Status of The Florida Panthers

KingsFan7824

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Dec 4, 2003
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I like your posts often on these issues, so I'll ask you. Where did the big 4 go wrong with Florida expansion? People bring up the Lightning, but even they were in trouble. The complaints hockey fans having about southern teams apply to almost every florida in every major sport. The Bucs, Jags are always near the bottom of attendance. Dolphins had blackouts right before the rule was lifted. Both baseball teams are about to sink again, the Magic are ok, but there are time the Heat will not sell out. What gives, and why did California and Texas do so much better with pro sports?

What the specific cause could be, I don't know, but if it's something that crosses all pro sports, then maybe it's just a Florida thing. Maybe it's a place where you have to win, or at least be competitive, and not out of it year, after year, after year, after year. That's most places though. Not going to get too many Toronto's. The Panthers have been to the playoffs in 5 out of what will soon be 24 years. That's 21% of the time. The Lightning will be at 10 of 25 years. Not a lot, but it's doubles the Panthers %. And they have a Cup, and been to the Final twice, and to the 3rd round 4 times. Multiple stars as well. Lecavalier, St.Louis, Richards, Stamkos, Hedman. Who's the biggest star for the Panthers? Bure? You think of him as a Canuck, not a Panther. Jovanovski? The Beezer? Jagr? Nashville will be at 11 of 19 years, which is quite good, and now the atmosphere at home games can rival some very established teams.

Like was said, it's not a place that has generation after generation of loyalty to fall back on. Most of the teams in Florida are relatively new. If you were born when the Panthers showed up, you're barely out of college, and there's a lot of nothing from the franchise. Losing seasons, blown picks at the top of drafts, can't keep the guys you do draft.

Maybe if Florida had a team in the 21 team league, when 76% of the league made the playoffs, they couldn't have gone a decade without making the playoffs, and could've been somewhat relevant. What would it be like if you could find an old clip of a Panthers and, whoever, Capitals or Flyers playoff series from the high flying 80's, where they had some kind of line brawl or two? How would the Panthers be seen? Instead, what's their feather in the cap? They got swept in the Final, after hacking and whacking the Penguins out of the 3rd round, deprived people of a Colorado/Pittsburgh series in 1996, and they haven't done much of anything as a franchise since. Sakic/Forsberg vs. Lemieux/Jagr at the top of their games. Instead you got Dave Lowry at the start of the dead puck era. Didn't get Lemieux vs Gretzky in 1993, but you still had the legendary Montreal Canadiens franchise involved. The rat thing was cool for the Panthers though.

Or, as we can see with Tampa and Nashville, if you get your ownership and management right, you can get a lot done.
 
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Melrose Munch

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Mar 18, 2007
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What the specific cause could be, I don't know, but if it's something that crosses all pro sports, then maybe it's just a Florida thing. Maybe it's a place where you have to win, or at least be competitive, and not out of it year, after year, after year, after year. That's most places though. Not going to get too many Toronto's. The Panthers have been to the playoffs in 5 out of what will soon be 24 years. That's 21% of the time. The Lightning will be at 10 of 25 years. Not a lot, but it's doubles the Panthers %. And they have a Cup, and been to the Final twice, and to the 3rd round 4 times. Multiple stars as well. Lecavalier, St.Louis, Richards, Stamkos, Hedman. Who's the biggest star for the Panthers? Bure? You think of him as a Canuck, not a Panther. Jovanovski? The Beezer? Jagr? Nashville will be at 11 of 19 years, which is quite good, and now the atmosphere at home games can rival some very established teams.

Like was said, it's not a place that has generation after generation of loyalty to fall back on. Most of the teams in Florida are relatively new. If you were born when the Panthers showed up, you're barely out of college, and there's a lot of nothing from the franchise. Losing seasons, blown picks at the top of drafts, can't keep the guys you do draft.

Maybe if Florida had a team in the 21 team league, when 76% of the league made the playoffs, they couldn't have gone a decade without making the playoffs, and could've been somewhat relevant. What would it be like if you could find an old clip of a Panthers and, whoever, Capitals or Flyers playoff series from the high flying 80's, where they had some kind of line brawl or two? How would the Panthers be seen? Instead, what's their feather in the cap? They got swept in the Final, after hacking and whacking the Penguins out of the 3rd round, deprived people of a Colorado/Pittsburgh series in 1996, and they haven't done much of anything as a franchise since. Sakic/Forsberg vs. Lemieux/Jagr at the top of their games. Instead you got Dave Lowry at the start of the dead puck era. Didn't get Lemieux vs Gretzky in 1993, but you still had the legendary Montreal Canadiens franchise involved. The rat thing was cool for the Panthers though.

Or, as we can see with Tampa and Nashville, if you get your ownership and management right, you can get a lot done.
Very true. So what to do think about the problems with the other florida teams, like with all three NFL teams in florida having various blackouts until the NFL ended that, and the baseball crisis with the rays and marlins. Similar situation to the panthers? Or should there be most support since those sports are american.
 

SladeWilson23

I keep my promises.
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Nov 3, 2014
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I mean its already been 25 years sure lets give it another 5, that's when the out-clause in the lease kicks in anyway

How about we wait until they have a period of sustained success? 25 years is not a long time when you've never had any kind of period of sustained success.
 

