been kept together for more than one year and have to find new linemates for Haas. This is a big risk to take with only two games before the beginning of the tournament. Had :eek::eek::eek::eek:i regained his form earlier, he probably would have gotten more consideration and a chance to show what he can do with another line. Instead, he's just a back up plan if Haas does not make it.

Anybody wants to take a shot at guessing the lineup? The Haas and Almond lines from last year's WC will probably be kept the same, and I assume Corvi will play with Ambühl, as has been the case lately with Davos and at the Karjala cup. Their most likely linemate I think is Moser, as he should get a role on an offensive line and played a game with them last November. Suter would be another possibility, he worked well with Ambühl at the WC. Bodenmann and Scherwey played with Schäppi at the Spengler cup, but going with this would mean breaking the 4th line and would defeat the purpose of picking Almond. Vermin - Suter - Herzog was also tried but didn't work too well.

Guessing lineups was a lot easier back in Krueger's time :D
 

MBTendy

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May 6, 2009
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Sweet, Stephan made it. Hopefully he stays healthy for this tourney and gets a game or two.
 

King Weber

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excited to see Suter play. Been keeping an eye on him since his draft year, hoping that the Preds would sign him before someone else does.
 

Pandaman11

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Surprised that Corvi made it. Fazzini should be there, at least as 13th F and PP weapon. Not sure if Herzog deserves just because of his goals against Canada.

Moser - Haas - Rüfenacht
Hollenstein - Suter - Praplan
Ambühl - Almond - Bodemann
Scherwey - Schäppi - Herzog
Vermin

Geering - Diaz
Blum - Untersander
Furrer - Loeffel
Du Bois

Genoni
Hiller

Extras: Corvi, Schlumpf, Stephan
 

stv11

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Fazzini's skating is a big issue at this level, I'd be surprised if he's ever successful in international hockey. Herzog got a bit overrated after the game against Canada, but he did well enough at the Karjala cup and Spengler cup to prove that it was no fluke.
 

Pandaman11

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Fazzini's skating is a big issue at this level, I'd be surprised if he's ever successful in international hockey.
I know, but that's why I'd have him as 13th F and not higher. 4 min. per game with time on the PP. Let him use his laser shot there and get him off the ice.
Not sure what Vermin or Corvi can bring with 4-5 min. ice time.

But yeah, I guess a coach sees it differently. I would usually take offensive weapons as 13th F and use them on the PP, especially if the offense doesn't work, which has often been a Swiss problem (e.g. Sochi).
 

Jon Riley

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According to Lugano HC, Hoffmann is one of the replacement in case of someone's forfeit.
Is there any info about who else can be called in case of need?
I like Hoffmann a lot, I see NHL potential in him, I hope that if he does not play at the olympics he'll get a chance at the WHC
 
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jonas2244

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Herzog plays a game which works very good at international play, probably better than in Switzerland. I really can understand his selection and don't think there is a similar player with the same skillset in Switzerland. Hofmann is a great skater, very fast, but otherwise he just seem to miss a lot. I don't see any NHL-upside there.

Regarding Fazzini and using him as 13F. If you go into a tournament in which you cannot exchange players it's just a very high risk to select a player for 4 minutes of PP-play. You need versatile players which can play in many situations and that's probably the reason behind selecting Vermin, Scherwey, Bodenmann, etc. over Fazzini.
 

Jon Riley

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Disclaimer: Sorry I keep on talking about Lugano's players but that's just because it's the team I follow the most
What do you think about Bürgler? I see a very complete player, defensively sound, that scores, has good hands and he's great in front of the goal. He plays both power play and penalty killing.
Is it just me that thinks it is a little strange that in the last years he basically has never had any chance to play for the NT, not even in friendly matches?
Is it just because his skating is quite sketchy and his speed is sub par?
 

stv11

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Disclaimer: Sorry I keep on talking about Lugano's players but that's just because it's the team I follow the most
What do you think about Bürgler? I see a very complete player, defensively sound, that scores, has good hands and he's great in front of the goal. He plays both power play and penalty killing.
Is it just me that thinks it is a little strange that in the last years he basically has never had any chance to play for the NT, not even in friendly matches?
Is it just because his skating is quite sketchy and his speed is sub par?

Skating is clearly an issue with Bürgler, this is pretty much the same case as Fazzini. He got his share of national team calls under Simpson, including when Fischer was assistant coach (he travelled with the team to the 2013 WC if I remember correctly). I guess this was enough to convince Fischer that he can't cut it in international hockey.

International hockey is both faster and tougher than the Swiss league, many players that are efficient with their club team are left out of the national team for fast players who can grind along the board. This is why Schäppi is better than Sprunger for the national team despite one being one of the league's best scorer and the other being a 3rd liner.

Hofmann is a great skater, very fast, but otherwise he just seem to miss a lot. I don't see any NHL-upside there.

I think there's more to Hofmann's game than speed, he can handle the puck decently and is a good goal scorer. His biggest weakness is his lack of hockey sense, he is so poor at reading the play that he's difficult to fit into a team. I remember a few situations at the Spengler cup when Suter wanted to set him up on the power play with a cross ice pass, but Hofmann didn't realise that the opponent's box was streched.
 

duga

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I think there's more to Hofmann's game than speed, he can handle the puck decently and is a good goal scorer. His biggest weakness is his lack of hockey sense, he is so poor at reading the play that he's difficult to fit into a team. I remember a few situations at the Spengler cup when Suter wanted to set him up on the power play with a cross ice pass, but Hofmann didn't realise that the opponent's box was streched.

I wanted to write something similar about Hofmann.

