Super Early 2008 Top 10

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Chicago Manitoba
I think the point is why don't you just save us the trouble and post your reasons why you think it's hilarious to place McRae over Hodgson? I think it's pretty apparent the vast majority of the posters on this site haven't seen most of the prospects they comment on. That doesn't mean opinions can't be formulated based on other criteria. Besides, since you are a scout (I believe), your insights would be welcomed.

again, couldnt have worded it better. its okay to get your opinion ripped on here, just wish more people would have the guts to atleast back it up and take the time to put out a list of "their" fav players whether they have seen them or not.

I never got to see Malkin play until the WJC, but I knew he was a stud before that.. dont have to see a player directly to know just how good they are.
 

Spetzky

Registered User
Jul 31, 2004
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Edmonton
im excited for filatov and stamkos' upcoming seasons.

(hugely biased towards skilled forwards) :D


i know this is a little off topic- but when was the last time a number one pick was under 6ft? (not including crosby at 5'10/ 5'11).

DiPietro, i believe but that doesn't really count.
 

Redwingsfan

Global Moderator
Jul 15, 2006
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PEOPLE!
IF YOU RANK FILATOV IN TOP 10, THEN YOU MUST INCLUDE PETROV, BECAUSE HE IS RUSSIAN TOP FOR 2008!
At least right now.

Skilled 6'3/200 forwards doesn't grow on trees.

it may have something to do with filatov's u-18 tournament. not many people have seen petrov at he's best yet, these lists will change A LOT the next year.:)
 

Avy*

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it may have something to do with filatov's u-18 tournament. not many people have seen petrov at he's best yet, these lists will change A LOT the next year.:)

But amaze with what kind of assurance all this lads make up their draft-list... No Chudinov (sixteen-year-old kid who play for his team in play-off) No Voinov (our best
defender in U18, Zubov's miniatur copy) No Lazarev ( rocket on a skates) No Petrov (Already have a same time in RSL champion - Ak Bars, excellent skating, soft hans, 6-3 and keep grow up) No Ostapchuk (skilled, grit winger, remind's Ovy)...

I don't say that all this kids will become a first round pick's, but by all accounts this draft seems to be a one the best for euro's.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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26,276
Chicago Manitoba
But amaze with what kind of assurance all this lads make up their draft-list... No Chudinov (sixteen-year-old kid who play for his team in play-off) No Voinov (our best
defender in U18, Zubov's miniatur copy) No Lazarev ( rocket on a skates) No Petrov (Already have a same time in RSL champion - Ak Bars, excellent skating, soft hans, 6-3 and keep grow up) No Ostapchuk (skilled, grit winger, remind's Ovy)...

I don't say that all this kids will become a first round pick's, but by all accounts this draft seems to be a one the best for euro's.

for those of us who dont get a chance to see much of the Euro's until the WJC, we kind of just go by what we have seen and heard the most about from North America. By the time the next WJC comes around, I think more respect will be given to Euro players..as long as it is deserved ofcourse. I thought 08' was going to be a weak year for Euro's again, but maybe you guys are right and it may surprise us.
 

Avy*

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for those of us who dont get a chance to see much of the Euro's until the WJC, we kind of just go by what we have seen and heard the most about from North America. By the time the next WJC comes around, I think more respect will be given to Euro players..as long as it is deserved ofcourse. I thought 08' was going to be a weak year for Euro's again, but maybe you guys are right and it may surprise us.

Well how much euro's in this firs round? 2 maybe 3, but 90 a much much strongly year then 89 not only in russia, in finland sweden too. Many of 90'born make the team in U18 and even U20.
 

Juan

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Apr 30, 2002
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I think the point is why don't you just save us the trouble and post your reasons why you think it's hilarious to place McRae over Hodgson? I think it's pretty apparent the vast majority of the posters on this site haven't seen most of the prospects they comment on. That doesn't mean opinions can't be formulated based on other criteria. Besides, since you are a scout (I believe), your insights would be welcomed.

If someone has never seen a player, the only "other criteria" you could be referring to is the opinions of other people who actually have. Or more likely on this board, the opinions of other people who haven't. I guess I have the answer to my question about American Dream's list as long as I understand the notion of "garbage in, garbage out".