Last Rat Standing

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May 26, 2016
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Very true. So what to do think about the problems with the other florida teams, like with all three NFL teams in florida having various blackouts until the NFL ended that, and the baseball crisis with the rays and marlins. Similar situation to the panthers? Or should there be most support since those sports are american.

The Marlins fire sale like none other and the Rays biggest problem is the stadium location. NFL down here is similar to hockey. People won't waste their time and money if they're not doing well. It's $60 just to park at a Dolphins game. But the Panthers have shown zero consistency over their time. If their doing well, people were showing. Even just back a few years ago. During their 12 game win streak, you saw the attendance increase from 10-11k per game to about 17-18k. That might not seem like alot but for them it is. You have to give a reason for people to come out. During my recent trips to games, i just hope that they score a few goals to give me a few moments of excitement. The concept of winning consistently has gone out the window until they show me and the other small handful of die-hards that they can. Until then, things will continue to show. Half filled building unless it's a northern team and talks of a Quebec move which can't happen for at least 5 years. But as I stated a few days ago, if things don't change and it's more of 80 point seasons, inconsistent play and a continued coaching carousel, then I wish Quebec all the luck with this current dumpster fire.
 

Melrose Munch

Registered User
Mar 18, 2007
23,546
2,006
The Marlins fire sale like none other and the Rays biggest problem is the stadium location. NFL down here is similar to hockey. People won't waste their time and money if they're not doing well. It's $60 just to park at a Dolphins game. But the Panthers have shown zero consistency over their time. If their doing well, people were showing. Even just back a few years ago. During their 12 game win streak, you saw the attendance increase from 10-11k per game to about 17-18k. That might not seem like alot but for them it is. You have to give a reason for people to come out. During my recent trips to games, i just hope that they score a few goals to give me a few moments of excitement. The concept of winning consistently has gone out the window until they show me and the other small handful of die-hards that they can. Until then, things will continue to show. Half filled building unless it's a northern team and talks of a Quebec move which can't happen for at least 5 years. But as I stated a few days ago, if things don't change and it's more of 80 point seasons, inconsistent play and a continued coaching carousel, then I wish Quebec all the luck with this current dumpster fire.
I think we should keep Miami as a sports market and hockey is a new sport, so we can cut you guys some slack. I'm just shocked the same issues hockey had are worsening the other sports. I mean at least the panthers are new. The dolphins have won before.
 

BoltSTH

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Sep 4, 2008
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Tampa
7 years ago the Bolts were probably the worst profession franchise in North America, were bankrupt and on the verge of relocation . Since then they have gone to the SC final once and the EC final once, and have sold out every game for the last 4 years, doing well this year, despite missing the playoffs 3 of those 7. The main reason: An owner committed to the team and city, the money to buy and run the team without debt, investing in the city's development ($3b+ development around the arena with no debt), supporting youth hockey, supporting local charities ($50K every home game) , hiring the best people available to run hockey and non-hockey operations, imposing no internal cap, and improving the facilities for fans and players ($65m even though the city owns the arena). So the NHL can work in Florida, but you need the $ and commitment from the owner to make it work, even with a down town arena.
 

KingsFan7824

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Dec 4, 2003
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Very true. So what to do think about the problems with the other florida teams, like with all three NFL teams in florida having various blackouts until the NFL ended that, and the baseball crisis with the rays and marlins. Similar situation to the panthers? Or should there be most support since those sports are american.

I'd guess it's a similar situation. If it's not contained to one sport, foreign or domestic, extremely popular or not, or even to one specific city in the state, then it's a more generalized phenomenon. Every league has chased the potential of Florida though. What works is winning. Although not the winning the Marlins have done, followed by complete teardowns. Or having a great player 20+ years ago like the Dolphins. Definitely what have you done for me lately.
 

Wingsfan 4 life

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Oct 9, 2016
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Why does attendance seem to be an issue for most Florida sports teams, when it's a state that has 20 million people in it (i.e. over half the population of Canada in an area that's about 1/5 the size of Ontario). I'd get if it was just hockey, but it doesn't seem to matter what sport it is, attendance is routinely an issue.

Tampa + Miami were last and third last in attendance last year in the MLB.
2017 MLB Attendance - Major League Baseball - ESPN

Jacksonville + Tampa were 26 & 27 last year for attendance in the NFL (21 and 28 if you go by % of stadium full)
2016 NFL Football Attendance - National Football League - ESPN

Miami + Orlando were 17th + 28th last year for attendance in the NBA
2016-2017 NBA Attendance - National Basketball Association - ESPN

Now to be fair, Tampa Bay Lightning in the NHL actually do seem to be doing pretty well for attendance these days, but Florida is still consistently near the bottom (5th worst last year), and when they made the playoffs with a very exciting young core of Ekblad, Huberdeau, Barkov, etc they were still 5th last.
List of National Hockey League attendance figures - Wikipedia

I dunno, but it seems the teams that more consistantly make the playoffs have better attendance as apposed to those who make the PO's once then string a bunch of non PO seasons.
 

Last Rat Standing

Registered User
May 26, 2016
212
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South Florida
I dunno, but it seems the teams that more consistantly make the playoffs have better attendance as apposed to those who make the PO's once then string a bunch of non PO seasons.

We also have tons to down here rather than wasting time on watching losing teams. 350 of our days it's great weather for outdoor activities and not to mention theme parks and every downtown area in the state to walk around, shop, eat etc.
 

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