Strachan Blames Nashville for Big Market Foes

joolzie

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Sep 24, 2003
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But using Nashville as an example is wrong. Before the lock-out we were one of the lowest payroll teams, after the lock-out we're still one of the lowest payroll teams.
Ahh, why must you allow your pesky details to get in the way of a good rant? :)

The payroll did go up though, right? And without revenue sharing it probably wouldn't have? I honestly don't know, and I don't have a problem with it if it is the case, I'm just curious.
 

puckhead103*

Guest
There's a darn difference between NFL and NHL... While there are smaller markets in the NFL, those teams never had any gates problems I can think of (thrown aside the Cardinals, but that's the case of a permanenly bad team), and football is the main sport in those cities -- as is the case with every cities represented in the NFL for that matter. Nobody in the NFL will whine about Green Bay receiving money from revenue sharing -- hey, their stadium is completely packed.

Hockey is the main sport in only 6 cities... And was a main sport with 2 teams that left because of the former economics. While a case could be made with hockey being the 2nd sport in Buffalo, hockey holds the 3rd to 56th spot in "sports ranking".
there is a growing sentiment among low revenue teams want their large revenue brethren to share revenues.....

clubs like philly, cleveland, and dallas have extra revenue streams that a team like buffalo does not have.....
 
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puckhead103*

Guest
Strachan is an idiot.....plus how the hell can he put the Avs and Wings in the same class as Philly?

They get blown out every game and are the worst in the NHL and with all these big salaries for crappy players, ie) Hatcher, Rathje, Nedved, etc.

Last time I checked the Avs/Wings dont have these big contracts for useless players and we are doing pretty good.

Stupid Strachan.
the article has some irony in it....

he mentions that the CBA rewards incompetence.....but if you look at it closely, the old CBA it rewarded incompetence towards bigger revenue clubs who could hide their mistakes just by spending on washed up free agents...
 

puttinonthefOIL

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Sep 5, 2005
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What in the hey does the above rant against the Leafs have to do with the article, most Leaf fans cannot stand Strachan, Cox and Simmons, the Axis Of Evil in Toronto.

I have no issues with the Leafs. In the article, Strachan is clearly trying to pin the woes of the Leafs (and a few other "big market" teams) on Nashville (and the other "small market" teams). My point was only that the the Leafs are still in control of their success... just like every other team. Nashville is doing more with less budget than most other teams. Why is that? Revenue sharing is a total red herring. Anyway I think most people can agree, Strahan is a tool and that definitely has nothing to do with the Leafs. :)
 

Northern Dancer

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Mar 2, 2002
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the article has some irony in it....

he mentions that the CBA rewards incompetence.....but if you look at closely...those teams who made the big bucks are incompetent in terms of trading away prospects for old, washed up players....a

in the old CBA it rewarded incompetence since those teams with bigger revenue streams can hide their mistakes just by spending on washed up free agents...

Huh, is not a team suppossed to ice the most competive team they can afford ?!?!
Or are teams suppossed to tank to accumulate draft picks ????
The old CBA was in need of repair and the current CBA is better however it does need some tweaking as it really does reward the incompetent teams. (imo)
 

Northern Dancer

The future ain't what it used to be.
Mar 2, 2002
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I have no issues with the Leafs. In the article, Strachan is clearly trying to pin the woes of the Leafs (and a few other "big market" teams) on Nashville (and the other "small market" teams). My point was only that the the Leafs are still in control of their success... just like every other team. Nashville is doing more with less budget than most other teams. Why is that? Revenue sharing is a total red herring. Anyway I think most people can agree, Strahan is a tool and that has nothing to do with the Leafs. :)

I do not disagree with anything you have said especially Strachan being a tool!! ;)
 

MXD

Original #4
Oct 27, 2005
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there is a growing sentiment among low revenue teams want their large revenue brethren to share revenues.....

clubs like philly, cleveland, and dallas have extra revenue streams that a team like buffalo does not have.....

Well, maybe, but Buffalo, Green Bay, and those small markets teams actually deserve an NFL team, the stadium is full, and football is the prime sport there.

And one could argue that Montreal and Toronto (amongst others, but those are the easiest examples) have high revenue figures because their tickets are very expansive... but hey, no matter what happens in Montreal and Toronto, attendance is always full OR nearly full. If Montreal and Toronto had their tickets at league's average, they wouldn't be doing that much revenues... And it won't draw any more people, they're already playing at full capacity. So we basically have to pay more for our tickets here to see our money go somewhere else?!?! This is where Strachan rant makes sense, even if he NEVER said those words in his papers.
 

Fugu

Guest
It obviously is wrong to blame Nashville. They did not impose the CBA on the other teams.... so how is it Nashville's fault?

However you need high revenue teams to have "high" revenues. That is what fuels the revenue sharing program. If the revenues of teams like Detroit, Philly or Colorado fall significantly, but there is still a bottom third of teams that need to be brought up to the midpoint of the cap due to their low spending and low revenues, where does the money come from? Does Toronto get to pay an ever increasing share of the bill? That really isn't feasible. Secondly a portion of the revenue sharing money comes from playoff receipts. I think it might be safe to say - I have no proof - that NYC or Toronto can pull in more revenue during the playoffs than the Canes or Thrashers could in fact or potentially (for the latter). If playoff receipts are lower than expected overall, then again, where does the money come from... Toronto?