In any event, here's my top 10 list of players coming out of the OHL for 2008:

1. Stamkos
2. Doughty
3. Pietrangelo
4. Hodgson
5. Bogosian
6. Del Zotto
7. Bailey
8. Arniel
9. Henrique
10. Jenks
 
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Garl

Registered User
Oct 7, 2006
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it may have something to do with filatov's u-18 tournament. not many people have seen petrov at he's best yet, these lists will change A LOT the next year.:)

I understand. So I know a liitle more about russian prospects than most NA people. so I tell them, that Petrov is russian best 90 right now. Filatov is very thin, one-dimensional and he didn't played with adults. Petrov had some ice-time in RSL already, he's captain of russian 90 team, and it's leader. Consistent leader.


But amaze with what kind of assurance all this lads make up their draft-list... No Chudinov (sixteen-year-old kid who play for his team in play-off) No Voinov (our best
defender in U18, Zubov's miniatur copy) No Lazarev ( rocket on a skates) No Petrov (Already have a same time in RSL champion - Ak Bars, excellent skating, soft hans, 6-3 and keep grow up) No Ostapchuk (skilled, grit winger, remind's Ovy)...

I don't say that all this kids will become a first round pick's, but by all accounts this draft seems to be a one the best for euro's.
Most of people here are from NA, and they don't know euros very well.

I for example can't make my list, because I don't know much about NA players.

I think the right decision would be: euro posters post EURO TOP 10, NA posters post NA TOP 10.


So EURO TOP 10 from me:
Something like that
1.Kirill Petrov
2.Johan Motin
3.Nikita Filatov
4.Mikhail Stefanovich
5.Sergei Ostapchuk
6.Philip Larsen
7.Mikkel Bodker
8.Vladimir Roth
9.Mattias Tedenby
10.Vyatcheslav Voynov

HM Andre Pettersson, Maxim Chudinov, Jerome Flaake, Tomas Kubalik, Anton Gustafsson.
 

Redwingsfan

Global Moderator
Jul 15, 2006
20,370
187
But amaze with what kind of assurance all this lads make up their draft-list... No Chudinov (sixteen-year-old kid who play for his team in play-off) No Voinov (our best
defender in U18, Zubov's miniatur copy) No Lazarev ( rocket on a skates) No Petrov (Already have a same time in RSL champion - Ak Bars, excellent skating, soft hans, 6-3 and keep grow up) No Ostapchuk (skilled, grit winger, remind's Ovy)...

I don't say that all this kids will become a first round pick's, but by all accounts this draft seems to be a one the best for euro's.

yes, but there isnt much hype for most of the euro's yet. the NA players usually gets hyped when they are 15-16 years old, while the euro's dont get anyones attention until their draft year (most times).
 

Garl

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Oct 7, 2006
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Well how much euro's in this firs round? 2 maybe 3, but 90 a much much strongly year then 89 not only in russia, in finland sweden too. Many of 90'born make the team in U18 and even U20.

3? No, it's not so bad, I think 7-8 players from Europe will be in TOP 30.
 

PensFan101

Forever Champions.
Apr 23, 2007
2,123
411
Owen Sound
lol, whoever mentioned Bailey earlier... He could go way up. Quarterbacks the Windsor PP and had a storng season despite on a bad team. It's too bad my hometown team the Attack had to trade him because he was captain material and one of maybe two or three bright spots goin forward for the team... But no... We have to overpay for an overage goaltender who finished in the lower echelons of goalies in the league even after leaving a basement team...

Anyway, that's just me venting my Attack frustration...

As for the draft, I think Bodker is going to grab a lot of attention, and Stamkos should be the #1 pick.
 

Redwingsfan

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Jul 15, 2006
20,370
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I understand. So I know a liitle more about russian prospects than most NA people. so I tell them, that Petrov is russian best 90 right now. Filatov is very thin, one-dimensional and he didn't played with adults. Petrov had some ice-time in RSL already, he's captain of russian 90 team, and it's leader. Consistent leader.



Most of people here are from NA, and they don't know euros very well.

I for example can't make my list, because I don't know much about NA players.

I think the right decision would be: euro posters post EURO TOP 10, NA posters post NA TOP 10.


So EURO TOP 10 from me:
Something like that
1.Kirill Petrov
2.Johan Motin
3.Nikita Filatov
4.Mikhail Stefanovich
5.Sergei Ostapchuk
6.Philip Larsen
7.Mikkel Bodker
8.Vladimir Roth
9.Mattias Tedenby
10.Vyatcheslav Voynov

HM Andre Pettersson, Maxim Chudinov, Jerome Flaake, Tomas Kubalik, Anton Gustafsson.

what about that swiss goalie. mayer or something like that and satteri?? i havent really gotten into the 08 draft yet. i know about the hyped NA guys and some of the euro guys, but other then that, i dont know much, YET.
 