Beside Corvi, Simion and till his jump to NA Malgin, he's the one swiss player in the NLA whose path I followed most closely the last few years. As I always thought if he puts all the pieces together, he'd be one of the best and most spectacular swiss forwards. IIRC I even stated once in here, he'd have the highest ceiling of all 92er forwards, arguably the best group of forwards Switzerland has produced so far...:rolleyes:

Well, if he really has, he certainly hasn't come close to it yet.

He always somewhat reminded me of a younger Ambühl. Not stylewise, but how his game was built up.

Feet > hands > brain

How much they differ though, and, here it gets tricky, varies wildy within a season, sometimes even from game to game. He does not only look like a teenager, he plays a bit like one too.

His biggest problem IMO is his mental inconsistency and streakiness. He does many things on the upper edge of speed and intensity for his brain and talent to follow: how he skates, handles the puck or makes a play.

When he's off his game, he oftenly overbites. he fumbles the puck or loses it at high speed, mistimes the most simple pass, starts to hesitate with his skating and is everywhere, just never there, where he should be. It's pretty frustrating to watch.

When he's on his game though, he's a joy to watch. He skates around opponents with ease, then his hands are suddenly not only quick, but fine as well and he's pulling moves successfully now and he's got a variety of shots which are dangerous all-over the offensive zone to acctually finish of a play. He even does show some surprising playmaking on top of his game. Then he still isn't a guy with great overall vision, but when he sees a possible passing line, has the quick feet and hands to open up a line and thread the needle with a laserpass.

That's why Lugano used him quite often last and this season at the right half-board on the PP. He setup Fazzini nicely a few times already this season. And there's always the danger, he takes the shot himself.

He still does some questionable plays in between, but he produces a high volume of chances, half-chances or a bit of chaos, that it's absolutely worth it. Then he's everywhere on the ice and oftenly close to the puck. Even if he isn't the most effective forechecker, as he still got no concept how to use his body correctly, but forces opponents into errors with his skating intensity. Then he even is a dangerous penalty killer.

In the prep games to the WHC 2 years ago, he played freely and scored something like 8 goals in 10 games, and he looked like he could transfer a lot of his game to the higher level. During the WHC he cooled down severely and IIRC wasn't he even benched in the end? The full Hofmann range.

As his ex-coach, Fischer knows him pretty well and he suits his idea of what a forward should be capable of, but he knows the risk as well. Maybe just not solid enough for the Olympics.

NHL? Im not as sure as 2 years ago and he definitely has to mature further, and maybe his overall hockey IQ isn't good enough. But he's been to the camp this year and who knows about next year... a strong WHC surely would help.

It was no coincidence, that legendary interview when Del Curto interrupted Hofmann and humiliated him in public. He knew about the sleeping talent in this diamond in the rough and was heavily upset about Hofmann losing trust in him to develop him further.

Swiss hockey can't afford that guys as talented as him do not fully develop.
 

duga

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I really think that it has to do something around the team, around his personality or something like that. Richard had a good WC and also a good Spengler Cup. His strenghts are pretty rare in Switzerland. But there is always something we don't know, we have no direct insight into the team and sometimes you just have to respect such a.

Of course that's very true. Let's hope it's something fixable for the near future. And no Krueger RvA kindergarden.:)

I vote for a Fiala-Richard combo in the future...:popcorn: add in Timo Meier, so him and Fiala can further work on their relationship...:cf:
 
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Pandaman11

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You need versatile players which can play in many situations and that's probably the reason behind selecting Vermin, Scherwey, Bodenmann, etc. over Fazzini.
Yeah but considering that you can't divide 13 by 3 or 4, a 13th guy automatically can't play much more than 6-7 mins. anyway ;)
 

duga

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I reread what I wrote, and of course my phrasing did not make any sense...I ment to write that the face offs are one of the reasons to pick Corvi over :eek::eek::eek::eek:i..:eek::eek::eek::eek:i is horrible on the dot.

That's more how I remember him as well. Though it was obvious, he had to leave the ZSC, the magic was gone. Im really glad he refinds his joy to play in Lugano, as a confident and healthy :eek::eek::eek::eek:i is a joy to watch.



I definitely have to relearn how to multiquote... sorry guys for this flood of posts!:D
 

duga

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Gregory Hofmann replaces Joel Vermin who is sidelined for one month. Not unhappy with this change.

I guess it's more a lateral move qualitywise.

Same age, Vermin a bit more mature, smarter, better playmaker, Hofmann a bit quicker skater, better shooter, more of a potential gamebraker. Both can play center, but are more natural wingers. Both have holes in there physical game, though Vermin learnt one or two things in NA, how to win board battles.

Im excited Hofmann's there, but was happy with Vermin too.

Beside the topline guys, the depth among attackers is still good enough to make 2 or 3 changes without losing much quality.

On the defensive side though Im not so sure. Genazzi could very well be on the team. After him it's a bit more adventurous.
 

swisdan

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The way Hiller is playing lately is impressive. Seemed like he came back at a level he lost for years. Could it be enough to steal the starter job to Genoni who is bit average during the last month? Seems like a interesting debate....
 

Speyer

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The way Hiller is playing lately is impressive. Seemed like he came back at a level he lost for years. Could it be enough to steal the starter job to Genoni who is bit average during the last month? Seems like a interesting debate....

I would say Genoni still starts. Despite being not at his best the last few weeks he is still a pretty consistant goalie, who has been exellent the last few years and played very well in last years WC. But since probably both will at the groupstage, i could see Hiller taking over the starting spot during the tournament if he outperforms Genoni by a significant margin.
 

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