(PS I'm not a Leafs' fan so don't go there...)
 

irisheyes555

Registered User
Dec 3, 2005
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Well, maybe, but Buffalo, Green Bay, and those small markets teams actually deserve an NFL team, the stadium is full, and football is the prime sport there.

And one could argue that Montreal and Toronto (amongst others, but those are the easiest examples) have high revenue figures because their tickets are very expansive... but hey, no matter what happens in Montreal and Toronto, attendance is always full OR nearly full. If Montreal and Toronto had their tickets at league's average, they wouldn't be doing that much revenues... And it won't draw any more people, they're already playing at full capacity. So we basically have to pay more for our tickets here to see our money go somewhere else?!?! This is where Strachan rant makes sense, even if he NEVER said those words in his papers.

if that is the case couldn't the leafs charge less for tix and move themselves down into the the middle 3rd of revenues? kinda like making a tax deductible contribution before tax time in order to move yourself down into a lower tax bracket. guess that is nashville's fault for making the leafs overcharge. i guess the leafs figure they can charge what the market will 'bear', pay the tax for being in the top third, and still MAKE MORE MONEY than if they cut prices and moved to the middle third.

let's really bottom line it. nashville is doing as much or more with less payroll than the leafs. the old days of large market entitlement have changed. the leafs(and their ticket office) may not have gotten the memo. look at the difference between the haves and the have not's pre/post CBA. kinda hard for nashville to compete with detroit if they are getting outspent by x3.5. last year it was around x1.3. no you can't buy cups, but you used to be able to rent a playoff spot every year if you have the money. of course this could always be a round-about way of getting back at contraction.

http://asp.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/nhl/salaries/default.aspx

2003-04 2005-06
Team Total Payroll Team Total Payroll

Detroit Red Wings $ 77,856,109 New Jersey Devils $ 44,895,949
New York Rangers $ 76,488,716 Vancouver Canucks $ 43,711,344
Dallas Stars $ 68,578,885 Philadelphia Flyers $ 42,566,760
Philadelphia Flyers $ 68,175,247 New York Rangers $ 41,474,800
Colorado Avalanche $ 63,382,458 Colorado Avalanche $ 41,044,829
Toronto Maple Leafs $ 62,458,140 Dallas Stars $ 40,651,480
St. Louis Blues $ 61,675,000 Detroit Red Wings $ 39,578,300
Los Angeles Kings $ 53,833,800 Tampa Bay Lightning $ 39,157,379
Anaheim Mighty Ducks $ 53,296,750 Edmonton Oilers $ 38,469,340
Washington Capitals $ 50,895,750 Los Angeles Kings $ 37,856,150
New Jersey Devils $ 48,931,658 Atlanta Thrashers $ 37,170,200
Boston Bruins $ 46,569,000 Ottawa Senators $ 36,909,094
Vancouver Canucks $ 42,074,500 Toronto Maple Leafs $ 36,796,580
New York Islanders $ 40,865,500 Boston Bruins $ 36,662,100
Ottawa Senators $ 39,590,000 Calgary Flames $ 36,589,140
Phoenix Coyotes $ 39,249,750 Carolina Hurricanes $ 35,308,700
Montreal Canadiens $ 38,857,000 Montreal Canadiens $ 32,994,940
Calgary Flames $ 36,402,575 Anaheim Mighty Ducks $ 32,060,233
Carolina Hurricanes $ 35,908,738 Nashville Predators $ 31,649,440
San Jose Sharks $ 34,455,000 New York Islanders $ 31,447,520
Tampa Bay Lightning $ 34,065,379 San Jose Sharks $ 31,005,400
Columbus Blue Jackets $ 34,000,000 Phoenix Coyotes $ 30,354,345
Edmonton Oilers $ 33,375,000 Chicago Blackhawks $ 30,141,200
Buffalo Sabres $ 32,954,250 Columbus Blue Jackets $ 30,093,235
Chicago Blackhawks $ 30,867,502 Buffalo Sabres $ 28,515,120
Atlanta Thrashers $ 28,547,500 St. Louis Blues $ 28,480,800
Minnesota Wild $ 27,200,500 Florida Panthers $ 26,500,510
Florida Panthers $ 26,127,500 Minnesota Wild $ 25,158,800
Pittsburgh Penguins $ 23,400,000 Pittsburgh Penguins $ 23,122,650
Nashville Predators $ 21,932,500 Washington Capitals $ 18,932,830
 
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MLH

Registered User
Feb 6, 2003
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While a case could be made with hockey being the 2nd sport in Buffalo...

A case? It is unquestionably the number two sport in Buffalo with nothing else coming remotely close. As the Bills continue to be inept, it's slowly creeping up on football (the difference between TV ratings is at an alltime low), but still has a ways to go.
 

Transported Upstater

Guest
What in the hey does the above rant against the Leafs have to do with the article, most Leaf fans cannot stand Strachan, Cox and Simmons, the Axis Of Evil in Toronto.