Garl

Registered User
Oct 7, 2006
8,019
1,013
what about that swiss goalie. mayer or something like that and satteri?? i havent really gotten into the 08 draft yet. i know about the hyped NA guys and some of the euro guys, but other then that, i dont know much, YET.

They are euro top goalies for 2008 draft. Haven't seen Mayer much. Sateri is IMO better than Russian Pechursky or Swedish Marcstrom.
 

Redwingsfan

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Jul 15, 2006
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They are euro top goalies for 2008 draft. Haven't seen Mayer much. Sateri is IMO better than Russian Pechursky or Swedish Marcstrom.

i havent seen mayer either, just heard he's name. i have seen satteri a couple of times and he looked very good. not really sure where hw will go in the draft yet though.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
36,959
26,276
Chicago Manitoba
If someone has never seen a player, the only "other criteria" you could be referring to is the opinions of other people who actually have. Or more likely on this board, the opinions of other people who haven't. I guess I have the answer to my question about American Dream's list as long as I understand the notion of "garbage in, garbage out".

In any event, here's my top 10 list of players coming out of the OHL for 2008:

1. Stamkos
2. Doughty
3. Pietrangelo
4. Hodgson
5. Bogosian
6. Del Zotto
7. Bailey
8. Arniel
9. Henrique
10. Jenks

great list Juanito...not what the thread was really asking for, but hey you actually put a list of 10 guys together.

Hodgson over Del Zotto??? ahhahahaha hilarious!! :biglaugh::biglaugh: just kidding, wanted to see what it would feel like in the other shoe..
 

Juan

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great list Juanito...not what the thread was really asking for, but hey you actually put a list of 10 guys together.

Hodgson over Del Zotto??? ahhahahaha hilarious!! :biglaugh::biglaugh: just kidding, wanted to see what it would feel like in the other shoe..

Actually, I fully expect to be questioned for having Del Zotto behind Hodgson and Bogosian, and some will even question him being behind Pietrangelo.

I've said it before on this board. I've been watching Del Zotto for 4 years. He has marvellous offensive instincts and talents, including one of the best point shots I've ever seen on a 16-year-old. The big BUT, though, is he is atrocious in his own end. Not "okay", not "needs work"... atrocious. Worse, he did not improve defensively one iota this past season. You could almost sense the bigger Belleville forwards perk up and start licking their chops when Del Zotto came over the boards in their 2nd round playoff series.

I don't have him as high as some people who just look at his offensive stats, because unless he improves his defensive play dramatically, he will struggle in the American League, let alone the NHL.
 

Redwingsfan

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Jul 15, 2006
20,370
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Actually, I fully expect to be questioned for having Del Zotto behind Hodgson and Bogosian, and some will even question him being behind Pietrangelo.

I've said it before on this board. I've been watching Del Zotto for 4 years. He has marvellous offensive instincts and talents, including one of the best point shots I've ever seen on a 16-year-old. The big BUT, though, is he is atrocious in his own end. Not "okay", not "needs work"... atrocious. Worse, he did not improve defensively one iota this past season. You could almost sense the bigger Belleville forwards perk up and start licking their chops when Del Zotto came over the boards in their 2nd round playoff series.

I don't have him as high as some people who just look at his offensive stats, because unless he improves his defensive play dramatically, he will struggle in the American League, let alone the NHL.

exactly what i have heard about him. i have him at #7, but if the draft was tomorrow he would have been lower. he still has a full year to improve, but if he doesnt he's going to fall pretty far, IMO.
 

Some_Arrogant_Jerk*

Guest
Surprised nobody has mentioned Jordan Eberle yet. 28 goals, and 50+ points in the dub isnt exactly a small feat.
 

cagney

cdojdmccjajgejncjaba
Jun 17, 2002
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Interesting to see Czarnik's name come up here. I was expecting him to be a big scorer for the NTDP U17 team this year but he dissapointed in the ragard. I did get to see him in a couple games from the Vlad Dzurilla tournament and he did seem to me to be the most skilled forward on the team (including McCrae who wasn't really noticable). He also ended with a strong playoff showing (5 goals and 7points in 6 games) so I have some hope for him. However, I'm surprised to see him coming up in people's top ten lists. Do you all expect his numbers to surge this coming season? Why didn't the points come for him this past season?
 

cdnhky1

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If someone has never seen a player, the only "other criteria" you could be referring to is the opinions of other people who actually have. Or more likely on this board, the opinions of other people who haven't. I guess I have the answer to my question about American Dream's list as long as I understand the notion of "garbage in, garbage out".

In any event, here's my top 10 list of players coming out of the OHL for 2008:

1. Stamkos
2. Doughty
3. Pietrangelo
4. Hodgson
5. Bogosian
6. Del Zotto
7. Bailey
8. Arniel
9. Henrique
10. Jenks

Juan, I agree with your sentiments wholeheartedly.

It's difficult to trust an opinion when the person offering it has no direct experience with the subject the are commenting on. If I'm looking to buy a new car, a Ford Explorer for example, I'd like to hear from people who have actually driven one. There is no value in hearing an opinion on the merits of the Ford Explorer, good or bad, from a guy who drives an Escalade and has never driven the Explorer.

Similarly, in the scouting business, credibility is quickly compromised when one continues to offer opinions and rankings on a player or players they have never seen. It's far too easy to type a bunch of names on a computer screen and state that this is how the players should be ranked (imo) without having any direct experience with the player. If you haven't seen a player and you offer an opinion or ranking on the player, at least have the balls to state why you feel that way. Your opinion or ranking may be based on the country the player was born in, the fact that he's a buddy of yours, or that your buddy saw him and says he's a good player, but don't pretend to be an expert on something you have no direct experience with.

I agree with your opinion on many of the players you have listed. Like you, I like Bogosian and was really impressed with what I saw from him this season. I, too, have grave concerns about Del Zotto's play on the D side of the puck. I was there the night he was a -6 againt Mississauga and the night he got walked around 4 times in Peterborough. He has outstanding offensive skills but needs to learn to play the game without the puck. Sadly I don't think he'll learn that from the coaching staff in Oshawa and if I'm his agent I'm looking to get him out of there quickly. From your perspective, is Del Zotto not interested in learning the defensive side of the game (coachability) or simply not capable of doing it (lack of ability)?

Where do you see Cuma, Gaulton, Dorazio, and Lalonde fitting into your OHL list?
 

Sore Loser

Sorest of them all
Dec 9, 2006
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Spokane, WA.
Feelin' the love...to keep things mellow about my list, I'll put up a top 5.

1. Stamkos is the best player in the draft...period
2. Doughty...obvious choice for #2
3. Luke Schenn simply because he was the best player on the ice every time he stepped on.
4. Mitch Wahl (see avatar)
5. del Zotto
 

Rabid Ranger

2 is better than one
Feb 27, 2002
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cdnhky1:

Good post above, but I'm not sure why you have a telephone pole up your rear. Most of the people who post on these boards are *fans* who have cobbled together some opinions based on a mix of direct viewing and second (third?) hand sources. Very few pass themselves off as legitimate scouts. Bottomline: If you're looking at posters like AmericanDream to give you the gospel truth on a wide range of prospects, your going to be very disappointed, and I think he'd agree. Besides, don't you come off as a bit of a hypocrite in all this? You lampoon the placement of certain USNTDP players over those in the OHL, but I seriously doubt you have a firm handle on what they bring to the table.
 

cdnhky1

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cdnhky1:

Good post above, but I'm not sure why you have a telephone pole up your rear. Most of the people who post on these boards are *fans* who have cobbled together some opinions based on a mix of direct viewing and second (third?) hand sources. Very few pass themselves off as legitimate scouts. Bottomline: If you're looking at posters like AmericanDream to give you the gospel truth on a wide range of prospects, your going to be very disappointed, and I think he'd agree. Besides, don't you come off as a bit of a hypocrite in all this? You lampoon the placement of certain USNTDP players over those in the OHL, but I seriously doubt you have a firm handle on what they bring to the table.

I'm certainly not looking at AmericanDream to give me the gospel truth on any prospect. I just think anyone who posts a ranking of prospects, many of whom they have not actually seen, should state that. He referred to someone else as being a coward for not posting a list of their own. I fail to see how courage has anything to ranking players that you haven't seen play.

As far as lampooning NTDP prospects, I stated that I didn't agree with AmericanDream's assessment of Jimmy Hayes as possibly being the best player in next year's draft. I didn't say Hayes wasn't a good player, I simply stated that I didn't think he was close to Stamkos and others presently and won't be a year from now. I also stated that I like what Colin Wilson brings to the table, and the last time checked he was in the program as well.
 