That's the "Axis of Douchebaggery."
 

Northern Dancer

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Mar 2, 2002
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i
f that is the case couldn't the leafs charge less for tix and move themselves down into the the middle 3rd of revenues?

As a Leaf subscriber I entirely endorse this. The scalpers union in Toronto would be dancing in the street as their profit margins soar. Unfortunately ticket prices in Toronto is driven by supply and demand and we seem to have a bit of a problem with the supply side. So probably a zero sum game for MLSE and a huge win for the scalpers.
 

grego

Registered User
Jan 12, 2005
2,390
97
Saskatchewan
Al is an idiot.

Most the big clubs are lucky the new CBA meant they couldn't have unlimited old guys.

Those old CBA teams could not have kept up with the new rule enforcement. The big clubs lost old vets but in many cases the team was no worse off. Some were just unable to adjust to the new rules
 

Northern Dancer

The future ain't what it used to be.
Mar 2, 2002
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I thought that was the plan for the last 40 years at MLSE.

The new CBA hasn't changed that has it... it was working so well.

Well if it was, we screwed that up as well !!! Aside from Wendel we had no other # 1 picks over-all, unlike some of these small market teams that everyone seems to think are so well run !!!!
 

darth5

No!
Mar 28, 2002
2,586
75
Smashville, TN
...The new CBA makes it easier for an average front office to achieve success, and makes it much harder to do it consistently.
I have to disagree with this statement. It is absolutely crucial that your front office be above average at drafting, player development, scouting, etc. Did David Poile make the Leafs sign Ted Nolan? Did the Predators force Shanahan to sign with the Rangers?

Actually, the Red Wings are a strong argument against Al's point. They still ice a solid team within the system. The distribution of talent to more franchises encourages more gate at all venues. Three years ago what premier name player did Nashville have to draw more casual fan interest? Now, they can see Kariya, Arnott, and Sullivan as well as home grown players like Erat, Weber, Radulov, and Vokoun. What's not to like about a bigger pie?
 

Northern Dancer

The future ain't what it used to be.
Mar 2, 2002
15,199
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I have to disagree with this statement. It is absolutely crucial that your front office be above average at drafting, player development, scouting, etc. Did David Poile make the Leafs sign Ted Nolan? Did the Predators force Shanahan to sign with the Rangers?

Actually, the Red Wings are a strong argument against Al's point. They still ice a solid team within the system. The distribution of talent to more franchises encourages more gate at all venues. Three years ago what premier name player did Nashville have to draw more casual fan interest? Now, they can see Kariya, Arnott, and Sullivan as well as home grown players like Erat, Weber, Radulov, and Vokoun. What's not to like about a bigger pie?

You are 100% correct, David Poile did NOT make the Leafs sign Ted Nolan. ;)

Maybe we should give the new CBA a few years to work before crowning who is the best managed organization.

I can definately tell you that the Leafs were a little blind-sided by the new CBA, they fully expected a luxury tax of some sort and were more than willing to pay it as a cost of doing business. So were they ready for year 1, absolutely not. Can they compete going forward,absolutely. Do they still have financial clout, absolutely, is that important, absolutely.
Do not short change MLSE and it's resolve to play as many play-off games as humanly possible.
 

ColoradoHockeyFan

Registered User
Feb 17, 2005
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Denver area
A case? It is unquestionably the number two sport in Buffalo with nothing else coming remotely close.
Is this really noteworthy, though, given that there is no MLB or NBA team in Buffalo? I mean, if there are only two major teams in a market, it's pretty hard to not be at least second, right? :)
 

OG6ix

Registered User
Apr 11, 2006
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What a joke, isn't this guy like the worst Sports writer in Canada that Bryan Burke snapped at?
 

Magnus Fulgur

Registered User
Nov 27, 2002
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Thanks for posting the link to the article. I wanted to read it originally, but I had to use the Toronto Sun to wipe myself.

Here's a gem:
"The team that took the most from the revenue-sharing program was Nashville. The Predators, it seems, are to the NHL what Quebec is to Canada."
 

Gnashville

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Jan 7, 2003
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Unfortunately ticket prices in Toronto is driven by supply and demand and we seem to have a bit of a problem with the supply side.
Doesn't WINNING drive demand? Do you honestly think prices would be the same in Toronto if they had 5 strait years like the Predators had for their 1st five years? Look what has happened to Chicago.
 

Northern Dancer

The future ain't what it used to be.
Mar 2, 2002
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Doesn't WINNING drive demand? Do you honestly think prices would be the same in Toronto if they had 5 strait years like the Predators had for their 1st five years?

Yes I do, in fact we did exactly that for the 20 odd years during the very, very bad, dark years of harold ballard's ownership.

we would be so hyped by our inventory of good draft picks they would probably double the prices every year. ;)
 

triggrman

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Doesn't WINNING drive demand? Do you honestly think prices would be the same in Toronto if they had 5 strait years like the Predators had for their 1st five years? Look what has happened to Chicago.
yeah, Toronto isn't they typical market, it's like Green Bay football, they sell out no matter the product.
 

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