Genghis Keon

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Apr 1, 2002
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I just think anyone who posts a ranking of prospects, many of whom they have not actually seen, should state that.

I agree with this. And it's not that the information isn't appreciated, but it'd be nice if it was prefaced with something like "from what I've heard," "from what I've gathered," "it seems like," "from the little I've seen," or the like, just so we know that the information is more recycled than first hand. And there's nothing wrong with stating what you've heard because maybe you've heard or read more than others, so your description might offer some more insight than other individual source scouting reports may offer.

I think it's also frustrating/annoying/maddening for people who actually have seen these players play or actually have scouting contacts to be contradicted (and not questioned politely like "can you elaborate on this because from what I've heard...") by armchair scouts who haven't seen the players, are just going by the consensus hearsay, and come off like they have some intimate knowledge of the player's game (the player who they've never actually seen play).
 

Juan

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Apr 30, 2002
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Juan, I agree with your sentiments wholeheartedly.

It's difficult to trust an opinion when the person offering it has no direct experience with the subject the are commenting on. If I'm looking to buy a new car, a Ford Explorer for example, I'd like to hear from people who have actually driven one. There is no value in hearing an opinion on the merits of the Ford Explorer, good or bad, from a guy who drives an Escalade and has never driven the Explorer.

Similarly, in the scouting business, credibility is quickly compromised when one continues to offer opinions and rankings on a player or players they have never seen. It's far too easy to type a bunch of names on a computer screen and state that this is how the players should be ranked (imo) without having any direct experience with the player. If you haven't seen a player and you offer an opinion or ranking on the player, at least have the balls to state why you feel that way. Your opinion or ranking may be based on the country the player was born in, the fact that he's a buddy of yours, or that your buddy saw him and says he's a good player, but don't pretend to be an expert on something you have no direct experience with.

I agree with your opinion on many of the players you have listed. Like you, I like Bogosian and was really impressed with what I saw from him this season. I, too, have grave concerns about Del Zotto's play on the D side of the puck. I was there the night he was a -6 againt Mississauga and the night he got walked around 4 times in Peterborough. He has outstanding offensive skills but needs to learn to play the game without the puck. Sadly I don't think he'll learn that from the coaching staff in Oshawa and if I'm his agent I'm looking to get him out of there quickly. From your perspective, is Del Zotto not interested in learning the defensive side of the game (coachability) or simply not capable of doing it (lack of ability)?

Where do you see Cuma, Gaulton, Dorazio, and Lalonde fitting into your OHL list?

Regarding Del Zotto, he is a fine skater, has quick hands and feet and has reasonable size and strength. So I'm not sure I can say that he's not physically capable of playing better defensively. I'm also not sure I'm prepared to say that a 16-year-old isn't coachable. Right now he just seems totally lost in his own end. Totally out of position, taking the wrong angle towards loose pucks and opposing forwards, spinning in the wind in front of the net, running around chasing the puck...

What I do know is that prior to coming to the OHL, Del Zotto never had to give defensive play a second thought. He always played on stacked Markham Waxers teams that had possession of the puck 80% of the time. Plus they played a run-and-gun style - lots of stretch passes and defensemen rushing the puck on quick transitions. In his three years before coming to the OHL, Del Zotto's teams played a total of maybe 6-10 close, tight games.

Of the other guys you mentioned, Cuma has good size and skating, but he really disappointed me in the first round playoff series against Belleville and at the CWG. Lots of boneheaded plays.

All the way through minor hockey, I never thought Gaulton was anything special. A very solid OHL defenseman with good size who got an unusual amount of icetime on a terrible Erie team. I don't see any more upside than a mid-round NHL pick.

D'Orazio I always really liked for his toughness and mean streak, which he loves to bring against the other team's top forwards. He should get a lot of ice next season given the graduations and forthcoming trades from Owen Sound's blueline. If his physical size (bulk) reaches the "size he plays" and he can show some of the offense that he had in minor hockey, I can see him being a 2nd round NHL pick. Style comparison: think a poor man's Chelios.

Lalonde is good in every aspect of the game offensively and defensively (I like his total skill set better than Gaulton's), but not special at any one thing. Couple that with his just OK size (listed at 6'1" unmeasured by CSS - I strongly doubt he's six feet), and I worry for his sake that he'll be the prototypical tweener.
 
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